If MM told BW we just had an inappropriate friendship, why is she stalking me on FB?

[bentnotbroken]

This is good information - and I could probably figure out their phone provider.

 

Thanks for the confidence building - I try to handle myself well!

You should know that phone records have to be subpoenaed to be used. That means anything you do, you must do legally. As for the phone calls, typically it takes more than hang ups to get something done legally. It would be hard to prove it is her and not him if they use the same provider, which most couples do.

[tami-chan]

Hi browndog!

 

You seem like a very nice person-as evidenced by your response to the obvious "shaming" that is going on here by some posters.

 

What your MM did at DD is classic. Interesting thing about stuff like this is that sometimes emotions lose to practicality- it can be that there is just too much to lose in his marriage to leave now or maybe ever-how long has he been married? does he have kids?

 

The thing is, what are you prepared to do for your relationship with him? Will you be able to look at yourself and truthfully say "I am happy where I am at?" If not, then STOP.

 

Your MM is not a happy man. There is a reason why he is drinking and passing out. What he said about being "happy" in his marriage is a lie, in my opinion. Often, men say that so that the OW does not get the "wrong idea" that he will somehow one day leave his wife. He would not be drinking and passing out and spending time in another room skype-ing you if he was happy.

 

Glad to know you went out with this other guy. I would not invest time on him though-emotional baggage like one he has is difficult to overcome. Him telling you that he "disappears" is him playing safe....so that when he does disappear on you at least he will be guilt-free-after all he told you beforehand.

 

Take care.

[whichwayisup]

Hey BD, I briefly read your thread and want to address the stalking. You can do something about it BTW. I would go to you local cop shop and find out what needs to be done in your area. If you get nothing from the cop shop search on line because there are laws that do protect against this sort of thing. Even though she blocks her number, her phone provider has the records and you can prove that your house was called from her location. The FB, I'm not sure how to track her on that.

 

Hang in there girl...you handle yourself well.

 

Just because it was from her location and house, it actually doesn't mean it's her. It could be him...There's no way of 'proving' it is her physically doing the online stalking. If they have kids, older ones...Never say never.. There was a thread not too long ago about the son intercepting messages between his mom and the OM..So, never say never..

 

Why not create another facebook page with your name, add all your friends and then set your setting to "no one can find you" or "friends only" and block her, this way she won't see your page. I still can't figure out how she is able to see your fb page if all your settings are private (friends only can see your page).. Or, is it possible you added her without knowing?? A different name?

[browndog319]

Hi browndog!

 

You seem like a very nice person-as evidenced by your response to the obvious "shaming" that is going on here by some posters.

 

What your MM did at DD is classic. Interesting thing about stuff like this is that sometimes emotions lose to practicality- it can be that there is just too much to lose in his marriage to leave now or maybe ever-how long has he been married? does he have kids?

 

The thing is, what are you prepared to do for your relationship with him? Will you be able to look at yourself and truthfully say "I am happy where I am at?" If not, then STOP.

 

Your MM is not a happy man. There is a reason why he is drinking and passing out. What he said about being "happy" in his marriage is a lie, in my opinion. Often, men say that so that the OW does not get the "wrong idea" that he will somehow one day leave his wife. He would not be drinking and passing out and spending time in another room skype-ing you if he was happy.

 

Glad to know you went out with this other guy. I would not invest time on him though-emotional baggage like one he has is difficult to overcome. Him telling you that he "disappears" is him playing safe....so that when he does disappear on you at least he will be guilt-free-after all he told you beforehand.

 

Take care.

 

Thank you, TC. I agree 100%. When I've had heart-to-hearts with HBMM (my nickname for him is Hillbilly, which he calls himself), I've told him that if he were happy, he would not be drinking like he does, every day. And yes, it is daily. And it is A LOT. And Skyping me. And yes. That was daily, too. And he said he was happy, he just was amazed by how much he loved me and was never expecting to find me at this point in his life.

