To women who have been in sexless marriages

[Cabin]

Notice she avoids this question at all costs. Pure bull____.

 

Nope, not avoiding! I was just away for a few days! The outrage eh?

 

Anyway, my H and I are drawing up separation papers and we will continue to live together for a few more months while we get our house ready to put in on the market. Neither of us is in a rush -- we want to split in a way that gives each of us time to get our new separate lives secured so that our D will have as seamless a transition as possible.

[Cabin]

I have to ask this because you don't detail what "brutal" means.

 

"Brutal" means two things: disconnected and infrequent.

 

Disconnected, now I know, because we just don't have that kind of chemistry. I'm reading a book called "Too Good To Leave/To Good To Stay" by Kirshenbaum, and she has a title called "It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing" and we just don't have that swing!

 

Infrequent, for the reason above... it simply wasn't enjoyable, even though I orgasmed nearly every time we did do it.

[Tech_E]

Nope, not avoiding! I was just away for a few days! The outrage eh?

 

Anyway, my H and I are drawing up separation papers and we will continue to live together for a few more months while we get our house ready to put in on the market. Neither of us is in a rush -- we want to split in a way that gives each of us time to get our new separate lives secured so that our D will have as seamless a transition as possible.

 

Too bad you never had the decency to do this before you started opening your legs for another man. Oh well with any luck your new man will discard you like the trash you are.

[luvbun80]

"Brutal" means two things: disconnected and infrequent.

 

Disconnected, now I know, because we just don't have that kind of chemistry. I'm reading a book called "Too Good To Leave/To Good To Stay" by Kirshenbaum, and she has a title called "It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing" and we just don't have that swing!

 

Infrequent, for the reason above... it simply wasn't enjoyable, even though I orgasmed nearly every time we did do it.

 

Was the book useful? Did your husband read it too?

[Waffles]

Too bad you never had the decency to do this before you started opening your legs for another man. Oh well with any luck your new man will discard you like the trash you are.

 

Don't know about Cabin's lack of "decency".

 

But any woman that decides to get a boyfriend, get married, settle down, buy a house together, have kids, lead her husband on for years, than decide that they have made a huge mistake, is going to raise some eyebrows.

 

Call it a mistake. I call it lack of foresight and emotional maturity.

 

I have male friends and family members that went through the exact same rubbish. And I have female friends that pulled the same rubbish. It's even worse for the kids who have to get dragged into the middle of these mistakes.

 

Fortunately for men (and unfortunately for me), the gender biases so prevalent in court, are slowly disappearing.

Edited July 21, 2011 by Waffles

[Cabin]

Was the book useful? Did your husband read it too?

 

Actually yes, very useful. We have read it together. It basically has 36 questions to ponder about divorce, and then it has guidelines about what your answers to those questions reveal. We have found that it is showing us we were mismatched from the beginning... which is sad.

[Cabin]

Don't know about Cabin's lack of "decency".

 

Call it a mistake. I call it lack of foresight and emotional maturity.

 

Definitely it was lack of foresight and emotional maturity. I was married way too young to know better. What we thought were good reasons to pick a life partner turned out not to be very solid ten years later.

 

Truthfully, I wish people in my life, older people, married people, had been more candid with us about marriage. I remember thinking that our similar family backgrounds, similar education, and the fact that we had some fun together was enough to base a marriage on... I had no idea what I should have been looking at.

 

Yes, it's unfortunate that I've learned all this by way of comparison via an A... I am not proud of it. But I can't "un-know" what I now know.

[Cabin]

Too bad you never had the decency to do this before you started opening your legs for another man. Oh well with any luck your new man will discard you like the trash you are.

 

I appreciate that you have a different perspective and opinion on the matter, but resorting to calling me "trash" just to insult me doesn't really advance this dialogue in any thoughtful or useful way.

 

Plus, it doesn't even have the effect you likely desired your comment to have.

[Tech_E]

Cabin you are correct, my language was harsh and I apologize. Having been personally impacted by cheating it is hard not to let the emotions get the better of me.

 

Nonetheless if you are now divorcing and giving your H a chance to heal then that is step forward.

[Waffles]

Cabin you are correct, my language was harsh and I apologize. Having been personally impacted by cheating it is hard not to let the emotions get the better of me.

 

Nonetheless if you are now divorcing and giving your H a chance to heal then that is step forward.

