Our experience with counciling..

[jmargel]

Most know my problem, if they don't just look in my other thread I started. We had our first counciling experience on Saturday. It went very well. It was almost a Godsend. She had us come in together and the first question she asked me was 'What did I want out of this'? That started the ball rolling. She was able to get some points across to my fiancee that I wasn't able to. She also got her to agree to what she can & can't do when she gets upset.

 

My fiancee explained that she sometimes says things that she doesnt mean, especially when she is upset. And that her controlling behavior lately is because she is afraid of losing me. I then told her, her controlling behavior is what will lose me. That she needs to show me the affection, love etc.. that has been lacking from her.

 

We are going once a week, then it will slowly become once every two weeks then once a month. She's going to also meet with us privately, but it won't be a 'bitch' session about the other person. That'll be counter-productive. It'll be about our own issues.

 

If anyone is considering counciling, please do so. Make sure you find a good councilor, one that has experience in marriage counciling, and one who is preferably certified. The points I was trying to make with my fiancee I was never getting across and we were both getting frustrated. What I would say would mean something different to her than what I was trying to get across, and vice-versa. I'll keep you all updated, but so far it went alot better than I thought.

[bluechocolate]

Hey J !!

 

congrat's mate

[jmargel]

Thanks man

 

I'm hoping to get her dad & his wife to go (not with us). Their marriage is just about over, but maybe this might help them too.

[HokeyReligions]

Thats great! I'm glad your experience so far with counseling is a positive one. You know, I'm an advocate of good counseling.

[sumdude]

Originally posted by jmargel

Thanks man

 

I'm hoping to get her dad & his wife to go (not with us). Their marriage is just about over, but maybe this might help them too.

 

Wow, that must be weighing heavily on her mind and heart. Especially when getting ready to tie the knot herself.

[Thinkalot]

Great news. I also support counselling, and have benefitted from it.

[jmargel]

Thanks.. It has helped in that she doesn't critize me anymore but something is still amiss. Affection wise, she never starts any with me. I am always the one giving the hugs & kisses. Last night she told me she was 'sad' but didn't know why. So she went out shopping and when she came back she didn't buy anything (unusual for her). She still had this sad look on her face. Lately when going to bed with me, she lays the opposite direction, curled up. She's always did this, but sometimes would curl upto me. She doesnt do that anymore.

 

This morning she was still very tired and had to ask for a hug, and when I went to kiss her, she didnt even put any effort into it. Before I left I asked her if she was still in love with me, and she said yes. Maybe she is just a little depressed and needs that medication, I dont know.

 

I wrote her an email this morning asking her not to distance herself from me. That I feel like sometimes I'm the reason why she is depressed because she doesnt show me any affection anymore. She is at least now telling me she loves me first however.

 

Two nights ago we were talking about the marriage and she asked if it's normal to have doubts. She then asked if I had doubts if she 'was the one'. I said I never have any doubts about that. She then admitted that maybe 1% of her thinks that. That hurt me alot, but maybe that is normal. I'm just thankful we are seeing the councilor on Saturday.

 

I guess I should've waited til Sat. with the councilor to mention about her recent lack of affection for me. I don't want to sound too critical. That other night she also told me she felt 'pressured'. Like she went out that night shopping but felt she had to be back at a certain time or I would get upset or call. I didn't and told her to trust me, that I wouldn't do that.

 

However I did make one mistake I guess, that she held in for a few days. Long story short, four years ago she had a baby that died during delivery due to heart problems. It was with another guy other than her ex-bf. They broke up for awhile, she met this guy, and then got back with her ex. At the sametime of getting back together she had sex w/ this guy one more time. It was this other guy's baby, but she never told him. Guess he was really mean to her. Anyway, while she was in a bad state, her ex made all the funeral plans. Actually had the baby buried in his family plot with his last name on the marker. I went last weekend with her to visit the grave, something she hasn't done in over a year. She feels like it's her fault and she is being punished for what she did. On the marker it said 'The son of Brandy and Ray'. Her mom went with her, still thinking it's her ex's baby. I supported her, but when we were alone I did say 'The marker is kind of misleading'. She got upset, in which she felt I wasn't supporting her. I just meant that the baby should have her last name. Not his. I apologized ten times over but I think she is still upset about that. Was it that bad that I said that? I just feel at times that I'm under this 'test' and she is analyzing every move I make. I love her so dearly and the last thing I want is for us to drift apart.

 

I just wish I had some ideas to help her get out of this rut.

[Debster]

Maybe due to counselling she has had to take a hard look at herself and her actions and maybe it even opened up old wounds. She could be resenting having to go through this and feeling like she needs to change and blaming you for making her have to deal with it.

 

I've heard that this is a reaction some people get when they go to counselling.

