Development

[Crazy chick1]

There is a real update to be told this time, honest!

 

I met MM today for a coffee & we talked about what had happened before, during & after d day. He seemed very confused still & upset that by re-opening the door by contacting me, he had re-opened a painful situation for me. He wants to work at his M but felt that he had unfinished business with me at the same time. He told me that I had gotten into his blood & he didn't want to lose or hurt me. His W called whilst we were there & accused him of being with me, which obviously he denied. At one point he hinted that he could give me a list of dates & times when he was available for us to meet but at another point, he almost asked me for more time to work on his M (as if I was the one to have broken NC!).

 

The whole situation was hard to bear & I know it cannot continue. He held me & kissed me before we went our separate ways, which was bitter sweet. I am speaking to him again in the morning & am almost sure that I will end things with him. I cannot live like this & much as I love him, it doesn't make sense to me what he is doing? I genuinely do not believe that he is trying to hurt me though.

 

Am I right to end things & can anyone please, please help me interpret what is causing his erratic behaviour?

[denise_xo]

There isn't that much to interpret. He's just trying to keep you both at the same time.

[Emme]

Here's the thing. There are many women who are willing to just be the OW. What do you want? That's the question you have to answer for yourself. You seem to be ok with rules being set or you would not entertain him. If you want more than just what he is offering you make your demands from now. Don't wait years down the line to voice how you feel. So, do you want him to end his marriage and be with you? Are you ok with being the OW and only having him when he finds the time? Start there.

[bentnotbroken]

I can help you intrepret, though it will be the same thing you have already been told and chosen to ignore.

 

1) he is a user.

 

2) you are allowing yourself to be used

 

3) you don't want to except you will be the OW until it no longer suits him or his wife finds out

 

4) he sat in your face and lied to the woman who he says he is working on his marriage with, but you are sitting around trying to figure out what he means by meeting with you? It means he is a LIAR.

 

5) you don't believe fat meat is greasy and you need to find out for yourself.

 

6) you like the drama and thrive on the mess.

 

7)you need to blame your actions on somebody other than yourself

 

8)There is no real update you are just re-framing the same mess with a different frame.

 

Take your pick..though we know you won't.

[Breezy Trousers]

I agree with everything BentNotBroken wrote.

 

It doesn't matter if he is trying to hurt you or not. You're hurting yourself. You decide when that hurt ends, not him.

 

DISCLAIMER: I'm not a fan of affairs, but I'm a fan of accepting reality on reality's terms, and affairs seem to happen in reality. So, having said that:

 

Pay attention to what OW who married their MM on this forum have done. They didn't let MM dictate the terms of their lives. They decided the terms, presented those terms to MM and walked away without looking back. MM followed.

 

That's quite different from what you're experiencing here.

[Gentlegirl]

I don't see any real update.

 

He's pushing you as far as you will let him.

 

If somebody doesn't stop him in his tracks and kick him in the bum, he will go on and on like a naughty child. He needs a boundary which he cannot cross.

 

Of course he's feeling upset. Somebody is threatening to take his pretty dolly away from him and he won't be able to play anymore. BOO BOO.

 

How did you honestly feel when he lied to you in fron of his wife? How often does he lie to her about you?

 

All these things become clear after the limerance of being in love fades and it willl not fade until you go absolutely NC.

 

All the best

Gentlegirl

[20Seconds]

Am I right to end things & can anyone please, please help me interpret what is causing his erratic behaviour?

 

The coffee thing - it's all about him wanting to feel less guilty for the way he's treated you.

 

You've enable this by agreeing to meet with him. See, if you'd really been that upset with him you'd have strung his b*lls to the top of the nearest lampost for throwing you under the bus at d-day, and you certainly wouldn't be meeting for coffee.

 

And...I think, correct me if I am mistaken, the reason you went for coffee is because you believe that if you stay under his nose you can change the outcome of the situation, and persuade him to choose you by telling him how much you love him, miss him and the rest.

 

Well, you can't. He's already chosen the outcome of the situation for him and it's not what you want, so why waste any more of your time?

[whichwayisup]

Sorry but nothing has changed. Another thread asking the same question. Nothing has been solved either. You more or less said your goodbye's and now you want to 'talk' to him tomorrow??

 

Either crap or get off the pot. Accept crumbs and your role as the OW and take what he gives you with a smile on your face and don't ask questions.. OR find some self respect, some backbone and ego/pride and tell him ENOUGH is enough and MEAN IT. You say you can't handle it anymore, yet you keep the door open.

 

You CAN DO THIS, don't let fear of feeling pain, dealing with grieving and acceptance of it all being over stop you from ending it.

