I feel like crap

[Els]

Heh that's funny. In other words, women who care about the first impression things that would normally turn them off to a guy they meet in person, are forced to turn those things off if they meet a guy online. And then when they finally meet, they have already made a solid impression and how he looks and acts won't effect as negatively as if the met right in person at first.

 

Eh, pretty much, I guess, if you want to put it that way. I think people often dismiss others IRL without even bothering to get to know them or give them a chance. In some cases, it really is getting to know the person inside without the distraction of the outer shell. Of course, it's bloody easy to get conned, too.

 

I have no interest in a LDR at all. I shouldn't have to resort to something like that.

 

Fair enough. Although I find it interesting how you consider suicide to be a more viable option than a LDR.

[Teknoe]

sd81,

it may seem like some of us are a little hard on you sometimes, but know we're all rooting for you to improve, get healthier and generally become all that you're meant to be.

 

I want to write a 100% positive post and re-emphasize this

 

 

Wow, you are really pushing for the activity thing. I'll do a search and see if anything is happening in my area.

 

I'm smiling like a proud cousin right now. This is the best thing you've said in this entire thread.

 

Now, you need to FOLLOW THROUGH.

 

I will check back with you for updates on this activity night outing, as I would love to hear how your experience goes. I know from personal experience I was in a DARK DARK place 2+ years ago.

 

Then I reached out to a local church activity night thing, and it brought me a lot of dear friends who had my back, especially during a season where things seemed really BLEAK and oppressive.

 

It changed my life, and it is my hope that it might change yours even in some small positive way.

 

Again, talk is cheap. Let's walk the walk. I'll be checking in with you for an update later. I recommend you search and find a contact to email within the next 48 hours or so. I find when a person finally decides to do something they have been resisting, the first 48 hours are critical. If you wait longer, you tend to just forget about it or slip back into your comfortable old ways.

[Ross MwcFan]

Hmm.

 

That just seems really odd, why would somebody like you online but not in person? I think you mentioned having some type of social anxiety. I figure that doesn't affect you online.

 

I honestly haven't any idea. I know online I am confident and not shy at all.

 

Offline I'm not as confident, and can be quite shy depending on the situation, especially with women.

 

But that can't be the reason as most unconfident shy guys still have relationships.

 

You're right, it is very odd, and I wish I had an answer, I've wanted an answer so much for many years.

 

This is what had lead me to thinking either my good photo's aren't accurate, and in real life I look very ugly, or there is something wrong with my pheremones and they repulse all women, or in fact maybe I don't produce any pheremones at all. Those seem to be the only possible explanations.

 

The fact is though, in these last couple of months, a showed a girl my worst photo, and she said she still found me attractive, and would still like to date me/have sex with me. I was gob smacked, I mean this girl was beautiful.

 

So it proves that even if in real life I do look as bad as my worst photo, that it's still possible for some women to find me physically attractive. And I'm sure I cannot look any worse in real life than that photo, in fact I'm sure I look way better.

 

That might be an idea for me to try. Using my picture as an avatar. Though it would have to be at a forum where I don't post anything really negative. I would hate for somebody who I know to recognize my online presence here. My words here are so depressed and I don't always say the nicest things about women.

 

That's right, if you sound depressed and have a negative outlook all the time, it's just going to put women off.

 

Yes I have dysthmia. It's a chronic, milder form of depression but it's very long term and somewhat resistant to medication. I did CBT for about six months. It doesn't really help.

 

You could always try those mp3's that I've spoken about. Not sure if I've spoken to you properly about them before, but if you want any more information, just PM me.

 

You know what guys? I'm actually in a good mood. Want to know why?

 

Because we talked on the phone and joked around today. Also it's seems pretty likely that we are going to go to Six Flags this week. So far it's still a maybe and she needs to figure out her schedule.

 

I also just realized something. If I were in her shoes, based on how I've been acting, I would have said no. Frankly, I'm amazed she has put up with me for so long.

 

I really do need to figure out why I depend on women so much for my happiness.

 

That's great you're starting to see that some of your ways of thinking aren't right. I know when this happened to me, it helped a great deal, you get to see things more clearly as how they really are, and usually they aren't anywhere near as bad as what you thought they were.

Edited August 17, 2011 by Ross MwcFan

[D-Lish]

SD,

 

I know you said that things aren't feeling as bad because she agreed to maybe going to 6 Flags with you. This is you once again placing your happiness on a "maybe"...

 

I know you already recognize this, but you have to make yourself happy, you can't expect others to be responsible for your happiness. That is putting a huge expectation on someone else. I guarantee that you give off a desperate vibe even if you don't realize it because of this. That won't attract women, it will repel them.

 

You have to start doing other things to enrich your life- or you won't make a healthy romantic partner. I don't think you see all the things you are doing that are detrimental to feeling better about yourself. Having male companionship and group functions would expand your dating possibilities and your social group.

