Consolidated Discussion - Older/younger woman/man and age gap dating

[hotpotato]

So other than being a creep, he isn't doing anything wrong... interesting.

 

He was, like touching me, being sexually explicit, stalking me. The guy would wait presumably at least an hour for me to go back to my car. He continued to contact me even though I told him not to. Every now and then I still get messages from him. He tried to get me to his house because supposedly a friend of his could fix my car, which really turned out to be a ruse.

[thefooloftheyear]

Well, no. I plan to be hot for at least the next 20 years.

 

You do realize there are drop dead smoking hot women that dont get hit on by creepy old(or young) guys...??

 

If you REALLY dont want it....you wont get it...trust me on this one...

 

TFY

[hotpotato]

Maybe look at it this way... if EVERY older man with whom you come in contact inquires as to whether or not you would like to be intimate with him, you might seriously just take a look at yourself.

 

Years ago I had a friend that used to complain that men always told her dirty jokes. She wanted to know why this never happened to me. Sounds like the same story here...

 

Yes, because talks about lebanon and changing oil is so erotic. And so are coffee and magazines. Ok, gotcha.

 

For the record, I dont dress sexy in public. At the park I wear shorts and a loose fitting tshirt in the summer. Every where else except for dates I wear loose fitting tops with jeans or a wear a loose fitting dress almost like a muumuu.

[hotpotato]

You do realize there are drop dead smoking hot women that dont get hit on by creepy old(or young) guys...??

 

If you REALLY dont want it....you wont get it...trust me on this one...

 

TFY

 

I think the problem is sometimes I try to be nice, and the guy thinks nice means sexual interest.

 

This isn't just older men, but they are more aggressive.

 

I usually dont get hit on actually. I mostly get stalkers. Men leave me alone most of the time. The problem starts when I start talking to them and being nice. Misunderstandings abound. Enter runaway imaginations.

[Keenly]

So it sounds to me like the problem isn't older men. Its that you are tired of getting hit on. Instead of changing your behavior, you want everyone else to change theirs?

 

 

Huh?

 

Your example of one complete loser is enough?

 

Don't we tell both genders on this forum not to demonize the entire sex because their ex hurt them so bad? Is that not the exact same thing ?

[hotpotato]

So it sounds to me like the problem isn't older men. Its that you are tired of getting hit on. Instead of changing your behavior, you want everyone else to change theirs?

 

 

Huh?

 

Your example of one complete loser is enough?

 

Don't we tell both genders on this forum not to demonize the entire sex because their ex hurt them so bad? Is that not the exact same thing ?

Huh is right!

 

What I just wrote goes beyond just hitting on someone.

Actually, I've had several hit on me, but only one of the older guys went to full on stalker mode.

 

I've said several times that I have changed my behavior. I do not talk to or smile at a man of any age unless i'm interested. I definitely will not have a conversation with one unless I'm sexually or romantically interested.

[RonaldS]

How about if he's park next to you, has figured out your schedule, literally chases you?I would turn around, ignore him, but he would literally chase me. It was to the point where he was accusing me of doing things to him which were impossible. I'm surprised he never tried to follow me home.

 

OK.

 

This actually has nothing to do with age-gap dating (although to be fair, neither do 60% of the posts in this thread). This is a stalking issue, apparently based on one single individual.

 

Since we're off topic, Las Vegas is not a liberal city. Far from it. It's really not even a city. But it's in the middle of a very red state. Liberal cities would be San Fransisco, LA, NYC, Boston, DC, Chicago, Seattle, Portland, and many college towns such as Ann Arbor MI, Boulder CO, Raleigh NC, Madison WI.

 

All of that being said, I was correct when I pointed out, based on your posts, that you live in a small, conservative town.

 

To the point about being hit on by men at stores; Walmart vs Whole Foods. While I have no doubt that older men will hit on women at both, the demographic differences between the two stores shoppers is going to make it far less likely that some nasty old man will perv out on you at Whole Foods than Walmart. Walmart is terrible.