 

I know it's rough T, but you'll feel better. I've been in your shoes. Not every woman is like your wife.

 

Cabin, I don't agree with what you are doing. But I've been in similar situations.

 

I hope your husband finds a partner that is more intune with who he is. I hope you find a partner that is more intune with who you are.

 

I can't remember if you have any kids. But treat them like your Princes and Princesses. As sappy as that may sound.

[Cabin]

Cabin you are correct, my language was harsh and I apologize. Having been personally impacted by cheating it is hard not to let the emotions get the better of me.

 

Nonetheless if you are now divorcing and giving your H a chance to heal then that is step forward.

 

Thank you.

 

I do empathize with your pain.

 

Listen, what I want more than anything for my H is that he can be happy with a woman who's suited just for him! I would welcome such a woman into our life -- I say "our" because he and I will always share our DD and we need to be friends!

[Cabin]

I hope your husband finds a partner that is more intune with who he is. I hope you find a partner that is more intune with who you are.

 

I can't remember if you have any kids. But treat them like your Princes and Princesses. As sappy as that may sound.

 

Yes, I want H to be happy. And I want to be happy.

 

And our "Princess" will be happy if she has two parents who love her, who get along to co-parent her, and who are each happy themselves.

[tropicalfox]

He recommended I read this: http://www.carolcassell.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7&Itemid=7 and now I realize I never had that "click" factor with my H.

 

 

If the premise of that book were true then there would never be any hope for unattractive people to maintain a long-term relationship. I think you have it backwards. You don't have sexual chemistry with your husband because you never had an emotional connection. Furthermore, how could you build any kind of emotional connection when you are boinking someone else? Your emotions obviously belonged with the person you are having sweaty boink sessions with. I know your crush seems rational now but there's a great chance when it wears off, he'll be boinking someone behind your back. Guys are like that--especially the ones who cheat on their wives to begin with.

 

I hope you don't have kids.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I'm sorry to be a buzz-killer on your thread, Cabin, but I have to. You are being so disingenuous that I just can't stand it.

 

 

Yes, it's tricky to be in MC, an A, and a sexless marriage. The MC is helping us come to terms with why our M soured (and it was sour before the A, not because of it)... I asked the MC if I should see a sex therapist. He said no. He said there's nothing wrong with me sexually; I just don't have that connection with my H. I feel horrible for my H about it.

 

Cabin, the above is just so full of ... selfish dishonesty.

 

You have NO BUSINESS going to MC with your husband if you are not willing to be honest there. I think it is absolutely base behavior.

 

I, also, went to marriage counseling with my ex husband when our marriage was falling apart. We had a lot to talk about there. What was NOT talked about - the gigantic elephant in the room of our marriage, which was the destroyer of our marriage - was the fact that my ex had returned to drug use.

 

I spent many months "working" on my marriage, feeling suspicious, being lied to, "working" on my "trust issues" with my ex husband. All bogus.

 

So, I take that crap personally.

 

And, my personal issues aside, WHY ask the MC if you should see a sex therapist? When you post up a storm about your wild sex with the married guy you're banging, unbeknownst to your husband, his wife, your marriage counsellor, your kids, your married guy's kids ... you have no thought AT ALL that you need a sex therapist.

 

It sounds like you are really, really going to EXTREME lengths to gaslight with that. You are trying as hard as you can to FOOL the MC and your husband into thinking you are "working on your marriage," aren't you?

 

I think you sound like one of the worst types of cake eaters imaginable.

 

It's too bad that you're screwing a married guy and that you are married, but since you believe that you are in love with him and that the two of you will be together ...

 

OWN IT AND LIVE IT. Move out of the marital home, WITHOUT waiting for everything to be just perfect FOR YOU.

 

Quit wasting time, money, and false hope (your husband's) in counseling. Stop that. It's sick.

 

Tell your husband the truth so he can stop feeling that he is somehow responsible for the state of your marriage.

 

It's not too late to make some decent choices, even though you can't turn back the hands of time.

[Mme. Chaucer]

 

 

Listen, what I want more than anything for my H is that he can be happy with a woman who's suited just for him! I would welcome such a woman into our life -- I say "our" because he and I will always share our DD and we need to be friends!