 

You've put all your eggs into this one basket with this girl that at best gives you a "maybe"... I cringe to see how you would react if she cancels or just goes back into ignore mode before the date.

[Teknoe]

You have to start doing other things to enrich your life- or you won't make a healthy romantic partner. I don't think you see all the things you are doing that are detrimental to feeling better about yourself. Having male companionship and group functions would expand your dating possibilities and your social group.

 

 

To SD's credit AND defense, he's made a very recent breakthrough. He said he will look into the activity night small group thing. Now I'm going to hold him to that, because he's given me his word. And a man is only as good as his word.

 

SD, I will be following up with you on this to make sure you follow through. Don't just say it, and then don't do it.

 

I genuinely believe though that you WILL do this. But what I believe is not as importantly as what you ACTUALLY DO (or will not do).

 

Let me know as soon as possible when you've contacted a small group leader. I want to be informed of every detail, even if it's just "Hey Teknoe, by the way, I found a local small group and emailed the leader for their next activity night. Currently waiting on his/her reply. Will let you know when they do."

 

See, that's what good friends do. Update each other and keep each other informed and also accountable, with a genuine interest to see the other person be all they can be. I have nothing to gain by offering you my support. I have no motives, other than to see you healthier and happier. Nothing will please me more if you go from having suicidal thoughts to living a life that's making a positive difference somehow.

 

And I think if you get healthy and right in your heart and mind, you could definitely make a positive difference in this world. But first, let's start the healing process. One step at a time.

[somedude81]

I appreciate all the posts, I've read over them all.

 

Based on how I'm feeling now D-Lish's really caught my eye.

SD,

 

I know you said that things aren't feeling as bad because she agreed to maybe going to 6 Flags with you. This is you once again placing your happiness on a "maybe"...

 

I know you already recognize this, but you have to make yourself happy, you can't expect others to be responsible for your happiness. That is putting a huge expectation on someone else. I guarantee that you give off a desperate vibe even if you don't realize it because of this. That won't attract women, it will repel them.

 

You have to start doing other things to enrich your life- or you won't make a healthy romantic partner. I don't think you see all the things you are doing that are detrimental to feeling better about yourself. Having male companionship and group functions would expand your dating possibilities and your social group.

 

You've put all your eggs into this one basket with this girl that at best gives you a "maybe"... I cringe to see how you would react if she cancels or just goes back into ignore mode before the date.

She has put off 6-flags for now cause she doesn't have a lot of cash and I'm not going to offer to pay for her because I'm not her boyfriend. Me paying for would make her uncomfortable.

 

So we're going to go to the beach on Saturday.

 

But that doesn't make me feel that good. Because I want to see her now or tomorrow. Saturday seems so far away. I just have the feeling of wanting to hibernate until then, and that's pathetic.

 

Now that I realized that, I need to start getting myself motivated to actually do something about it.

 

BTW, I was pretty active during the school year. I had regular aquainteces that I'd talk, shoot hoops and work out with. I was also fairly active at the Japan club on campus, went to all of the meetings and social events. I even took part in the big "sports" festival.

 

But it was only kind of fulfilling. There were several girls in the club that I was attracted to. A couple of girls weren't regular members so I didn't see them that often. I did start getting to know one girl and asked her out. Of course she rejected me.

 

I was more outgoing there than I have ever been. And yet I wasn't able to make any real friends.

 

Teknoe, can you please back off a bit.

Edited August 18, 2011 by somedude81

[D-Lish]

I appreciate all the posts, I've read over them all.

 

Based on how I'm feeling now D-Lish's really caught my eye.

 

She has put off 6-flags for now cause she doesn't have a lot of cash and I'm not going to offer to pay for her because I'm not her boyfriend. Me paying for would make her uncomfortable.

 

So we're going to go to the beach on Saturday.

 

But that doesn't make me feel that good. Because I want to see her now or tomorrow. Saturday seems so far away. I just have the feeling of wanting to hibernate until then, and that's pathetic.

 

Now that I realized that, I need to start getting myself motivated to actually do something about it.

 

BTW, I was pretty active during the school year. I had regular aquainteces that I'd talk, shoot hoops and work out with. I was also fairly active at the Japan club on campus, went to all of the meetings and social events. I even took part in the big "sports" festival.

 

But it was only kind of fulfilling. There were several girls in the club that I was attracted to. A couple of girls weren't regular members so I didn't see them that often. I did start getting to know one girl and asked her out. Of course she rejected me.

 

I was more outgoing there than I have ever been. And yet I wasn't able to make any real friends.

 

Teknoe, can you please back off a bit.

 

Well I tend to hibernate sometimes as well, so I get that compulsion.

 

The thing about making your own happiness before being ready to be in a relationship is that, if you go into a relationship expecting that the other person is going to make all your troubles go away magically- it doesn't work like that. You'll just bring all that neediness into the relationship and potentially push your partner away when they realize that you're relying on them too much to make you happy.

 

That's why having a hobby, or finding something in life besides romance that makes you happy is going to make you a better bf.

