FWB versus dating

[Ayla]

There have been a few threads around FWB recently...so I thought this might be interesting conversation starter.

 

In your opinion what is the difference between FWB and dating? What are the indicators of each?

 

Also would you ever consider a FWB situation with the sister/brother of one of your best friends? Why/why not?

[MrNate]

There have been a few threads around FWB recently...so I thought this might be interesting conversation starter.

 

In your opinion what is the difference between FWB and dating? Thinner than it looks. What are the indicators of each? I think they're pretty easy to tell apart.

Also would you ever consider a FWB situation with the sister/brother of one of your best friends? Why/why not? Nooooo.

 

 

Answers are in bold.

[Pierre]

Sometimes a woman dates a guy and she does not she is just a FWB.

[sm1tten]

I said this in the other thread, but I'll repeat it here. I don't get the difference between FWB and casual dating, EXCEPT perhaps that dating usually is meant to move forwards (committed romantic relationship). whereas an FWB usually goes backwards (friends) - but we all know there are occasions where the opposite occurs.

 

But let's say you date without pre-defined goals. Say you go on dates with people you like but you're not necessarily looking for marriage or long-term, just enjoying what you have at that moment. Where is the line between a person you respect and like, enjoy spending time with, and are sexually monogamous with? Is it that in a FWB you are (generally) free to look for other partners or people to date outside of it? Is it the "label" you stick on it?

 

And keep in mind, I'm not talking about a f*ck buddy or a booty call, which is just someone that you have sex with and have no other bond. Nor do I mean the ones where it's pretty clear that one person thinks they are dating and the other person doesn't - I mean two people who are on the same page.

[Ruby Slippers]

In your opinion what is the difference between FWB and dating?

I have an FWB with whom I am sexually exclusive, but I am realizing that term has become too loaded and doesn't quite fit. So I am starting to think of him as my LOVER. Men and women have had lovers all throughout the ages, and something tells me that lover sex can be even better than committed sex.

 

The difference is that we just hang out, mostly at my house, have fun, and have sex. If I were dating someone, it would be more public. We'd go on dates all over town, hang out with my friends, and so on. We'd be evaluating each other as long-term partners.

 

With my lover , I am not evaluating him as a long-term partner. Yes, I leave room for the heavens to part and lightning to strike euphoria into our hearts, but because of some limitations on his part, I'm not holding my breath for that whatsoever. I just accept and appreciate exactly what he brings to the table, and expect nothing more.

 

Also would you ever consider a FWB situation with the sister/brother of one of your best friends? Why/why not?

No. Too incestuous for me.

 

I don't get the difference between FWB and casual dating, EXCEPT perhaps that dating usually is meant to move forwards (committed romantic relationship). whereas an FWB usually goes backwards (friends) - but we all know there are occasions where the opposite occurs.

I don't see being friends as moving backwards. My lover lights a fire under me and inspires me to move forward in my life in many ways, and I believe I do the same for him. He is almost certainly not a long-term contender for me, but in a similar way, not every platonic friend I make will be a friend for life.

[Pierre]

I have an FWB with whom I am sexually exclusive, but I am realizing that term has become too loaded and doesn't quite fit. So I am starting to think of him as my LOVER. Men and women have had lovers all throughout the ages, and something tells me that lover sex can be even better than committed sex.

 

The difference is that we just hang out, mostly at my house, have fun, and have sex. If I were dating someone, it would be more public. We'd go on dates all over town, hang out with my friends, and so on. We'd be evaluating each other as long-term partners.

 

With my lover , I am not evaluating him as a long-term partner. Yes, I leave room for the heavens to part and lightning to strike euphoria into our hearts, but because of some limitations on his part, I'm not holding my breath for that whatsoever. I just accept and appreciate exactly what he brings to the table, and expect nothing more.

 

 

No. Too incestuous for me.

 

 

I don't see being friends as moving backwards. My lover lights a fire under me and inspires me to move forward in my life in many ways, and I believe I do the same for him. He is almost certainly not a long-term contender for me, but in a similar way, not every platonic friend I make will be a friend for life.

