MM wants to tell people about us

[eleanor01]

Hello, Y'all--

 

I'm in something of a quandry at the moment and, if you have time, I would love your thoughts on something.

 

My MM wants to tell a couple of our mutual friends about us. We've already each told two people and they are all happy for us and very supportive. However, my lover has started talking about maybe telling a married couple with whom we are both good friends. He'd very much like to socialize with them occasionally. This would mean having them over to my house for dinner or something (which I don't really see, as he's almost always needed at home during the dinner hour). To go out, we'd probably have to go halfway across the state to make sure we didn't see anyone we knew. In short, I think that telling any more people than we have would be an enormous mistake. So here are some of my thoughts/questions:

 

1. I don't really think of us as a couple in any real sense. We are most certainly in love, we can't be a couple. He's married. So why this yearning on his part? Here are some thoughts:

• He craves normalcy. His life at home is chaotic and depressing. Being a "couple" is normal.
  
• He's trying to escape. Playing couple might be a way for him to pretend for an hour or two that his real life doesn't exist (he doesn't do this when we're together alone, though).
  
• For my work I travel abroad for weeks at a time. I don't really know how to describe it without going into more detail than is wise, but perhaps this will suffice: I am involved in humanitarian work that takes me to places that people often think are much scarier than they really are. Although he knows this, perhaps he is afraid of losing me "over there." Maybe that somehow plays into why he wants to play couple?
  

2. I just don't see that presenting ourselves as a couple to two people who really are a couple could do anything other than freak them out. These two are certainly open-minded by anyone's standards, but still. . .

• We'd only have an hour or two with them at any given time, so it's not like they would have hours with us playing Scrabble or something that would help them get over the shock.
  
• I would grieve terribly if I lost this couple as friends (especially the wife. I love her to pieces).
  

If it sounds like I'm trying to play armchair psychologist, well I am. I'm also asking you to do the same. Do you have thoughts on the above? Do you see anything obvious that might also be going on? I'm trying to figure out his possible motivations regarding why he wants to play couple. I'm also trying to consider consequences and repercussions if we do so. I need to talk to him about this at length and I want to have considered as many angles as possible before I do so.

 

Does anybody think that telling this married couple about us is a good idea?

 

FYI--realistically, he can't go see a therapist. We both already know everybody in our parish who works in that capacity, so he'd have travel a couple of parishes distant to find somebody we don't know (or who doesn't know the various other people here). He doesn't have the time to do that, right now.

 

Thanks for your thoughts.

Ellie

 

P.S. For those who haven't read my posts in other threads: My MM's wife is terminally ill and is now receiving hospice care at home. She's been very sick for a very long time and up until recently he's been her primary caregiver. He loves her very much. Her brain is fuzzy and she's turning mean--probably from the dementia. I've been caring for him, which mostly includes holding him and talking, but sometimes also includes sex. I've already taken it on the chin here in this forum for our actions; in this query I am not looking for approval or opinions on the general situation, please. I'm interested in your responses about the above.

[anne1707]

Does this couple also know his wife? If they do then that is putting them in an impossibly difficult situation and would be very disrespectful of their friendship.

[whichwayisup]

Does this couple also know his wife? If they do then that is putting them in an impossibly difficult situation and would be very disrespectful of their friendship.

 

I agree with this. And, if there's a chance that you could lose the friendship, have the dynamic change completely in a not so good way, don't do it.

[woinlove]

Presumably this couple knows MM is married? If so, even if they don't really know the W, I'd go with your reasoning and conclude it is a bad idea. When people feel uncomfortable, it can affect friendships. If they are open minded, they might be accepting, maybe not. But even if they are now, how will they react when the W dies? It just seems awkward for people who know of the wife at all and are not firmly aligned on "your side". They may not really know how to mix the condolences along with what it might mean for you two as a couple. Something like that could make them fade away as friends.