 

I made the mistake of putting that expectation of my happiness on my ex. he had a rich social group, and I did not. He golfed, had hobbies, and I only had work. Everytime he wanted to go out without me, I felt rejected (because I had no one to go out with or anything else to do). I am pretty sure he got tired of having to be my source of entertainment as well as my cheerleader. Since then I have made a point of accepting friendships and getting out of the house a little more - even if it means going by myself to the beach (which I do). The next time I meet someone, I am going to make sure to have a social/hobby outlet outside of my relationship....I'm building that now so I'll have that in place if I meet someone.

 

It's only a couple more days- instead of hibernating, make a plan for the next couple days. Heck, if you live near the beach- go on your own if it's nice out tomorrow or Friday, build a bit of a tan before you see her.

 

If you do end up dating someone with a healthy social group or a penchant for hobbies- you're not going to be able to see them every day- so you want to have your own plans in place. Are you a golfer?

[Teknoe]

Teknoe, can you please back off a bit.

 

 

Dude.

 

You said you would look into it. I'm merely holding you to what you've said because I know it COULD help you.

 

Now you're telling me to back off? In other words, what you mean by that is "I am not really going to contact any activity night event coordinator because that involves putting myself out there, taking a risk, and I don't want to step outside my little bubble. Oh crap, now that Teknoe guy is on my butt about it. Tell him off so I can continue living in my same bubble existence."

 

MAN! You got me and SEVERAL others agreeing this activity night thing could do you wonders, and I'm just trying to hold you accountable rather than a token "Yeah I'll check it out" and then NOT. Yet when push comes to push, you WANT TO LIVE THE SAME OLD LIFE.

 

Maybe betterdeal was right.

 

 

It's easier to be a victim than an active participant. Even if you contrive that victim status by doing pretty everything you can to prevent things moving on to another stage. You play cat and mouse with her. Pulling her back when she goes and pushing her away when she come to you. And that's your choice. You are choosing to live this life.

 

That's you, somedude81, to a tee. Not just with girls, but with life.

 

Someone tries to get close to you (in this case, I'm trying to help you) and when I get too close for comfort, you push me away. Because the closer I get, the more real it seems. When I busted out the accountability check up thing, I am no longer a random anonymous internet faceless soul you can brush by.

 

People who are scared of being held to their word/accountable are cowards and people who TALK THE TALK but NEVER ACTUALLY walk the walk.

 

You ain't doing it, are you?

 

You're just going to passively wait for people to invite you, knowing full well no one ever will, so you justify it by saying to yourself "Hey not my fault, no one invited me."

 

Lose the victim's mentality.

 

In the end, not my loss though. It's your loss. You talk about change, even convince people you might change, but you always go back to doing the same ole ***** (that doesn't work might I add).

[betterdeal]

I was more outgoing there than I have ever been. And yet I wasn't able to make any real friends.

 

What's a real friend?

[Teknoe]

What's a real friend?

 

 

Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see SD81 has intimacy issues.

 

Crush invites him to dinner with her parents, even if it was a pity invite, he didn't take her up on it. I'd understand if he went out with his guy friends instead, or even just worked on a healthy hobby, but because we all know he doesn't have either of those, safe bet that he probably stayed home that night browsing LoveShack instead.

 

Latest example, I get a little too close for comfort, wanting to check up on him and HIS WORD that he'll look into the activity night, and he pushes me away.

 

Again, get intimate (or close) with SD81, and he repels. Intimacy issues. He wants to have a good relationship/life, but he only sabotages himself.

[Dorie]

Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see SD81 has intimacy issues.

 

Crush invites him to dinner with her parents, even if it was a pity invite, he didn't take her up on it. I'd understand if he went out with his guy friends instead, or even just worked on a healthy hobby, but because we all know he doesn't have either of those, safe bet that he probably stayed home that night browsing LoveShack instead.

 

Latest example, I get a little too close for comfort, wanting to check up on him and HIS WORD that he'll look into the activity night, and he pushes me away.

 

Again, get intimate (or close) with SD81, and he repels. Intimacy issues. He wants to have a good relationship/life, but he only sabotages himself.

 

Very astute, Teknoe. I concur.

[Teknoe]

Very astute, Teknoe. I concur.

 

I'm equally frustrated and disappointed by his latest reply. I really thought he was beginning to turn the corner there -- the best thing one can ask/hope for is a person to have an OPEN spirit and to be teachable, especially when at this point SD81 really has nothing to lose and everything to gain.

 

After all, half of life is really JUST showing up. I mean seriously! Just show up. Nothing will change if you lock yourself in your room all by yourself. But walk out that front door... and on ANY GIVEN DAY or NIGHT, your life could change for the better -- forever.

 

I don't mind if SD81 orders wrong. The problem is, he's NOT ORDERING AT ALL. Nothing's worse in life than NOT trying. At least when you fail by trying, you learn something from it!