 

 

Ruby

 

I see you have upgraded your FWB to LOVER status.

 

Love is in the air!!!!!!!!!!!!:love::love:

[verhrzn]

I think perhaps commitment is the difference... Casual dating is agreed upon sexual exclusivity that may or may not be working towards a future together, whereas in a FWB you do not have any agreements on sexual exclusivity.

 

Honestly, I think casual dating is doing the exact same activities as an FWB, but with some stated interest in each other. FWB is more a free-for-all, where they probably don't have an interest in you beyond you getting them off.

 

At least, that's always been my experience.

[grkBoy]

Most of the time, people I've known who had FBs and FWBs didn't really do much with that person other than sex. So there wasn't any dinners out, movies, going clubbing, etc.

 

Generally they call one another late at night when drunk and horny, looking to hook up for sex.

 

So they didn't have a date to their friend's wedding, or a person they bring home to meet their parents, etc. It was just a warm body to call when they want sex.

[sm1tten]

I really liked your definition, Ruby Slippers.

 

Oh, and to be honest, I probably wouldn't even date someone who was related to one of my good friends. I briefly, hilariously, and disastrously dated my brother's best friend for like 2 seconds. He still hasn't forgiven me.

[2011aug]

Ruby

 

I see you have upgraded your FWB to LOVER status.

 

 

I wonder if he knows this yet? Is it a promotion or a demotion?

[Pierre]

I wonder if he knows this yet? Is it a promotion or a demotion?

 

 

I think it is a promotion. In many parts of the world the lover has status.

 

Furthermore, he is a lover to a single women and she is exclusive to him. Most lovers don't get exclusivity.

[Ruby Slippers]

I wonder if he knows this yet? Is it a promotion or a demotion?

To me, it's neither. I just think it's a more accurate label. And what started me thinking about this is the common perception that FWBs don't care about each other at all, and are just using each other's bodies. That's not the case here. There's nothing wham bam thank you sir/ma'am about it. He has never just dropped in for a quick shag, and I can't see either of us wanting just that. In addition to having sex, we talk, have fun, give each other advice and feedback. And all of this is more fun and enjoyable for both of us with touches of romantic flirtation.

 

He's coming over tomorrow for dinner plus, and I'm going to talk to him about this. I have already made clear that I'm not interested in him for a long-term relationship, given a couple of factors, and he says he understands and realizes that those factors will stand in the way of having the kind of relationship he wants period, and he's working on them. He told me he'll be involved with me to whatever extent I want, whether that is fun and sex, or more. I will let him know that what I want is for him to be my friend and lover, and for us both to have the freedom to seek something else if that is what we want.

Edited August 17, 2011 by Ruby Slippers

[zengirl]

You know, I wonder if a lover is the same as a FWB.

 

I think if you were a different sort, Ruby, you'd enter into a dead-end relationship with him (because you do like him, as you say; he's just not right for you). I think lovers are precisely that: someone you like but with whom there are circumstances --- in the past days, they were often external, but why can't they be internal too? --- that make marrying/winding up with them impossible.

 

After all, lovers, in olden times or movies, were always people with whom you just couldn't be married, for whatever reason.

[Pierre]

She is exclusive to her lover.

 

She claims sex with the lover is better than sex in a typical relationship.

 

She looks forward to the encounters.

 

She admits she is energized

 

She admits a permanent relationship is impossible due to some barriers. This is a bit like unrequited love. That is the most intense form of love.

 

 

Just a few observations.

[OliveOyl]

Ruby, so it sounds like what you have is:

 

Lover = Boyfriend - (minus) Future - (minus) Not looking around for others.

 

Does that sum it up?

[Ruby Slippers]

Ruby, so it sounds like what you have is:

 

Lover = Boyfriend - (minus) Future - (minus) Not looking around for others.

 

Does that sum it up?