 

If they don't know MM is married and won't know when/if the W dies, then you aren't likely to encounter problems for yourself, provided you keep things that way (them not knowing).

[bentnotbroken]

I think it is a great idea. I say shout your love from the roof tops. Everyone should be really supportive of the relationship.

[TurboGirl]

Answer is NO. Please do not tell anyone else about your relationship.

 

I don't care how "open minded" your friends are - there is the "ick" factor, about the dying wife and the poor woman is on her deathbed, and here is Mr. Wonderful, coming out about his relationship with you! I can't even believe you each told 2 people! Of course, it is your life... and I guess you hope to marry him when his wife dies. All this loving care you are giving to your MM, Ellie, it does not guarantee that he will be with you after his W dies. Grieving is very different for every person. He needs some professional help, NOT yours, to get through this.

 

Yes I can understand craving normal behaviour and a normal life, normal couple, etc. However, your MM needs to man up and continue caring for his wife right now. Better or worse, unless the worse part does not count here. Oh yes, it hurts him, well sorry but boo hoo hoo. It is part of life. How would you feel if one of your friends was dying... and you knew her H was running around on her with another woman? Have you considered that aspect? Can't you give the respect to this woman she deserves and wait to go public with your A after she is gone?

 

Telling other people... extremely distasteful.

[Tenacity]

Frankly, I do not think that most people would be supportive of this. Particularly if this couple knows/is friends with his W. There is very little chance, if that were the case, that this would turn out well. If they are friends or even know his W then you are putting them in a difficult and completely unfair position.

 

As to the "armchair psychologist" thing about why he wants to tell people, who knows. I doubt it is anything so complicated as that he thinks he's going to "lose" you overseas. Men don't tend to think that way. There is probably a much less complicated reason. In any event, I can think of absolutely no good reason or possible benefit to telling anyone.

[woinlove]

As to motivation, does he feel a lot of guilt? If so, he might be trying to think of people who would "approve" in order to alleviate his guilt. The more people he can gather that "approve", the more okay his actions must be. Many affairs don't have any confidants and I'm surprised you already have four, given the circumstances. Perhaps he feels a lot guilt when looking at his W and his children.

 

If that is the reason, it doesn't sound good, because the death could really send him over the edge guilt-wise.

[Silly_Girl]

Usual rule - if it leaves you uncomfortable or might impact you negatively, just say No

[Gentlegirl]

Oh Ellie,

 

Just for a while, please put this man second and consider your own future. If you live in a small community and go public, the wrath of society will descend on you from high. You have already told others so you no longer have a secret. The roasting you received on this forum will be nothing compared to what you will have to live with in your town.

 

Then of course, when his wife dies, will you then serve any prupose in his life? At the moment you are being his escape, his fantasy... but what will happen when he no longer needs you? He could view you very differently. You probably think not, but who knows?

 

He is selfishly using you and risking your future and his kid's future happiness and his relationship with them.

 

I think your MM is suffering from "carer's dementia". It happens. It is ce an attempt to escape from an unbearable present. It is a yearning for normalcy, peace and that feeling of well being when all is right with your world. He craves it the fact is that he can't have it at the moment. I understand as it happened to me and I created a fantasty with xMM.

 

Please thing longer term Ellie and do put yourself first on the agenda...you are not his doormat or his mother.

 

Warm wishes,

 

Gentlegirl

[IfWishesWereHorses]

I can't believe neither of you are considering the position you will put this couple in. But, hey, if it feels good do it! It does sound like he's ready to move forward with your R. Hopefully, it won't be much longer, huh?

[whichwayisup]

My friends father is suffering badly from demensia. it isn't easy and it's stressful on the whole family, but you know what? As upsetting as it is and how their lives have changed, her mother is looking after him. She looks unhappy, she's tired and drained but she is sucking it up and doing what a wife does. Looks after her ailing husband and enjoys the time they do connect. A touch, a look, a conversation.