 

This could be the case or it could be what you are fearing. This just gives you another perspective.

[Thinkalot]

jmargel...many times it seems almost as though your fiance is not ready for marriage. She is going through all the adjustments that come with entering this new phase of committment, and seems to be struggling with it.

Sometimes counselling can make things worse for a time, as you confront things, and also confront the fact there's things you need to confront! That can be unsettling in itself. I remember my guy and I felt embarassed almost that we needed to see a couples counsellor....we kinda snuck into his office as though we were guilty of something! LOL!

 

Doubts...mmmmm sometimes doubts can surface between two who love each other. It's healthy to question and be sure...but too much doubt is a warning signal.

 

I have had doubts sometimes, and so has my guy...because we've weathered a few storms....but neither of us has ANY doubt now. We are 100% sure of our committment, and our hopes to marry one day and so on.

 

I hope counselling can help you two sort through your joint issues, and your individual problems, especially your fiances.

 

Good luck with it.

[jmargel]

It has, we had our session on Saturday. The hour we have sure goes by fast. Basically I wasn't giving her the chance to love me, since I was being the pursurer majority of the time. She was actually getting turned off by this since she was taking this as a sign of me being needy. When she kept her distance I pursued it further thinking something was wrong. The councilor told me to totally back off, and not even give her hugs at first. I didn't. I didn't realize how much affection I was trying to give her, until I made myself stop. Within' a day she has come around and actually giving me what I've been missing the past two weeks.

 

This morning she said she was coming downstairs again, but I told her I had to leave in 5 mins. 5 mins came and I had to go, so I said bye to her and got in my car. Two minutes later she was standing at my window wanting to give me a kiss & say she loves me.

 

When the councilor first told me about backing way off, before I could even ask she also mentioned that what you are going to be doing now isn't 'games'. That in every relationship giving way too much of yourself could actually have the opposite result of what you want. That a relationship should always have a desire to be with the other person even if you have to present a little challenge now & then.

 

She also talked alot to her about her not saying certain things to me when she's upset or angry. I consider some of the things she has her wanting to leave & the councilor agreed. That she should only say things when she truly means them, and for other things I can't take them to heart like I have been. I think she's going to be seeing us each other individually soon. I think having my fiancee hear things from an outsider has helped alot. Someone who can give an objective view without taking sides. Seems like she wasn't respecting anyone else's advice until we went to her.

 

I actually looked forward to going this Saturday, it's really like a stress reliever for me. It actually seems like what I say there, my fiancee really listens. I also hear things from her that are encouraging that I don't hear during the rest of the week, which I've been trying to make her aware of.

[jmargel]

I'm very upset and need advice. My fiancee's cell bill has been pretty high and verizon doesn't show the calls made or received, unless online. So, two weeks ago we signed up on the online account. I know her ex's phone numbers and they weren't on the last statement.

 

I checked it today to see what her balance was, because I was going to help her pay it off (since I do call her quite a bit) and found she tried calling him on 4/11 at 1:50am and then twice more on 4/20. Each lasted 1 minute so she probably left a message and he called back. On her cell phone, she took him off her contact list. Her phone is old, and it only shows 'frequent contacts' not a call log. With him off the list I can't tell by looking at her phone.

 

They don't show who called her, just her phone number for the incoming calls. I am SO pissed because back in early March we had that encounter with him & his goons and since then she told me she hasn't talked to him. Well, guess I should've asked if she TRIED calling him.

 

To me it's the same, she should've told me. Because when all that happened she told me she wasn't going to talk to him again. I won't see her until later tonight but right now my trust for her is going down the drain.

 

I need to bring this up in a way that she doesn't think i'm snooping and turn the whole thing around on me. I know this is going to get ugly too. Now i'm thinking this is part of the reason why I've been treated so bad the past few weeks. And here I thought things were going better with us. F**king lies.

[brashgal]

There is no graceful way to bring this up without her knowing you've been snooping. Trust is then damaged on both sides - yours and hers. If you can stand it, I think it might work out better to bring up the subject of her ex in your counselling session (I know it's a long time until Saturday!). I wouldn't say anything about the phone calls but I would bring up the subject of the March encounter and admit that her involvement with her ex makes you insecure - hopefully the counsellor can get to the bottom of her dependence on this guy.

[DerangedAngel]

To me it's the same, she should've told me. Because when all that happened she told me she wasn't going to talk to him again. I won't see her until later tonight but right now my trust for her is going down the drain.

 

It is the same. And yes, she should have. I'm sorry, j. She totally should have been up front about it with you.

 

I think it's quite likely she's going to flip everything around, and blame you for "snooping". Which honestly, I feel is a bunch of BS. But many people here might rag you for it.