I figure it a little differently:

 

fun + sex + a dash of romance + the freedom of being in this moment only = lover

 

He invited me on Facebook today, and even though I hesitated, I accepted. I think he is trying to wiggle his way in. I just have to be strong!

[Professor X]

He invited me on Facebook today, and even though I hesitated, I accepted.

 

And so it begins!

[Ruby Slippers]

And so it begins!

Oh god. What does it mean? I'm too old for this ****.

[Ruby Slippers]

Oh, upon review, I see that I missed some posts.

 

I think if you were a different sort, Ruby, you'd enter into a dead-end relationship with him (because you do like him, as you say; he's just not right for you). I think lovers are precisely that: someone you like but with whom there are circumstances --- in the past days, they were often external, but why can't they be internal too? --- that make marrying/winding up with them impossible.

 

After all, lovers, in olden times or movies, were always people with whom you just couldn't be married, for whatever reason.

You make some excellent points, zengirl.

 

And the reason I have been single for the past 3 years, I think, is that I feel as though every single guy I've attracted for a long-term relationship had issues that impeded long-term success. They were apparent from the start, but I chose to give these guys a chance, anyway. My thinking was that we all have flaws, and things can get better with greater understanding. But they always turned out to be too big.

 

So why do I keep doing this? And how can I not do it now and in the future?

 

Is this the best I am able to attract? Or did I think that was the best I could do? Or am I just picking unsuitable guys from among others who would be suitable? I am working pretty hard to solve this puzzle.

 

She claims sex with the lover is better than sex in a typical relationship.

No, I didn't say that. I said it could possibly be better, for all I know. So far, it has been better than some of the sex I've had in relationships, but nowhere near the best of it... yet. ha

 

She admits a permanent relationship is impossible due to some barriers. This is a bit like unrequited love. That is the most intense form of love.

You know why I think it's the most intense form of love?

 

Because you are not expecting or asking the other person to fit into some box you created in your mind (boyfriend does this, wife does that). You are as close to accepting a person as they truly are as you will ever be. And that's really what love is -- accepting a person exactly as they are and supporting their health and growth with your friendship, affection, and care.

 

I am and have always been looking for the purest form of love I can give and receive.

 

Maybe this is way off from that. But if it is, I think I'll figure that out pretty soon.

[Ayla]

It means that there is something more there...it is more personal. Very exciting Ruby!

 

On the thread...today in the car an American Sociologist/Anthropologist was a guest. Very interesting, she specialises in relationships (and how the brain reacts etc) she also did some market research with over 500 singles on Match.com.

 

She claims that the brain has 3 sectors when it comes to feelings and relationships:

1. Attractive/Not attractive, sexual attraction etc

2. Attachment

3. Love

 

Apparently the brain can be sexually attracted to a person and be attached to the...but not have the 'love' feeling. Obviously just sexual attraction is also possible. BUT these feelings can change, in the market research she had done: over 35% said that a FWB relationship did develop into love at some point. Obviously it didn't last because all the peopl interviewed were single.

 

She also said that it is possible to have all 3 feelings (attraction, attachment and love) but not act on them...try and hide them, for whatever reason (emotional unavailability, fear, in another relationship etc) However, just like you can not ignore it when your hungry or thirsty, you can not ignore it when you love someone.

 

I found this rather interesting.

 

IMO - FWB is just sex, good conversation, respect-but is kept behind closed doors. Not a public relationship/friendship. Dating is conversations, respect, sex (maybe), more private things shared, doing things together (with or without others) in public. Something that you are not wanting to hide from your social circle. Perhaps more of a statement that it might lead somewhere.

 

I think FWB with a friends brother/sister - would be wrong and carries a lot of risk, I guess just like a FWB situation amongst your social circle. Friends could be lost, people hurt etc. But dating/potential relationship...this might be ok, if the person is worth it, someone special.

[Professor X]

You know why I think it's the most intense form of love?