 

It's heartbreaking that your MM has completely disengaged and detached from his wife. He's distanced himself as the "man and father" of the family unit and is secretly playing house with you to "live life" again. Sadly, this may come back and bite him in the ass one day. The guilt, wishing that he handled things differently.

 

Anyway, if he is this miserable with looking after his wife and he wants to "live" again, be out there and not have the responsibility he's faced with, then he needs to own it and change his life. HE can look into facilities his wife can move into to and be looked after 24/7. It'll cost him a pretty penny but atleast he'll be happy and living life with you, socializing with friends and feeling good.

 

Though I doubt he has the balls to do that, so I guess it's okay for him to do what he's doing..That is, until his kids find out, or his inlaws, or even his own parents. Even his wife, if she's lucid enough and has moments where she knows him. Is she at that point where she doesn't know who he is?

 

Just remember how he's bailed on his wife during this time. He can't handle illnesses, let alone having it affect his own happiness. IF you end up with him, he could very well do the same thing to you. Imagine having a disease, cancer or a life long illness that needs care and at times, hospitialization and finding out he was sneaking off behind your back, cozying it up with another woman because he didn't want to deal with the bad and awful stuff life throws at him.

[Spark1111]

There is absolutely NO valid reason to NOT see a therapist, I do not care if you live in a parish of 100 people.

 

It is against the law to divulge what is sad during a therapy session unless he threatens to harm himself or harm others.

 

If the therapist gossips one word, he/she will lose their license to practice.

[eleanorrigby]

How much longer does the BW have to live? 6 months? A year? I know it's hard but you should convince your MM to slow down a bit and let his wife finish dying before you guys start telling everyone about your relationship.

[Lostinlife4now]

Hi Ellie!

 

Just adding my 2 cents here....NO do not tell anyone else about your R....His wife is dying....YOU and HE will not look good in anyone's eyes....DO NOT tell the other couple.....

 

You look rather CLASSLESS!.....His w is dying...tell him to stand up and be a man and take care of her in whatever time she has left.. If it is meant to be with you and him, there will be enough time LATER to do so.....BUT not now!!!!

 

Don't mean to be harsh....but you need to hear the truth.....

[jj33]

I can only echo what the others have said. It is bound to make everyone uncomfortable and really what is with this guy? Did he love her while she was well? Its very difficult to nurse a spouse or any family member through a long term illness. Its isolating its lonely and its draining. But its also what you do for your loved ones. If hes not willing to step up at this vital time and cant wait to go out and socialize as a couple with you and their friends what does that say about him in your eyes?

[fooled once]

How much longer does the BW have to live? 6 months? A year? I know it's hard but you should convince your MM to slow down a bit and let his wife finish dying before you guys start telling everyone about your relationship.

 

Ditto

 

Hi Ellie!

 

Just adding my 2 cents here....NO do not tell anyone else about your R....His wife is dying....YOU and HE will not look good in anyone's eyes....DO NOT tell the other couple.....

 

You look rather CLASSLESS!.....His w is dying...tell him to stand up and be a man and take care of her in whatever time she has left.. If it is meant to be with you and him, there will be enough time LATER to do so.....BUT not now!!!!

 

Don't mean to be harsh....but you need to hear the truth.....

 

Ditto

 

What a crappy thing to do to this other couple! Sooner rather than later, the few you have told will spread the knowledge and when it goes through your small town, you will see first hand what people really think. Hopefully, the children don't get put through hell from friends and others when the actions of their parents are the talk of the town.

 

As for "why" he wants to tell everyone....so that you will also be 'guilty' when it comes out what is going on. He wants to make sure people don't think it was just him chasing you - that you were and are a willing participant in the affair.

[eleanorrigby]

What a crappy thing to do to this other couple! Sooner rather than later, the few you have told will spread the knowledge and when it goes through your small town, you will see first hand what people really think. Hopefully, the children don't get put through hell from friends and others when the actions of their parents are the talk of the town.

