Consolidated Discussion - Older/younger woman/man and age gap dating

[pickflicker]

I don't think Loveshack is going to help you much.

 

<snip>

 

Wish I could like this more than once. Are you single? If not, she's a lucky woman.

[pickflicker]

Thank you for your kind words. It just so happens that I am indeed, single.

 

It's nice to meet someone who appreciates and shares my nonsense approach to men / women / dating / relationships and calling it like it really is.

 

When I am special enough and have the ability to send / receive PMs, we will continue our conversation "offline". Until then... We will have to flirt / play / tease each other in the various threads we respond too.

 

Consider it done!

 

Gawd, so long as everyone are consenting adults, let them date whomever they want!

[PinkInTheLimo]

It's nice to meet someone who appreciates and shares my nonsense approach to men / women / dating / relationships and calling it like it really is.

 

You are not calling it like it really is. Not all girls in their twenties are partying and sowing their wild oats. I have always been looking for the "one". Unfortunately the fact that I was severely physically and emotionally abused by my mother (and emotionally abused by my father who let it all happen) made me into a very insecure and vulnerable girl who thought that whoever approached her did so with the best intentions. Which was not the case and I got my heart broken cruelly a couple of times.

I've never been attracted to bad guys but to guys who were nice to me at first and then turned out to be selfish. I could have married a couple of them but thanks god I always knew instinctively that I only wanted to do that if the relationship was really good and working.

 

There are good guys out there. Most of them are good guys when they are 20. I don't believe that a bad selfish boy of 20 will automatically become a decent guy at 40. He might be better at hiding his flaws.

 

My own experience is that having been in a bad relationship makes you very wary. I want to know a guy first before getting together with him but guys then think you are not playful enough. But I can only play when I feel safe. I think that this is why guys call us older gals "jaded". We don't play along with the basic "me Tarzan, you Jane" scenario, we are careful and suspicious thus we are not the "smiling, joyful" ego stroke they want us to be.

 

But the "older women are jaded" argument is so unfair. If we are jaded it is because we were not treated well in our relationships by... the men who call us "jaded". So what do these men? They go for younger women so that they can "jade" these as well .

 

I find it such an eye opener that so many women who divorce in midlife say that they would like to have a partner again but not want to get married/live together again, whereas men are eager to marry again. Shows you that marriage is apparently a good deal for men but not so much for a woman. Probably because being married for a woman still very often means taking care of a lot of practical stuff for husband and children. I guess at some point these women get enough of being at the beck and call of her family members and divorce. What does the man then do? Instead of thinking a bit about what went wrong, he goes for the younger woman, feels young and powerful again and once the relationship is established he goes back to his old selfish ways. The younger woman in the mean time is stuck with young children so she stays but after 15-20 years she also leaves.

 

A bit a simplistic description by me but it often boils down to this I'm afraid.

[Babolat]

Yeah, he must be enabling players, is one and/or is giving licenses to the predators, users, and manipulators. He probably dated a woman much younger than him at one point, had sex without a condom, has a male friend who once had a FWB, too. I'd dump him now if I were you.

I forgot to add, he & you, are calling it dating after only 3 dates, red flag, he has issues, moving way too fast...false sense of intimacy and security. Classic signs. .

[Babolat]

In the South, Midwest, West Coast it's usually 8 out of 10 Professional men who I met who were quality, values, morals, character, integrity, etc. Heck even most of those who ended up divorced still spoke very highly and respected their Ex Wives.

 

I like to have a good time and even date for "fun" but myself, friends, co-workers and other men we hang out DO NOT and WOULD NOT lie, chea, manipulate or try to take advantage of women (young or old). Most guys are like me, my friends and co-workers. However, that isn't the case in the Northeast.

 

Have you ever consider moving or doing some traveling? I bet you would be blown away with the quality and quantity of men you would run into.

 

Pats himself on the back for living in the South! Thank You!

[Babolat]

Thank you!

 

Ever since I've been here, the majority of posts have been of the nature that women over 35 my as well be in a nursing home. With that, and things happening offline/things I've had drummed into me, it's been difficult to remain in a positive state of mind regarding anything.

 

I felt this way at 44 when I divorced. Good gosh, my life has been amazing times 10 since then. Emrace 39 and look forward to 40+. The woman I have been with in their 40s, wow, I mean, wow. I starting to see a woman who is 49, and so far, WOW, lot's of wows! I'm actually a little nervous about having sex with her as in she may tear me apart!

[Babolat]

Great to hear that so far this one is going well, RedRobin, I hope it remains a good story.

 

As do we all, as maybe it means, she will leave LS and all of us effed up men can have fun again......sniffle, sniffle, sniffle.

 

Seriously RR I too hope it works out for you.