 

To your point about me being more charismatic and attractive than other men my age.......YAY! Somebody finally got what I and a few others have been saying! This is a tremendous break-through. Many women have been harping on how a younger woman is doing herself a disservice by going after an older man because older men are apparently not good enough.

 

I've brought a lot of numbers to the discussion to dispute that notion. While there are a lot of older men out there who do over-assess themselves, there are also a decent number of guys who attract women of all age groups. It is what it is. So, I bring that narrative to the discussion, and then certain women have to shoot my own personal experiences down because....I don't really know why. Insecurity? Bitterness at themselves aging? I have no idea.

[hotpotato]

OK.

 

This actually has nothing to do with age-gap dating (although to be fair, neither do 60% of the posts in this thread). This is a stalking issue, apparently based on one single individual.

I was also trying to discuss how older men are not as attractive to young women as they think. That does relate to age gap dating. That got lost in the hubbub.

Since we're off topic, Las Vegas is not a liberal city. Far from it. It's really not even a city. But it's in the middle of a very red state. Liberal cities would be San Fransisco, LA, NYC, Boston, DC, Chicago, Seattle, Portland, and many college towns such as Ann Arbor MI, Boulder CO, Raleigh NC, Madison WI.

 

New Orleans isn't liberal despite being heavily Democratic. Las Vegas isn't liberal either. OK.

 

All of that being said, I was correct when I pointed out, based on your posts, that you live in a small, conservative town.

 

To the point about being hit on by men at stores; Walmart vs Whole Foods. While I have no doubt that older men will hit on women at both, the demographic differences between the two stores shoppers is going to make it far less likely that some nasty old man will perv out on you at Whole Foods than Walmart. Walmart is terrible.

 

I suppose parks and book stores like Barnes and Noble are also cesspools. While I may be from a smaller city, most of the people I date have not been. i

I've tasted the scenes at New York, Las Vegas, and New Orleans. Apparently, most of those were conservative towns.

 

 

To your point about me being more charismatic and attractive than other men my age.......YAY! Somebody finally got what I and a few others have been saying! This is a tremendous break-through. Many women have been harping on how a younger woman is doing herself a disservice by going after an older man because older men are apparently not good enough.

 

I've brought a lot of numbers to the discussion to dispute that notion. While there are a lot of older men out there who do over-assess themselves, there are also a decent number of guys who attract women of all age groups. It is what it is. So, I bring that narrative to the discussion, and then certain women have to shoot my own personal experiences down because....I don't really know why. Insecurity? Bitterness at themselves aging? I have no idea.

 

I do agree that a select portion of older men (and women) have no problem getting younger dates. However, most of the older men I've known and dealt with arent nearly as hot as they think they are. At least we can agree that a lot of older men over assess themselves.

 

The older guy i was talking to in NY, he was hot as hell and didn't look old and was wealthy on top. He's the kind who didn't let himself go, got rich, and managed somehow not to age. I would say he was hotter than most guys my age.

[thefooloftheyear]

Oh, so in other words, women who are being hit on by much older men and don't want that are sending some kind of signal to these older men that their advances are desired. That's the same mentality as blaming rape victims for being raped.

 

 

Absolutely not...you missed the point entirely.....

 

If I was a woman, and I kept getting hit on unnecessarily by creeps, and I didn't like it, id examine what I was doing or where I was going to incur these experiences..And I would change my behavior..Simple as that...It might not stop it entirely, but id bet it would diminish to such a rarity to not be worth discussing..

 

I know a woman that "complains" occasionally of this type of attention...She's actually an ugly dog, but she bats her eyes and flips her hair at every guy she comes in contact with, wears clothes that hang her tits and ass out ...you get the picture...Does it mean that guys should bug her?, well.. no...but sometimes you need to take a look at what you are doing if you are getting attention and you dont want it...Then change,Like I said..I know women that NEVER get fcked with...My office manager is a perfect example...She has this "aura" around her..And she is a very attractive woman..

