Awkward dinner with AP and W

[Lizzie60]

So last night I attended a small dinner party (8 people) and my AP and W were there. In the days leading up to it, I was nervous, but there was no real excuse to get out of it.

 

We are all in the same profession, and the hostess is a mutual friend (obviously) who knows that there is chemistry between us, though she doesn't know that we're in a relationship.

 

It was very interesting to observe the interactions between him and his W. She is very reserved/introverted and she doesn't drink. She spent most of the evening sitting quietly, looking downright bored to tears by the end of the evening. My AP is the LIFE of the party. It is such a weird mix.

 

Normally she would not join him at dinner parties like that, or if she did, she'd leave right after dinner. They've been living like that for nearly 10 years. He "behaves" while she is there for a meal, then has fun when she leaves. How unsatisfying!

 

Anyway, ever since he told her he wants to end their relationship, she's been trying harder to make him happy and do the things he wants to do. Hence, she stayed at the party all evening. They didn't speak to one another almost at all.

 

When she did speak, it was to share sarcastic jabs about him with the group.

 

I know I'm not going to be very objective on this one -- biased by my love for him -- but they are not well matched.

 

He and I are very similar in that we both like social gatherings, we are both extroverts, we both like to be active in conversations, we're both very animated and we both like to drink socially!

 

I know he is not going to leave his M unless they come to some amicable understanding about shared custody and not putting the kids through a tug game... but after what I saw last night, I don't see how he can possibly stay.

 

Anyway, just thought i'd share.

 

I have not read the whole thread.. but IMO, he will never leave, why would he?

 

Men usually don't leave because they don't want to lose anything they've earned (house, pension, etc.) but mostly they don't want to be separated from their kids.

[donnamaybe]

Yes, I realise that. I see the judgements and the attitudes that follow. This is not news.

It's now odd to "judge" AKA find fault with someone who has an attitude of "F everyone, 'cause it's all about ME ME ME?"

[Silly_Girl]

It's now odd to "judge" AKA find fault with someone who has an attitude of "F everyone, 'cause it's all about ME ME ME?"

 

I didn't say that.

 

Fact is you have a remarkable talent for twisting people's words and seeing what serves you. You do it here but, like me, you're not only what is seen in text on a forum. You have a wider understanding... lots of us do. But here it's not always used to its full potential, because that's how it has to be. Or will be, rather. We both know that

[Silly_Girl]

Easy. You don't condone their actions and you don't associate with them. I respect the rules within the confines of this forum. However IRL, I would never associate with someone like you and others of your ilk.

 

How does that work in your life? Do you vet potential friends? Give them questionnaires as to their previous sexual partners? Run crime checks on them?

 

Do you drop friends who have been cheated on of they're reconciling with their husband? To save you associating with such creatures? After all, they've accepted the cheater in their life, shown forgiveness. As have many on this board, on both sides of the fence.

 

I think you could be missing out...

[thomasb]

I have not read the whole thread.. but IMO, he will never leave, why would he?

 

Men usually don't leave because they don't want to lose anything they've earned (house, pension, etc.) but mostly they don't want to be separated from their kids.

 

 

 

I get tired of that statement. I am glad the 'kids' involved in our situation were my wifes. At least she knew I wanted to save our marriage was because I loved her.

[donnamaybe]

Fact is you have a remarkable talent for twisting people's words and seeing what serves you.

Oh, the irony!

[Silly_Girl]

Oh, the irony!

 

 

<splutter!!!>

 

You're an old hand. I learned from the master....

[donnamaybe]

Ah, never mind... lol

Edited June 23, 2011 by donnamaybe

[pureinheart]

Easy. You don't condone their actions and you don't associate with them. I respect the rules within the confines of this forum. However IRL, I would never associate with someone like you and others of your ilk.

 

I'm priddy sure that is mutual:D

[pureinheart]

So last night I attended a small dinner party (8 people) and my AP and W were there. In the days leading up to it, I was nervous, but there was no real excuse to get out of it.

 

We are all in the same profession, and the hostess is a mutual friend (obviously) who knows that there is chemistry between us, though she doesn't know that we're in a relationship.

 

It was very interesting to observe the interactions between him and his W. She is very reserved/introverted and she doesn't drink. She spent most of the evening sitting quietly, looking downright bored to tears by the end of the evening. My AP is the LIFE of the party. It is such a weird mix.