 

As for "why" he wants to tell everyone....so that you will also be 'guilty' when it comes out what is going on. He wants to make sure people don't think it was just him chasing you - that you were and are a willing participant in the affair.

 

All that married couple needs to do is mention this to one person. I read that the MM's kids are teenagers. oh god.... I've got teenagers and they flip their lids over little stuff, I don't even want to imagine the drama that would ensue if they found out I took a lover when their dad was dying!

Edited August 14, 2011 by eleanorrigby

[bentnotbroken]

All that married couple needs to do is mention this to one person. I read that the MM's kids are teenagers. oh god.... I've got teenagers and they flip their lids over little stuff, I don't even want to imagine the drama that would ensue if they found out I took a lover when their dad was dying!

 

 

My kids were teens when they found out about Mr. Messy. The kids at their school talked, kids at our church talked...and I wasn't dying. I am a firm believer in reaping what you put out there. I hope this guy buys a semi, he's going to need every square inch. :sick:

[Woman In Blue]

The word that comes to mind here is "ghoulish."

 

His wife is terminal but very much alive, and your married boyfriend is playing "couple" already? Jesus.

 

When someone shows you who they ARE, it would behoove you to watch closely. He's showing you that he has ZERO loyalty to his wife or their marriage. Watch out - it could very easily be YOU one day in the future, lying in your deathbed while he's over some other woman's house, pretending you don't exist while whining that he wants to 'socialize' with another couple. :sick:

[jthorne]

I think it is a great idea. I say shout your love from the roof tops.

I'm with Bent. I think this is the best idea your lover has had so far. But please don't stop with this couple. Tell everyone you know. Just please start with the kids first, because they should hear it from you, not from the town crier.

[IfWishesWereHorses]

Is it possible that the more people who condone this the less guilt he feels. Your MM is not thinking clearly. There is a reason why they teach widow/ers NOT to make any decisions before atleast the year anniversary of a spouses death. I've seen the craziness with my own father and MIL. One was expected the other was not, and their reactions were very much the same after the deaths. (no affairs or lovers, just the need to change things, escape the pain and loneliness.

 

The children deserve happiness as much as their father in this situation. They deserve to be protected from further hurts. Where is the adult who is protecting them while the father copes and the mother dies?

[eleanor01]

Oh Ellie,

 

Just for a while, please put this man second and consider your own future. If you live in a small community and go public, the wrath of society will descend on you from high. You have already told others so you no longer have a secret. The roasting you received on this forum will be nothing compared to what you will have to live with in your town.

 

Then of course, when his wife dies, will you then serve any prupose in his life? At the moment you are being his escape, his fantasy... but what will happen when he no longer needs you? He could view you very differently. You probably think not, but who knows?

 

He is selfishly using you and risking your future and his kid's future happiness and his relationship with them.

 

I think your MM is suffering from "carer's dementia". It happens. It is ce an attempt to escape from an unbearable present. It is a yearning for normalcy, peace and that feeling of well being when all is right with your world. He craves it the fact is that he can't have it at the moment. I understand as it happened to me and I created a fantasty with xMM.

 

Please thing longer term Ellie and do put yourself first on the agenda...you are not his doormat or his mother.

 

Warm wishes,

 

Gentlegirl

 

OMG, gg. You nailed it. Despite the few nasty comments here, I am so glad I started this thread, because this information is more helpful to me than you could ever know. I can't believe I didn't put this together before. I have mentioned to him that I am worried about burnout, but I just didn't get it before now. I had figured out some of the pieces, but now my understanding is ever so much clearer.

