Where is the line between insecurity and reasonable concern?

[RuinedLife]

When is it acceptable to express your "jealousy based" concerns to your partner?

 

1) When they are flirting with someone else online?

2) When they are still in regular contact with their ex?

3) When they want to spend their holiday time alone with an old friend of the opposite sex and exclude you?

4) When they flirt with every other person they see?

 

Or if you truly trust your partner should none of these things matter?

 

I know it depends on the specifics of the situation. But the line for me is incredibly blurred and insecurity clouds my thinking.

[Eeyore79]

1) and 4) are disrespectful - I expect my partner to respect our relationship and not be overly flirtatious with others. I don't see this as controlling, because he's free to end the relationship and flirt with whoever he wants - but if he chooses to be with me then he has to maintain respectable boundaries with others.

 

3) shows a lack of commitment and interest in the relationship - my partner should want to spend his holiday time with me, and there's obviously something wrong with our relationship if he doesn't. Spending large amounts of time alone with someone of the opposite sex is disrespectful when you're in a relationship - again it comes back to maintaining respectable boundaries.

 

2) is a deal breaker; I don't date any man who maintains contact with his ex, it isn't worth the hassle. Previous relationships should be over and left in the past before starting a new relationship.

[RuinedLife]

3) shows a lack of commitment and interest in the relationship - my partner should want to spend his holiday time with me, and there's obviously something wrong with our relationship if he doesn't. Spending large amounts of time alone with someone of the opposite sex is disrespectful when you're in a relationship - again it comes back to maintaining respectable boundaries.

 

Maybe you could give me your opinion on my situation?

 

 

I'm trying to determine whether or not I was justified tell my bf that I felt hurt when he cancelled his weekend plans with me and had an old female friend spend the weekend with him instead.

 

I told him I felt hurt and not to change his plans so suddenly again and exclude me in the future. And I also told him that our relationship wouldn't work out if he couldn't understand why I felt hurt. Which I really regret now as soon after he dumped me. And I just feel so responsible for the break up because I know if I hadn't told him how hurt I felt and how our relationship wouldn't work if he couldn't understand, that everything would still be fine between us. And I feel so guilty and regretful for telling him how I felt.

 

He didn't say "it would be awkward if I was there" he just didn't want me there and just wanted to spend some time catching up, just the two of them.

 

But I have really bad anxiety issues and felt really insecure so even though I trusted him, my anxiety and insecurities got the better of me, and I ended up telling him how I felt, when I would usually have tried to keep those anxious and insecure feelings to myself. In this situation it just seemed like I needed to tell him how I felt so that he wouldn't do the same thing in the future and would be more understanding of my feelings. But it had the complete opposite effect as he just decided I was too insecure for him and we broke up.

 

I just don't know whether in this case my insecurity was justified? As I feel so guilty and hate myself so much for ruining my relationship. I feel I should have been able to better suppress my anxiety and insecurity. And I really wish that I had not told him how I felt, but instead just waited it out.

 

Now I can't take back what I did, but still I'm curious to know how others would have reacted in the same situation and whether they would also have felt excluded and told their partner how they felt? Because I don't know whether me expressing how hurt I felt was purely due to my own insecurities or whether I was justified to express my feelings? And I wonder whether most people would feel excluded in a similar situation? Or whether I really did completely overreact and most people wouldn't be phased by such a situation.

 

Discussed further in THIS thread.

 

Have had some feedback, but I'm still struggling to come to terms with what happened so would really appreciate your take on it. Thanks.

[OldOnTheInside]

While I didn't explore your older thread too thoroughly, I'll give you my opinion.

 

When it comes to emotions...justification has little to do with it. You feel what you feel. And often, your gut feeling contains some levels of accuracy. Of course, sometimes it is way off.

 

Whether or not your (ex)boyfriend is cheating on you, if he disregards or minimises the importance of your feelings, you need to take note of this.

 

Although, if you do have low self-esteem, then relationships should be put on your back burner. You don't want to get somebody else involved with your own personal problems like that.

 

The question you need to ask is: How am I going to build up my self-confidence? This is something that you need to do on your own.

[RuinedLife]

 

Although, if you do have low self-esteem, then relationships should be put on your back burner. You don't want to get somebody else involved with your own personal problems like that.

 

The question you need to ask is: How am I going to build up my self-confidence? This is something that you need to do on your own.

 

Yes I agree its very important I work on my self esteem issues and insecurity issues now. I'm seeing a therapist and have been very depressed since my break up so I'm taking anti-anxiety and anti-depressant medication.

[NervisPervis]

Yes I agree its very important I work on my self esteem issues and insecurity issues now. I'm seeing a therapist and have been very depressed since my break up so I'm taking anti-anxiety and anti-depressant medication.