 

Normally she would not join him at dinner parties like that, or if she did, she'd leave right after dinner. They've been living like that for nearly 10 years. He "behaves" while she is there for a meal, then has fun when she leaves. How unsatisfying!

 

Anyway, ever since he told her he wants to end their relationship, she's been trying harder to make him happy and do the things he wants to do. Hence, she stayed at the party all evening. They didn't speak to one another almost at all.

 

When she did speak, it was to share sarcastic jabs about him with the group.

 

I know I'm not going to be very objective on this one -- biased by my love for him -- but they are not well matched.

 

He and I are very similar in that we both like social gatherings, we are both extroverts, we both like to be active in conversations, we're both very animated and we both like to drink socially!

 

I know he is not going to leave his M unless they come to some amicable understanding about shared custody and not putting the kids through a tug game... but after what I saw last night, I don't see how he can possibly stay.

 

Anyway, just thought i'd share.

 

Hey Cabin....thanks for sharing:D, and hoping you are ok.

 

I love parties, and personally would find it hard to be with an introvert. In bold- this could be the main reason they are splitting up. The worst thing IMO a person can do to a man is embarrass him in that fashion and others. I've talked to many men and lack of respect by talking crap was the main nail in the coffin.

 

Airing personal business is another way to loose a man REAL quick. At this point they detach and are eventually gone. I feel the same way men do on both these points and agree and totally understand.

 

Good luck Cabin and glad to see you on LS!

[2sunny]

my sister and her H are very healthy together, yet when they socialize... she stays very quiet (not her nature in the comfort of her own home) while her H plays the extroverted social role in THOSE situations.

 

anyone looking at THAT - would not understand the way things REALLY are when they are home.

 

they have been married more than 30 years... and still extremely happy.

[Glinda]

How does that work in your life? Do you vet potential friends? Give them questionnaires as to their previous sexual partners? Run crime checks on them?

 

Do you drop friends who have been cheated on of they're reconciling with their husband? To save you associating with such creatures? After all, they've accepted the cheater in their life, shown forgiveness. As have many on this board, on both sides of the fence.

 

I think you could be missing out...

You are blinded by arrogance if you think there is any comparison to a BS that reconciles with a remorseful spouse and an affair advocate such as yourself who intentionally hurts others and encourages others to do the same.

[Mme. Chaucer]

One of the most offensive aspects of many posts by women who are having affairs with married men, for me, is the frequent analyzing, denigrating, judging, and personal-information-sharing about the betrayed wife. I can't think of ever seeing a man who's poking another guy's wife ragging on like this about the betrayed husband, though I certainly could have missed something along the way.

 

When ANY woman comes on here with stuff about the wife, I immediately go into "dislike" mode and can't really empathize with her about anything.

 

Why is this so common? Do many women find it necessary to think poorly of their AP's wife in order to justify what they're doing? And if this is indeed the case, WHY must they share it with thousands of strangers over the Internet? Does it serve to assuage guilt? What purpose can it serve? It just seems to add so much sort of Karmic "evil" to an already difficult situation that is inherently fraught with features that we culturally despise (but which can be exciting, like most forbidden things) like deceit, abandonment and betrayal

 

I can't relate. I have shared here before that I messed around with a married man when I was very young; he was my boss. I was EXTREMELY flattered that this man (a published poet! a university professor! gorgeous!) bothered with little old me. I thought his wife was a GODDESS (I didn't know her, just had seen her) and this made me even MORE over the moon that he "wanted me."

 

I was just as self centered and destructive as anybody else engaged in that behavior, but honestly, I did not even think for a moment about his marriage, his relations with his wife, her character, health and shortcomings.

 

Also, I had the role of "cheater." I NEVER thought my boyfriend (whom I cheated on) was a jerk or "deserved" it in any way. I just got swept away by idiocy when I encountered a very compelling ex of mine. It had NOTHING to do with my poor betrayed boyfriend; everything to do with me having no impulse control, wanting what I wanted, being a raging asshat and supremely self centered and again, DESTRUCTIVE.

 

Disclaimer: I am not proud of, or even okay with my behavior in those situations (though I'm many years past beating myself up about them). I don't think I cheated or helped a man cheat any "better" than anyone else around; I am just having so much trouble relating to that very common aspect of the threads started here.

[OldOnTheInside]

I can't think of ever seeing a man who's poking another guy's wife ragging on like this about the betrayed husband, though I certainly could have missed something along the way.

 

This is interesting...

