Love possible in A?

[wheelwright]

This could be its own thread; a lot to think about.

 

I wonder how many long-married people here relate to the stat that 90% of arguments are unsolvable?

 

I definitely feel that we come to mutually agreeable solutions MOST of the time.....but it is never my way or his way. We consider my way and his way starting points of the conversation, not ending points. OUR way is almost always a much better idea than what I or he thought of alone.

 

I would hesitantly suggest that it is not the fact of arguing which determines success, but the treatment during and after. The attitude of listening to the other's view or not etc.

 

Although some people rub along quite nicely and disagree rarely, they may come unstuck if they are not able to be respectful when they do disagree.

[wheelwright]

It think that fits in. In the beginning, the flaws are commonly minimized--even considered part of what makes the person unique and special.

 

For me, it was 2-7 years later when his "special" way of chewing got oh-so annoying Along with a few other things that became "issues". For others, some issues become intolerable, or ar realized to be unacceptable.

 

Now, at year 20ish, I still see the same flaws, but differently again. Annoying, but who cares? Leave him be.

 

I think bolded is a lovely way to feel. I think it's exactly how flaws are dealt with in love Rs.

[wheelwright]

Almost the exact same words I used with my best friend about 6 months in to the relationship!!

 

Would you say the 'leave him be' way of feeling that xxoo describes can set in so early? I think perhaps it can.

[xxoo]

Would you say the 'leave him be' way of feeling that xxoo describes can set in so early? I think perhaps it can.

 

I don't think that is something you can know without the hindsight of the subsequent 7-10 years together.

 

I thought I accepted my H as he is when I married him, at year 3ish of the relationship. Turns out, not quite

[MissBee]

It think that fits in. In the beginning, the flaws are commonly minimized--even considered part of what makes the person unique and special.

 

For me, it was 2-7 years later when his "special" way of chewing got oh-so annoying Along with a few other things that became "issues". For others, some issues become intolerable, or ar realized to be unacceptable.

 

Now, at year 20ish, I still see the same flaws, but differently again. Annoying, but who cares? Leave him be.

 

The flaws are super cute and quirky in the beginning

 

Which is why when my friend was telling me about some dude she just started seeing ...and ALL she had to say were negative things, I was telling her she doesn't really like him, because people who are madly in like with another, even their flaws are cute and great or minimized. The fact that all she had to say were negatives was quite a testament to her real feelings.

[ladydesigner]

I also believe that a profound and deep falling in love experience (or limerance as you call it) will offer shades and echoes that resonate for a couple throughout their time together, and sustain couples in times of disillusionment, and that the latter does not go so deep for such couples.

 

Great post WW! It is the bolded that I think I am still married to my H. This entire thread has been so enjoyable to read, thank you for starting it!

[Tenacity]

Hi Tenacity. Yes it was you I was referring to. You have cleared up my misconception here, thanks.

 

I do think it's important to mark out differences between unhealthy addictions and love which has a wonderful potential to bring happiness.

 

I hope you are doing OK in your current situation. You sound very grounded and strong here, so perhaps you are feeling better.

 

Thanks wheelwright. I am doing better, thanks to all of you

[wheelwright]

Great post WW! It is the bolded that I think I am still married to my H. This entire thread has been so enjoyable to read, thank you for starting it!

 

I am very glad for you LD. There is a sense of relief and appreciation for your M in your current posts that wasn't there a year or so ago.

 

It has been a very unbashy thread, while still offering food for thought. It also helped me develop my thoughts, and thank all posters on it for that.

[Got it]

Yes for us it was love and the love as continued growing and deepening as the years have gone on.

 

Falling in love has addictive characteristics, that is why some people get addicted to it.

 

But falling in love, what a wonderful thing!

[Owl]

I just wanted to add on the subject of 'limerance' . When I have felt this, it has not involved overlooking a person's flaws. It has involved seeing flaws quite clearly, but finding the person as a whole beautiful still.

 

Is that allowed in the stages theory?

 

Interesting view.

 

My observations have been that no one will ever ADMIT that they're overlooking another person's flaws, even to themselves.

 

In fact, my wife said nearly identical words when she was still in "limerance" over her OM.

 

The truth is...it's not "overlooking" the flaws...it's minimizing them. People in this phase will never admit to overlooking the flaws, instead, the mentally minimize or find ways to reduce those flaws to the point of being meaningless.

 

Example...OM smoked. Had smoked for YEARS. My wife was/is very allergic to cigarette smoke, both new (firsthand) and what's often embedded in the clothes/furniture/belongings of someone who smokes in their home/car.

 

When I pointed this out to her while she was still in limerance, she said "oh, he's quitting so he can be with me".

 

Totally refused to consider the difficulties of him actually implementing that strategy or the odds that he'd be successful, and completely disregarded and blinded herself to the fact that she'd have had horrible asthmatic reactions had she actually gone to live with him, due to all of the buildup of old smoke in everything he owned.

 

She saw the flaws...but she refused to give them any due consideration.

 

This sounds eerily similar to what I see in your statement, WW. It would suggest to me that you never came out of the "limerance state" with your OM...in fact, most of what you post suggests that you haven't, which is what I would consider as the single greatest reason your attempts to recover your marrage were unsuccessful.

 

I don't believe that your H stood a chance to actually reconcile with you. Your focus never left OM. There was no hope for your M until that happened, and I don't believe it's happened even as of today.

[xxoo]

This sounds eerily similar to what I see in your statement, WW. It would suggest to me that you never came out of the "limerance state" with your OM.

 

Wheel, I'm curious about why you think you did move past the limerance stage. Did you go through a period of disillusionment and feel that you moved past it?

[Glinda]

Love is scary. It is bigger than we are.

 

I used to fear that my love A was a symptom of my being f**ked up.

 

This was a horrible fear. It made me lose faith in everything.

 

I don't think people who have fallen in love should be steered towards this way of thinking.

 

I think we should be glad to follow our hearts. Love is a better guide than fear. Unless the fear is about something concrete - too often it is about the shadow bogeymen of having to please others, feeling undeserving, or preferring to be a stone instead of a warm hearted life lover.

 

I would say to people who have fallen in love and lost, embrace your experience, never fear yourself or your heart, and remain compassionate to self and others while following the path you need to take.

"Some have a very romantic notion of what love can do. Love can do so many things, but saving people from themselves isn't one of them."

[MissBee]

"Some have a very romantic notion of what love can do. Love can do so many things, but saving people from themselves isn't one of them."

 

 

Love that!