 

I think MM lies to himself more than he even lies to his wife and me. So it is hard to hate him. Because he self-medicates and he has a lot of pain. And he really could be so amazing. But I don't deserve to feel this pain anymore.

 

As for this new guy, I'm proud of myself for being open to it and trying to move on, but he scares the crap out of me. I thhink the reason I'm open to it is because he doesn't present any real threat to my A. And if MM actually left his wife, I could ditch new guy without guilt. Although new guy made it very clear if he found out I had a boyfriend he would be really upset. I felt like I was lying when I said I was single, although it was after DDay. My heart doesn't feel single.

 

But the new guy texted me last night to make sure I made it from the beach safely. So so far he is trying to be sweet. We'll see. And he told me our mutual friend warned him not to go for me because he has his track record, so he promised he would not be a jerk. Now I hope I will be kind.

 

I really want to go back to being a whole, kind person that can be open in my relationships.

[browndog319]

Just because it was from her location and house, it actually doesn't mean it's her. It could be him...There's no way of 'proving' it is her physically doing the online stalking. If they have kids, older ones...Never say never.. There was a thread not too long ago about the son intercepting messages between his mom and the OM..So, never say never..

 

Why not create another facebook page with your name, add all your friends and then set your setting to "no one can find you" or "friends only" and block her, this way she won't see your page. I still can't figure out how she is able to see your fb page if all your settings are private (friends only can see your page).. Or, is it possible you added her without knowing?? A different name?

 

Great question - I went through all of my friends and checked every friend. I personally know everyone.

 

As for the phone calls, it could be his kids, they are 16 and 18. He seems to think his kids are oblivious. To even the drinking. I tell him his kids are not stupid, they have to know, they know their parents sleep in separate bedrooms, etc. They know their dad was always on the phone, texting, etc. It's a good thought. Maybe. I just assumed that she found my number on their family plan phone bill. He usually calls from his work phone (bill never goes to the house). But he sometimes calls from his iPhone, so she probably was combing through the bill and noticed a weird number. He also called my home from their landline once or twice.

 

My DD was 4 when I separated from her father and she knew when I started sleeping in the office - she asked why I wasn't sleeping with daddy. I told her I was sick and didn't want Daddy to get sick. Daddy snored too loudly and I needed to sleep. She's 6 now and even though she knows we're "de-horsed" (I LOVE my sweet girl!), she asks every now and then if we can have a family sleep over, all 3 of us in one bed like old times. She knows if she can get us in one bed, maybe intimacy can be restored. At that age.

[denise_xo]

My DD was 4 when I separated from her father and she knew when I started sleeping in the office - she asked why I wasn't sleeping with daddy. I told her I was sick and didn't want Daddy to get sick. Daddy snored too loudly and I needed to sleep. She's 6 now and even though she knows we're "de-horsed" (I LOVE my sweet girl!), she asks every now and then if we can have a family sleep over, all 3 of us in one bed like old times. She knows if she can get us in one bed, maybe intimacy can be restored. At that age.

 

Bless her sweet heart. That was touching

[Fight4Me]

Hey again, Browndog. "de-horsed" That cracked me up... definitely the opposite of getting hitched, if you pardon the pun.

 

You asked me what I meant by "titanium fence" in my earlier post, and I was just conveying that I don't see him jumping off the fence one way or another and that he has firmly planted himself there. Although, the visual I get in my mind is that he's on the marriage side (won't leave his wife), but likes having you as a diversion, so refuses to fully release himself from the A.

 

When talking about his drinking and his admitted addictive tendencies, I think you should consider that this affair could be one of them. He escapes inside a bottle... he escapes to another woman... and avoids the withdrawal like the plague. This does not mean he doesn't have genuine feelings for you, but I'm just saying that given the big picture, this is a very unhealthy way for ANY relationship to start out.

 

And if I may share a bit of my own FOO (family of origin), my father died from alcoholism and two of my siblings are recovering alcoholics. I don't remember my father, but my older siblings do (very kind and humorous, loving man). They were profoundly affected by his addiction. You have a precious little one to protect. If he were to divorce and come to you legitimately, yet without having done the hard work of recovery, she would grow up with him as a father figure and be affected one way or another, no matter how hard you try to protect her.