 

But, the thing is ... he can't do that now, unless he's willing to be a lying cheater. So, he is suffering and waiting, completely sexless - while you're having wild sweaty sex. Waiting on YOU to make the move to leave the marriage, which evidently you won't do until the time is just perfectly convenient. For you.

 

How can you be fine with this? And sound so chipper?

[Cabin]

If the premise of that book were true then there would never be any hope for unattractive people to maintain a long-term relationship. I think you have it backwards. You don't have sexual chemistry with your husband because you never had an emotional connection.

 

 

No, I think you don't understand. It isn't about attractiveness... believe it or not, many would think my H is more handsome/attractive than my AP, but for me, there is no inner pull, no desire, no unique attraction to him that I have experienced with AP.

 

You are right that the emotional connection isn't strong, and that definitely plays itself out in lack of sexual interest.

[xxoo]

Thank you.

 

I do empathize with your pain.

 

Listen, what I want more than anything for my H is that he can be happy with a woman who's suited just for him! I would welcome such a woman into our life -- I say "our" because he and I will always share our DD and we need to be friends!

 

Yes, I want H to be happy. And I want to be happy.

 

And our "Princess" will be happy if she has two parents who love her, who get along to co-parent her, and who are each happy themselves.

 

This is the real risk in having an exit affair, rather than cleanly ending the marriage.

 

Eventually, he will know about the betrayal. He will know he went through the effort of MC while you were hiding an affair. How do you think that will complicate your relationship as friends and coparents?

[xxoo]

I've had hours upon hours of passionate movie lovemaking, and I'm not going back to a life without it.

 

Do most people have fantastic crazy wild sweaty sex?!?!?!?! If not, THEY NEED TO BE!!!

 

Oh the whole world would be so much happier!

 

I want to comment on this again.

 

Yes, passionate sex is wonderful.

 

But, no, people do not NEED to be having it.

 

And, no, the whole world would not be happier if people prioritized passionate sex above being a good parent, or a faithful spouse.

 

Even in a longterm marriage where the passion burns for many years, there will be seasons without passionate sex. There will be births, illnesses, tough years when the passionate sex is just not happening. And still, a good spouse and parent gets up, stays involved, and trudges through.

[Mme. Chaucer]

Nope, not avoiding! I was just away for a few days! The outrage eh?

 

Anyway, my H and I are drawing up separation papers and we will continue to live together for a few more months while we get our house ready to put in on the market. Neither of us is in a rush -- we want to split in a way that gives each of us time to get our new separate lives secured so that our D will have as seamless a transition as possible.

 

Since everything is so amicable ... and he understands completely about the fact that your marriage is over ...

 

WHY CONTINUE TO DECEIVE HIM?

 

 

Ideally, I would have realized how empty my connection with my spouse was and separated before meeting my AP. But realistically, without the experiences I share with my AP, it may have been years and years of not really knowing how empty my marriage was and is. One is contingent on the other.

 

So on a moral level, yes, I wish I'd approached things differently. But on a heart level, no, sadly I don't.

 

I get this, but how and why do you continue to justify the great lengths you continue to take to maintain the deceit? Is it because you need to be cheating to have the "thrill"? Or are you afraid of the consequences of honesty? Are you (secretly) fearful that your married sex partner won't be leaving his wife to go on into eternity with you, so you're hedging your bets? Even though you and your husband are exactly in tune with the fact that your marriage is over, according to you?

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by xxoo

Did he feel the passion/chemistry for you? What has his perspective been on your sexual relationship during the marriage?

 

Why did he date and marry you?

 

Your response:

 

Yes, he says he does for me.

 

DOES. You use the present tense. Your husband feels passion and chemistry for you NOW, but you are completely checked out of the marriage - and faking "working on the marriage" in MC.

 

Please address how you think that your treatment of your husband and your marriage is okay - beyond the fact that you're engaging in sex on the side with a married person. Clearly, I'm judgmental and negative about THAT, but what I am asking here is: sneaky sex aside, WHY do you continue to lie and participate in marriage counseling and live with your husband, who LOVES YOU, wants you, feels passion for you, is still "working on the marriage," when you are 100% OUT?

 

Please respond, and try to do so without being disingenuous at all. It's not becoming. You are not an innocent young woman just discovering the glories of passion. You are actively destroying another person - not just your marriage, which is admittedly half yours to destroy.

[LittleTiger]

Just caught up on this thread and I agree with everything Mme. C is saying.