 

Best visual for a person like him I think is -- he's choking, people walking by who have empathy offer to apply the Heimlich maneuver to relieve him of his anguish, but he constantly rejects our (potentially healing) offers. He would rather choke than possibly be saved, because his mind is anxious about what if suddenly you decide to be his best buddy, expecting to hang out with him 3-4x a week. No, he would MUCH rather stay in his "safe" little bubble, choking away, than truly attempt to change as much as he is proclaiming it verbally. (talk is cheap)

 

The ironic thing is, that "safe" bubble of his is actually quite toxic.

 

OK maybe that choking-no-don't-get-close-enough-to-actually-save-me! visual is little extreme and unjustified... then again, actually maybe not. It's getting hard to tell at this point. It really, sadly is.

[betterdeal]

Whilst I agree with that, I am interested in what he thinks constitutes a real friend.

[somedude81]

If it wasn't obvious Teknoe, I said I'll check into it because I wanted to get you off my back. I appreciate the help but you are bordering on overbearing.

 

Whilst I agree with that, I am interested in what he thinks constitutes a real friend.

There's a guy who was a regular member of the club I go to on campus. We've often talked and hung out a few times. When the semester was over I sent him a message on Facebook. Something like, "Yo dude what are you doing this summer? We should hang out." He doesn't respond.

 

Completely by chance, I run into him in a Gamestop at a mall about a week later, he's with his GF and I'm with her. We talk for a bit and he told me that he got my message. He said he's working full time so he doesn't have a lot of time during the week. I told him that we should do something and he said that when he's free he'll get a hold of me. I never heard from him again.

 

A friend would have gotten back to me. I'm not going to pursue a man like I would a woman.

Someone tries to get close to you (in this case, I'm trying to help you) and when I get too close for comfort, you push me away. Because the closer I get, the more real it seems.

Sorry, you're not even close.

You're just going to passively wait for people to invite you, knowing full well no one ever will, so you justify it by saying to yourself "Hey not my fault, no one invited me."

Why should I have to do all the work?

 

If you haven't figured it out already, I'm not the most outgoing guy. I'll try to reach out a couple of times. If it doesn't work, I'm done.

Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see SD81 has intimacy issues.

Eh, in what way?

 

I've never had the chance to be intimate in a relationship and it's something that I crave. But I don't think that's what you are talking about.

 

If anybody has intimacy issues it's the girl I'm pursuing. She doesn't really let anybody get close to her. Seems to be both emotionally and physically.

The thing about making your own happiness before being ready to be in a relationship is that, if you go into a relationship expecting that the other person is going to make all your troubles go away magically- it doesn't work like that. You'll just bring all that neediness into the relationship and potentially push your partner away when they realize that you're relying on them too much to make you happy.

What quantifies as too much?

 

I would be really happy if I could see this girl once a week. Once every two weeks would still be acceptable. But all I've gotten is once a month but it's summer vacation, and she's not even working. So it's really frustrating because she's so unavailable. While I'm the total opposite and I have a job.

I made the mistake of putting that expectation of my happiness on my ex. he had a rich social group, and I did not. He golfed, had hobbies, and I only had work. Everytime he wanted to go out without me, I felt rejected (because I had no one to go out with or anything else to do). I am pretty sure he got tired of having to be my source of entertainment as well as my cheerleader.

And that's the thing. She has a much more active social life than I do. I got jealous that she went to Vegas, I would have loved to gone; though probably not with her family. Even now when she's spending time with her friends I'd like to be there and see more of her.

 

So yeah, I don't like the thought of her having fun without me. And a big part of that is that I'm not having any fun. Of course I'm not going to tell her this and I need to be very careful that I don't give her that impression.

 

It's only a couple more days- instead of hibernating, make a plan for the next couple days. Heck, if you live near the beach- go on your own if it's nice out tomorrow or Friday, build a bit of a tan before you see her.

I'm actually a 10-minute bike ride from the beach. So I go there every week. I'm not much of a lay in the sun and get a tan guy, I'm usually on my bike on the path. I'm also kind of wary about taking off my shirt because I don't want to get burned on my back. Heh, I wonder if I should ask her to put some on me when we go there?

 

If you do end up dating someone with a healthy social group or a penchant for hobbies- you're not going to be able to see them every day- so you want to have your own plans in place. Are you a golfer?

I wouldn't need to see her everyday. Two days a week would be amazing.

 

Does mini-golf count?

Edited August 18, 2011 by somedude81

[Teknoe]

If it wasn't obvious Teknoe, I said I'll check into it because I wanted to get you off my back. I appreciate the help but you are bordering on overbearing.

 

 

In my experience working with people who need a lot of support, the best thing is tough love. I don't apologize if I came across bordering on overbearing. It's just I know too many people like you who need a BIG PUSH to do something they say "they'll check out" (which usually means 8 months from now, or never is the most common one)

 

Because you don't have a real life male friend who can physically pound on your door and drive you to these events, I figure the least I can do is to ask for your accountability over the internet.