 

Rereading my original post, I think that it's pretty obvious that I was thinking "WTF??????" gg, after reading your comments here I've done a little bit of research--I'd never heard of caregiver's syndrome (or its other names) before. I haven't delved into the scholarly literature about it yet, but what I've found by googling is blowing me away. Perhaps the most helpful site so far is squidoo. It doesn't present in-depth information, but it gives me a starting point. Here are a few particularly relevant passages:

 

__________________

Caregiver Syndrome has been defined as:

 

 

A debilitating condition brought on by unrelieved, constant caring for a person with a chronic illness or dementia.

 

Caregiver Stress Syndrome (CSS) is a proposed definition:

 

 

A syndrome found in caregivers involving pathological, morbid changes in physiological and psychological function. This syndrome can be the result of acute or chronic stress, directly as a result of caregiving activities.

How Caregiving Affects the Caregiver's Emotions

In his 2003 article on Caregiver stress syndrome, Australian Research Journalist, David M. Guia described the emotional health complaints experienced by caregivers. Citing that not only do caregivers experience physical symptoms, but emotional ones as well. These emotional symptoms are listed below.

 

 

 

Source: Guia DM. 2003. Caregiver stress syndrome. Letters to the Editor. Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients.

• Grief
  
• Anxiety
  
• Resentment
  
• Anger
  
• Fear
  
• Helplessness
  
• Despair
  
• Depression
  

Caregiving Can Damage the Health of the Caregiver

 

Chronic Caregiver's Stress May be Similar to Post Traumatic Stress Disorder

 

Caregiving can be very damaging on the health of the caregiver. According to a study published in 1999 in the Journal of the American Medical Association researchers Richard Schulz and Scott Beach from University of Pittsburgh reported that elderly caregivers are at a 63 percent higher risk of mortality than noncaregivers in the same age group.

 

They found that the physical symptoms of caregiver stress are a result of a prolonged and elevated level of stress hormones circulating in the body. Researchers likened exhausted caregivers' stress hormone levels to those suffering from post traumatic stress disorder.

 

Additionally, the chronic stress of caring for someone can lead to high blood pressure, diabetes and a compromised immune system.

_________________________

Looking at information re: PTSD, I see many commonalities. Again, I can’t believe I missed this. Further, what I’ve read generally describes caring for elderly people—spouses or parents. My MM also works full-time and is raising kids. The disease that his wife has isn’t always terminal, but it is always debilitating (I’m sorry, but I can’t go into more detail about it). She was diagnosed about 10 years ago and has been “terminal” for four. That’s when the family moved back here (he’s not from here), so that she could be near her sister (who just isn’t very helpful, at all). He works full-time, takes care of his kids, and takes care of his wife. That’s more than most people caring for the elderly have to do.

 

MM has a reputation around here of being incredibly stoic. He also minimizes the effects of the situation on himself. For example, he’ll say that while it’s hard on him, it is so much worse for her. Which it is.

 

It sort of feels to me like since she’s been getting hospice care, he occasionally becomes irrational. Maybe it’s because hospice care = the reality of no hope. I don’t know, maybe there are other reasons.

 

I’ve come across a few sites that specifically talk about caregivers and affairs, but I haven’t had time to really get into that information yet. From what I’ve gathered thus far is that it’s not uncommon. Also, what you and a few others have said about the possibility of his not wanting to have anything to do with me after she dies echoes what I’ve read. I guess I need to try to prepare myself for this.

 

Wow. What an eye opener.

 

Gg, you have my undying gratitude for your kindness and your guidance.

Thanks,

Ellie

Edited August 14, 2011 by eleanor01

[jwi71]

OMG, gg. You nailed it. Despite the few nasty comments here, I am so glad I started this thread, because this information is more helpful to me than you could ever know. I can't believe I didn't put this together before. I have mentioned to him that I am worried about burnout, but I just didn't get it before now. I had figured out some of the pieces, but now my understanding is ever so much clearer.