 

Since your breakup? You broke up with this girl? I hope so because every one of those crosses that line you described. She's into other guys more than she is you. DO NOT let her think this is your issue. It's hers. Dump her if you haven't already.

[RuinedLife]

Since your breakup? You broke up with this girl? I hope so because every one of those crosses that line you described. She's into other guys more than she is you. DO NOT let her think this is your issue. It's hers. Dump her if you haven't already.

 

Well it was a guy (now my ex bf, and I'm a girl, just be clear) but he broke up with me when I tried to make him understand my point of view. I told him that the relationship wouldn't work out if he couldn't understand how I felt. But he couldn't understand, wasn't willing to talk about it further so he broke up with me. Which hurt a lot. And I blame myself for the break up, because I know if I hadn't been so desperate for him to understand my feelings and hadn't shown how insecure I was then we'd probably still be together and everything would be ok now.

 

As it is my self esteem is at rock bottom and I'm struggling a lot with deep depression, anxiety and really dark thoughts. Hopefully with therapy and medication I'll get better, forgive myself, move past this failed relationship and regain my self esteem. I'm trying to stay as positive as possible and see that if he doesn't love me enough to try and work things out I'm better off without him. But its hard to see that at the moment. As I hate myself so much for showing him how insecure I was and just throwing my relationship away like that.

 

Must keep trying though. Will other peoples support I'm getting there slowly.

[NervisPervis]

Sorry for the gender mix-up. I'm dealing with wife who would rather see me go insane than help me, so "horrible female" was my automatic first thought.

 

You were not wrong. You were with a man who would rather be with other women but didn't have the balls to break up with you first. He forced the breakup then blamed it on you. That's the work of a p.u.s.s.y. Go out and find a real man who can appreciate you. It shouldn't be hard. We're out there.

[kourtney01]

I'd say ALL OF THE ABOVE if they have a history of cheating, lying or suspicious/ disrespectful behavior.

 

1 and 4 are definitely COMPLETELY unacceptable and show insight into someone's character! The ex situation is iffy. Really depends on the dynamics of their friendship but there are definitely boundaries that should not be crossed there either. For example, there is no reason why your SO should be hanging out with the ex more than you, or even keeping in regular contact.. once in a while at most.

 

3 is also iffy. again, it depends on the character of the SO, the dynamics of their friendship and the purpose of their trip. But I would be bothered by it as well.

 

Speaking from experience and having almost married a serial cheater (broke free 3 months ago and still coping) I can almost say with certainty that when someone makes you feel completely secure in a relationship (you just feel it in your gut) little things do not bother you... when your gut is telling you something, it's because there usually is something to worry about. We were born with intuition for a reason and too often we ignore it.

 

Also.. when a man truly loves you, he will fight for you and prove to you that he can be trusted. Breaking up with you because his behavior causes you to feel insecure is a classic example of a person who did not value the relationship all that much to begin with!

 

My ex used to constantly go 'on a break' with me every time I would fight with him over some of the examples you mentioned in your post even though he had a history of cheating and lying. It's almost like he would use this 'break' to teach me a lesson so I would stop questioning him even though I had every reason to! Do not blame yourself or let this 'man' make you feel like you are the sole reason it did not work out. Had he not given you a reason to feel insecure, the BU wouldn't have happened either! It takes 2 to tango!

Edited June 20, 2011 by kourtney01

[OldOnTheInside]

But he couldn't understand, wasn't willing to talk about it further so he broke up with me. Which hurt a lot. And I blame myself for the break up, because I know if I hadn't been so desperate for him to understand my feelings and hadn't shown how insecure I was then we'd probably still be together and everything would be ok now.

 

So it is your fault that your boyfriend has communication problems?

 

Honey...

[fltc]

2) is a deal breaker; I don't date any man who maintains contact with his ex, it isn't worth the hassle. Previous relationships should be over and left in the past before starting a new relationship.

 

Can't agree with that, my exwife and I divorced each other, not our children. We have remained in contact for 37 years now and are good friends, she's also friends with my SO.

 

I have other posts on this subject.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2982004&postcount=124

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2986684&postcount=130

[RuinedLife]

So it is your fault that your boyfriend has communication problems?

 

Honey...

 

No, but its my fault that I have bad communication problems.

 

I just wish I could have just kept quiet about how I felt. I tried to be ok with it all, but my anxiety and insecurity just completely overwhelmed me and I felt I really had to tell him how hurt I was, really felt that he needed to understand my point of view. But I was scared how he would react, terrified, so I told him these things in an email. I know it was a really bad idea, but I was just really scared how he'd react. I did want to talk to him about things in person and I told him this, but he wouldn't come to see me, so I definitely handled the situation all wrong.