 

Cabin you are being completely dishonest and selfish.

 

You are lying to your husband and your MC (and who knows how many other people). Pretending that this is 'oh so sad and tragic' that your marriage didn't work out while you watch your husband go through hell.

 

He thinks you're both suffering and facing the prospect of a sad and lonely life without each other in the near future. He's being the loving, faithful, devoted husband, hoping for a miracle before it all falls apart, while you're lying, cheating, having hot, passionate sex and, by the sounds of it, the time of your life with another man.

 

You know very well that you're not waiting to make sure you both have your individual lives in order before you split up, you're only waiting to make sure your AP leaves his wife, so that you don't end up on your own.

 

Spare just one second's thought for your husband. When you eventually do split up (when/if your AP leaves his wife) your husband is going to be on his own, completely alone, no loving wife, no sex (passionate or otherwise), no fun or excitement. He is going to be bereft, grief stricken, lonely, sad, depressed, lost.....just read the divorce section on LS to get some idea of how he will be feeling.

 

And all the while you'll be celebrating your freedom and your exciting new relationship, and the opportunity to have all the hot sex you can manage. Who cares about him eh?

 

You're so scared of feeling all of those horrible feelings yourself that you're hanging on to your husband, just in case, and giving him hope so that you don't have to suffer. This is unbelievably selfish, not to mention cruel!

 

Get real!!! If you want to jump ship, then do so......but, if you ever loved your husband, for goodness sake find some integrity and treat him with the respect he deserves!

[Cabin]

 

Please address how you think that your treatment of your husband and your marriage is okay - beyond the fact that you're engaging in sex on the side with a married person. Clearly, I'm judgmental and negative about THAT.

 

Please respond, and try to do so without being disingenuous at all. It's not becoming.

 

Neither is your patronizing tone. I guess you have a right to it though, since you've never been unfaithful yourself.

 

Listen, Mme. Chaucer, I appreciate your comments and of course they resonate with truths I wish I didn't have to take responsibility for.

[freestyle]

Cabin:

 

There is every chance , that if your H finds out that you've been lying to him, and betraying him---

 

while simultaneously presenting a facade of "working on the marriage"

(dragging him to MC sessions, where he bares his heart & vulnerabilities, and jumps through hoops to save the marriage)

 

 

........There is every chance that his capacity for trust will be permanently damaged. So not only will the marriage go down the toilet---but he may never be able to find happiness again in a relationship. Part of him will always be "waiting for the other shoe to drop". Part of him will never forget the humiliation, and being played as a chump.

 

Bottom line---this could mess him up----for the rest of his life.

 

 

What I'm wondering is---Just what did he do to you, to deserve this low of a blow?

 

Decimating someone's ability to trust is quite a huge punishment to dole out.

 

His "crime" was what, precisely?

[Mme. Chaucer]

If you have read other posts from me, you know that I have in fact been unfaithful, and also that I dallied with a married man. I don't understand what this has to do with the questions I have raised. I believe you brought that up as a defensive move, but it is not useful to this discussion or to whatever your goals are in posting on these fora about your marriage and your affair.

 

 

Would you please respond to my questions? I think it's very fair for me to ask, and that I am not the only person who has the same ones, given your threads. You have been very forthcoming with many details about your marriage and your affair, here and on the OW forum. It's certainly appropriate for these questions to be addressed - they were prompted by all the information you have provided.

[Mme. Chaucer]

One further question:

 

How do you envision your life when / if the sex partner does NOT leave his wife and make a commitment to life with you? What is your timeline for that? Do you have one?

 

Is your husband on hold indefinitely pending the moves of the other married guy?

[GorillaTheater]

Cabin:

 

There is every chance , that if your H finds out that you've been lying to him, and betraying him---

 

while simultaneously presenting a facade of "working on the marriage"

(dragging him to MC sessions, where he bares his heart & vulnerabilities, and jumps through hoops to save the marriage)

 

 

........There is every chance that his capacity for trust will be permanently damaged.

 

If I were Cabin's H, my ability to trust may or may not be permanently damaged, per se, except to the extent I may not be able to place my trust 100% in another woman. What would be far more certain, however, is that I would start taking a scorched-earth, thermonuclear approach to my divorce. How else would I deal with someone with no integrity, who's playing me for a fool to make her life easier?