 

I dont like to make small talk with strangers...No one ever makes small talk with me...WIn/Win...And I dont wear a sign on my back...So there is something to this "body language" that everyone talks of...

 

TFY

[Babolat]

Every single one, eh?

 

I guess that's the price of elegance.

 

I have not read the 80+ pages on this thread, but seriously, older men follow you in stores and explicitly ask you, for sex?

[hotpotato]

Either she hasn't reported him, like I encouraged by the way, or she has and the cops say he isn't doing anything against the law.

 

 

Yeah, he is weird. But this has absolutely nothing to do with older men dating younger women.

 

I never reported him because others had advised me not to. Luckily, he eventually stopped. He was very harassing even aside from the touching. I would completely ignore him, but he would still try to talk to me. I'd be sitting and he come over and stare at me and talk to me for 20 minutes even though I would give him 0 response.

[Babolat]

If you are attracting women that young, you are probably much more attractive or/and charismatic than most men your age. That doesn't mean every guy or even most guys your age are going to be that attractive..

The new owner of my local coffee shop is 23, adorable, cute,sexy, tiny petite...all the right stuff. She flirts with me every day, every day. I do not flirt with her, more small talk.

 

And her flirting is increasing. Yesterday she talked about how she has nothing to do, would love to go on a hike with me. She even commented that she liked my hair and the clothes I was wearing. Should I say No because she is 23? I'm starting to see someone right now so the obvious answer is No, but, if I was not, I'm supposed to say No because she is so young?

[Babolat]

How about if he's park next to you, has figured out your schedule, literally chases you?I would turn around, ignore him, but he would literally chase me. It was to the point where he was accusing me of doing things to him which were impossible. I'm surprised he never tried to follow me home.

 

"He' equals every older man? You had a stalker, call the police, geez.

[hotpotato]

"He' equals every older man? You had a stalker, call the police, geez.

More knowledgeable people told me I would not have a case despite everything. I was on the verge of trying to get a restraining order.

It's not that extreme everytime, but yes, everytime I try to talk to one sex comes. Nowadays, I dont talk to a man I dont want to have sex with. This has helped a lot. It's just too easy for someone to get the wrong impression.

[hotpotato]

My ex gf, barbie doll looks and all, use to tell me "I have dealt with unwanted male attention my entire life" in a "woe is me" kind of tone. Then go into bars with her breast hanging out, a short skirt where I could see her panties, and mostly talk to men. Really? Then she would Facebook them, post pics of her having fun at bars, at the beach, etc and then like their "Looking good" "Looking hot" comments. Really?

 

Yes, change your behavior if you do not want the attention. Same goes for a man receiving unwanted attention from a woman.

 

Aaaand I never dressed like that. I usually wear something loose fitting, no makeup, and even my workout attire is more conservative than a lot of what other women wear.

[serial muse]

I agree about the jumping the shark thing and I think there's some odd hyperbole on both sides. Everybody's escalating to try to "win" so nobody will.

 

That said...I'm actually kind of troubled by the comments a few have made that suggest that someone getting harassed should change her behavior. I don't talk about this stuff too much but whatever, shxt needs to be said and you guys need to just take one step back. I get what you're saying that not all older men (and women!) are predators for wanting to date who they want to date. I mean, of course they aren't, that's silly.

 

But .... well, shxt needs to be said, and I'm going to say it.

 

Stop with the victim-blaming, it's really really insensitive, not to mention flat-out wrong.

 

I'm a very shy person and wear very modest clothes. My husband remarked, when he met me, that I don't flirt, even with him. I'm the opposite of flirtatious. Just never really had it in me. I don't flirt on here, I don't flirt in real life, and although I'm friendly when you get to know me, almost all of my friends IRL have remarked on the difference between my private and public personas. Especially when I was younger, when I walked on the street I kept my eyes downcast and walked quickly and never sashayed and did all the things they tell you to do.

 

And it caused me all kinds of grief because frankly over the years I have been groped, catcalled, chased, even knocked down once while a guy tried to rape me (it was winter and I was wearing a thick winter coat!). That was in a public tourist site, at midday.

 

There is NOTHING about me that asks for it. I'm decent-looking but no Bo Derek 10. But there it is. Sometimes shxt happens and it's Not. Your. Fault. And it took me YEARS to get the courage to admit that to myself.

 

A LOT of women are like me. They will NOT call out the guy on the metro feeling them up, they will just shrink in shame and flee at the next stop. They did nothing to bring the creepage on themselves, but it happened anyway, because frankly SOME PEOPLE REALLY ARE CREEPS AND YES SOME OF THEM HAVE XY CHROMOSOMES, SO SORRY KTHXBYE.

 

So you know what? Stop it right now with the victim blaming.

 

But resume pointless debate if you must.

[Robert Z]

FWIW, I am now approaching younger women regularly and am doing so with extreme caution and care. The last thing that I would want to do is to offend or scare anyone. I know that some women will be freaked by any older man coming on to them, so there is a certain creep factor that is probably impossible to avoid if one is to be bold. But that is a perception problem or a value judgment. Some women will be insulted because any man my age would dare to think such a thing. But a certain percentage are open to relationships with older men. Not much that one can do about that. But groping and direct requests for sex are in the arena of predators and perverts. It vastly derails the topic and is just more man hating to make this about predators, when it supposed to be about dating and relationships.

 

There are plenty of very nice older men who like younger women. And plenty of us do marry much younger women. I think the fact that we like younger women makes us a target for certain individuals who have an agenda - primarily to paint all men as being the same with one stroke of the brush... or perhaps just all men who don't do as they are expected to according to ancient myths and nutty religions.

Edited April 30, 2014 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[123321]

Stop with the victim-blaming, it's really really insensitive, not to mention flat-out wrong.

 

No.

 

First, there is no victim when a guy approaches a gal.

 

Second, if a gal has all her routine social activities (as she has stated) interrupted by EVERY older man in her vicinity hitting on her relentlessly (again, her statement) no matter where she goes, her experience is atypical and it's completely fair to explore why.

[serial muse]

No.

 

First, there is no victim when a guy approaches a gal.

 

Second, if a gal has all her routine social activities (as she has stated) interrupted by EVERY older man in her vicinity hitting on her relentlessly (again, her statement) no matter where she goes, her experience is atypical and it's completely fair to explore why.

 

No.

 

I am currently on my phone, but look forward to quoting the relevant posts at you later, unless you care to take my comment seriously and review the last five pages yourself.

[Woggle]

NO woman should put up with genuine harassment but there is a difference between that and approaching and talking to a woman. There have been a number of women on here saying it is a man's job to approach because we are the hunters and some have sort of criticized men for not going up to a woman and talking to her. If most of the approaching is up to us then we can't magically guess whether or not a woman will be interested.

[serial muse]

NO woman should put up with genuine harassment but there is a difference between that and approaching and talking to a woman. There have been a number of women on here saying it is a man's job to approach because we are the hunters and some have sort of criticized men for not going up to a woman and talking to her. If most of the approaching is up to us then we can't magically guess whether or not a woman will be interested.

 

Agreed, but by the same token there are posts taking advantage of that hyperbole to push their own: the idea that women being harassed do ask for it and should change their behavior. I'm not inclined to let that slide.

[thefooloftheyear]

I agree about the jumping the shark thing and I think there's some odd hyperbole on both sides. Everybody's escalating to try to "win" so nobody will.

 

That said...I'm actually kind of troubled by the comments a few have made that suggest that someone getting harassed should change her behavior. I don't talk about this stuff too much but whatever, shxt needs to be said and you guys need to just take one step back. I get what you're saying that not all older men (and women!) are predators for wanting to date who they want to date. I mean, of course they aren't, that's silly.

 

But .... well, shxt needs to be said, and I'm going to say it.

 

Stop with the victim-blaming, it's really really insensitive, not to mention flat-out wrong.

