Am I being too hard on my wife

[bentnotbroken]

Most of them do this. Keep in mind that all you can own up to is your part in the state of the marriage. You had no part in the affair. It wasn't your fault. You can't "own up to" any of that. If she was that unhappy it was her responsibility to confront you with that, and insist the two of you figure out a way to fix things (or split up). Not go jump in the sack with some other man just to get her "emptiness" fixed. Don't let her bully you with senseless crap like that.

 

 

 

Ditto. You aren't responsible for her poor choice in dealing with marital issues. You own 50% or problems within the marriage, she owns 100% of the relationship outside of the marriage.

[bentnotbroken]

Sometimes I think women can rationalize anything they do. They always have a tough time taking ownership. Men seem to man up and take it straight on while women think of a million excuses. They love to shift blame whenever they can.

 

 

I wasn't married to woman. I was married to a man and he owned up to shyt. Let's not do the generalizations. There are women who are jackazzes and men who are jackazzes. The title is a equal opportunity profession.

[David Cain]

Sometimes I think women can rationalize anything they do. They always have a tough time taking ownership. Men seem to man up and take it straight on while women think of a million excuses. They love to shift blame whenever they can.

 

This is a good statement.

[Mz. Pixie]

Pete has given you great advice.

 

I am happy to read that you are not considering any sort of revenge affair.

 

Untouchable_Fire brings up a fantastic point, why did she confess to you? I also take a voluntary confession as a positive sign (if it is indeed a voluntary confession).

 

I know it's hard not to but don't focus on the AP. I did that and I realized it had little to do with the AP. Further to that focusing on the AP detracts from the healing process.

 

Pete is awesome. He can be tough but he is fair.

 

The AP is not the issue- your wife is the one who said vows with you-not him. He's a non issue really- this is about her.

 

Her trying to place blame on you for her actions is bullcrap. Did she ever once try to tell you she was unhappy? Even if she did= she is 100 percent responsible for her decision to cheat. Most people in happy marriages do not cheat- I am saying most. There are exceptions of course-but there are an awful lot of people who don;t express that they are unhappy either. It was her choice 100 percent to handle it in a way she shouldn't have. You only have responsibility for your part that made the marriage vulnerable to an affair-if she expressed her feelings to you. You are not a mind reader-so if she didn't say or do anything to indicate a problem you couldn't have known.

 

Resentment and entitlement is what starts the cycle that leads to infidelity a good percentage of the time. The resentment you're feeling over the fact that you have worked while she was a SAHM and enjoying herself and then cheated is a little bit of the kind of resentment it takes to get into that type of situation. I am glad you decided not to have a revenge affair. It may have felt good in the temporary but it would have felt like crap later.

 

Just so you know-because it will be pointed out by other posters-and I have been told I should be in disclosure of everything when I am talking to a BS. I was a wayward wife in my first marriage. I didn't reconcile. Since then I have been in therapy and spent alot of time working on myself, reading, posting on several relationship forums and helping several couples in real life reconcile after infidelity. I know what I did was wrong. I come here to help betrayed spouses, particularly the guys-because you're not going to get many wayward wives who will give you the insight into what your women are thinking.

[road]

did you suspect, confront, ask was WW cheating, or did she come out and confess on her own?

[Will_miss_rk]

My wife cheated during a rough spot in our marriage and for years held on to the rationalization that it was "good for her to experience other men so she knew that she really wanted to be with me." What a load of crap. It took her years to face the fact that she just whore'd it up for her own selfish reasons and caused pain and suffering that it took us both many, many years to recover from.

 

I don't share your view that men are any better at owning their ****; I think rationalizing a selfish, immoral act is universal. People don't like facing the truth when they do something they know is horribly wrong, so they must find a way to excuse their behavior in order to live with themselves.