 

Sorry if I've come off harsh here, I just really think that if you take the leap and stay away from him, you will be happier and find "you" again.

[Trimmer]

...as if I was the one to have broken NC!

I agree with wisernow:

I know you feel HE broke NC, but the way I see it, YOU broke NC by agreeing to meet him.

"NC" is not a mutual endeavor, something you are doing together. NC is YOURS - you own it. From your perspective, all that should matter is if choose to allow NC to be broken, and you did make that choice.

 

Am I right to end things & can anyone please, please help me interpret what is causing his erratic behaviour?

How does his behavior seem erratic? It doesn't seem erratic to me:

 

With respect to his marriage, he's trying to maintain the status quo by "working on" things, although with questionable sincerity, since.....

 

With respect to the affair, he's trying to maintain the status quo by testing you with offers of continuing your affair, to see what you will accept; and in the space where those two worlds overlap....

 

He's trying to maintain the status quo on both sides by lying to his wife about you.

 

There's nothing erratic about any of that - he's doing everything he can to keep everything right in its place.

Edited June 19, 2011 by Trimmer

[fooled once]

I can help you intrepret, though it will be the same thing you have already been told and chosen to ignore.

 

1) he is a user.

 

2) you are allowing yourself to be used

 

3) you don't want to except you will be the OW until it no longer suits him or his wife finds out

 

4) he sat in your face and lied to the woman who he says he is working on his marriage with, but you are sitting around trying to figure out what he means by meeting with you? It means he is a LIAR.

 

5) you don't believe fat meat is greasy and you need to find out for yourself.

 

6) you like the drama and thrive on the mess.

 

7)you need to blame your actions on somebody other than yourself

 

8)There is no real update you are just re-framing the same mess with a different frame.

 

Take your pick..though we know you won't.

 

Not to be rude, but there's not really a development here. He wants to keep the A going (in all aspects). This is par for the course.

 

FWIW, I think you're right to end it if you don't want this to continue this way. I don't see it going any differently. It's up to you though if you want to see how it plays out.

 

I agree with Bent and SadinTexas.

 

Nothing new here. No "update".

 

Wow, you had COFFEE with him and discussed the affair again.

 

So his wife called him and he lied AGAIN about his actions! Wow - as if you didn't know he was a liar.

 

You want to hear that he adores you and loves you and will do anything to be with you; but that is NOT what is going on. He is using you, getting you to get all gooey and glittery, telling him how much you love him and want to be with him. You are giving his ego a good stroking.

 

And at the end of the day, he goes home to his WIFE.

 

What part of that are you not understanding?

 

We can't help you if you won't open your eyes and see it for what it is.

[BB07]

You've had excellent consitent responses and I agree......there is only one thing I have to add. You said you don't think he "means" to hurt you.........it makes no difference if he means to or not. He IS still hurting you and you are accepting the pain. Just stop, please.

 

Yes it will hurt like hell when you end it but you will make it through it. There is better on the other side.

[Mr.Harris]

You've had excellent consitent responses and I agree......there is only one thing I have to add. You said you don't think he "means" to hurt you.........it makes no difference if he means to or not. He IS still hurting you and you are accepting the pain. Just stop, please.

 

Yes it will hurt like hell when you end it but you will make it through it. There is better on the other side.

 

He's not hurting anyone. She knew the situation from the start and she's playing right along.

 

I agree with everyone: No new update just him trying to keep you two in the same bed and you're letting him have it his way.

[MissBee]

There is a real update to be told this time, honest!

 

I met MM today for a coffee & we talked about what had happened before, during & after d day. He seemed very confused still & upset that by re-opening the door by contacting me, he had re-opened a painful situation for me. He wants to work at his M but felt that he had unfinished business with me at the same time. He told me that I had gotten into his blood & he didn't want to lose or hurt me. His W called whilst we were there & accused him of being with me, which obviously he denied. At one point he hinted that he could give me a list of dates & times when he was available for us to meet but at another point, he almost asked me for more time to work on his M (as if I was the one to have broken NC!).

 

The whole situation was hard to bear & I know it cannot continue. He held me & kissed me before we went our separate ways, which was bitter sweet. I am speaking to him again in the morning & am almost sure that I will end things with him. I cannot live like this & much as I love him, it doesn't make sense to me what he is doing? I genuinely do not believe that he is trying to hurt me though.

 

Am I right to end things & can anyone please, please help me interpret what is causing his erratic behaviour?

