Author cheergirl Posted July 3, 2011 Author Share Posted July 3, 2011 You have been extremely judgmental in your replies - calling posters bitter, etc. So please refrain from saying you aren't judgemental when clearly you are. Everyone judges others, but you have been down right rude and snarky in several responses the purpose of that post was really just to put the shoe on the other foot... It's easy to not be nice. This was me doing what many others have been doing. Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 3, 2011 Author Share Posted July 3, 2011 All I can say to that is, the title of your thread put people off. Not all who responded are part of an affair triangle! Also, if you went into a room full of 200 people and said what you've said on here, you'd have the same reaction. Some would be disguisted, some would be offended, some would be supportive, some would agree, some wouldn't, some wouldn't care either way.. Take the good with the bad and go from there. Yeah i got that (finally) and apologised for causing offence, alarm etc. not for my opinion To reiterate, NOT trying to offend or push anyone's buttons. Just being honest, which, apparently, is offensive to many people. You're right. I'm sure there are some BS's who aren't perfect saints, but that isn't a justification for a WS to go and cheat, have an affair. Each person in the marriage is responsible for issues and problems in the marriage.. A BS doesn't hold a gun to the WS's head and say "cheat" he/she does that all on their own, by choice. "I'm sure there are some BS's who aren't perfect saints"!!!??? I'm sorry I don't know one person who is a perfect saint. Not one! We are all just people. People have EMAs for a million different reasons, and just because a lot of people hold the default position of "It's just 100% wrong!" Doesn't mean others are not entitled to their opinions without being jumped on and slandered. Like what has happened on this thread.... Link to post Share on other sites
Scarlett77 Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Good on you for sharing what you feel, and not putting up with some of the insane bull**** posted here. I withdrew from LS after being attacked. Funnily enough, the ignorant attacks ended up reinforcing to me that my love for my MM is right for me( at this time) I dint wish you" the best of luck" I just wish you to keep on being you:) and when I ever work out the PM thing , please email me. I have read some of your other posts , on different threads, and you stood out as a voice of reason, in this sheep, take no responsibility for your life, world:)))) Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 I want relationship (of a particular type) and he does too. He likes certain things, his wife doesn't. Apparently she knows, (but does she? and do I care? not really) all i want is a bit of romance, fun, and some intelligent conversation...He can provide all those things. Once a month/fortnight? Fine... I'm divorced very busy w/family so I don't want a man in my house again; not looking for him to leave his wife family. I couldn't possibly look after a man full-time again...But P/T, yes... Happily... I've been told by exes that i am like a guy in a lot of ways. I'm always the 1st to fall asleep after, when he wants to talk and cuddle, but the up side is I am praised highly for not nagging or bitching. I don't recognise myself in a lot of these scenarios I've read about here... I cannot see myself sitting home pining for this chap. Just not the type, not looking for anything anymore permanent or fixed than it works out to be. Hold on loosely, Que Sera,sera and all that... Anyone else like me out there? Yep.. ME.. I am just like you.. do not need a man full time.. in fact, I love my space too much... In a way, we are the perfect OW.. we do NOT want them to leave their family.. Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 It sounds to me like subconsciously you want to impress us (and basically, yourself) with your coolness. Uh no.... I have never been a "cool" person, rather too warm if anything. I am a heart on my sleeve type person, not cool... If you really feel cool about what you're doing then why do you need to come to this forum and boast about how not fazed you feel about it all? Who's boasting? I am not fazed, nothing to boast about just a statement of fact. You say you want to find other women like you, but I'm not buying that. Of course you know what I really think and feel... Why would you want to do that? To exchange notes on how to get the man you say you don't want to get, or to form a "support group for the tough-nut OW who don't need support"? I don't need notes on how to get a man... I would try to explain but I assume by the emotionally-charged tone of your reply that you would not understand, and probably never will. You seem unable to separate your experience from mine and in so doing, render any possible further discourse as meaningless. You will use me to vent anger at your situation and no meaningful communication will happen. Tell me I'm wrong... I don't mean to be ironic so I'll just be direct; I feel you're not in touch with your emotions at all, Wrong and at your age (you hint that you're not that young) did I? where? I'm not sure it's something to be proud of. Bingo! the moralistic judgement flounce. I am very much in touch w/my feelings Miss Red, but, listen carefully, MY feelings are just different to yours, okay? we are different people d-i-f-f-e-r-e-n-t-, okay?Hope this helps... Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 but here's the thing... it goes both ways... many "other men/other women" feel that they were "seduced" by the big , bad evil married man/women. I will certainly grant that there was probably a lot of lying going on, etc. - but the affair partner chose to believe the lies, etc.. Take responsibility However- there may have been "mitigating circumstances"- maybe the "other man/woman" was in a very vulnerable time in their life, maybe they were naive, maybe they were lied to and had their whole rational decision making process "turned upside down"- who knows. grow up and take respomsibility But if this can be said for the "other man/other woman", then the same can certainly be said for the "wayward spouse" as well. Maybe they feel they were "seduced" by the big, bad evil affair partner. Maybe they were in a really vulnerable time in their life, maybe they were naive, maybe they were lied to and had their whole "rational thinking process" turned upside down-again, who knows. again, take responsibility I certainly am no "expert", but from reading a lot of posts on here it really does seem as if the human psyche is a hugely complicated thing, and it may not be as simple as "you can't steal what is freely given", because, if it was, then no person who was hurt by another in a romantic relationship would ever be deserving of one iota of sympathy (e.g.- a woman who gets lied to by a married guy, starts an affair with him- he keeps lying, she keeps believing and , in the end, she gets terribly hurt) when their choices cause them pain. deserving of sympathy? what will my or anyone else's sympathy do to help her life. this sounds like choosing to be a victim to me. take responsibility BTW (and I could be totally wrong here, and if I am, I apologize for it) but it seems as if the original poster was badly hurt in her marriage and is trying to protect herself from being hurt again. If this is the case, I am so sorry that she got hurt like that...I guess I'll never understand the way people can hurt others like that Thank you for your kindness. Unfortunately, your assessment is incorrect. Just like the person who gave me a full psychological assessment based on a few posts and came up with dangerously unstable, disassociated with reality potential bunny-boiler nonsense; you are trying to understand a person who thinks very differently to you within your own mindset. Until you understand mine you can't. Kudos to you for having compassion in your heart and mind though, it starts and ends with that. I love your thoughtful, insightful post about learning something from everyone here. You sound like a lovely person... Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 Yep.. ME.. I am just like you.. do not need a man full time.. in fact, I love my space too much... In a way, we are the perfect OW.. we do NOT want them to leave their family.. Hi Lizzie, thanks for your response, apparently we are a rare breed... Now, I was thinking of writing an instructional manual of how to steal married men... KIDDING!!! lol... seriously though hope to hear form you on another thread! C Link to post Share on other sites
Steadfast Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 No matter how it's justified, no matter how many chime in with support (mostly I've noticed, because they desire to validate their own actions) pursuing any kind of gain at the expense of someone else is a documented dead end for everyone involved. How can one support such cruelty without first admitting they're emotionally desensitized? Does the fact that others have, are and will do the same justify it? Is true happiness possible when we unsympathetically wipe our feet on another person's feelings? The answer to these questions, is no. This is not a blanket judgement but the documented facts of those who have followed the same path before you. Those who later in life realized that what they saw as 'judgement' and 'closed mindedness' was actually an act of love and concern. That strong warning to cease and desist was given by those who truly cared the most. The 'attack' aspect is a real one; those who care the most will most certainly attack the cold, evil reality of your situation and do so with your best interests in mind. Otherwise it's a lose-lose, like sheep jumping off a cliff. Making a bad situation worse is categorizing the admonishment of those taking issue with your actions as controlling, judgmental and (most insulting) unintelligent. Isn't that the classic response for justifying anything? 'You're not intelligent enough to understand this'. Another lie! In my opinion, your post is a cry for help. You'll probably bristle but I'd wager that back-and-forth struggle is something you live with daily. Problem is, no amount of sex (no matter how thrilling) success, position, or admiration will fill the emptiness of a heart with no love. Real love. The kind of love that longs to give and is strengthened by crisis. The kind of love you deserve. Stop viewing discipline as the enemy and see it for what it really is. Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Hi Lizzie, thanks for your response, apparently we are a rare breed... Now, I was thinking of writing an instructional manual of how to steal married men... KIDDING!!! lol... seriously though hope to hear form you on another thread! C In a way, yes, we are a rare breed.. in the sense that we do not want any serious commitment with those men. I have flushed quite a few in the last few years.. I kept only the ones I prefer which means very few.. and we've been seeing each other for years... (my scout dad for example has been with me for over 9 years now). In a way, we are the best OWs a MM can have.. we are not emotionally attached to these men.. we just want to have sex.. that's all.. and they know it (in my case anyway).. and they also know that I will never ask them to leave their family... and they will never ask me to be 'exclusive'.. in fact, they never asked me if I was seeing other men.. they probably don't really care.. as long as I'm availabe when they want to see me, in a reasonable time frame... I am old enough to know what I want and what I don't want.. Plus I honestly think that my MMs return home happier, then in turn, makes their family happier (wife included). Link to post Share on other sites
tami-chan Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 I went back and re-read their posts and don't see them as nasty or rude. You may disagree, but dear cheergirl, these women have lived it. You may think you're having dialogue with a BS, but it very well be you're talking to an xOW who has been hurt deeply and is on the other side of that, trying to offer their experience to you. Not in a hurtful way, just truthful in their experience. I hope you find the answers you seek. If you're happy in your situation, go for it. If it goes south, there are some of us who have lived it and have come out on the other side. Actually, some were nasty and rude. Cheergirl clearly states why she posted. Some have asked her, why are you posting? to swap stories (DUH! )?; for support? etc.etc. Some responded by telling her what they think of her and labeling her all kinds of things. These are the same people who want, nay, demand respect but choose not to give respect to those who do not share their beliefs or their moral compass. Ahh...the irony ! Yes, it IS a public forum and to some it gives them a venue to vent their anger and yes, bitterness..albeit, misdirected. Cheergirl, as long as you can live with yourself and the fallout, what can anyone do really? Shaming you and making you feel guilty are ways cowards believe they can get an upper hand to those who are not afraid to break conventional practices. Take care. Link to post Share on other sites
tami-chan Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Not judging here, but this sounds like the oldest profession minus the payment. I love sex too, but wow. Just wow. You are not judging but felt the need to state that...why? Link to post Share on other sites
tami-chan Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 And as a woman you feel OK giving your precious body and your priceless femininity to a man who doesn't even like you enough to care if you're seeing other men? Would that be the same thing to those wives who are doing everything to keep their cheating husbands? You know, those types-hitting the gym and buying sexy lingerie to entice their husbands back? The same husbands who, respect, care and love them so much they CHOOSE to cheat on them? Oh that's different...! I see ! Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 Sorry if I mistook this to be an indication of your age, but it's safe to assume if you have kids and they are "too big" then you must be at least in your forties? Actually I've been where you are, I've been un-emotionally involved with a MM before, when I was 20 and I wasn't in touch with my feelings at all. I was on a power trip too (I didn't realize that back then but I do now) and I had a strikingly similar attitude to yours. I definitely didn't want him to leave his W (though I wouldn't be too displeased if he ended up wanting to leave his W for me... only to graciously refuse to "go down that road and sacrifice my freedom" and in fact even to lecture him a little bit about how he should stay in his marriage and make it work) and professed to any girlfriend who was willing to listen how "relaxed" I felt about the whole thing. Now I'm 35, I'm older, and I know that when women try to compartmentalize their lives and rationalize their emotions, it's usually an indication of low self-esteem and unresolved issues. Of course you may be the one exception to that, in which case, bravo. But I doubt it. Is it STILL so hard to understand people are different. you compare me to yourself and then, decide you can decipher my actions based on your experiences:confused: Such sweeping generalizations you use! It's really astonishing...How can you suppose to speak for all of womankind??? It's delusional, crazy... Better to say, in my experience of women like myself surely... Because believe me, YOU are NOT every woman... Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 No matter how it's justified, no matter how many chime in with support (mostly I've noticed, because they desire to validate their own actions) pursuing any kind of gain at the expense of someone else is a documented dead end for everyone involved. How can one support such cruelty without first admitting they're emotionally desensitized? Does the fact that others have, are and will do the same justify it? Is true happiness possible when we unsympathetically wipe our feet on another person's feelings? The answer to these questions, is no. This is not a blanket judgement but the documented facts of those who have followed the same path before you. Those who later in life realized that what they saw as 'judgement' and 'closed mindedness' was actually an act of love and concern. That strong warning to cease and desist was given by those who truly cared the most. The 'attack' aspect is a real one; those who care the most will most certainly attack the cold, evil reality of your situation and do so with your best interests in mind. Otherwise it's a lose-lose, like sheep jumping off a cliff. Making a bad situation worse is categorizing the admonishment of those taking issue with your actions as controlling, judgmental and (most insulting) unintelligent. Isn't that the classic response for justifying anything? 'You're not intelligent enough to understand this'. Another lie! In my opinion, your post is a cry for help. Um, no it isn't You'll probably bristle but I'd wager that back-and-forth struggle is something you live with daily. Ok, no bristling and there is no struggle... there is no back and forth Problem is, no amount of sex (no matter how thrilling) success, position, or admiration will fill the emptiness of a heart with no love. Real love. The kind of love that longs to give and is strengthened by crisis. The kind of love you deserve. I agree. but I am not looking for love, I've had it and have it now... Stop viewing discipline as the enemy and see it for what it really is. Totally appreciate your honesty and passion... Link to post Share on other sites
woinlove Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Is it STILL so hard to understand people are different. you compare me to yourself and then, decide you can decipher my actions based on your experiences:confused: Such sweeping generalizations you use! It's really astonishing...How can you suppose to speak for all of womankind??? It's delusional, crazy... Better to say, in my experience of women like myself surely... Because believe me, YOU are NOT every woman... CG, but you toss around labels at others saying they are angry, bitter, delusional, crazy,... and yet your own posts are some of the angriest. Red never claimed to talk for or about all women. In fact, her statement was "when..usually...". Is something bothering you? Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 Actually, some were nasty and rude. Cheergirl clearly states why she posted. Some have asked her, why are you posting? to swap stories (DUH! )?; for support? etc.etc. Some responded by telling her what they think of her and labeling her all kinds of things. These are the same people who want, nay, demand respect but choose not to give respect to those who do not share their beliefs or their moral compass. Ahh...the irony ! Yes, it IS a public forum and to some it gives them a venue to vent their anger and yes, bitterness..albeit, misdirected. Cheergirl, as long as you can live with yourself and the fallout, what can anyone do really? Shaming you and making you feel guilty are ways cowards believe they can get an upper hand to those who are not afraid to break conventional practices. Take care. Hi Tami! I've seen many of your other posts, thanks for replying. I think you hit the nail on the head, it's the breaking of convention that is so disturbing... Link to post Share on other sites
Steadfast Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Take care. I doubt the sincerity in that. The OP is most certainly not taking care. She's grasping havoc, rebellion and sickening levels of selfishness. Speaking personally, I realize it is not within my rights to suggest she give up her freewill or right to choose because I said so. I am making a case against the tone and motivation of this thread...not from hate, but from caring. Question to all; how many here, when in a hurry or otherwise stressed at daily life jump out of their cars and scream at the stop sign; "You can't tell me what to do!" We all seem to understand and accept that these things are placed in an effort to protect everyone involved. Do we have to stop? No. Can we state it unfair that someone, somewhere demand we stop without knowing us, our situation or our history? Yes. Will repeatedly ignoring that stop sign eventually result is something terrible happening? The odds are it will. The risk of hurting yourself or someone else is great. Fact; the overwhelming majority of crime and/or homicides have domestic roots. The number one motivation for murder? Situations regarding marital issues and/or unfaithfulness. And while I have no idea how cheergirl's situation will eventually play out, she is indeed playing with fire. Have our demands for tolerance reached the point where common sense and decency be dismissed? Are we really advocating freedom? Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 CG, but you toss around labels at others saying they are angry, bitter, delusional, crazy,... and yet your own posts are some of the angriest. Red never claimed to talk for or about all women. In fact, her statement was "when..usually...". Is something bothering you? Actually she did, here, in bolded... Now I'm 35, I'm older, and I know that when women try to compartmentalize their lives and rationalize their emotions, it's usually an indication of low self-esteem and unresolved issues. Of course you may be the one exception to that, in which case, bravo. But I doubt it. It is delusional, crazy to speak for 3 billion people... It doesn't bother me so much as I feel the need to point out the inherent invalidity of such a statement... Such is the narcissism of the DPWA.... Link to post Share on other sites
tami-chan Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 (edited) Because that's how I see it. I frankly could give a rat's a$$ what she or anyone else does. I think most people come here wanting/needing advice for the situations they find themselves in. I did. Others, come to shock, and stir. Wanting nothing more than to get a reaction And because she did not come "wanting/needing advice" right away she is suspect???? . Live a little, huh? So people can't respond unless it's exactly what you want to hear? Last I heard, that's NOT open dialogue. Sure people can respond, why not? but perhaps in the spirit of "Giving respect"...why not respond to the ACTUAL post and actual questions? No, we feel the need to shame, belittle, guilt the people who do not share our moral values...maybe it makes some of us feel better about ourselves/our situations..don't know...Besides, last time I heard, doing those things is not exactly OPEN dialogue...don't know...maybe in your world, it is... Edited July 4, 2011 by tami-chan Link to post Share on other sites
tami-chan Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 I doubt the sincerity in that. You doubt MY sincerity? Are you out of your mind? get your perspectives right. Link to post Share on other sites
tami-chan Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Well, at least their husbands loved them enough to put a ring round their finger. So yeah. These wives have a right to at least try to get their husbands attention back. I'm an OW myself but fail to understand your problem with Ws. "At least"...LOL...is that enough, really? I was a BS for a long time-"at least" is not enough. Link to post Share on other sites
Author cheergirl Posted July 4, 2011 Author Share Posted July 4, 2011 Well, at least their husbands loved them enough to put a ring round their finger. So yeah. These wives have a right to at least try to get their husbands attention back. I'm an OW myself but fail to understand your problem with Ws. Okay, you're assuming, again, I have never had or don't have or couldn't get a husband, "no-one" loved me enough to put a ring on it... Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 And as a woman you feel OK giving your precious body and your priceless femininity to a man who doesn't even like you enough to care if you're seeing other men? Humm.. and do you really think they really love their wife.. the way you think a husband should love his wife.. I doubt he would come and see me a few times a month for over 9 years.. Link to post Share on other sites
woinlove Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Actually she did, here, in bolded... It is delusional, crazy to speak for 3 billion people... It doesn't bother me so much as I feel the need to point out the inherent invalidity of such a statement... Such is the narcissism of the DPWA.... Actually, not all women satisfy the first condition Red made of "when..." and then "usually..." says that even of those who do compartmentalize/rationalize, not all satisfy the second. It seems that you read into the posts what isn't there. You really have to see a lot that isn't there to label others here as crazy and delusional. Not much point in discussing with someone behaving that way. Good day. Link to post Share on other sites
tami-chan Posted July 4, 2011 Share Posted July 4, 2011 Yes many are like you. Next time you enter your house and are wiping your feet look downward, it's called: "Doormat." It's a shame you thought you had to settle for the ONLY man out of hundreds who met your requirements. You didn't, really. You need to do something to make yourself more attractive so you have more viable options. That way you won't have to settle for being the OW of a married man, next time. LOL..."doormat" is relative. I know several spouses who settle. Don't go there, calling names, because this site is full of broken people begging for their unfaithful spouses to come back... Link to post Share on other sites
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