 

I've read this thread and want to point something out to you that hasn't yet been discussed - things are going to get worse for you. When the porn movies staring your wife and OM start playing in your head you are going to alternately want to puke your guts out and scream "f'ing whore!" at your wife. You are going to get really angry, and then you are going to feel really low. Just reading your replies on this thread I can feel that your anger is just below the surface and beginning to bubble up here and there. Have the porn moves started yet? Do you feel sudden fits of rage yet? Do you feel incredibly sad for no apparent reason yet?

 

You get a lot of good and bad advice on LS and you need to pick and choose those things that apply to you and your situation. I would advise you to be wary of advice from women as they simply can't relate to how much damage this does to the male ego. For your situation, women on this forum can be extremely valuable in helping you understand specific behavior by your wife and are great at spotting female bull****.

 

Finally, I don't believe your wife is being honest with you about the frequency of sex with OM. Maybe you don't care, and that's fine. But if getting it all out in the open is important to you, just tell her point blank that you think she is lying about this and not to bother talking to you until she is ready to come clean. After she does come clean, there is still a lot of stuff she will hide so you will have to repeat this many times. Women lie about their sexual history so often it's like breathing to them; they don't even know they are doing it until pressed for the real truth. She will only tell you what she believes she has to tell you and nothing more. Makes me sick but I guess it's just their nature.

 

The porn movie in my head has already started and it is as painful as you describe. I too want to vomit every time it plays in my head. It's these types of images that make it hard to stay in the marriage. Knowing that your wife was performing hard core sex acts is never easy to take. Even watching minor sex scene on tv remind of her transgression.

 

So it sounds like you stayed together with your wife, is that correct? How many years has it been and what is your state of mind now?

[Will_miss_rk]

first of, trying to minimize things by saying it was ONLY ONCE is a load of crap. Once is enough.

 

 

 

 

and you never fully will because you will NEVER forget.

 

 

 

 

to think like this is to be a doormat. not saying you are, just don't think like this. doesn't matter if its once, or a hundred times. and doesn't matter if she never did anything like this before.

 

 

 

 

hell no. its natural for someone to want to, or at least thinking about leaving someone that can't be trusted or betrayed you in one of the worst ways.

 

 

 

 

no, not if forgiving is just too easily given out. This has only been 2 months. I'd say there is something wrong with you if you came out and said you have fully forgiven her in this short amount of time.

 

If you feel you want to stay and forgive, then is will require time.

 

But in exchange for your forgiveness, she starts acting like a wife. No more going to lunch with this guy, or any guy she finds attractive. And no after work drinks at happy hour. She comes her ass home.

 

and no, thats not controlling. that expecting a wife to act like a wife after being found out to be a cheater, and expecting her to EARN any 2nd chance she gets.

 

I don't think my wife realizes how just even texting and calling a guy is a huge amount of betrayal even if there wasn't a ton of physical activities. According to her there was only 3 months of physical activity then they only texted and called for 3 months after. Why is that she had to continue to keep in touch with a guy? Why not just end it if all you are doing is talking? It doesn't make much sense. She said is was for attention which is hard to swallow. She probably knew she should stop the affair but just couldn't let go because she was so attracted to the guy. Maybe they had a fight or something or he just lost interest. Who knows? Six months is a long time to be in a relationship with anyone especially when you wanted to have sex with the guy and DID have sex with the guy. Incidentally, some of those texts were during dates that are special to the family and us which really hurts. On our anniversary she texted the guy and on christmas day. What the heck is that about? Those things hurt almost as bad as the sex sometimes, not quite, but close sometimes.

[Will_miss_rk]

Do you know for sure who the OM is? If not this could be another way she's blowing smoke up your ass. It's much easier for the betrayed husband to take her back when he thinks the om was a washed up loser, the sex was terrible, etc. Would you be secure enough to take her back if the other guy was a handsome hedge fund manager who makes 7 figures and is better in bed to boot? No chance. Don't take anything she says as truth unless you can prove it man. She's obviously still playing you for a fool if she's telling you she slept with him once. I mean think about it? If he was so worthless why would she betray her hardworking husnad and risk her marriage? He must have something, be it looks, charisma, "skills", etc.