 

I just wish so badly I could forgive myself for my mistakes because they haunt me everyday. I know everyone makes mistakes, I didn't mean to hurt him and I didn't mean for us to break up because of this, but I still blame myself everyday because of the words I used etc. It just all went so horribly wrong. So in hindsight it just seems like it would have been so so much better to not mention how bad I felt and to not insist that he understood at the cost of the relationship. I did apologize best I could. But as much as I want to I can't take back what I did now. And he's gone. I can't believe he's really gone forever from my life because of this.

[rafallus]

#1 Maybe the person is good for casual fun. Not for commitment.

 

#2 Maybe OK, if they're cordial and not hiding anything. If she gets agitated whenever I mention him and goes out of her way to hide it, running shoes ready.

 

#3 Not in a billion years. They totally can spend holidays with whoever they want and exclude me from fun, but when they come back, I won't be there.

 

#4 It means it's not a person to get commited to. Again, good for casual fun, maybe, but not to get commited.

[RuinedLife]

#1 Maybe the person is good for casual fun. Not for commitment.

 

#2 Maybe OK, if they're cordial and not hiding anything. If she gets agitated whenever I mention him and goes out of her way to hide it, running shoes ready.

 

#3 Not in a billion years. They totally can spend holidays with whoever they want and exclude me from fun, but when they come back, I won't be there.

 

#4 It means it's not a person to get commited to. Again, good for casual fun, maybe, but not to get commited.

 

Do you think these behaviors could indicate that the person is commitment phobic? Because I definitely think my ex was a commitment phobe, I think me expressing my feelings was the trigger for our break up but the possibility of me moving in on a more permanent basis was subtly hinted at (not that I really wanted to move in permanently but still) and I think this was another major factor in his decision to run.

 

A insecure type like me + a commitment phobic, emotionally unavailable type like him, I guess there was bound to be a breaking point sooner or later. I only wish it could have been a LOT later and that we didn't have to end things on such a sour note. He wants to be friends, but I'm so heartbroken and I love him so so much still, I definitely couldn't handle it at the moment. Maybe a few years in the future, but seems unlikely.

[NervisPervis]

What are you worrid about? A man behaves like that and YOU worry that YOU did something wrong?

 

OK. Don't look at it as though he left you because you bereted him on this. He left you because he wanted to continue this inappropriate behavior and for you to shut the **** up about it. When you ritefully didn't, he split.

 

Is that better?

 

Let's try this. My wife left me because I told her that giving strange men handjobs down by the pier was unaceptable behavior. She said it wasn't sex so it was OK. And for gods sake shut the **** up about it or I'm going to leave.

 

Is there a difference? Should I be angry with myself for forcing this decision on her part?

[RuinedLife]

What are you worrid about? A man behaves like that and YOU worry that YOU did something wrong?

 

OK. Don't look at it as though he left you because you bereted him on this. He left you because he wanted to continue this inappropriate behavior and for you to shut the **** up about it. When you ritefully didn't, he split.

 

Is that better?

 

Let's try this. My wife left me because I told her that giving strange men handjobs down by the pier was unaceptable behavior. She said it wasn't sex so it was OK. And for gods sake shut the **** up about it or I'm going to leave.

 

Is there a difference? Should I be angry with myself for forcing this decision on her part?

 

Well your ex wife's behavior was blatantly unacceptable and inappropriate. Is hard to believe anyone would view that as acceptable behavior within a monogamous marriage.

 

But, even though there is some truth to your evaluation of my situation. My ex bf's behavior wasn't so clearly wrong, as it all depends on how you interpret the situation. Because from his point of view having an old friend visit for the weekend so they could catch up was perfectly acceptable and from his point of view if I trusted him it shouldn't be a problem. And I can understand his view. As I can see how that situation might be perfectly acceptable for most secure trusting couples and how I could quite easily be seen to be overreacting. Even though from my point of view I felt excluded. I.e. just because I felt excluded and uncomfortable with the situation doesn't mean his behavior was necessarily wrong.

 

And as it was my insecurities and anxiety that caused me to force the issue too harshly (i.e. by saying that our relationship wouldn't work out if he couldn't understand why I felt left out) I feel guilty and to blame for the break up.

Edited June 21, 2011 by RuinedLife

[NervisPervis]

For the record, my wife never gave handjobs down by the pier. It was an example. And yes, your boyfriends behavior was every bit as unacceptable. You did no wrong. Do you really want to still be with this guy after all of this? Be with someone who has a whole bunch of irons in the fire. You klnow, just in case he needs one?