 

I have been friends/acquaintances with a handful of OMs in the past, and a curious trend I've noticed is that there is very little malicious commentary on the gf/MW's partner.

 

Usually it's either sympathy or apathy. Very rare is the "hurr durr, I bet he has a small c*ck."

 

Just my experience of course.

[MissBee]

One of the most offensive aspects of many posts by women who are having affairs with married men, for me, is the frequent analyzing, denigrating, judging, and personal-information-sharing about the betrayed wife. I can't think of ever seeing a man who's poking another guy's wife ragging on like this about the betrayed husband, though I certainly could have missed something along the way.

 

When ANY woman comes on here with stuff about the wife, I immediately go into "dislike" mode and can't really empathize with her about anything.

 

Why is this so common? Do many women find it necessary to think poorly of their AP's wife in order to justify what they're doing? And if this is indeed the case, WHY must they share it with thousands of strangers over the Internet? Does it serve to assuage guilt? What purpose can it serve? It just seems to add so much sort of Karmic "evil" to an already difficult situation that is inherently fraught with features that we culturally despise (but which can be exciting, like most forbidden things) like deceit, abandonment and betrayal

Mme. Chaucer:

 

I think that a lot of women have a competitive attitude when it comes on to other women. I have no idea if it has been artificially induced by society or it's hardwiring, but it exists. Think about the idea that many women dress up not for men but for other women, so that other women can comment or that we can have a nicer dress than this other women, cuter shoes, blah blah, because let's face it, half the time, men aren't invested in that sort of thing, but our girlfriends are as well as other females....so we do it for that sake.

 

I think feeling prettier, smarter, cuter etc. than another women esp with regards to a man in the middle as the prize validates many women. I heard a story recently from a friend who is a counselor, where a mother and daughter came in for counseling, as the father was molesting the daughter and the mom's response, instead of being mad at her husband was accusing the daughter of "f**king her man"! I was appalled. But it is not uncommon that in some dysfunctional scenarios, the mother has a rival type relationship with her daughter vying for the father's attention.

 

I remember when my ex and I broke up...I had some huge sense of relief and accomplishment when I felt like his new flings weren't as pretty or smart or could cook as well as I could My bestfriend is a lesbian and feels like she doesn't think like a "normal woman", she commented to me on the fact that her gf was always asking if she thought other women were pretty or prettier than her and that she herself never thought of such things and it must be " a woman thing".

 

I think self worth and self esteem issues hit women a lot harder than it does men or in a different way at least and one way it shows up is in the competitive attitude women display; seeing other women as enemies and threats and therefore there is a preoccupation with asserting one's self as somehow better and more of something than another woman. For affairs to be conducted though, I think the ingredient of feeling special has to exist,so that also factors in. If you are no prettier, smarter, sexier, sensual, caring, outgoing than the wife and a man were to tell you, you're just like her or she's actually better or if it weren't you, it would have been someone else, I doubt many women would bother to do it.

Edited June 24, 2011 by MissBee

[NoIDidn't]

This is interesting...

 

I have been friends/acquaintances with a handful of OMs in the past, and a curious trend I've noticed is that there is very little malicious commentary on the gf/MW's partner.

 

Usually it's either sympathy or apathy. Very rare is the "hurr durr, I bet he has a small c*ck."

 

Just my experience of course.

 

One of my friends picks married women to sleep with because he believes they must be bored with their husbands by now. He doesn't feel anything about the husbands, and is really only using the wives for his own sexual needs.

 

But yeah, no real denigrating talk about husbands from him either. At least nothing to the level of comparing himself with the husband over and over again.

[OldOnTheInside]

One of my friends picks married women to sleep with because he believes they must be bored with their husbands by now. He doesn't feel anything about the husbands, and is really only using the wives for his own sexual needs.

 

But yeah, no real denigrating talk about husbands from him either. At least nothing to the level of comparing himself with the husband over and over again.

 

I think that it's a "guy thing". Band of Brothers and all that...

 

Two OMs stand out. First guy is basically a player. He's not an apologist about what he does. Pretty much in the middle when it comes to sympathy and apathy. "Hey, I know how you feel buddy and it hurts, but that's life".

 

Second guy is a fOM. I think that he is more like FC, East, and carhill. Basically not in the best place in his life. And, yeah, he was sympathetic towards the BH, especially when the affair came to light. No happy endings for either him or the BH.