[PinkInTheLimo]

Are you referring to just playful banter / teasing / flirting below? Or the Physical side of things?

 

All of it. I will be correct and charming but things will be on a friendship basis until I know a bit what you stand for. If the guy pulls the romantic card immediaty it makes me very suspicious. He does not know me so his romantic gestures don't have any meaning.

 

I don't give blank checks.

 

1. How is that putting your best foot forward to attract and keep a guy?

 

Putting my best foot forward is that fact that I am genuinely interested in the person I have a conversation with. And once I am in a relationship I am a very affectionate and considerate partner. But a guy needs to be worth it.

 

2. Why should I have to "suffer" for things that I had nothing to do with?

 

I don't do egostroking. If the fact that I don't makes you suffer, that's not my problem.

 

3. Why can't you work to resolve / deal with / etc. the bad experiences that you had so you aren't "jaded"? Why should that be my responsibility to overcome / solve? Isn't that yours and you are the only one who can really fix it?

 

I have worked through my experiences and drawn my conclusions. There are good people out there. There are good men out there. There are also way too many bad, inconsiderate, selfish men out there and I should make sure that I don't end up with one of those. The best way to do that seems to take my time to get to know someone. It's not a 100% guarantee but it helps.

 

4. If some guy refused to be romantic, get emotionally involved, buy you a wedding ring, propose or marry you, etc. because his Ex wife cheated, left him for his best friend and took his dog with him. Would you think that is fair? Do you "deserve" to be treated that way because of what his Ex wife did or didn't do?

 

If I would meet such a guy I would conclude that he is not ready for a committed relationship. I have no problems with commitment at all. Let me meet a man with whom an honest, beautiful relationship is possible and I will commit.

Edited April 17, 2014 by PinkInTheLimo

[RedRobin]

1. I was not being absolute and there are always exceptions to rules.

 

 

Great.

 

 

I was going to say... far be it from me to deprive anyone at a chance at love... no matter what package it comes in.

 

 

Do I think the vast majority of age gap relationships are effed up?? Absolutely.

 

 

Do I think the vast majority of age gap relationships involve people who have issues that would be better addressed in another way? You betcha.

 

 

Do I feel that the older person (male or female) has a responsibility to be 'the adult' and recognize this and (nearly all of the time) refashion the interaction to one that is more healthy for both parties. Yes. I do.

 

 

Are there exceptions? Of course. Most people are NOT the exception.... and that is my only point here...

 

 

Everyone wants to believe THEY are the exception. Especially when the outcome weighs strongly in their favor... whatever that is. Usually short term.

 

 

To the extent that they neglect or ignore the negative outcomes to the other person in favor of having their own needs met is what makes them pathological... which, I believe underscores the great majority of these age gap relationships... and what people here want to vehemently protest because they don't see themselves in 'that way'...

 

 

I get it. Noone does.

[RedRobin]

You were lucky to have good role models growing up who protected you and instilled good values in you. My parents were good people with good values, but were conflict avoidant and did not protect my sister when the much older MM pursued her. I had to take matters into my own hands as a child to protect her. Maybe that's one reason why I feel compelled to protect women and children who are preyed on by others and have become a women's advocate and therapist.

 

 

... and I was often the only woman in the room or maybe even the building having to hold my own on lots of things.

 

 

I didn't have too many other women around to show me the ropes or to help navigate things where I needed the most help... at work and at school. Had a lot of great male mentors though. A lot.

 

 

A few really sucked. The ones I mention here.

 

 

The reason I feel compelled to try and protect some women (and guide some men) is because I didn't necessarily have so much of that guidance from women growing up... and I know what good guidance and interaction looks like and feels like from men. I know what the bad looks like too.

 

 

... at the very least, I think people ought to know what they are getting themselves into. Not everyone has someone in their lives that will help them make those choices responsibly with their eyes open. Your sister is fortunate to have you.

[thefooloftheyear]

Here is 40 year old Heidi Klum with her 27 year old boyfriend...I dont see anyone calling her out...And just for the record, Ive never dated a supermodel and I am not a fine art dealer, but if I had that guys physique, Id be too embarrassed to take my shirt off...And I am old enough to be his daddy...

 

Heidi Klum goes topless with boyfriend, 27 | Page Six

 

TFY

[GorillaTheater]

Here is 40 year old Heidi Klum with her 27 year old boyfriend...I dont see anyone calling her out...And just for the record, Ive never dated a supermodel and I am not a fine art dealer, but if I had that guys physique, Id be too embarrassed to take my shirt off...And I am old enough to be his daddy...

 

Heidi Klum goes topless with boyfriend, 27 | Page Six

 

TFY

 

Somebody needs to let that dude know that he's nothing but a victim. Poor guy.