 

Because you are not expecting or asking the other person to fit into some box you created in your mind (boyfriend does this, wife does that). You are as close to accepting a person as they truly are as you will ever be. And that's really what love is -- accepting a person exactly as they are and supporting their health and growth with your friendship, affection, and care.

 

I am and have always been looking for the purest form of love I can give and receive.

 

Maybe this is way off from that. But if it is, I think I'll figure that out pretty soon.

 

I have to disagree with you on your explanation.

 

I think the reason it's the most intense form of love is because you share some emotional chemistry with said man; One that you are willing / not willing to admit (which is partly translated into accepting the person as is).

 

I do agree however that people have expectations of others, however it's not the fault of the title but rather the fault of said people (in other words, people who are trying to fix/change their SO).

[Professor X]

Oh god. What does it mean? I'm too old for this ****.

Oh it means it is most likely that you will end up together (despite your attempts to resist ), he does seem to fire you up in a beautiful way.

[Ayla]

Oh it means it is most likely that you will end up together (despite your attempts to resist ), he does seem to fire you up in a beautiful way.

 

I'll second that!!

[zengirl]

And the reason I have been single for the past 3 years, I think, is that I feel as though every single guy I've attracted for a long-term relationship had issues that impeded long-term success. They were apparent from the start, but I chose to give these guys a chance, anyway. My thinking was that we all have flaws, and things can get better with greater understanding. But they always turned out to be too big.

 

So why do I keep doing this? And how can I not do it now and in the future?

 

Is this the best I am able to attract? Or did I think that was the best I could do? Or am I just picking unsuitable guys from among others who would be suitable? I am working pretty hard to solve this puzzle.

 

Interesting. Obviously, every guy (except the current one) I've been with has not worked out as well. If they did, I wouldn't have ever been with anyone else. I like to figure each relationship is a lesson----and I did learn and grow and change from all of them----that is leading me to who I need to be. Is my current BF the one? Well, maybe, but I won't know till much later if he is. (But I certainly don't think anyone should go into a relationship if they don't see it having a chance for lasting success. I just don't think a "failure" is really a failure, if you learned something.)

 

It's good that you're trying to learn and seem open to whatever the lesson is. As long as you are, I feel certain things will fall into place for you.

 

You know why I think it's the most intense form of love?

 

Because you are not expecting or asking the other person to fit into some box you created in your mind (boyfriend does this, wife does that). You are as close to accepting a person as they truly are as you will ever be. And that's really what love is -- accepting a person exactly as they are and supporting their health and growth with your friendship, affection, and care.

 

Interesting. I would say I don't think creating a box in your mind is good, though it is inevitable. The best I can do is lose the box when I know the person. If we talk in hypotheticals, of course there is a box. I have to create a hypothetical. But where I think people go wrong is they try to treat a real three-dimensional flesh-and-blood person like a hypotheticals. Hypotheticals can help us create our boundaries, but it's all a lot of trial and error.

 

Anyway, I do agree and consider "love" to be truly accepting a person exactly as they are. Though you also decide who you love, IMO, which involves some judgment. It has to. Or we could go around loving abusers and the like. But the judgment comes first and when I let someone in, personally, they get all the way in. It is hard to balance judgment/boundaries/good sense with the depth of intimacy and total acceptance required of love. That's perhaps the hardest balancing act of life. (I certainly don't do it perfectly, and I'd imagine it hard to ever do so.)

[ThsAmericanLife]

FWB has replaced traditional 'courtship', apparently.

 

People want the safety and distance that traditional courtship provided while deciding if someone is suitable for commitment, but want the physical release and fleeting bond of affection that sex brings. Then they wonder why their FWB relationships almost always end up badly.

 

I'm not interested in it. I would never allow myself to trust someone or bring into my inner intimate circle a man who insisted on FWB with me. He's heaped his disrespect on me from the beginning. Why would I grow to love someone like that??

 

That is what it feels like to me. Disrespectful. And it takes my time away from things I could otherwise be doing... like finding someone who wants more than a FWB relationship.