 

My true feelings are that: you need to develop a stronger sense of self and stop behaving like a second class citizen in your own life. You seem very unsure about EVERYTHING. This situation won't be the last of your troubles and I think you should end it and begin to work on yourself and your life and where to go from here as you seem to be existing on a VERY shaky foundation.

[MissBee]

I can help you intrepret, though it will be the same thing you have already been told and chosen to ignore.

 

1) he is a user.

 

2) you are allowing yourself to be used

 

3) you don't want to except you will be the OW until it no longer suits him or his wife finds out

 

4) he sat in your face and lied to the woman who he says he is working on his marriage with, but you are sitting around trying to figure out what he means by meeting with you? It means he is a LIAR.

 

5) you don't believe fat meat is greasy and you need to find out for yourself.

 

6) you like the drama and thrive on the mess.

 

7)you need to blame your actions on somebody other than yourself

 

8)There is no real update you are just re-framing the same mess with a different frame.

 

Take your pick..though we know you won't.

 

Ditto to everything...

 

Crazychick is indeed living up to her name.

 

Her life is a hot mess and her sense of self and boundaries is non-existent....some women seem to have a semblance of having it together in their OW situation (albeit most times it is just an appearance of it) whereas she is the classic example of a woman being used, abused with no mind of her own to even make decisions about what to do for herself and her situation. 45 different threads about the same thing, all the while belittling herself and placing everything on the shoulders of this man and then at the same time admitting she is insane and foolish... It is very sad. I really do hope though that after she flogs this dead horse to a bloody pulp, she sees how ridiculous the entire thing is and takes the leap to get her self esteem and life in order.

[NoIDidn't]

He intends to stay married and still wants to see me is what his actions seem to be screaming to me. I once dated this type of guy as the OW. But I didn't want to be the OW so I left. After I left, a few years actually, he told me he wanted to keep me on as his mistress after he married the other girl.

 

These kinds don't get divorced unless it is against their will. The real development will take place when you decide what you want out of this.

[Crazy chick1]

We've spoken this morning & I've asked the questions I needed answers for & he admitted some things & denied others. But the real answer appears to be that he is totally confused & his head's in a mess.

 

The scene has been set to end communications today, after we have had one last conversation this afternoon. I am going to tell him that if & when he makes a decision & if it is to come to me, I will speak to him again. If he chooses his M & wants nothing more than an A, he need not come to me. It really hurts though....

[whichwayisup]

We've spoken this morning & I've asked the questions I needed answers for & he admitted some things & denied others. But the real answer appears to be that he is totally confused & his head's in a mess.

 

The scene has been set to end communications today, after we have had one last conversation this afternoon. I am going to tell him that if & when he makes a decision & if it is to come to me, I will speak to him again. If he chooses his M & wants nothing more than an A, he need not come to me. It really hurts though....

 

Why are you two (you) prolonging this? One more talk/conversation?

 

I hope you can follow through on ending it and staying in NC mode once and for all so YOU can allow the healing process to begin to take place, so you can truly let go and grieve. Finality.

[20Seconds]

Why are you two (you) prolonging this? One more talk/conversation?

 

I think this happens, I know I did it.

 

Trouble is, you keep somehow hoping that during that "last" conversation they will suddenly transform into the Prince / Knight in Shining Armour declaring their love for you and that they will do anything for you to be together, and everyone will live happily ever after.

 

This man is a frog, CC, he's already shown you that, and no amount of kissing by a princess is going to turn him into anything else.

 

I hope you go NC today.

[BB07]

My true feelings are that: you need to develop a stronger sense of self and stop behaving like a second class citizen in your own life. You seem very unsure about EVERYTHING. This situation won't be the last of your troubles and I think you should end it and begin to work on yourself and your life and where to go from here as you seem to be existing on a VERY shaky foundation.

 

Great post MissBee and also Bent!

 

Bent made some awesome points that you really need to read and read again CC.

[Crazy chick1]

Firstly, thankyou to all you lovely members on LS. You have offered me great advice & largely I have gone against it. This is the last time I will be posting on here as I am simply wasting your time.

 

I tried to end it this afternoon, but ultimately I ended up in tears unable to accept that me & MM would never speak or see each other again. He told me that he didn't want to let me go, but would for my sake if it was what I really wanted. He is adamant that he loves both me & his W & that deciding to stay with her was the hardest decision of his life. I realise that we both have qualities & offer different things to him & I can understand why he stayed with her. I guess the day will come when I can no longer bear being in this A, but I love him completely & just don't know how to find the strength to go NC. I also know that the longer this situation continues, the worse it will become. I feel defeated right now & realise the hold MM has got over me (& know also that he realises too).