 

When I found out that I was an OM, I pretty much wanted to get the hell out. But I was quite sympathetic towards the BH.

[John Michael Kane]

When I found out that I was an OM, I pretty much wanted to get the hell out. But I was quite sympathetic towards the BH.

 

So did you leave immediately?

[OldOnTheInside]

So did you leave immediately?

 

I bet I'm on your watchlist now...

 

Ended the relationship but continued speaking to her on-off for just under a month, decided that it wasn't worth it for MW, BH, and myself. Even if the journey had a happy ending, the journey itself would've been too much pain for everyone. She said that she wanted to work on the marriage...probably a lie. Went NC which was fairly easy due to her level of deception.

 

Although, if it makes you feel any better, hubby was already onto her early on in our relationship. So it's not like I left him in complete ignorance. He phoned me up about a year later too. Apparently he'd been working two low paying jobs to feed the kids, so he had less time at home for his wife. Nice.

 

Sad thing is, I knew her for nearly eight years beforehand. Her lying about being divorced, well, it left me displeased.

[Silly_Girl]

You are blinded by arrogance if you think there is any comparison to a BS that reconciles with a remorseful spouse and an affair advocate such as yourself who intentionally hurts others and encourages others to do the same.

 

Both the OW and BS are with a remorseful WS... and both 'condone' the cheating by not banishing that person from their life the way you would do.

 

But anyway, how are you going to ensure you and I don't accidentally become pals in five years time, gg? How are you going to protect yourself from accidentally starting a friendship with someone who seems cool, happy, settled, but who met and married the father of her kids years before and he was married in the beginning? How do you ensure none of your current friends have something going on the side? I'm just interested.

 

Do you ban other categories of people from your life?

 

I guess whilst I can see your view, and your suffering must colour that, it must be hard to live with that mindset and being so hardened in terms of people you encounter. I'm not sure I'd have the time or energy to judge everyone in my life and score whether they're worthy of being around me based on their past behaviours. Life is too short for that, for me.

[Silly_Girl]

One of my friends picks married women to sleep with because he believes they must be bored with their husbands by now. He doesn't feel anything about the husbands, and is really only using the wives for his own sexual needs.

 

But yeah, no real denigrating talk about husbands from him either. At least nothing to the level of comparing himself with the husband over and over again.

 

Is a difference because he's just banging them and has no long-term interest in being with them?

[Mme. Chaucer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoIDidn't

One of my friends picks married women to sleep with because he believes they must be bored with their husbands by now. He doesn't feel anything about the husbands, and is really only using the wives for his own sexual needs.

 

But yeah, no real denigrating talk about husbands from him either. At least nothing to the level of comparing himself with the husband over and over again.

 

Is a difference because he's just banging them and has no long-term interest in being with them?

 

Are you saying that if he did have long-term interest, he would be talking nonstop about the MW's husband and all of his perceived shortcomings, like so many of the women involved with married men here on LS do?

[Silly_Girl]

Exactly, Kilmeny. Ta.

[Mme. Chaucer]

The worst thing IMO a person can do to a man is embarrass him in that fashion and others. I've talked to many men and lack of respect by talking crap was the main nail in the coffin.

 

I KNOW. Can you imagine? She's at a party with only 7 other people, among them her husband, "the life of the party," (seriously - what 8 guest professional dinner party needs a "life of the party." Was there lampshade wearing to be enjoyed?) and his side dish. What a BITTER beeyotch she must be to make any sarcastic remarks about him. A real good wife would only say sweet and flattering things, even though she might be in utter desperation about her marriage falling apart, and be having tremendous difficulty being put in this disgusting situation.

 

Plus, she is a boring INTROVERT. Yuck. It's hard to imagine how she even dares to live, much less to be married to "the life of the party" and actually accompany him TO a party.

 

Loser!

[BB07]

I KNOW. Can you imagine? She's at a party with only 7 other people, among them her husband, "the life of the party," (seriously - what 8 guest professional dinner party needs a "life of the party." Was there lampshade wearing to be enjoyed?) and his side dish. What a BITTER beeyotch she must be to make any sarcastic remarks about him. A real good wife would only say sweet and flattering things, even though she might be in utter desperation about her marriage falling apart, and be having tremendous difficulty being put in this disgusting situation.

 

Plus, she is a boring INTROVERT. Yuck. It's hard to imagine how she even dares to live, much less to be married to "the life of the party" and actually accompany him TO a party.

 

Loser!

 

 

:lmao: