Consolidated Discussion - Older/younger woman/man and age gap dating

[KathyM]

I personally never got that impression from the older/younger women I approached and/or dated, or from any of my female friends over the decades, but it appears to be one impression forwarded here.

 

Regarding a past posting, while I had not kept up with the machinations of Clint's marriage (now divorce process), the news stories evidently bore out exactly what the thrust of my posting was focused on. He and Dina had their differences, she first filed for a separation (I saw the case summary at the court) then a divorce a month later (same) and Clint proceeded to apparently become involved with the ex-spouse of the old 'friend' Dina took up with, a lady some 40+ years his junior. Did he care how it 'appeared'? Ha! That's what successful men do. What they want to. Sure, some will call them names like creepy or perverted. Yep, it happens. Part of life.

Well, Clint may not care how he appears in going after women 30 or 40 years younger than him, but the fact remains, he lost his wife to a man who was her own age, and I'm sure that must have hurt. Not a good plan to marry someone so much younger if your goal is to have a lasting marriage.

[hotpotato]

Then those people have a very unrealistic view of the future. I can assure you, there is a reason why most people marry someone close to their age: they don't want to start being a carer to an elderly person in their 40s or give up sex.

 

Right, most people want someone to grow old with.

[hotpotato]

I personally never got that impression from the older/younger women I approached and/or dated, or from any of my female friends over the decades, but it appears to be one impression forwarded here.

 

Regarding a past posting, while I had not kept up with the machinations of Clint's marriage (now divorce process), the news stories evidently bore out exactly what the thrust of my posting was focused on. He and Dina had their differences, she first filed for a separation (I saw the case summary at the court) then a divorce a month later (same) and Clint proceeded to apparently become involved with the ex-spouse of the old 'friend' Dina took up with, a lady some 40+ years his junior. Did he care how it 'appeared'? Ha! That's what successful men do. What they want to. Sure, some will call them names like creepy or perverted. Yep, it happens. Part of life.

 

Clint Eastwood is...rich...He is also in good shape for his age.

People are having a hard time finding average old and elderly men dating young women.

[carhill]

Another anecdote, local in nature, from my social circle. Man is married to younger wife, about 8 years younger, both now in their sixties. Social man, always enjoys younger women. One would presume the wife would end up being the carer of her older H in his infirmities of age. Unfortunately, the reverse happened and he now cares for someone fighting stage 4 cancer. Lesson? In life, there are no absolutes and youth, or being 'younger' or 'older' is no guarantee of anything.

 

I was reading about another guy, apparently an anathema to elderly UK gents, Pierce Brosnan, who was married to his first, older, wife until she died of ovarian cancer at a quite young age (43), then later lost a daughter to the same disease, and he later remarried a lady a decade his junior. He's 'elderly' but certainly appears to buck the trend of what elderly UK men apparently are, both in health and what being a husband entail, even with age differences. Will his current wife be his 'carer' in his elderly years? Perhaps, just as he was the carer for his first wife until she passed. That's how life goes.

 

As another poster mentioned, statistically, most people date and marry contemporaries and this thread is focused on those whose life experiences are outlier to the 'rule'. The rule is accepted, by myself anyway. I certainly followed it in my own M, marrying someone only a few months older. That in no way invalidates another man or woman marrying/partnering with someone years or decades older or younger. If their life is enhanced with such companionship, even if not 'forever', I wish them well.

[sillyanswer]

Right, most people want someone to grow old with.

 

Eventually, yes, but not all age-gap dating (or other dating) is done with the intention of it being a life-long relationship even if those people do eventually want someone to grow old with.

[hotpotato]

He isn't married and this is till death due you part.

 

Assuming we are not talking about two people who are just dating for "fun".

 

The purpose of your relationship is to find out an answer to a question.

 

What is the question, you ask?

 

"Is this the person I want / am going to spend the rest of my life with?"

 

If either of you decided to stop dating, break up or end a relationship for WHATEVER reason... You both now have the answer to that question and the answer is, NO.

 

If I am dating or in a relationship with someone and we are fighting all the time, she is crazy, she is abusive, she gets fat, she is cruel, she cheats, she lies, I am no longer like her attracted or I just want to be single, etc.

 

I am not going to stay and work it out or go to couples counseling.

 

If I am dating or in a relationship and I know the answer to the question. Which is, I do not want to spend the rest of my life with this person... I'm OUT and I hope the other person would do me the favor of doing the same thing if the shoe is on the other foot.

 

A break up is not a failure, it's an answer to a question and the successful conclusion of your relationship.

 

 

 

If you do not want to be with him, then don't be. Same applies to him.

 

When did dating or being in relationship mean you have to get permission and the other persons approval to break up?

I think we will have to agree to disagree. I think one should do the best they can to make something work. The grass isn't always greener anyway.

If she's that bad, then just break up. No need to chase young poon or really anybody because he wants another lily in the pond to land on and an ego boost.

[RonaldS]

Well, he was attractive!

Here's a question, why are women supposed to look past all of men's faults? No matter how old he is, or whatever, she is supposed to look on the inside and love him, yet he doesn't do that same?

 

Nobody is supposed to look past anybody's faults, beyond the normal acceptance of certain faults requisite or any relationship.

 

The 'jaded older women' crew in this thread is sort of implying that their own aging is somehow a fault of their own and that men need to accept it. Maybe the women need to accept it first. Then they might not come off as being so grumpy and, subsequently, probably seem more attractive to men? Just a thought.

 

As I stated 72 pages ago....in my experience with dating women my age, it's the attitude that turns me off. Not the wrinkles. And to that point, if I wanted to be with a pissy woman with a sh*tty attitude who blames everybody else in the world for every little perceived injustice toward them, I would have just stayed married.

Edited April 30, 2014 by RonaldS

[MidwestUSA]

 

The 'jaded older women' crew in this thread is sort of implying that their own aging is somehow a fault of their own and that men need to accept it. Maybe the women need to accept it first. Then they might not come off as being so grumpy and then, subsequently, probably seem more attractive to men? Just a thought.

 

Did you mean 'no fault of their own'?

[123321]

Here we go, blame the victim again

 

And because someone else said it:

 

You are not an victim when you get hit on. I don't care how young, old, smooth, or weird the guy is, but stop using the word victim. Its dramatic and woe is me

 

 

 

I don't know the story of hotpotato, but it's also not relevant to my point. My point is this: you are participating in and escalating the hyperbole if you go from one person's story to a general statement such as "I would examine my behavior if I was repeatedly getting harassed".

 

Well that's rough because it's absolutely central to my statement. People here are saying that if she SPECIFICALLY is having the experiences she SPECIFICALLY says she has, then maybe it has something to do with her because it seems extremely atypical. Sorry (again) if that sort of conversational thread doesn't fit into the narrative you were wanting or expecting.

 

But it's the conversation we were having HERE in that context.

 

 

I dont care if a woman wants to date a man who is much older, I'm simply saying that the average old and elderly man thinks he is more attractive than what he really is. He also doesn't see that yes older men can marry younger women, but they are usually bringing something else to the table besides sex and romance.

 

First, why do you care what he thinks? Second, yes, there is a lot more to life.

 

 

Well, he was attractive!

Here's a question, why are women supposed to look past all of men's faults? No matter how old he is, or whatever, she is supposed to look on the inside and love him, yet he doesn't do that same?

 

"Supposed to" is such a horrible phrase in this context don't you think? How about we just let people do what they like and leave the motives to themselves?

 

 

Right, most people want someone to grow old with.

 

Says who?

[Emilia]

Eventually, yes, but not all age-gap dating (or other dating) is done with the intention of it being a life-long relationship even if those people do eventually want someone to grow old with.

Ah! But some of the men are saying precisely that many of those interested in older men do want a life-long relationship with them. That's the deluded part.

 

Probably wouldn't bother with the whole thread if it was just about short term sexual relationships. They have no significance at all.

