Roles and Labels

[Silly_Girl]

You can't compare 'cheating' in the sense of a board game, white lying about weight or age TO cheating in an affair when it out right HURTS innocent people.

 

Apples and strawberries!!

 

I didn't compare them. I was musing about the term 'cheater'. No mention of infidelity. The posts about 'when is a cheater (not) a cheater' led to it. Hope that makes it clearer.

[RepairMinded]

Most people have 'cheated' at one time or another. Board game, eating something and pretending they haven't when on a diet, lying about how much something cost, not giving back change when the shop assistant gives back too much. Maybe we're all cheaters.

 

Do not pass go, do not collect $200.00

[RepairMinded]

I didn't compare them. I was musing about the term 'cheater'. No mention of infidelity. The posts about 'when is a cheater (not) a cheater' led to it. Hope that makes it clearer.

 

The Parker Brothers forum is thataway honey.

[RepairMinded]

Okay . . . yes in that sense I guess you can say they are the same. But I would argue that a person who cheats, a cheater, is more than that label correct?

 

But yes, both are descriptive terms of an object.

 

Does the "history of cheating" matter? That seems to imply more than one? What if they are currently doing so. I am assuming you are meaning if one cheats, has cheated or planning on cheating then they are a cheater. Correct?

 

It's not beyond the realm of the plausible to use that particular label on that particular group of persons.

[silktricks]

Why are some people so obsessed with these roles, and the labels, anyway?OW, BS, etc.; ad infinitum, long, long after the situation has been resolved? I can certainly understand being fairly immersed in them during the quagmire of the affair and all that, but why go on and on after that part of life is in the distant past?

 

Is having affairs with married people, or having extramarital affairs while married the absolutely defining feature of some peoples' identities?

 

As I have shared before, I have cheated, and I have messed with a married man. I still cannot even come CLOSE to relating to this "syndrome" which is such a big feature of many of the threads here.

 

Here on LS, it helps provide the back-story so other posters can better understand where you're coming from. JMO...

[Memphis Raines]

 

Why would you say that? The word 'most' signifies a large proportion but not all.

 

"Most people have 'cheated' at one time or another."

 

because to say the above phrase is usually an attempt to say, "bah, its no big deal, most people do it", or that since "most people do it" that someone shouldn't make a big deal about it if they are on the crap end of the stick in the "love" triangle.

[RepairMinded]

Also Memphis, everyone knows that stealing $5 in Monopoly money as a six year old child is exactly equivalent to a married adult having a long-term sexual affair.

 

Both are "cheaters."

[Memphis Raines]

Also Memphis, everyone knows that stealing $5 in Monopoly money as a six year old child is exactly equivalent to a married adult having a long-term sexual affair.

 

Both are "cheaters."

 

LOL, and the child that got cheated out of a win in Monopoly, and those on the crap end of the stick in an affair are just "bitter". LOL. another label conveniently forgot about in this thread.

[Silly_Girl]

"Most people have 'cheated' at one time or another."

 

because to say the above phrase is usually an attempt to say, "bah, its no big deal, most people do it", or that since "most people do it" that someone shouldn't make a big deal about it if they are on the crap end of the stick in the "love" triangle.

 

'Usually'? Perhaps. In this case? No.

 

Labels can be far-reaching, a word has many connotations, different for some than others. If we get into the 'anyone who has cheated IS a cheater', then it makes me wonder whether one incident, for example, does indeed give one a label for life. And if so there's probably a lot of us with the same ones.

[Memphis Raines]

If we get into the 'anyone who has cheated IS a cheater', then it makes me wonder whether one incident, for example, does indeed give one a label for life.

 

depends on the person. to me it does.

 

If I know someone to have cheated before, the term once a cheater, always a cheater, I suppose, is subjective. but I won't take a chance on a known cheater.

 

likewise if I start dating someone and find out they have cheated before, the relationship won't last long after that.

[Silly_Girl]

depends on the person. to me it does.

 

If I know someone to have cheated before, the term once a cheater, always a cheater, I suppose, is subjective. but I won't take a chance on a known cheater.

 

likewise if I start dating someone and find out they have cheated before, the relationship won't last long after that.

 

I wonder if it's a bit deeper than subjective. My friend was a psychiatric nurse before he became a landscape gardener. He intends to keep his new profession. I would never introduce him as a nurse, but as a gardener as that's him now. But you would, where cheating is concerned, say the label prevails. Presumably over many decades even?

[jwi71]

Why would I go around expliciting telling people whomever crosses our path that he was a MP?

 

And we come to the crux of it....why wouldn't YOU?

Why NOT share that you began dating when he was still M? If its "just a label and doesn't define you"...why omit that? Why is that information, that you began as his OW, TOO personal? Isn't it just a label which doesn't define you? It just seems in conflict to me. I would have expected you tell whomever precisely because its a label and you don't care. Interesting.

 

Do you air personal information that freely?