 

How I wish I'd never become embroiled in this mess. Thanks again for trying to help me.

[whichwayisup]

Now is not the time to disappear from this place! You need encouragement and strength to end it. And you WILL when you can't take it anymore and when you've had enough.

 

Start slow. Start by not allowing yourself to rely on him for your happiness. If you can't talk to him because you're out and busy (and DO live your life, see friends, family) it's OK. Detach from him.. If you can do tiny steps to get to the bigger picture YOU WILL see that you won't die if it ends and you never hear from him again. i know you're scared of letting go and it being 'final'. The grieving and giving up hope.

 

Also, stop giving yourself that bit of hope that there's a chance. There isn't.

 

See him in a different light. IF he truly cared for you, he'd see how hard this is on you and stay away. He would see that you can't end it and can't say no to him.. Instead, he's selfishly manipulating you to keep you in HIS life for selfish reasons. Sorry, but that ain't love. Especially when he's TOLD YOU he loves his wife too.

 

Stay and keep posting. Read our advice and let it sink in. Take time to think about what it is you actually want. Stay the OW and live this life? Have continual pain or end it once and for all and know that pain WILL go away in time.

[bentnotbroken]

Firstly, thankyou to all you lovely members on LS. You have offered me great advice & largely I have gone against it. This is the last time I will be posting on here as I am simply wasting your time.

 

I tried to end it this afternoon, but ultimately I ended up in tears unable to accept that me & MM would never speak or see each other again. He told me that he didn't want to let me go, but would for my sake if it was what I really wanted. He is adamant that he loves both me & his W & that deciding to stay with her was the hardest decision of his life. I realise that we both have qualities & offer different things to him & I can understand why he stayed with her. I guess the day will come when I can no longer bear being in this A, but I love him completely & just don't know how to find the strength to go NC. I also know that the longer this situation continues, the worse it will become. I feel defeated right now & realise the hold MM has got over me (& know also that he realises too).

 

How I wish I'd never become embroiled in this mess. Thanks again for trying to help me.

 

 

Anybody else shocked by this response.

[Trimmer]

I guess the day will come when I can no longer bear being in this A, but I love him completely & just don't know how to find the strength to go NC. I also know that the longer this situation continues, the worse it will become.

That seems likely, especially since his wife already knows about you, and even as he is claiming to try to "work on" his marriage (which now everyone but his wife knows is a sham...) she still suspects him - correctly! - of being with you. It's not "paranoid" when they're really out to get you...

 

I feel defeated right now & realise the hold MM has got over me ...

This helpless attitude is one of your biggest obstacles, and will become a significant source of anguish. Yielding control to him is a natural tendency, because now you can claim that it's not your choice, that you have no power or control.

 

But in the end it just diminishes you. Admit and accept: you are making a choice, and you have the power to control your life and walk away, but you have chosen otherwise. Owning this is the first step to controlling the situation and your life.

[MissBee]

That seems likely, especially since his wife already knows about you, and even as he is claiming to try to "work on" his marriage (which now everyone but his wife knows is a sham...) she still suspects him - correctly! - of being with you. It's not "paranoid" when they're really out to get you...

 

 

This helpless attitude is one of your biggest obstacles, and will become a significant source of anguish. Yielding control to him is a natural tendency, because now you can claim that it's not your choice, that you have no power or control.

 

But in the end it just diminishes you. Admit and accept: you are making a choice, and you have the power to control your life and walk away, but you have chosen otherwise. Owning this is the first step to controlling the situation and your life.

 

 

Yepp!

 

No one can help those who won't help themselves...no therapist, psychologist, LS members etc.

 

So I wish Crazychick well and I hope a torrential downpour of illumination and strength befalls her, but as you said, with this helpless, I'm-a-dandelion-floating-in-the-wind or I'm-a-poor mouse-with-an-elephant-on my-tail attitude will keep her in the situation indefinitely.

[jj33]

We've spoken this morning & I've asked the questions I needed answers for & he admitted some things & denied others. But the real answer appears to be that he is totally confused & his head's in a mess.

 

The scene has been set to end communications today, after we have had one last conversation this afternoon. I am going to tell him that if & when he makes a decision & if it is to come to me, I will speak to him again. If he chooses his M & wants nothing more than an A, he need not come to me. It really hurts though....

 

 

Thats very wise. Who knows whether he is confused, whether he may leave in a year or 5, whether he is using you. We have no idea.

 

What we do know is that he is sitting there with you denying your existence and asking you for more time to work on his marriage.

 

You are doing the right thing walking away. It takes time to get over people. Give yourself a head start. If he comes back great if he doesnt you have started the healing process.