 

Oh I see. Even though 50% of marriages end in divorce. Where there is an age gap involved it's 100% certain you are dumber than the other 50% dummies were.

 

Example:

 

A 35 year old woman and 45 year old men are to STUPID and unable to court just like everyone else. They are unable to see how well their personalities, interests, desires, goals, dreams, etc. mesh together and based on those plan a see / plan future together. They are unable to determine if they have the same values, character, morals, beliefs and discuss finances, money, retirement, kids, etc.

 

If the above 35 year old woman or 45 year old man are too STUPID to not do that with each other they sure as hell aren't going do it with someone their own age.

Your post makes absolutely no sense. Would you care elaborating again?

Edited April 30, 2014 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Merge

[RonaldS]

Did you mean 'no fault of their own'?

 

No, I mean they subconsciously view their age as a fault. They're insecure about it, but they don't realize they are, so then they project blame onto others for making value judgements of them based on their age, and then get mad at others (eg men who prefer younger women).

 

The reality is that they're actually the ones making the value judgements of themselves, and don't realize that it isn't the age that's turning men off....it's the attitude.

 

I have no issue at all with women my age or older, from an attraction POV. I have a client who is 53, and I would absolutely DESTROY her. That's 13 years older, and 'old' by most metrics. But in my experience in dating older women, many have that sh*tty aforementioned attitude, and it's just a turn off. All things being equal, I would rather spend my time with a woman who isn't penalizing me for her perceived lack of interest from men due to her age...self-fulfilling prophetic as it typically is. I'll just hang out with a 28 year old who isn't bitter yet.

[sillyanswer]

Hi Emilia!

 

Ah! But some of the men are saying precisely that many of those interested in older men do want a life-long relationship with them. That's the deluded part.

 

Deluded, I agree, or perhaps naive (the men, for believing that). It may even be true some of the time.

 

Probably wouldn't bother with the whole thread if it was just about short term sexual relationships. They have no significance at all.

 

Well, it's not just about that, but it's also about that. The whole idea of life-long relationships seems to be dwindling across all age groups.

[Woggle]

No matter what age I want nothing to do with a woman who seems to want to punish me for being born with a penis. I dealt with my issues with the opposite sex and while I admit I am still very much a work in progress I am getting counseling and this is my issue and no innocent woman should have to pay for it. If more women took that mentality with their men issues maybe they would do better in their relationships. If I wanted to be around an older misandrist I would move in with my mother. Younger women with that attitude are just as much of a turn off.

[clia]

What do people consider to be too large of an age gap? 5 years+, 10 years+?

[iiiii]

I think some in this thread have declared a relationship is "wrong" if one person is old enough to be the parent of the other (so presumably a 16 year gap is wrong?), and others have said the cut off is if one is old enough to be the grandparent of the other (presumably making a 32 year gap wrong?)

 

I kind of like the "half your age plus 7 rule".

 

Although more seriously, I think if there's such a thing as too large an age gap, what it is probably depends on the people involved.

 

I also wonder if people's feelings about this partly depend on how old their parents were when they were born? My father is 33 years older than me, for example, so dating a guy 16 years older than me wouldn't feel at all like dating my father. Whereas if there were only 16 years difference between my father and myself, maybe I'd be more weirded out by dating a guy 16 years older than me?

Edited April 30, 2014 by iiiii

[GorillaTheater]

Considering almost all of the men in this thread are not in romantic relationships, married, nor have they expressed the desire for a romantic relationship or marriage and instead prefer to date and sleep around...

 

Good thing you said "almost".

 

I'm not on the market and if I was, I picture myself dating women of my age and experiences. I'm just here because I can't believe that anyone would take issue with the dating preferences of others. It just doesn't compute. At all.

 

But with all of the apparent hypocrisy thrown around, I'll share some of my own: if my twenty-something daughter was dating a man my age, I'd be pissed, and I'd make it known to all involved.

 

Hey, you want 100% consistent logic and reason, look elsewhere.