 

How is this personal information? I gladly speak of dating, then quitting, then trying match.com and meeting my now very serious GF. She was D, no kids, VP of large international bank...whats not to like? Whats NOT to share? What of that is "too personal"?

 

And yes, I am more open than most. Of course, I am mostly proud, and not in boastful way, of the labels I earn. And the ones I am not proud of, I tend to call too personal and omit telling everyone I meet. Just sayin'

 

And I don't promote myself either way though, I guess this would come up next, how long does one wear a label, I would technically be the GF and not the mistress.

 

I say forever. Once you earn a label you cannot un-earn it. We tend to let those "unwanted" labels fade - or least keep them under wraps.

 

Though we do joke with each other how "his mistress would do something" or "my MM would do something" that boring ole us now doesn't. Sometimes the mistress had things MUCH better.

 

I'm glad you two are happy together - I really am. I have always maintained I don't care how an A ends (who ends with who) as long as it ends.

 

In any case, Im not attacking you - just pointing out what I think is you doing exactly what I say people do - promote some labels over others because of their acceptability/likeability/whatever-ability perceived or otherwise.

 

And you better believe I have labels I wish I didn't. And no, I'm not telling

[Memphis Raines]

I wonder if it's a bit deeper than subjective. My friend was a psychiatric nurse before he became a landscape gardener. He intends to keep his new profession. I would never introduce him as a nurse, but as a gardener as that's him now. But you would, where cheating is concerned, say the label prevails. Presumably over many decades even?

 

you are comparing a choice to change careers to someone's character.

 

but if you want to make that comparison, ok. if I knew the same person, I know they still could perform the duties of a psychiatric nurse anytime they want, and if a friend asked them to give them their opinion as such, they would do it.

[Silly_Girl]

you are comparing a choice to change careers to someone's character.

 

but if you want to make that comparison, ok. if I knew the same person, I know they still could perform the duties of a psychiatric nurse anytime they want, and if a friend asked them to give them their opinion as such, they would do it.

 

I'm talking about labels and whether they (should) have an expiration date, or not.

[Memphis Raines]

I'm talking about labels and whether they (should) have an expiration date, or not.

 

thats the point, you compared it to once a cheater always a cheater as a label.

 

just as your PN friend. she can still be considered one because she has the qualifications and knowledge.

 

just as someone who has cheated with their character.

 

so IMO, cheater doesn't have an expiration date.

[fooled once]

Most people have 'cheated' at one time or another. Board game, eating something and pretending they haven't when on a diet, lying about how much something cost, not giving back change when the shop assistant gives back too much. Maybe we're all cheaters.

 

That is just silly. Letting a kid win a board game, sneaking chocolate while on a diet are not even in the same realm as sneaking around and sleeping with someone who is married. To even imply they are 'one and the same' is reaching big time, IMHO

 

You can't compare 'cheating' in the sense of a board game, white lying about weight or age TO cheating in an affair when it out right HURTS innocent people.

 

Apples and strawberries!!

 

Apples and a dress

[Silly_Girl]

That is just silly. Letting a kid win a board game, sneaking chocolate while on a diet are not even in the same realm as sneaking around and sleeping with someone who is married. To even imply they are 'one and the same' is reaching big time, IMHO

 

Which post was that in?

[Dionysus]

I say forever. Once you earn a label you cannot un-earn it. We tend to let those "unwanted" labels fade - or least keep them under wraps.

And that is it right?

 

I don't believe that labels "define" us personally. But they are a part of who we are and remain so, until we die, and possibly beyond. IMO anyway.

 

Why should a label just disappear? Is it because you want it to disappear because you don't like what it says about you?

 

Interesting.

[Silly_Girl]

Some labels are directly in contrast to others and become applicable (or not) as we progress through our cycles in life. Someone who's promiscuous in their 20s, for example, may marry in their 30s and be faithful and loyal for the rest of their life. So should they be referred to as a promiscuous person when in their 40s? Or their 70s? I'd find that very strange.

[Dionysus]

Some labels are directly in contrast to others and become applicable (or not) as we progress through our cycles in life. Someone who's promiscuous in their 20s, for example, may marry in their 30s and be faithful and loyal for the rest of their life. So should they be referred to as a promiscuous person when in their 40s? Or their 70s? I'd find that very strange.

 

Interesting (again).

 

This hypothetical person was promiscuous. And that's the point. That label is a part of their personal history. Birth till death.

 

I'd say that PPP (past promiscuous person) needs to accept who they were without letting it consume them. In other words, the PPP label is hidden away by their shiny "faithful and loyal" label. Both labels remain as a part of their overall identity though. One just happens to be placed in the forefront due to its increased relevance.

 

IMO.

Edited July 27, 2011 by Dionysus

[sillysmart]

Why are people obsessed with labels? OUr minds work that way. We are relationship creatures I believe. We are wherever we are why label it well to know where we are. I am in California. We also relate to other people Dah. I am a sister, a mother, a wife, a friend. Sometimes a stranger. I think you don't like labels because you don't like judgment.