 

 

Why should I have to do all the work?

 

It's the same thing with respect.

 

How do you get respect?

 

BY FIRST giving it.

 

How do you develop good friendships?

 

BY FIRST being a good friend yourself.

 

And guess what, that means initiating!

 

 

If you haven't figured it out already, I'm not the most outgoing guy. I'll try to reach out a couple of times. If it doesn't work, I'm done.

 

I noticed this almost from the get-go. Like I said before, you can't allow past results to determine your present/future. Just because X didn't work in 2008, doesn't automatically mean it or Y won't work today!

 

It's baffling that you don't understand or grasp this simple fact. Nothing is NEVER or ALWAYS. Unless you make it so in your head (i.e. I'll never get a GF attitude = you really will never have a GF)

 

 

Eh, in what way?

 

I've never had the chance to be intimate in a relationship and it's something that I crave. But I don't think that's what you are talking about.

 

Your inclination is correct, as I was talking also about your latest response to me to back off. I'm not talking intimacy in terms of being physical, but intimacy in terms of MATTERS OF THE HEART. The closer I move into "your life" so to speak (as close as internet "strangers" can, anyhow), I notice you freaked out and started to push me away.

 

That, along with all your other posts in LS history, clearly demonstrate to me you most likely have intimacy issues, which is why you don't have any male friends or haven't had a relationship (in a long time, if ever?)

 

When people get close to you, you push them away. It's a defensive mechanism. You claim you want to be happy, but you don't seize those opportunities.

 

 

If anybody has intimacy issues it's the girl I'm pursuing. She doesn't really let anybody get close to her. Seems to be both emotionally and physically.

 

Please, let's not blame her here. You're trying to shovel some dirt on her end. You're using the wrong tool there.

 

You should be using a RAKE.

 

Coz that pulls the issues and problems back to you.

 

Let's focus on SELF-improvement here. After all, you did post this thread in Self-Improvement and Personal Well-Being, and not in Dating.

 

Did you expect people to just sympathize with you and pat you on the back? Some folks are giving you some tough love, because sometimes that's the only way to help that person break the cycle of vicious self-sabotage.

[betterdeal]

So yeah, I don't like the thought of her having fun without me. And a big part of that is that I'm not having any fun. Of course I'm not going to tell her this and I need to be very careful that I don't give her that impression.

 

Your solution is to pretend to be what you are not, then when she falls for this falsehood, you'll have interests and a social life and have fun without her. The details of how you will attain these things that you don't particularly want are yet to be determined.

 

You do realise how unrealistic that sounds, right? It's the princess and the frog fairytale.

 

She is wary of you for good reasons: First, you are desperate. Second, you don't have a social life. Third, you are jealous. Fourth, you don't take any risks. Fifth, you're inauthentic and she sees right through it. What does she get from this?

 

Let's suppose you do manage to bamboozle her, and she has sex with you, falls for you &c. Then what happens?

 

Come on! You're a bright lad and I find myself teeth-clenchingly annoyed by the stupidity of your approach to life. That's almost certainly because I was in exactly the same mental backwater as you are, and it just sucks the fat one. You're not doing this to annoy anyone, and you don't wish to hurt anyone, but you are and you will, if you continue to let your fear of fear dominate you.

 

Something has to change in your head for something to change in your life. I don't know what's holding you back from experimenting with different thinking. As Ross has suggested, hypnosis can help an awful lot (it did for me) and talk therapy where you explore more integrative approaches with a more open minded therapists rather than CBT and other instructional techniques. To thine ownself be true, said Shakespeare, and to do so, you need to know yourself first.

 

Maybe get a bar-job where you have to interact with people all the time. And learn from them. I've found yoga is also a great thing to do too. It's a moving meditation and a way to socialise.

 

Continuing to mither this woman and bore her into a relationship with you may work. It won't last, almost certainly, but you'll learn lots. It's just that life is much much easier if you let it be.

Edited August 18, 2011 by betterdeal

[Els]

OP, I'm sorry, but it seems to me that you're closing off whole avenues here. Here are all the things you won't do to meet girls:

 

1) LDRs

2) Going to religious activities

3) Going to bars/pubs

4) Asking out random girls

5) Getting friends of the same sex to help you, because you don't have any

6) Working on changing your style and getting buff

 

I could go on. Now, I don't know about the people you know, but pretty much all the people I know are at least open to one or more of the above 6 ways. Personally, if I had closed off all of the above, I would never have been in a relationship.

 

If you pigeonhole yourself into a corner like that, you're simply lowering the odds for yourself.

Edited August 18, 2011 by Elswyth

[somedude81]

Please, let's not blame her here. You're trying to shovel some dirt on her end. You're using the wrong tool there.

 

You should be using a RAKE.

Silly goose, I can't put dirt on her with a rake.

 

Yes I'm joking

 

One thing I need to make clear, if she didn't have any intimacy issues, me and her wouldn't be in this situation. Either we'd be dating or she'd be in a relationship with somebody and we would have never gotten to this point.