 

I'm pretty sure who the guy is. I have his name and of course his number off the cell phone record. I've been tempted to call him up and see if his story matches the wifes but I am not sure it's the smart thing to do.

 

I've also seen a picture of the dude as well. I'm not a female so I don't really great idea of what attracts when expect in cases where it's brad pitt or johnny depp which he isn't. The guy is very different than me, in that he is more of a tattoo, earing wearing guy while i'm just an ordinary run of mill average guy.

[Will_miss_rk]

Not only did your wife betray you with the OM, but she betrayed you even more when she got your very own sister to be in on it with her, thus robbing you of part of your logical support network. By talking to your sister your wife was humiliating you behind your back to your very own family months before you knew, not only letting her position it with no chance of your side being heard, but also showing that members of your family are more loyal to her (even when she is cheating on you) than they are to you. Additionally, she also robbed you of the option of not telling your family if that would have helped you better deal with the affair. Clearly your wife thinks only of herself and clearly she thinks little about you. As for your sister, she picked a side and it was not you; always remember that.

 

One more thing, if she was bold enough to tell your sister, she probably told many others, even further humiliating you behind your back. Everywhere you go you will wonder if they know and if they think less of you as a man because of it.

 

 

That says it all. She has no true remorse. You had it coming to you. She cheated because you pushed her into it. This is probably what she was telling her friends and your sister behind your back. You saying that you “see her point” is why she is getting away with thinking this. In PegNosePete’s four rules that your wife needs to agree to if she does not want a divorce, he left one out because it was assumed. He left out that your wife must assume full 100% blame for her cheating or you will divorce her on the spot. If she does not assume full 100% blame, then she will do it again.

 

In your first post you asked “Do you guys think I'm being too hard on my wife wanting to leave?” My answer is that you want to leave because she does not have 100% remorse and you know that she may do it again.

 

I too believe she didn't have true remorse. I think she wants me and the family back together a lot but doesn't truly understand the depth of the betrayal. You're right, until she understands it, this will never work because eventually she will solve her problems the same way again if the same problems arise.

 

As for my sister, the disgusting part of it was my sister was having an affair before my wife did. My family was preoccupied with my sisters situation because it was out in the open since my brother in law had told us about it. Since I was somewhat fixated on my sister's situation I lost track of the wife and thought much of her talking on the phone was with my sister regarding my sister's affair. Some of it was but my wife was also talking to the other guy obviously. The only good thing that came out of it was that I was able to forge a closer relationship with my brother-in-law and now we bike and talk about our unfaithful wives. The whole thing is truly a messed up situation. BTW, I don't talk to my sister anymore.

[Will_miss_rk]

Let me ask you something: Before her affair, did she ever just sit down with you and say "You are making me feel empty enough on the inside, that I don't know what I will do?"

 

Or something like that?

 

 

She complained about my not holding her hand or being affection a lot but never sat me down and said that she would have an affair and leave me if I wasn't more affectionate. After she said things about being more affectionate I did try to be more affectionate, but I guess it wasn't enough. I'm not a real hand holding type of guy and it doesn't come natural to me. Still, it isn't a justification to sleep with another guy. You're right she should have told me that exact consequences of not giving her the love she desired. Of course, this could all be a way for her to rationalize her act anyway so I really don't know.

[Will_miss_rk]

Ditto. You aren't responsible for her poor choice in dealing with marital issues. You own 50% or problems within the marriage, she owns 100% of the relationship outside of the marriage.

 

 

Yep, she has to own up to her affair 100% and in fact needs to own up to her 50% of the pre-affair marriage. She hasn't even done that.

[Will_miss_rk]

I wasn't married to woman. I was married to a man and he owned up to shyt. Let's not do the generalizations. There are women who are jackazzes and men who are jackazzes. The title is a equal opportunity profession.

 

True, there are a ton of crappy dudes who do the same thing. Just listening about my sister and now my wife it's easy to pin it all on women. In real, there is just bad acts by people that has nothing to do with gender, race, or religion.