 

Rereading my original post, I think that it's pretty obvious that I was thinking "WTF??????" gg, after reading your comments here I've done a little bit of research--I'd never heard of caregiver's syndrome (or its other names) before. I haven't delved into the scholarly literature about it yet, but what I've found by googling is blowing me away. Perhaps the most helpful site so far is squidoo. It doesn't present in-depth information, but it gives me a starting point. Here are a few particularly relevant passages:

 

__________________

Caregiver Syndrome has been defined as:

 

 

A debilitating condition brought on by unrelieved, constant caring for a person with a chronic illness or dementia.

 

Caregiver Stress Syndrome (CSS) is a proposed definition:

 

 

A syndrome found in caregivers involving pathological, morbid changes in physiological and psychological function. This syndrome can be the result of acute or chronic stress, directly as a result of caregiving activities.

How Caregiving Affects the Caregiver's Emotions

In his 2003 article on Caregiver stress syndrome, Australian Research Journalist, David M. Guia described the emotional health complaints experienced by caregivers. Citing that not only do caregivers experience physical symptoms, but emotional ones as well. These emotional symptoms are listed below.

 

 

 

Source: Guia DM. 2003. Caregiver stress syndrome. Letters to the Editor. Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients.

• Grief
  
• Anxiety
  
• Resentment
  
• Anger
  
• Fear
  
• Helplessness
  
• Despair
  
• Depression
  

Caregiving Can Damage the Health of the Caregiver

 

Chronic Caregiver's Stress May be Similar to Post Traumatic Stress Disorder

 

Caregiving can be very damaging on the health of the caregiver. According to a study published in 1999 in the Journal of the American Medical Association researchers Richard Schulz and Scott Beach from University of Pittsburgh reported that elderly caregivers are at a 63 percent higher risk of mortality than noncaregivers in the same age group.

 

They found that the physical symptoms of caregiver stress are a result of a prolonged and elevated level of stress hormones circulating in the body. Researchers likened exhausted caregivers' stress hormone levels to those suffering from post traumatic stress disorder.

 

Additionally, the chronic stress of caring for someone can lead to high blood pressure, diabetes and a compromised immune system.

_________________________

Looking at information re: PTSD, I see many commonalities. Again, I can’t believe I missed this. Further, what I’ve read generally describes caring for elderly people—spouses or parents. My MM also works full-time and is raising kids. The disease that his wife has isn’t always terminal, but it is always debilitating (I’m sorry, but I can’t go into more detail about it). She was diagnosed about 10 years ago and has been “terminal” for four. That’s when the family moved back here (he’s not from here), so that she could be near her sister (who just isn’t very helpful, at all). He works full-time, takes care of his kids, and takes care of his wife. That’s more than most people caring for the elderly have to do.

 

MM has a reputation around here of being incredibly stoic. He also minimizes the effects of the situation on himself. For example, he’ll say that while it’s hard on him, it is so much worse for her. Which it is.

 

It sort of feels to me like since she’s been getting hospice care, he occasionally becomes irrational. Maybe it’s because hospice care = the reality of no hope. I don’t know, maybe there are other reasons.

 

I’ve come across a few sites that specifically talk about caregivers and affairs, but I haven’t had time to really get into that information yet. From what I’ve gathered thus far is that it’s not uncommon. Also, what you and a few others have said about the possibility of his not wanting to have anything to do with me after she dies echoes what I’ve read. I guess I need to try to prepare myself for this.

 

Wow. What an eye opener.

 

Gg, you have my undying gratitude for your kindness and your guidance.

Thanks,

Ellie

 

 

Having read this thread its clear that you have zero intentions of stopping - in fact GG reply has, it seems, given you even more reason to become more involved.

 

And, presuming my assumptions above are correct, you will tell others.

 

What, at least from what I gather, you are failing to miss is the reputation you will earn: namely buzzard.

 

As many others have said, the ick factor here is off-the-charts.

 

You are going to go public with your affair for what reason? Normalcy?

 

An illusion. Maybe delusion.

 

Affairs are NOT normal relationships. Period.

Affairs where both parties are waiting for the spouse to die even less normal.