 

Sorry... I'm being long winded. I hope you don't take my words as lecturing or anything, and I know I'm not saying anything you don't already understand. I just want to encourage you in the direction you already know in your heart to be the right one.

 

Hang in there!

[whichwayisup]

Great question - I went through all of my friends and checked every friend. I personally know everyone.

 

As for the phone calls, it could be his kids, they are 16 and 18. He seems to think his kids are oblivious. To even the drinking. I tell him his kids are not stupid, they have to know, they know their parents sleep in separate bedrooms, etc. They know their dad was always on the phone, texting, etc. It's a good thought. Maybe. I just assumed that she found my number on their family plan phone bill. He usually calls from his work phone (bill never goes to the house). But he sometimes calls from his iPhone, so she probably was combing through the bill and noticed a weird number. He also called my home from their landline once or twice.

 

My DD was 4 when I separated from her father and she knew when I started sleeping in the office - she asked why I wasn't sleeping with daddy. I told her I was sick and didn't want Daddy to get sick. Daddy snored too loudly and I needed to sleep. She's 6 now and even though she knows we're "de-horsed" (I LOVE my sweet girl!), she asks every now and then if we can have a family sleep over, all 3 of us in one bed like old times. She knows if she can get us in one bed, maybe intimacy can be restored. At that age.

 

De-horsed..That's cute. She gets it on some level, but doesn't realize it's forever.. As someone else said, bless her little heart!

 

His kids are not stupid at all, they KNOW. They know about his drinking (he's totally in denial if he truly believes they aren't aware) and they probably know about the other stuff too. KIDS listen into conversations and snoop too, so he IS fooling himself if he thinks they are obvilious to what's going on around them.

 

Anyway, I suggest you delete that facebook account and start another one with a new email address and add your friends again, then make your friends list visible to only YOU and set everything else to private, friends only.

[fooled once]

 

As for the phone calls, it could be his kids, they are 16 and 18. He seems to think his kids are oblivious. To even the drinking. I tell him his kids are not stupid, they have to know, they know their parents sleep in separate bedrooms, etc. They know their dad was always on the phone, texting, etc. It's a good thought. Maybe. I just assumed that she found my number on their family plan phone bill. He usually calls from his work phone (bill never goes to the house). But he sometimes calls from his iPhone, so she probably was combing through the bill and noticed a weird number. He also called my home from their landline once or twice.

 

 

why do so many OW think a wife combs through a phone bill? Maybe her HUSBAND does the bills? I will never understand this. I have NO reason to go through the phone bill and since most plans now are inclusive of local and long distance for the same price, why would ANYONE go through the entire phone bill to spot a phone number? And how do you know "whose" phone number the unusual one is? Could be a work person, could be a friend, could be the post office, could be the hardware store? And maybe HE does the bills so she would never even see the phone bill. I swear, I must be the only wife who trusts her H and doesn't need to go searching through bills to see who he calls.

[MissBee]

why do so many OW think a wife combs through a phone bill? Maybe her HUSBAND does the bills? I will never understand this. I have NO reason to go through the phone bill and since most plans now are inclusive of local and long distance for the same price, why would ANYONE go through the entire phone bill to spot a phone number? And how do you know "whose" phone number the unusual one is? Could be a work person, could be a friend, could be the post office, could be the hardware store? And maybe HE does the bills so she would never even see the phone bill. I swear, I must be the only wife who trusts her H and doesn't need to go searching through bills to see who he calls.

 

But this man was in fact cheating....so the wife going through the phone bill would be relevant in this case, as she obviously has (rightful) suspicions.

 

My mother would go through the phone bills...when she had suspicions...she was always right.

 

But in a case where there are no suspicions, combing through phone bills would be indeed a strange hobby and quite a hassle.