 

I'm a very shy person and wear very modest clothes. My husband remarked, when he met me, that I don't flirt, even with him. I'm the opposite of flirtatious. Just never really had it in me. I don't flirt on here, I don't flirt in real life, and although I'm friendly when you get to know me, almost all of my friends IRL have remarked on the difference between my private and public personas. Especially when I was younger, when I walked on the street I kept my eyes downcast and walked quickly and never sashayed and did all the things they tell you to do.

 

And it caused me all kinds of grief because frankly over the years I have been groped, catcalled, chased, even knocked down once while a guy tried to rape me (it was winter and I was wearing a thick winter coat!). That was in a public tourist site, at midday.

 

There is NOTHING about me that asks for it. I'm decent-looking but no Bo Derek 10. But there it is. Sometimes shxt happens and it's Not. Your. Fault. And it took me YEARS to get the courage to admit that to myself.

 

A LOT of women are like me. They will NOT call out the guy on the metro feeling them up, they will just shrink in shame and flee at the next stop. They did nothing to bring the creepage on themselves, but it happened anyway, because frankly SOME PEOPLE REALLY ARE CREEPS AND YES SOME OF THEM HAVE XY CHROMOSOMES, SO SORRY KTHXBYE.

 

So you know what? Stop it right now with the victim blaming.

 

But resume pointless debate if you must.

 

I feel bad for you, and understand that I would NEVER blame a victim...

 

That being said..If I was a woman and someone harassed me, the creep would get a fist in their face, or a healthy dose of pepper spray...No way would I take it....If that meant I had to alter my behavior, then thats what I would do....No way am I going to just take it...I'd do something different-and maybe extreme...Thats all I was saying..Whats wrong with change if it makes your life easier and more pleasant?

 

And some women(obviously not you), do constantly flirt and dress provocatively...There is absolutely nothing wrong with it-and it doesn't warrant being harassed.....But then you better have some thick skin, because some aszhole guys are going to give you some crap...Again, I am not saying its justified...but Its likely going to happen...And some of these women are quick to talk about how this guy or that guy said something about their ass/whatever...They'll act like it bothers them, but in reality they love the attention..Again, I am sure this doesnt pertain to you or anyone else in the thread..But these people do exist..

 

Getting harassed is nothing to take lightly...

 

TFY

[Robert Z]

First, there is no victim when a guy approaches a gal.

 

 

I think there are two distinct situations that arise. One is where the woman is freaked out by any older man coming on to her and determines that he is a creep based solely on the fact that he would try. She labeled him a creep but not because he did anything inappropriate. It is a value judgment.

 

 

Then there really are creeps who act inappropriately for anyone in any age group.

 

 

I have been shocked at the way many younger men treat women. My 23 year old sb won't even consider dating anyone under 30. And she gets sick of getting groped and grabbed, or cat-called, at night clubs. But I can promise you that I treat her like a princess. In fact she once got upset, and with a cry in her voice, she asked why other [younger] men can't be more like me.

[123321]

Agreed, but by the same token there are posts taking advantage of that hyperbole to push their own: the idea that women being harassed do ask for it and should change their behavior. I'm not inclined to let that slide.

 

If a woman said that every time she went in public all the older men walked up to her and raped her, I would also be inclined to believe (1: most likely) she is well, let's call a spade a spade, she's lying, or (2: less likely) something is making her experience while walking in public unique and therefore I would question what that is.

 

This is completely different from blaming a victim of a random act, in that the "every time" aspect makes this not random. I would not blame a guy who slipped, fell and was injured in a grocery store for his injury. If it happened multiple times every time he went into the store, I (and the police and the insurance company) would tend to think he was causing his own problems.

 

So no, the phrases "think of the children", "blame the victim" and so on are not win buttons. Sorry.

[sillyanswer]

It is when he stalking me, ogling me, won't stop asking if I want sex. It IS my business.

 

I'm sorry that you're being stalked and sexually harassed. I'm not sure where you live, but if those things are illegal where you live then please go to the police and report this criminal.