[NervisPervis]

2) When they are still in regular contact with their ex?

3) When they want to spend their holiday time alone with an old friend of the opposite sex and exclude you?

 

I almost feel guilty for ratting out my fellow males and giving up these secrets:

 

2 - We hate our ex's. The ONLY reason we would stay in contact with them is for the potential sex.

 

3 - The only reason we'd spend time with....

 

Oh, never mind. Go ahead and beat yourself up. Maybe if you're lucky he'll strike out with these two and take you back until something better comes along.

 

Good luck to you.

[rafallus]

Do you think these behaviors could indicate that the person is commitment phobic? Because I definitely think my ex was a commitment phobe, I think me expressing my feelings was the trigger for our break up but the possibility of me moving in on a more permanent basis was subtly hinted at (not that I really wanted to move in permanently but still) and I think this was another major factor in his decision to run.

 

I don't know about his fear of commitment. Could also be a plain douchebaggery. What I know that I would get acute case of commitment phobia while dealing with person like him. It would go away as offender leaves.

[RuinedLife]

I almost feel guilty for ratting out my fellow males and giving up these secrets:

 

2 - We hate our ex's. The ONLY reason we would stay in contact with them is for the potential sex.

 

3 - The only reason we'd spend time with....

 

Oh, never mind. Go ahead and beat yourself up. Maybe if you're lucky he'll strike out with these two and take you back until something better comes along.

 

Good luck to you.

 

Surely not all guys think like this?

Or am I just incredibly naive?

 

So now he's broken up with me he hates me too?

 

Ouch. Love hurts.

[NervisPervis]

Surely not all guys think like this?

 

No, not all. But the ones that act this way do.

 

He may not hate you. But when he comes crawling back, be ready to give it up or he's gone again.

[RuinedLife]

No, not all. But the ones that act this way do.

 

He may not hate you. But when he comes crawling back, be ready to give it up or he's gone again.

 

I wish he'd come crawling back. But really I don't think he ever will. I'm just not worth the effort to him.

 

Ouch, ouch, ouch.

[NervisPervis]

You're not worth the effort for this scumbag? Then find someone even scumier that won't mind you questioning his inappropriate relationships with other girls.

 

Or, better yet, you can work on your self esteem problem before you do.

 

(mental note - try to discover why women fall so hard for jerks)

[RuinedLife]

You're not worth the effort for this scumbag? Then find someone even scumier that won't mind you questioning his inappropriate relationships with other girls.

 

Or, better yet, you can work on your self esteem problem before you do.

 

(mental note - try to discover why women fall so hard for jerks)

 

I don't think my ex bf was a jerk, I'm just really insecure. But you are right, I definitely need to work on improving my self esteem. As its been very low for a long time now, mainly because I'm suffering from severe depression at the moment I guess. But I'm on anti-depressant, anti-anxiety meds, sleeping pills and I'm having therapy, so hopefully given some time that will help me feel more positive about myself. Its a shame it'll be too late to save my relationship with my ex bf, but hopefully when my self esteem and confidence is higher one day I'll be able to better cope with my next relationship and better hide my insecurities.

[Eeyore79]

I'm trying to determine whether or not I was justified tell my bf that I felt hurt when he cancelled his weekend plans with me and had an old female friend spend the weekend with him instead.

 

I told him I felt hurt and not to change his plans so suddenly again and exclude me in the future. And I also told him that our relationship wouldn't work out if he couldn't understand why I felt hurt. Which I really regret now as soon after he dumped me. And I just feel so responsible for the break up because I know if I hadn't told him how hurt I felt and how our relationship wouldn't work if he couldn't understand, that everything would still be fine between us. And I feel so guilty and regretful for telling him how I felt.

 

Don't feel guilty and regretful; you did what any normal person would have done under the circumstances. He probably dumped you because he realized he couldn't mess you about. If someone needs to cancel plans at the last minute they should at least have a good excuse - overtime, illness, family emergency, etc. Preferring to hang out with another woman is not a good excuse! (tbh that would be rude even if it was a friend that did it to you. If you make plans with someone, you stick to them, because it's incredibly rude to let people down at the last minute; if you really need to cancel you apologize politely and make it up to them later).

 

Tbh I wouldn't want my bf spending the weekend alone with another woman under any circumstances, even if he gave me weeks of notice and we hadn't made plans together. It's just one of those boundaries that you don't cross in a mutually respectful relationship. If she's just a friend, then there's no reason why his gf shouldn't be there too. It's a huge red flag that your ex didn't want you there that weekend; he probably had sex with the other woman. You should be glad that you dodged a bullet because he obviously didn't respect you.