[MidwestUSA]

TH, are you seriously contrasting a 33 year old and a 25 year old? I guess it's all about perspective, but from where I'm sitting, they'd be considered 'same age'.

[KathyM]

Several of the female posters have shared many of their encounters with younger / same age / older men. I think it's time men share our experiences with women who are younger / same age / older too. Men should know what the differences are and what they can expect to encounter should they pursue Age Gap sexual or romantic relationships, right?

 

In my case, 30 something women (same age) and older versus 20 somethings (younger).

 

Many women my age and older have a lot of "baggage" and not nearly as attractive when compared to women who are younger.

 

Many of the single women my age or older since they were in their teens / 20s their selection criteria and the type of man they choose to date / marry (some many times) is like that of a producer on Jerry Springer when they are determining the criteria and types of men they would like to have on the show.

 

Then you have things like kids which could be from several fathers who they may or may not have married and many who are deadbeats, a gazillion douche rockets, bar tenders, losers, STD and multiple abortions (which they are quick to tell / complain / still suffer from emotionally), years of abuse from either drinking, drugs, physical / emotional (from many of the "gems" she choose to be with), credit problems, debt up to their eyeballs, DUI(s), etc.

 

They do not have slightest clue what normal is, chaos / drama follows them everywhere and if there is any peace they will create chaos / drama because they are not happy without it. Then you add in all the lies, cheating, etc. that many of their BFs and Husbands did (often times these women did too), etc.

 

Then of course due their long history of self-destructive choices they made you have years and years of mental and emotional abuse, neglect, stress, trauma, pain, disappointment, suffering, misery, bitterness, anger, drama, sadness, regret, torment, loss, etc.

 

Then the icing on top... They believe they had no part / say in any of that. They take ZERO accountability for their bad choices and actions, their piss poor taste in men and believe no they are certain they are 100% victims in all of this.

 

Now you get the 30 something year old woman who already frustrated, angry and bitter about where her life ended up and then add in she is suffering miserably from the consequences of the lifestyle she choose and long ago and years and years of bad choices (money issues, kid(s) issues, ex-husband(s) issues, credit issues, substance abuse issues, mental and emotional issues, etc.) and that none of it is her fault and the source / reason for all her pain, misery, misfortune, hardship, etc. is due to men... Let's just say it isn't realy pretty or a pleasant experience to be around much less date these women.

 

Notice we haven't even got to the physical / attractiveness yet.

 

The "mileage" / damage / hell the 33 year old put herself through takes a toll ("Rode Hard and Put Up Wet" comes to mind)!

 

My conclusion

 

When you contrast the same age (30 something) / older women against the 25 year old world class hottie... She smokes them in every way (looks, body, mind and soul).

The same could be said of older men, divorced, kids with an ex wife, etc. The older man has all the baggage, but somehow he feels he's too good for women who have the same baggage as he does. Or he feels that somehow younger women should have to put up with his baggage, but he doesn't have to put up with any baggage from women. Quite a double standard there.

[MidwestUSA]

I agree with you but some people have + / - of 3 to 5 years tops.

 

For the sake of the male posters who might be considering dating / pursing a relationship with an age gap, how about a 39 year old male and 25 year old female.

 

So you mean as opposed to him choosing a 33 year old. Gotcha. You sure weighted that 33 year old down with a lot of baggage. Like a whole Samsonite set!

[Woggle]

There are older women who are great catches and then there are younger women who are a complete mess so age has nothing to do with it. I used to work with a 22 year old who sounded like some angry male basher who went through a lifetime of drama chasing and she tried to make me her therapist until it was obvious I was ignoring her.

[RonaldS]

Let's just start at +/- 10 years as the defined gap. Make it easy on ourselves.

 

Of all of the women I've hung out with after my marriage ended, I would say that the average age difference was -10 years. I did hang out with a couple of same age and older women too (factored into avg).

[FitChick]

Re: Susan Sarandon: Four years isn't much time together. When she's 80 and he's 50, I wonder if he'll feel quite so enamoured or attracted.

Maybe. Joan Collins and her husband have the same gap and they've been married at least ten years as far as I know.