And finally, affairs where both parties are waiting for the spouse to die and go public are bizarro.

 

Let me ask you this....would you be going public IF the W was "normal" and healthy?

 

I will presume your answer is no.

 

Which leads me to conclude that the only reason you are going public is....she is terminally ill.

 

Please examine YOUR motives here.

Please consider how you are going to be seen.

IF he can't talk to a counselor in your area for fear of fallout why the hell are you openly flaunting your A? Why tell other couples when you can't tell a therapist? Not getting that one either.

 

Good luck, I think this is going to end very badly for you.

[eleanor01]

Hi, Everyone—

 

Thanks for your input. Many of you have taken some serious time and consideration in responding to me.

 

Does this couple also know his wife? If they do then that is putting them in an impossibly difficult situation and would be very disrespectful of their friendship.

I agree with this. And, if there's a chance that you could lose the friendship, have the dynamic change completely in a not so good way, don't do it.

 

Presumably this couple knows MM is married? If so, even if they don't really know the W, I'd go with your reasoning and conclude it is a bad idea. When people feel uncomfortable, it can affect friendships. If they are open minded, they might be accepting, maybe not. But even if they are now, how will they react when the W dies? It just seems awkward for people who know of the wife at all and are not firmly aligned on "your side". They may not really know how to mix the condolences along with what it might mean for you two as a couple. Something like that could make them fade away as friends.

 

If they don't know MM is married and won't know when/if the W dies, then you aren't likely to encounter problems for yourself, provided you keep things that way (them not knowing).

 

Frankly, I do not think that most people would be supportive of this. Particularly if this couple knows/is friends with his W. There is very little chance, if that were the case, that this would turn out well. If they are friends or even know his W then you are putting them in a difficult and completely unfair position.

 

Yes, this couple knows MM and his wife. It’s a small town. I’ve been trying to think about what I would feel if I were in their position. I think I would have a hard time digesting this at first, although I would probably be accepting, eventually. The four people we’ve told have all had similar reactions—“thank god he’s doing something to take care of himself.” I don’t know if his two friends are happy for me that I’ve finally fallen in love. My two friends say that they are. They haven’t expressed “ick,” but I have to assume that “ick” may be something that they are not saying.

 

As for putting our married friends in an unfair position: I completely agree with you. Please understand that his suggestion was a brand-new development when I posted originally about it. I hadn’t considered all the angles (probably still haven’t, but I’m trying). The responses here have been very helpful in that regard.

 

As to the "armchair psychologist" thing about why he wants to tell people, who knows. I doubt it is anything so complicated as that he thinks he's going to "lose" you overseas. Men don't tend to think that way. There is probably a much less complicated reason.

 

Yeah, you’re right. I was grasping at straws trying to understand.

 

As to motivation, does he feel a lot of guilt? If so, he might be trying to think of people who would "approve" in order to alleviate his guilt. The more people he can gather that "approve", the more okay his actions must be. Many affairs don't have any confidants and I'm surprised you already have four, given the circumstances. Perhaps he feels a lot guilt when looking at his W and his children.

 

If that is the reason, it doesn't sound good, because the death could really send him over the edge guilt-wise.

 

Yeah, I do think he feels lots of guilt. There’s the survivor’s guilt, guilt at so much. He loves his wife very much and is so sad.

 

1. It's heartbreaking that your MM has completely disengaged and detached from his wife. He's distanced himself as the "man and father" of the family unit and is secretly playing house with you to "live life" again. Sadly, this may come back and bite him in the ass one day. The guilt, wishing that he handled things differently.

 

Anyway, if he is this miserable with looking after his wife and he wants to "live" again, be out there and not have the responsibility he's faced with, then he needs to own it and change his life. HE can look into facilities his wife can move into to and be looked after 24/7. It'll cost him a pretty penny but atleast he'll be happy and living life with you, socializing with friends and feeling good.