[RedRobin]

You are not calling it like it really is. Not all girls in their twenties are partying and sowing their wild oats. I have always been looking for the "one". Unfortunately the fact that I was severely physically and emotionally abused by my mother (and emotionally abused by my father who let it all happen) made me into a very insecure and vulnerable girl who thought that whoever approached her did so with the best intentions. Which was not the case and I got my heart broken cruelly a couple of times.

I've never been attracted to bad guys but to guys who were nice to me at first and then turned out to be selfish. I could have married a couple of them but thanks god I always knew instinctively that I only wanted to do that if the relationship was really good and working.

 

There are good guys out there. Most of them are good guys when they are 20. I don't believe that a bad selfish boy of 20 will automatically become a decent guy at 40. He might be better at hiding his flaws.

 

My own experience is that having been in a bad relationship makes you very wary. I want to know a guy first before getting together with him but guys then think you are not playful enough. But I can only play when I feel safe. I think that this is why guys call us older gals "jaded". We don't play along with the basic "me Tarzan, you Jane" scenario, we are careful and suspicious thus we are not the "smiling, joyful" ego stroke they want us to be.

 

But the "older women are jaded" argument is so unfair. If we are jaded it is because we were not treated well in our relationships by... the men who call us "jaded". So what do these men? They go for younger women so that they can "jade" these as well .

 

I find it such an eye opener that so many women who divorce in midlife say that they would like to have a partner again but not want to get married/live together again, whereas men are eager to marry again. Shows you that marriage is apparently a good deal for men but not so much for a woman. Probably because being married for a woman still very often means taking care of a lot of practical stuff for husband and children. I guess at some point these women get enough of being at the beck and call of her family members and divorce. What does the man then do? Instead of thinking a bit about what went wrong, he goes for the younger woman, feels young and powerful again and once the relationship is established he goes back to his old selfish ways. The younger woman in the mean time is stuck with young children so she stays but after 15-20 years she also leaves.

 

A bit a simplistic description by me but it often boils down to this I'm afraid.

 

 

I agree with most of this... I wasn't sowing my oats in my 20's either. Got married relatively young and had a pretty happy marriage for the most part until near the end when life tested us and our communication issues got the best of us... That's as generous as I can be today about that.

 

 

... met a great guy after that and was set to marry again. Everyone knows the story.

 

 

Big shock being thrust into the dating world again in that pivotal 30 something age group and hearing the long list of garbage about women that age... and getting the same negative attention I never wanted at any age from that same group of guys.

 

 

... and yes, as women, we are told pretty much on a routine basis at any age that who we are doesn't matter... Just what we look like. And it feels especially appalling to observe that men are allowed and encouraged to be fully integrated human beings and allowed to do, and experience, and experiment with all kinds of things and not be judged for it. Or, even be patted on the back for it.

 

 

It seems like nothing they do to themselves or others matters at the end of the day. We women are supposed to overlook, forgive all... with open arms and without judgment and barely caution... or else be judged frigid, prudish, or 'jaded'...

 

 

yet, we... are not.

 

 

Yes, I realize this is a simplistic way of viewing things...

 

 

Sometimes I like giving some men here just a teeny-weeny taste of what it feels like... because sometimes that is the only way to get the message across. They have to know what it feels like in order to empathize. Or so it seems.

[PinkInTheLimo]

Here is 40 year old Heidi Klum with her 27 year old boyfriend...I dont see anyone calling her out...And just for the record, Ive never dated a supermodel and I am not a fine art dealer, but if I had that guys physique, Id be too embarrassed to take my shirt off...And I am old enough to be his daddy...

 

Heidi Klum goes topless with boyfriend, 27 | Page Six

 

TFY

 

I did not know about this new boyfriend but if I would have, I might actually have given it as an example of a relationship that seems not balanced or healthy because I have the impression that Heidi Klum is not a stable person when it comes to relationships. I mean, she was pregnant with a child from another man when she met Seal, that does not sound like a woman who is very stable. Then for years she and Seal constantly profess their love for each other and next thing you know they are broken up and she's with her bodyguard.

 

Sounds all like a big midlife crisis to me, women can also have them .

[Woggle]

Somebody needs to let that dude know that he's nothing but a victim. Poor guy.

 

Yes. He is so helpless and naive and evil Heidi Klum is taking advantage. At 27 he is barely out of his diapers.

[GorillaTheater]

Yes. He is so helpless and naive and evil Heidi Klum is taking advantage. At 27 he is barely out of his diapers.

 

She should be mentoring him, not using her mature wiles to repeatedly screw him senseless.

[joystickd]

She should be mentoring him, not using her mature wiles to repeatedly screw him senseless.

 

Cougars are so manipulative. They should date the older men.