 

She's an attractive 22 year old girl. Yes she's kind of geeky but that's no explanation for never having been in a relationship.

 

I have put a ton of effort into this girl and I've been stopped at the most basic things.

 

Your inclination is correct, as I was talking also about your latest response to me to back off. I'm not talking intimacy in terms of being physical, but intimacy in terms of MATTERS OF THE HEART. The closer I move into "your life" so to speak (as close as internet "strangers" can, anyhow), I notice you freaked out and started to push me away.

 

That, along with all your other posts in LS history, clearly demonstrate to me you most likely have intimacy issues, which is why you don't have any male friends or haven't had a relationship (in a long time, if ever?)

 

When people get close to you, you push them away. It's a defensive mechanism. You claim you want to be happy, but you don't seize those opportunities.

I do not push women away. That's completely counter-intuitive. If anything, the walk away because of my neediness.

 

Intimacy issues is also completely the wrong term to describe how I interact with other men.

I'm not talking intimacy in terms of being physical, but intimacy in terms of MATTERS OF THE HEART. The closer I move into "your life" so to speak (as close as internet "strangers" can, anyhow), I notice you freaked out and started to push me away.

I didn't get freaked out. I was starting to get annoyed.

 

I don't want to have an argument about this.

Your solution is to pretend to be what you are not, then when she falls for this falsehood, you'll have interests and a social life and have fun without her. The details of how you will attain these things that you don't particularly want are yet to be determined.

My solution is to tell her as little about what I'm doing as possible. Why should she even care about what my activities are? So what falsehood is there to fall for?

She is wary of you for good reasons:

I wasn't aware that she was wary of me at all.

 

First, you are desperate.

While I am desperate, I think I've done a decent job keeping this from her. I'm tempted to ask her what she really thinks of me and if she believes I'm needy or desperate but I'll refrain from doing it as I know it won't help me at all.

 

Second, you don't have a social life.

Why does that matter at all? Also it's not something I talk about with her. I mainly try to keep conversations about common interests and her. On the rare occasion she asks a question about myself that I'm not comfortable answering, I'll dodge and weave and bring it back to her.

 

Third, you are jealous.

There is no way she can get that impression from anything I've done and said. She's not psychic.

 

Fourth, you don't take any risks.

That's not entirely correct. She has barriers up where most women have none. I need to break them down before I can do something that can be considered risky. Lets not forget that she has actually rejected the last couple hugs I tried to give her. Though I have been thinking that I can just try to bypass a hug and put my arm around her or just go for a kiss.

 

What I really need is an opportunity and I've had very few of those.

 

Fifth, you're inauthentic and she sees right through it.

In what way?

What does she get from this?

From this? I'll assume you mean, what would she get from dating me?

 

A nice, sweat guy who looks out for her and makes her laugh. Somebody who has many common interests with her who tries to get her to be more active. Somebody who gets along with her very well and has a similar personality. Never mind the stuff I can do for her in the bedroom.

 

Let's suppose you do manage to bamboozle her, and she has sex with you, falls for you &c. Then what happens?

We have a fulfilling relationship?

 

What kind of answer are you looking for?

 

Come on! You're a bright lad and I find myself teeth-clenchingly annoyed by the stupidity of your approach to life. That's almost certainly because I was in exactly the same mental backwater as you are, and it just sucks the fat one. You're not doing this to annoy anyone, and you don't wish to hurt anyone, but you are and you will, if you continue to let your fear of fear dominate you.

All I've ever gotten from women is rejection and pain. Wanting to avoid pain is a basic animal behavior.

 

Even then, I still put myself out there. And I'm going to do it again.

Something has to change in your head for something to change in your life. I don't know what's holding you back from experimenting with different thinking. As Ross has suggested, hypnosis can help an awful lot (it did for me) and talk therapy where you explore more integrative approaches with a more open minded therapists rather than CBT and other instructional techniques. To thine ownself be true, said Shakespeare, and to do so, you need to know yourself first.

I have tried many things.

 

What's holding me back the most is that I have very little money and no health insurance. The therapy I have gotten at the school was free, and it obviously wasn't the best quality. Same can be said for the low cost place I went to when I used up my allocated hours at the college. I've done CBT and talk therapy. Hypno is the only one left and I don't think it's cheap. I have tried some self hypno stuff I found online but it's never really worked for me. My mind is constant non-stop noise.

Continuing to mither this woman and bore her into a relationship with you may work. It won't last, almost certainly, but you'll learn lots. It's just that life is much much easier if you let it be.

LOL! I don't think it's possible to bore somebody into a relationship.

 

I'm trying to suggest things things that would be fun to her but I don't really know what excites her. The most fun I've seen her have was when I took her to the aquarium. She also really enjoyed playing videogames with me.

OP, I'm sorry, but it seems to me that you're closing off whole avenues here. Here are all the things you won't do to meet girls:

 

1) LDRs

I need companionship, intimacy and sex too much to settle for a LDR. The only way I could possibly make a LDR work, is if I had another girl where I was getting those things from.