[Will_miss_rk]

did you suspect, confront, ask was WW cheating, or did she come out and confess on her own?

 

 

Confessed on her own.

[bentnotbroken]

True, there are a ton of crappy dudes who do the same thing. Just listening about my sister and now my wife it's easy to pin it all on women. In real, there is just bad acts by people that has nothing to do with gender, race, or religion.

 

 

I can't imagine my sister knowing and not beating the shyt out of Mr. Messy. For this I have no advice other than what I already said, take care of you.

[Will_miss_rk]

Pete is awesome. He can be tough but he is fair.

 

The AP is not the issue- your wife is the one who said vows with you-not him. He's a non issue really- this is about her.

 

Her trying to place blame on you for her actions is bullcrap. Did she ever once try to tell you she was unhappy? Even if she did= she is 100 percent responsible for her decision to cheat. Most people in happy marriages do not cheat- I am saying most. There are exceptions of course-but there are an awful lot of people who don;t express that they are unhappy either. It was her choice 100 percent to handle it in a way she shouldn't have. You only have responsibility for your part that made the marriage vulnerable to an affair-if she expressed her feelings to you. You are not a mind reader-so if she didn't say or do anything to indicate a problem you couldn't have known.

 

Resentment and entitlement is what starts the cycle that leads to infidelity a good percentage of the time. The resentment you're feeling over the fact that you have worked while she was a SAHM and enjoying herself and then cheated is a little bit of the kind of resentment it takes to get into that type of situation. I am glad you decided not to have a revenge affair. It may have felt good in the temporary but it would have felt like crap later.

 

Just so you know-because it will be pointed out by other posters-and I have been told I should be in disclosure of everything when I am talking to a BS. I was a wayward wife in my first marriage. I didn't reconcile. Since then I have been in therapy and spent alot of time working on myself, reading, posting on several relationship forums and helping several couples in real life reconcile after infidelity. I know what I did was wrong. I come here to help betrayed spouses, particularly the guys-because you're not going to get many wayward wives who will give you the insight into what your women are thinking.

 

Up to this point I never realized how selfish a person wife wife really was. Which makes it difficult to reconcile since my whole perception of the person has change and I don't know if this new person I'm discovering is someone I want to spend my whole life with.

[RepairMinded]

Up to this point I never realized how selfish a person wife wife really was. Which makes it difficult to reconcile since my whole perception of the person has change and I don't know if this new person I'm discovering is someone I want to spend my whole life with.

 

Wow. She hasn't even told you who the guy is?

 

No remorse at all there. She's just protecting him.

 

Listen, from your descriptions, the woman you married is a total fraud who pulled the wool over your eyes.

 

Don't be discouraged or think you are different from many other guys this happens to also.

 

Apparently what I've learned from reading LS is that there is a particular "type" of woman who pretends to be a "good girl" which obviously is meant to attract a good-hearted sort of man who just wants to have a lifelong relationship and family with her.

 

Yet in reality at heart she's not good at all.

 

So this type of woman will bide her time and then when she decides she feels like it and thinks she can get away with it will have zero problems with cheating. She will carefully select the man she will have the affair with and often is the active pursuer of the other man (although they frequently say the other man talked them into it, that's almost never really the case).

 

They are clever and tricky and very diabolical.

 

It sounds like you have exactly one of these women. She can never change nor does she want to change. She is just selfish and wants whatever it is she wants and doesn't really care about your feelings.

 

Does she love you? Did she ever really love you?

 

That's a difficult question since I don't think people like your wife perceive what "love" is the way you probably do.

 

At some point you probably bought into the romantic fantasy ideal, she's Cinderella, you're prince charming.

 

A lot of women give lip service to this but they don't really believe it.

[Bryanp]

She continues to disrespect you by refusing to tell you who it is. If the roles were reversed do you honestly think that she would have accepted such a lack of remorse and refusal of you telling her who the other person was? She does not deserve you and you deserve so much more. Her actions continue to disrespect you and your marriage. If you do not respect yourself then who will?