 

If I suspect you're cheating...you're most likely cheating and I will probably not comb through anything. I would confront you head on and ask and see your reaction. From then on I'll decide if there is a future for us. But I am not one who believes in being a part time FBI agent in my relationship.

[browndog319]

But this man was in fact cheating....so the wife going through the phone bill would be relevant in this case, as she obviously has (rightful) suspicions.

 

My mother would go through the phone bills...when she had suspicions...she was always right.

 

But in a case where there are no suspicions, combing through phone bills would be indeed a strange hobby and quite a hassle.

 

If I suspect you're cheating...you're most likely cheating and I will probably not comb through anything. I would confront you head on and ask and see your reaction. From then on I'll decide if there is a future for us. But I am not one who believes in being a part time FBI agent in my relationship.

 

Exactly. And I know she manages all of their bills. He told me how once he got in trouble for a work meeting where we got room service (well, more him) - he ordered a bucket of beer and a pizza. I had a beer and some pizza and he put it on his personal credit card bc he had already exceeded the corporate limit for the day. He got screamed at for the bill. And they are very comfortable. And he does that crap when he's alone! So it wasn't like it was out of character...

[browndog319]

I'm glad some of you liked the de-horse. My DD is the best!

[whichwayisup]

Exactly. And I know she manages all of their bills. He told me how once he got in trouble for a work meeting where we got room service (well, more him) - he ordered a bucket of beer and a pizza. I had a beer and some pizza and he put it on his personal credit card bc he had already exceeded the corporate limit for the day. He got screamed at for the bill. And they are very comfortable. And he does that crap when he's alone! So it wasn't like it was out of character...

 

Did you actually hear her, first hand? Or did he tell you? He is painting her into the evil wicked witch.. The woman he said vows to, in front of family and friends.. Look how he's treating her.. Lying to her, betraying her, gaslighting her, deceiving her.. How do you respect someone who knowingly hurts their spouse and continues to live a big fat lie, yet makes it seem like she's the one who has issues.

[browndog319]

Did you actually hear her, first hand? Or did he tell you? He is painting her into the evil wicked witch.. The woman he said vows to, in front of family and friends.. Look how he's treating her.. Lying to her, betraying her, gaslighting her, deceiving her.. How do you respect someone who knowingly hurts their spouse and continues to live a big fat lie, yet makes it seem like she's the one who has issues.

 

Not for that, fair enough. I never thought about that as a negative thing. He has always said he married way out of his league and that no one could believe he got his wife to marry him. I always hated when he said that, but just listened quietly.

I have heard him get yelled at for other things, though. Not fun.

I don't know how. I never thought about it like this bc he never said bad things about her.

[Silly_Girl]

why do so many OW think a wife combs through a phone bill? Maybe her HUSBAND does the bills? I will never understand this. I have NO reason to go through the phone bill and since most plans now are inclusive of local and long distance for the same price, why would ANYONE go through the entire phone bill to spot a phone number? And how do you know "whose" phone number the unusual one is? Could be a work person, could be a friend, could be the post office, could be the hardware store? And maybe HE does the bills so she would never even see the phone bill. I swear, I must be the only wife who trusts her H and doesn't need to go searching through bills to see who he calls.

 

I go through my phone/utility bills, and I'm not cheating on myself I do it because I have been falsely charged for things way too many times. It's not some freakishly ridiculous thing to do FO!

[Silly_Girl]

Did you actually hear her, first hand? Or did he tell you? He is painting her into the evil wicked witch.. The woman he said vows to, in front of family and friends.. Look how he's treating her.. Lying to her, betraying her, gaslighting her, deceiving her.. How do you respect someone who knowingly hurts their spouse and continues to live a big fat lie, yet makes it seem like she's the one who has issues.

 

Or, it could be completely true.

[browndog319]

Silly Girl, sometimes I'm a wee bit dense - do you mean that it could be true that she's rough on him?

[Silly_Girl]

Silly Girl, sometimes I'm a wee bit dense - do you mean that it could be true that she's rough on him?