2) Going to religious activities

I went to Church at least twice a month for the vast majority of my life. The last time I went was when I was 27 and moved out of my Grandmothers house. I also participated in some activities and even did a couple of camping trips.

 

I never got close to any of the girls.

3) Going to bars/pubs

Eh, I'm not really smooth enough to walk up to random girls at a bar and try to hit on them. And for what purpose, to get a one night stand?

 

I've actually tried the bar and club a few times. Usually there was a shortage of girls and I don't really like staying out late.

 

4) Asking out random girls

See number 3 for the smooth and not even knowing what the purpose is.

5) Getting friends of the same sex to help you, because you don't have any

Guy friends have never helped me with girls. The closest thing a guy has done to helping me, is hosting a party where girls are going to be at, and inviting me. Other than that guys have done nothing. I don't even know what else they can do.

 

6) Working on changing your style and getting buff

That I am doing. I think my style is good for what I can afford. I also work out pretty regularly. I have bad genes so it's hard for me to get big, though I have a decent amount of muscle on me. Right now I want to get rid of my gut.

[UpDownAllAround]

Because, plenty of women online, had flirted with me, shown interest in me, had developed romantic feelings for me, and even wanted to meet and **** me.

 

But offline, it's like a completely different world. No one has ever shown interest for some reason, or at least, I've never noticed it.

 

Online, it's like it just happened naturally, I'd never plan it or try to make it happen. It just happens naturally like it does for other people in the real world.

 

What will help, is having your pic as your avatar, so women can see what you look like, and just being in a good care free mood when posting in forums. Then one day, bam, it just happens.

 

 

Wow, I'd love to have what you're taking to get those results.

 

Never happened to me. Ever. Online or OFF.

 

They always choose someone else over me.

[Teknoe]

wow, there is some SERIOUS mental blockage for you, SomeDude. It's so weird, because I see you posting in OneGoal's threads, and you come off as a very intelligent guy. You give the right advice to OneGoal I've seen

 

i.e. "Move on. This girl doesn't like you. The more you push, the worst it will get for you."

 

Then I read YOUR THREADS and I'm like... is this the SAME person??

 

You seem to understand OneGoal's futile situation, but you can't see (or you deny) YOUR VERY OWN.

 

Everything we suggest you to do, you just say "nah, not for me" or "Nah, it didn't work for me in 1928, so it won't work today" (1928 is said tongue-in-cheek).

 

I'm starting to feel like this is One Goal 2.0, not as creepy, but just as frustrating and baffling.

 

And let me break it to you now... don't be surprised if that lady cancels on you Friday afternoon/night. I just get a bad feeling about this one. And then, it wouldn't shock me if her rejection or the simple fact you won't see her Saturday will drive you into another mental despair.

 

It's a vicious cycle man, but the only one STOPPING you is you. Really. Honestly. It's not her. It's not God. It's not the world. You can complain and bitch all you want about being dealt a "bad hand" -- but in the end everything falls on your shoulders. The quality of life you're living now is based on YOUR choices.

 

Speaking of choices, I recommend viewing this YouTube video beginning to end

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9yGsweX6eA

 

YOU HAVE A CHOICE. THERE ARE NO VICTIMS HERE.

[Els]

Sigh, look, somedude, I don't necessarily agree with all of the methods I listed for you either. It was an illustration. My point is, that if you want something badly, you have to go out of your comfort zone sometimes, or accept less-than-ideal circumstances. That is true for most areas of life. You're like a guy who wants a job but won't check the internet cause there's scammers there, and don't read the papers because you live in a rural area and have to pay $2 more for it to be delivered to you, and don't watch TV because you're afraid of EM radiation. Sure, you probably COULD find one through contacts or the radio, but uh, if you don't, don't you think the solution is to open up those avenues?

 

Where do you make an attempt to talk to women to besides in class or through playing video games with them?

[betterdeal]

Wanting to avoid pain is a basic animal behavior.

 

I take it you can't ride a bicycle then. You know, avoiding all that falling off and the pain of grazing your knee is basic animal instinct.

 

You say in the same post that you will lie by omission then you ask how am I lying? When you exhibit such patent intellectual dishonesty there is nothing to be said.

 

Anyway, I'm done enabling your neurosis.

[somedude81]

wow, there is some SERIOUS mental blockage for you, SomeDude. It's so weird, because I see you posting in OneGoal's threads, and you come off as a very intelligent guy. You give the right advice to OneGoal I've seen

 

i.e. "Move on. This girl doesn't like you. The more you push, the worst it will get for you."

 

Then I read YOUR THREADS and I'm like... is this the SAME person??

 

You seem to understand OneGoal's futile situation, but you can't see (or you deny) YOUR VERY OWN.

I can sympathize with one goal. I know what it's like to quickly get strong feelings for girls and then fail at getting them, then struggle in getting over then.