 

Besides, didn't you ever see the cult film Harold & Maude?

[D.Mc.]

OMG. That is too funny. Yep, I'm on board with that. Three men in my house.

 

the younger one would cook too (because they are ok with mixing gender roles).

 

The old one could live there too. He'd probably sleep through the evening festivities anyway. Maybe he'd have fun watching.

 

The uglier one. He'd be the one I'd occasionally kick the younger one out of bed for to have long, late night conversations or watch movies with.

 

The younger one and the uglier one could team up on house projects. The old one would just make sure the mortgage was paid and my bank balance full. Ok, ok, maybe I'd try to give him oral sex as a 'thank you'. If my arms didn't get too tired.

 

Ah well. We can dream after all

 

There's a South American tribe in the Amazon rain forest that actually practices a form of this (saw it on PBS years ago). An older adult female will have 2 husbands for a year or so, one of them much younger, so he can learn what the requirements for a good husband are, while the older male helps w/the children & gets a break from hunting all the time. Why are we so "civilized"? This is essentially what the polygamous marriages they show on tv are doing (not to mention the FLDS compounds in the western U.S.). If it's good enough for men then why not us women too?

[Anela]

So 'debonair' George has been 'tamed', while 'tragic' Jen was 'saved' ? no surprise there | Hadley Freeman | Comment is free | The Guardian

 

Poor George Clooney. Poor tragic, oldster, childless, longterm singleton George Clooney. Did you know he's over 50? Did you know he got divorced over 20 years ago and has not been married since? Instead, he has lurched pathetically, hopelessly from one failed relationship to the next, his biological clock going tick-tock-tick-tock. Meanwhile, his ex-wife, Talia Balsam, who was clearly too good for him, remarried sexy John Slattery from Mad Men and had a son. A family. Ouch! That must have hurt.

 

 

But now, lucky George has finally found a woman in the nick of time, and has somehow convinced her to marry him. They got engaged after only seven months of dating, which proves how desperate poor/lucky George Clooney is. I bet he's going to turn into a right Groomzilla now and insist on having a baby immediately.

 

 

I jest, of course. Clearly that is not the way George Clooney's unmarried life and recent engagement were reported in the media, because George Clooney is a man. Therefore, he is a sexy, debonair bachelor, a living breathing combination of Cary Grant, Brylcreem and handsomeness. He loves and leaves his women, that sexy cad, and the women are heartbroken. But he just waltzes on through life, evading the haggish hands of women hoping to nail him down, possibly literally. Ouch!

 

 

And so, as is appropriate, his engagement has been greeted in the press this week with shock ("George Clooney engaged? What?!"), because why on earth would this silver fox give up his sexy, debonair love 'em and leave 'em life, right? But there has also been grief ("Sorry, girls, Clooney has got engaged"), because it is a truth universally acknowledged that all women are desperate for Clooney to marry them.

 

 

His fiancee, Amal Alamuddin, is described in terms more appropriate to a wild animal hunter than a humanitarian lawyer: she "tamed" him, she "hooked" him, she "tied him down"; because Clooney is not just a handsome bachelor, you see: he is a wild leopard. And all of us "girls" have been dying to drag that leopard up the church aisle and get our hands on his handsomeness, his money and his famous last name. Haven't we, girls? You know we have. And now, we are all sad. Sad and desperate. As we always are.

 

 

Never mind that Alamuddin is, by any standard, quite a woman, being tri-lingual, smart, a barrister, a human rights lawyer, an adviser to Kofi Annan and beautiful. She obviously had to pull out all the tricks to "snare" Clooney, and what was her trick? According to a "well-informed source", it "was not her strategy for world peace" that snared Clooney (obviously not – intellect is repulsive in a woman): it was that she "played hard to get". This allegedly entailed Alamuddin turning Clooney down twice for dinner: "She was operating on the lines of 'treat 'em mean, keep 'em keen!'" the "well-placed source" revealed. Yesssss, maybe she was playing hard to get, or maybe an intelligent barrister could think of other things to do with her evening than listen to another actor blah on with his ill-formed thoughts about Syria when she'd already had quite enough pseudo-intellectualism from other celebrities she may have encountered through the UN, including Geri Halliwell and Angelina Jolie. Because maybe a smart 36-year-old woman is not as wowed by celebrity as candyfloss-brained tabloids. And as anyone with more than candyfloss for brains can see, it's Clooney who has lucked out here.