[Tech_E]

Umm without 1000000000% FULL exposure of her activities there is simply nowhere to go. Period.

[David Cain]

:laugh: Please do not tell me you are dim enough to believe that men NEVER shift blame.

 

Will, you are not being hard enough on your wife. She has no remorse for the cheating and she is likely being dishonest about the extent of the affair.

 

Considering I'm a man myself, I think I just did tell you.

Men do not shift blame as much as women do.

[Binster]

Have you had any legal advice about what a divorce would cost you, might be a good idea.

[jnj express]

I have not read your whole thread---so I don't know if these 2 things were covered

 

Do not under any circumstances cheat back on you wife, and do NOT move out and ABANDON your family

 

A judge in a divorce/custody action will level you for doing either----yes your wife cheated, then you intenionally cheated back------the person giving you that kind of advice isn't thinking very clearly----and you need to stay in your home---a good attorney will rip you apart if you abandon your kids---if anything send your wife packing

[Darth Vader]

Up to this point I never realized how selfish a person wife wife really was. Which makes it difficult to reconcile since my whole perception of the person has change and I don't know if this new person I'm discovering is someone I want to spend my whole life with.

 

 

Ok, just drop her ass! Plain and simple, oh, BTW, she cheated, she leaves! You stay there with your girls, in your house! Don't you dare leave!

[confusedinkansas]

Will Miss

You have a right to feel & do anything you like.

Don't let anyone here tell you any different or try to sway you one way or the other.

 

Suggestions:

 

BUT, If you're feeling like you're being too hard on her perhaps you should step back for a while before making SET IN STONE decisions.

 

Maybe a separation before any final divorce.

 

If you second guess your decision then perhaps it's not exactly the right thing to do at that particular time.

Again, you need to do what you feel is right for you~!!

 

Good luck to you.

[drifter777]

The porn movie in my head has already started and it is as painful as you describe. I too want to vomit every time it plays in my head. It's these types of images that make it hard to stay in the marriage. Knowing that your wife was performing hard core sex acts is never easy to take. Even watching minor sex scene on tv remind of her transgression.

 

So it sounds like you stayed together with your wife, is that correct? How many years has it been and what is your state of mind now?

 

Yes, I stayed. At the time I was in a state of shock and denial & just wanted the pain of her betrayal to stop so when she begged me to stay I agreed. I truly believed that I could compartmentalize the incident and hide it away in my mind and that it would just "go away" over time. Wrong. Stifling your feelings cannot work in the long run. When the porn movies began I became withdrawn and angry. Sometimes I would tell her that I just couldn't believe she was such a slut and didn't know if I could even look at her. Then I would grab a blanket and hit the couch for a day or two until I could stuff the images and feelings back into that corner of my mind and try to get back to "normal".

 

A major problem for me is that for many years my wife refused to acknowledge that what she did was selfish, hurtful, and just plain wrong. She always would say "I'm sorry that I hurt you, but it was good for me because I learned how much I loved you...". Anytime there is a "but" associated with an apology it simply cancels it out. As the years went by I resented her more because of her bullsh*t attitude and refusal to simply admit that what she did was wrong and no good came of it. She has finally faced reality and accepted responsibility for whore-ing it up and causing us both years of pain and suffering. I now feel much more at peace with the whole thing, but I'm not sure I will ever forgive her.

 

If your wife is trying to paint a smiley face on any aspect of her cheating or includes a BUT in her apology please realize that this will effectively block your recovery process. You may or may not ever find it in your heart to forgive her, but your own recovery is not dependent on that. For you to recover you must repair your own self respect to the point that your decision to leave or stay is your own. For me, I wish I would have told my wife that I needed more time alone before deciding whether to attempt to reconcile. You need to figure out what is best for you right now and then do it.

[Memphis Raines]

Maybe a separation before any final divorce.

 

oh she'll like that one. talk about give her a green light.

 

"but we were separated!! it isn't cheating when you are separated!"