No one label does not a whole person make but it lets them and others judge reality of where they are in relaitionship to others. What is another woman? Another woman is someone who is sleeping with another woman's husband. Simple as that. The label means just what it is. The judgment you don't like in the label tries to avoid that reality. Sleeping with someone else's husband gee what should we call it if anything....too people sleeping together. But alas that leaves out just a small piece of reality like a whole family consisting of son's daughters, father's blah so you lose context of the relationship and what it means.

All those living with a distorted view of reality. Like an adopted child finding out they are adopted at 18 feeling betrayed feeling like finally It all makes sense and I am not crazy. Lies create a distorted sense of reality causing anxiety, control issues, betrayal, lack of trust, confusion, false conclusions etc. and lost opportunities for real love. These people labeling themselves are least truthful about their reality here and so maybe they can be off of here! That is why they are obssessed with it.

So by saying you don't like labels you are in fact trying to make one up that has nothing to do with context or reality. Maybe you are thinking get over it where you are....being the OW etc. but that's the whole point. IF you are not there then fine but if you are that is where you are. Maybe you feel Ow or MM sorry for them apologizing like oh well it is all good! Meaningless like it is all a game or something coming out in the wash. You sound upathetic and unattached. Have you forgiven yourself for these labels or places you have been? Just some thoughts.

[browndog319]

thats the point, you compared it to once a cheater always a cheater as a label.

 

just as your PN friend. she can still be considered one because she has the qualifications and knowledge.

 

just as someone who has cheated with their character.

 

so IMO, cheater doesn't have an expiration date.

 

Actually, the psychiatric nurse designation WOULD have an expiration date because you have to keep your license current - no one wants you to be treated by a nurse who hasn't kept up with current clinical practice for years.

 

Similarly, many women who opt out of the work force to raise families are penalized upon re-entry - they do not immediately assume their former positions and titles. It doesn't work like that.

 

So even professional designations have an expiration date.

 

If one is not allowed to evolve and rehabilitate, what is the point of trying, learning and growing. Of redemption? Because if redemption is not possible in this human life, we are F***ed as a human race.

 

We have all sinned. I have committed the sin of adultery. Yep. I have coveted my neighbor's husband. David coveted Bathsheba, had her husband killed after he knocked her up and God still allowed Jesus Christ to be born through his family line to honor him as a man... just saying. In the new testament, they don't constantly refer to King David as that philandering murderer, do they?

[Tayla]

It boils down to this, are you an adjective or a noun?

 

Such things as a "loyal" patriot, An "avid" reader. Labels.aka, "roles" are definitive, this much is true. Even when I pass on ,the terminology of "a decent taxpayer", a corrupt politician will still ring true thru time. Its what "value" you give to labels. Call it the point system, you get two points if you are supposedly an altruistic person, you get one point if you fibbed to a teacher , you get slapped with negative points if you go below the "moral" standards in which your culture abides by, such as disobeying the family, defying the norms, or heaven forbid speak your own mind or live a lifestyle that is defiant to society. You get negative points if you belong to a cult...

The bottom line is ....Roles/labels carry as much value as you define them to have.

 

To the poster who is a purist I give you negative two points. Sorry that I cant recall the person so much as they turn their back on a date who has a "past". Get over yourself, you are not beyond imperfection or being flawed.

[donnamaybe]

Actually, the psychiatric nurse designation WOULD have an expiration date because you have to keep your license current - no one wants you to be treated by a nurse who hasn't kept up with current clinical practice for years.

 

Similarly, many women who opt out of the work force to raise families are penalized upon re-entry - they do not immediately assume their former positions and titles. It doesn't work like that.

 

So even professional designations have an expiration date.

 

If one is not allowed to evolve and rehabilitate, what is the point of trying, learning and growing. Of redemption? Because if redemption is not possible in this human life, we are F***ed as a human race.

 

We have all sinned. I have committed the sin of adultery. Yep. I have coveted my neighbor's husband. David coveted Bathsheba, had her husband killed after he knocked her up and God still allowed Jesus Christ to be born through his family line to honor him as a man... just saying. In the new testament, they don't constantly refer to King David as that philandering murderer, do they?

But that is the point of this thread. There are women who claim to.be "happy married," yet they still seem to revel in their OW "label."

[Silly_Girl]

But that is the point of this thread. There are women who claim to.be "happy married," yet they still seem to revel in their OW "label."

 

Likewise there are those who actively work to hide and deny their 'labels'.

 

It seems most don't use them IRL anyway. Being in denial is something I would be concerned of. If one is in a place, but can't see it, that's not good. But most people I see here are very aware of what labels their actions may attract and don't contest them.

 

Labels do become outdated and superseded by others. That doesn't erase history or mean events didn't happen, just means it's no longer relevant to describe a person in that way. I agree with BD that we must, as a society, leave room for individuals to change and mature and rehabilitate (if appropriate).