 

Let us turn now to another divorced and now engaged celebrity, one Jennifer Aniston. Like Clooney, Aniston was married and then got divorced from a fellow actor who has since remarried another actor and gone on to have children with them. Like Clooney, she went on to have a series of relationships with stonkingly good-looking people. And also like Clooney, she is now engaged to a fellow glamorous human being who goes by the name of Justin Theroux. So presumably when her engagement was announced, the media should have been filled with headlines along the lines of "Sorry, boys, Jen's been snapped up!" and "Jen's engaged?! We're all heartbroken!"

 

But of course none of those headlines appeared because even though – going by the tabloids' rubric – Aniston is a less desperate case than Clooney, being both younger and divorced for a shorter period, she is a woman. Therefore her engagement to Theroux was reported in precisely the terms and tone I used in the first paragraph, and has continued to be so ever since, with tales of Aniston's fiance trying to "break it off" and "refusing to see her" and her "desperation for a baby" filling the covers of tabloids and women's magazines every day. And that's because, in the world of the media, women are tragic and desperate and sad, and men are caddish and free. Because the media, apparently, believes that people are like characters in a crap romcom you wouldn't watch on a 14-hour flight.

 

It would be nice, wouldn't it, to live in a world where the media – tabloid and broadsheet – didn't talk about and to unmarried grown women as if they were hysterical teenagers desperate to be saved by their prince, insane with a need to be married NOW. It would be equally nice if the media didn't portray unmarried men as naughty schoolboys, terrified of those crazed women lurking around every corner waiting to kidnap them and take them to the altar. But then writing about people as changeable, varied human beings requires thought, whereas trotting out gender cliches from the 17th century doesn't.

 

 

So congratulations, George Clooney! I'm as happy for you as I would be for anyone I don't actually know. To be honest, I always preferred Noah Wyle. Oooh, anyone know if he's still single?!?!?!?

 

This. There's an age gap there, so that's on-topic for this thread, but I love the entire article, that goes along with similar jabs that are made towards women all over these boards, and offline.

[123321]

Several of the female posters have shared many of their encounters with younger / same age / older men. I think it's time men share our experiences with women who are younger / same age / older too. Men should know what the differences are and what they can expect to encounter should they pursue Age Gap sexual or romantic relationships, right?

 

You pretty much nailed it; the sex is fine until they hit menopause, but there seems to always be a lot more drama, like an onion, a layer of drama for every year. Individual cases vary, but as a rule of thumb, yeah.

 

 

The same could be said of older men, divorced, kids with an ex wife, etc. The older man has all the baggage, but somehow he feels he's too good for women who have the same baggage as he does. Or he feels that somehow younger women should have to put up with his baggage, but he doesn't have to put up with any baggage from women. Quite a double standard there.

 

If I can choose between a younger woman with less baggage and an older one with more, why would I choose the latter over the former?

 

Your reasoning is ass-backwards.

 

• "but somehow he feels he's too good for women who have the same baggage as he does. " No, he just looks at his options and takes the best one.
• Or he feels that somehow younger women should have to put up with his baggage Again no, he simply looks at his options and takes the best one. It's up to the woman to decide if she feels "his baggage", whatever it is, is worth it. Simple.
• he doesn't have to put up with any baggage from women Not really, rather he has proven by experiment what level of baggage he has to put up with, and has also determined how much he is WILLING to put up with. If he can attract a woman with less baggage than his limit, he dates her, otherwise he plays golf.
• Quite a double standard there Again, no. Each person has their own circumstances and standards. I don't know anyone who is dating younger woman and encouraging other women to do ... anything.