 

2. Though I doubt he has the balls to do that, so I guess it's okay for him to do what he's doing..That is, until his kids find out, or his inlaws, or even his own parents. Even his wife, if she's lucid enough and has moments where she knows him. 3. Is she at that point where she doesn't know who he is?

 

4. Just remember how he's bailed on his wife during this time. He can't handle illnesses, let alone having it affect his own happiness. IF you end up with him, he could very well do the same thing to you. Imagine having a disease, cancer or a life long illness that needs care and at times, hospitialization and finding out he was sneaking off behind your back, cozying it up with another woman because he didn't want to deal with the bad and awful stuff life throws at him.

 

1. He has not disengaged from his wife. She is ever-present in his thoughts. He and I can only spend an hour or two together here and there. And then, a lot of the conversation relates to her.

2. He’s not a coward and he’s not hard-hearted. He’s kind and good and I believe that he’s doing the best that he can. People look at his situation and wonder how he manages.

3. No, not yet. She has good days and bad days.

4. I don’t consider the few hours he spends with me to be “bailing.”

 

There is absolutely NO valid reason to NOT see a therapist, I do not care if you live in a parish of 100 people.

 

It is against the law to divulge what is sad during a therapy session unless he threatens to harm himself or harm others.

 

If the therapist gossips one word, he/she will lose their license to practice.

 

I know it’s against the law. However, it would be stupid to see any of the (very few) therapists locally. Please, take my word on this one. I hope that he’ll be able to take the time to see somebody more distant after his wife dies.

 

Hi Ellie!

 

Just adding my 2 cents here....NO do not tell anyone else about your R....His wife is dying....YOU and HE will not look good in anyone's eyes....DO NOT tell the other couple.....

 

You look rather CLASSLESS!.....His w is dying...tell him to stand up and be a man and take care of her in whatever time she has left.. If it is meant to be with you and him, there will be enough time LATER to do so.....BUT not now!!!!

 

Don't mean to be harsh....but you need to hear the truth.....

 

Well, it is harsh and he is taking care of her. But, I take your point. I know I look classless and tawdry and icky. I know this. But please, I think that he deserves compassion.

 

 

I can only echo what the others have said. It is bound to make everyone uncomfortable and really what is with this guy? Did he love her while she was well? Its very difficult to nurse a spouse or any family member through a long term illness. Its isolating its lonely and its draining. But its also what you do for your loved ones. If hes not willing to step up at this vital time and cant wait to go out and socialize as a couple with you and their friends what does that say about him in your eyes?

 

He still loves her.

 

As for "why" he wants to tell everyone....so that you will also be 'guilty' when it comes out what is going on. He wants to make sure people don't think it was just him chasing you - that you were and are a willing participant in the affair.

 

I’ve thought about your post a lot, and I don’t think that’s it. I think that maybe he’s trying to create an alternative reality. But, it isn’t a reality—it’s a fantasy.

 

All that married couple needs to do is mention this to one person. I read that the MM's kids are teenagers. oh god.... I've got teenagers and they flip their lids over little stuff, I don't even want to imagine the drama that would ensue if they found out I took a lover when their dad was dying!

 

Excellent point.

 

Is it possible that the more people who condone this the less guilt he feels. Your MM is not thinking clearly. There is a reason why they teach widow/ers NOT to make any decisions before atleast the year anniversary of a spouses death. I've seen the craziness with my own father and MIL. One was expected the other was not, and their reactions were very much the same after the deaths. (no affairs or lovers, just the need to change things, escape the pain and loneliness.

 

The children deserve happiness as much as their father in this situation. They deserve to be protected from further hurts. Where is the adult who is protecting them while the father copes and the mother dies?

 

Another excellent point.

 

However, about the bolded: He’s doing his best. He goes to their school functions, keeps his temper when they do mean things, etc. He’s trying.

 

Thank you all for your consideration. Really. I have a lot to think about.

Ellie