 

The main difference is that one goal keeps trying long after he shouldn't. I have never kept going after a girl once she told me to leave me alone.

 

When it comes to this girl, I'm going to keep trying till she tells me no. Going out with me is a very funny way to say no.

And let me break it to you now... don't be surprised if that lady cancels on you Friday afternoon/night. I just get a bad feeling about this one. And then, it wouldn't shock me if her rejection or the simple fact you won't see her Saturday will drive you into another mental despair.

Yeah she could cancel. I need to get her to confirm today or tomorrow.

 

If she cancels I'm going to confront her. I need to get us both mad enough that we won't want to see each other again.

 

She knows exactly what I want which is why I'm still surprised that she wants to hang out at all.

 

I doubt I'm going to have a mental breakdown.

 

It's a vicious cycle man, but the only one STOPPING you is you. Really. Honestly. It's not her. It's not God. It's not the world. You can complain and bitch all you want about being dealt a "bad hand" -- but in the end everything falls on your shoulders. The quality of life you're living now is based on YOUR choices.

Yes my choices are important but I was dealt a bad hand. I could really get into all the things wrong with me though all it's going to do is depress me thinking about them.

 

Where do you make an attempt to talk to women to besides in class or through playing video games with them?

It primarily is classes and club meetings. I've also gotten to know a couple of girls on the bus going to and fro school.

 

Other than those, most people seem to meet their SO's through friends or online dating. I've never had any friends or acquaintances introduce me to anybody. I can try online dating.

I take it you can't ride a bicycle then. You know, avoiding all that falling off and the pain of grazing your knee is basic animal instinct.

There you go again, over-generalizing.

 

I spent the vast majority of my post addressing yours and that's what you give back to me?

[somedude81]

I don't accept hints.

 

I will only move on if she tells me to, or ignores me for a week.

 

What's most important to me is knowing that I gave it my all and there is no chance whatsoever of it working. Without that, I won't be able to get over her.

[Teknoe]

^ Agreed. The more I read from SD81 the more I just think of OneGoal. SD is not as creepy or stalker-ish (hard to match OneGoal), but SD is TOO CLOSE FOR COMFORT.

 

sd, your behavior toward this girl totally reeks of desperation, and trust me, she knows it. for whatever reason she's still entertaining you, but everything at this point really looks like a pity meh hang-out to her, until she can find something better.

 

Texting her multiple times a day is not cool. You just waiting for her to tell you off is delaying the inevitable.

 

 

I'm also kind of wary about taking off my shirt because I don't want to get burned on my back. Heh, I wonder if I should ask her to put some on me when we go there?

 

Do you know how pathetic and selfish that sounds?

 

Please don't ask her to put some sunscreen on you. Good grief man she won't even hug you -- what makes you think she'll say yes to putting on sunscreen on your bare body?

 

 

I wouldn't need to see her everyday. Two days a week would be amazing.

 

Again, do you know how pathetic this sounds?

 

Get a hobby that isn't centered around obsessing over girls.

 

Sadly, I can already see it now. You're not going to apply any of the sound advice we've given you, and this thread will just carry on and on the same broken song.

 

Eventually, on like page 16, you're going to bitch about how the girl's flaking out on you and if you should still pursue/how to pursue.

 

It is very OneGoal-esque. It's certainly OneGoal-predictable. You once said please don't compare you to OneGoal, but see, I ain't the only one who sees it. You have others too. It's not easy to hear, but let's face it. You are not right in the head.

 

Seek professional help.

 

In fact, I'd seek professional help before the activity night.

 

Let me erase that. I'd recommend seeing a therapist AND a life coach. Some man who will show you how to be a man, and live and think like a man. You really need a major environmental change. Somebody's gotta come into your life (you better seek them out too) and shake you the hell up. I'm convinced now posting on these boards does ZERO good.

 

There's a verse in Scripture that talks about how a dog returns to its vomit.

 

I'm actually with betterdeal here. Much like OneGoal, our replies to you may be more enabling than helpful. Especially the way you are taking our replies and sticking to your guns. Of course, we who like to help, think maybe we can make a difference. We can't. It's up to you, and in the end you always go back to your original way of being and thinking.

 

I'm just gonna sit back and wait to see this thread deteriorate, because it's inevitable. Waiting for the shoe to drop... i.e. the lady cancelling on you and whatever else follows.

 

This is a rerun, it's predictable and I've seen this crap before.

 

Now I'm just gonna sit back, and see how you just destroy yourself by not taking any of our healthy advice.

 

Like OneGoal, I am now a SomeDude81 Level 4 poster. Level 4 is the point where you throw your arms up and say to heck with it, this guy really isn't serious about changing. He doesn't want to change badly enough. All talk. No walk. I keep trying to help you, but you don't listen.

 

If you don't listen, then I'll stop talking.

 

Just wasting keystrokes here.

 

*grabs popcorn and waits for inevitable meltdown this weekend*