[RedRobin]

Yes. He is so helpless and naive and evil Heidi Klum is taking advantage. At 27 he is barely out of his diapers.

 

She should be mentoring him, not using her mature wiles to repeatedly screw him senseless.

 

 

right... and your reverse sexism would lead me to believe you don't think men are capable of being harmed by the inappropriate attention of a much older woman either.

 

 

... in your world, as long as he is getting his rocks off, then that makes him healthy and fully functioning, with no long term emotional damage possible. Yes, we know. In your world, nothing men do has any long term consequences on his future or ability to relate to the opposite sex. Whether it is effing much older women or effing much younger women... or anything in between. As long as he's effing something, then he has value as a man. I mean, in your world.

 

 

If you have a son, would you like him marrying a woman who is 13+ years older? Who fits Heidi's relationship history? Or spending significant time with her? Likely not.

Edited April 17, 2014 by RedRobin

[GorillaTheater]

right... and your reverse sexism would lead me to believe you don't think men are capable of being harmed by the inappropriate attention of a much older woman either.

 

 

... in your world, as long as he is getting his rocks off, then that makes him healthy and fully functioning, with no long term emotional damage possible.

 

 

If you have a son, would you like him marrying a woman who is 13+ years older? Who fits Heidi's relationship history? Or spending significant time with her? Likely not.

 

 

No, I wouldn't be too excited if my son decided to marry a screwed up woman, older or not. That's assuming that Klum is screwed up (I don't know my celebs well enough to say), and that these two are getting married.

 

If I had to throw my two cents in every time I thought my kids were involved in lousy relationships, though, they'd probably never speak to me again. I don't like my daughter's husband. I think he's a lazy dumbass, but other than that he treats my daughter as well as he can and she loves him. No age difference there. I keep my mouth shut. Mostly.

 

I'm not on the market, but if I was I'm firmly convinced I'd pursue women my age. Nothing against older women or younger women, that's just my preference.

 

And that's what it boils down to: preference. You don't want to date older men? Fine by me. But you portraying younger women as being some kind of dumbass victim because they may have a preference for older men is beyond absurd. As in: no f*cking credibility whatsoever.

 

Emilia, one of my favorite posters here, has a preference for younger men. Several women in this thread prefer or at least are open to older men. Your statements to the effect that there's something wrong with them make my eyes roll so hard you can hear the pop.

[Candy_Pants]

Before my H, I mostly dated older men. At least 10 years older. There were less games and judgements. It was the men in my age bracket that lied to me, tried to use me, and secretly judged me while trying to manipulate their way into my candy pants.

 

Just one woman's experience .

[hotpotato]

Before my H, I mostly dated older men. At least 10 years older. There were less games and judgements. It was the men in my age bracket that lied to me, tried to use me, and secretly judged me while trying to manipulate their way into my candy pants.

 

Just one woman's experience .

 

I have men of all age brackets trying to lie to me and play games. Sometimes older guys are a little more suave, sometimes not.

[RedRobin]

Gorilla,

 

 

The only idea that has no f*cking credibility, is the idea that age gap relationships (on average) are in any way equal to a same age relationship.

 

 

Candy Pants,

 

 

The only men (as a group) who have been more honest with me is younger men.

 

 

Same age and older have been the ones willing to be deceptive. The only reason I haven't given up the same age group is because I believe that finding one in that group is more likely to be long lasting... IF one can be found.

 

 

If/when I give up any desire for something long-lasting, I will go for the younger ones too. I've had plenty of offers.

 

 

Don't see any benefit whatsoever in going older. None.

[Candy_Pants]

Red, that's fine. You don't have to go older. But don't demonize older men for dating younger women. You're also insulting the younger women they date, by saying the older men are deceiving them.

 

People lie sometimes. That's no surprise. Just look around here and see how many men in my age group (mid to late 20s) are bitter and seem to think women owe them something. Then look at older men (late forties to early fifties) who do that. No comparison.

 

Unfortunately the whole PUA crap is mostly popular with younger guys, not older guys.

[thefooloftheyear]

Looking at those photos again,,,I gotta say...Its time for Heidi to go in to the repair shop for some service...Ive seen better bodies on 40+ 9-5 soccer moms...

 

Just sayin"

 

TFY

[PinkInTheLimo]

The only men (as a group) who have been more honest with me is younger men.

 

The younger guys are also a lot more emancipated. They understand that if in a couple you both go out working that the household chores should also be shared. It might be because their mothers already were professionally active.

 

I prefer a guy my age but if these guys keep going for the younger women, I would certainly give a younger man a chance. Not an older man. In my case, born in the 60ies, the older guys are spoilt baby boomers who are totally incompatible with Generation X gals.