 

It could be true that she ticked him off for wasting money. Maybe they're 'comfortable' because she's financially conscientious. Him being unfaithful certainly does not mean everything he says is rubbish, that's all.

[browndog319]

Thanks, Silly Girl. I took it as she was probably pissed that he spent a fortune on room service beer because he's a freaking alcoholic. And this was after he exhausted the generous corporate expense max at the bar and AFTER a reception with a complimentary open bar.

 

She didn't know that his bucket consumption was cut down by one. She has every right to be concerned about his alcohol consumption - I have actually expressed concern over it, too.

[NoIDidn't]

Browndog, I am really confused as to why you are going through all these changes for an alcoholic. You do know that this behavior will not likely change just because he changes addresses. This is him. His marriage may have originally had something to do with it, but at this point its just a habit on his part.

 

I would hate for you to end up with him only to end up with the same frustrations as his W.

[Silly_Girl]

Thanks, Silly Girl. I took it as she was probably pissed that he spent a fortune on room service beer because he's a freaking alcoholic.

 

Well yeah, there is that!

 

My comment was more in response to WWIU's 'did you hear it for yourself though?' post. Which was a reasonable point, as was mine on the other side of the coin.

[browndog319]

Browndog, I am really confused as to why you are going through all these changes for an alcoholic. You do know that this behavior will not likely change just because he changes addresses. This is him. His marriage may have originally had something to do with it, but at this point its just a habit on his part.

 

I would hate for you to end up with him only to end up with the same frustrations as his W.

Thank you, this is one area that scares me a lot. He is a highly functional alcoholic. He manages through life without most people knowing. And our work environment really develops this behavior. For some reason.

 

I do think about it a lot. He is a good man - I have talked to him about it and he said fi we would up together he would never hide from me the way he hides from BW. I told him I wouldn't let him. I think I'm stronger than his wife, believe it or not, and could save him. I've often wanted to Email his BW to just explain some of his drunken behavior on the road. But I haven't. Not my place

[2sunny]

i can tell you from experience that living with an actively drinking alcoholic is extremely painful - at best.

 

why would you even choose this for yourself? as the OW or anything else.

 

even IF you were dating him as a single guy - i'd advise against this.

[NoIDidn't]

Thank you, this is one area that scares me a lot. He is a highly functional alcoholic. He manages through life without most people knowing. And our work environment really develops this behavior. For some reason.

 

I do think about it a lot. He is a good man - I have talked to him about it and he said fi we would up together he would never hide from me the way he hides from BW. I told him I wouldn't let him. I think I'm stronger than his wife, believe it or not, and could save him. I've often wanted to Email his BW to just explain some of his drunken behavior on the road. But I haven't. Not my place

 

I hate to sound like a Negative Nelly but his promise to not hide from you doesn't sound good to me. It sounds like he's saying that you've already seen how dirty he can get, so what's a little more letting it all hang out in more disrespectful ways going to do.

 

You know, those guys that just don't seem to know that their behavior is inappropriate - even at home. You wouldn't want to come home to an unconscious man and hear "you knew I was like this, at least I'm not hiding it from you".

 

My point is, you can't save him. A highly functional alcoholic is still an alcoholic and only one crisis away from becoming a non-functioning alcoholic. I think that not living with him really keeps you from seeing the reality of living even with a functional alcoholic. Its not pretty. And if he's thinking you can save him from himself, you shouldn't want a man that wants to put the responsibility for himself onto someone else.

 

I'm sorry if I'm coming across as not having anything nice to say, I just don't think you should be putting so much worry and energy into him and his W. I can't find any value in buying someone else's drama.

[NoIDidn't]

i can tell you from experience that living with an actively drinking alcoholic is extremely painful - at best.

 

why would you even choose this for yourself? as the OW or anything else.

 

even IF you were dating him as a single guy - i'd advise against this.

 

I was typing my post while this posted but it really sums up what I'm saying nicely.

 

I didn't even live with my alcoholic relatives, but it was very painful seeing the things they put my cousins and aunts through.

 

I couldn't imagine signing up for this. Not even for a single guy.