 

I wish you the best, and I sincerely hope nothing is going on between them. It still sounds like (to me) she isn't over him, or she would have had absolutely nothing else to do with him after the 'club scene'. Good luck tonight.

 

-Deranged

[jmargel]

What I don't understand she was with me on 4/11. On a sunday night at 1:50am in the morning. We are sleeping then (at least I was). No other phone calls are made or received that late in the night that shows on her bill. And the cell she called showed 4:12pm and 4:13pm each 1 minute. Why would that be?

 

Our session is Thursday since she can't see us on Sat. If I don't say anything to her she'll know something is up by the way I'm acting. If I don't say what I'm thinking I get distanced and resentful.

 

At first I thought she took him off her cell phone because she was truly never going to talk to him again. Guess I should've known better.

 

If she is going to turn it around on me, then it's pretty much over. I was going to pay her bill online using my credit card, and to find this.

 

I just have a feeling something bad is going to happen tonight. I just can't let this in. I'm going to sit her down and tell her we need to talk. And then ask her if there is 'anything' she wants to tell me. If she says no, then I'm going to tell her the truth about this online thing. I went on with good intentions and should have nothing to be ashamed of.

[Debster]

You know my opinion on your relationship - so I won't even get into that.

Were these calls around the same time as she had to deal with the death of her baby? Maybe this had something to do with it?

 

AS for whether or not you should bring it up - of course you should. If something is bothering you about your relationship or her actions - you need to tell her. Explain it as you did here, that you were trying to pay her bill and you saw the number on the call list.

 

Stop waiting to deal with issues until you get to the counsellor. Surely you should be able to talk to your fiance about your issues and problems without always needing a third party to negotiate.

[jmargel]

No, the death of her baby's anniversary was last week. The calls she made were on 4/11 & 4/20. I was actually sick on 4/20 and it shows she called his cell around the time she would be on her way home from work.

 

This just feels like a stab in the back. I know she's going to give some excuse and say they aren't talking. I can't even believe her when she says that now. 1:50am! That has me upset. It doesn't show any other calls to him for at least another 10 days. Ugh, I guess it's a blessing I can't talk to her right now because I need to calm down some.

 

It's starting to make sense too. About 3 weeks ago we got into an arguement and she mentioned she's been 'thinking' about him. I was ready to leave her. Then at counciling she said she says these things out of anger. Yea right. Now i'm starting to doubt what she says in counciling.

 

This is getting sorted out tonight. Sorry for venting, i'm just very angry.

[Debster]

Oh, I thought that if it did coincide with the death of her baby that could be understandable. The fact that it doesn't is not a good sign I'm sorry to say. I'm glad to hear that you will sort things out tonight.

 

I do feel bad for you. I know that you had your heart set on making this relationship work. With your past relationship and her tendency to cheat I can understand how this causes you to doubt a lot of things and could be a dealbreaker.

 

However, try not to attack her. Calmly tell her that you were trying to pay her bill online. Then ask her if there is something she needs to tell you. If she comes clean right away - that is a good sign. There could be an explanation that might justify her actions. Please keep in mind that the counselling is causing her to really examine herself and it might be that something she realized from counselling was bugging her and she needed closure on that issue to help move forward with your relationship.

 

Give her the chance to tell you about it BEFORE getting mad. If she doesn't and tries to deny it - well I think you know what you need to do.

 

Keep me posted.

[DerangedAngel]

This is getting sorted out tonight. Sorry for venting, i'm just very angry.

 

What else is this place for?

 

I went on with good intentions and should have nothing to be ashamed of.

 

I agree. Good luck, again.

 

-Deranged

[jmargel]

Those calls were placed before we started counciling. She doesn't have a background of cheating and I don't think she has cheated on me.

 

I won't see her until about 7:00 and it's only 10:30. I know the day is going to drag until that time. I'm not trying to let my mind think the worst but what else can I expect. I can't marry someone I don't trust. What upset me even more, when she did used to call him about once a month awhile back, she always told me. She's hasn't now. That tells me alot right there. Maybe I'm jumping to conclusions but i'm already starting to think this past month has all been a lie.

[jmargel]

Update: She just called me at work and told her I needed to talk to her tonight. She wanted to know what it was, so I asked her that question. She said she had nothing to tell me. So then I told her what I mentioned on here.

 

She didn't deny it and said she would talk later about it. That she had to get back to her meeting. She didnt get mad at me, because she knew I was going to pay it before. I'm not now. I'm just so hurt. All she said when I asked her if she called him that late was 'You remember when I was mad at you?' but then didn't get into it. I didn't want to get into it either right now since i'm at work.

 

I can't trust her and it breaks my heart to even think that. Especially after saying 'no' to asking her if there was anything she needed to tell me. I don't even know what to do right now.

 

I really shouldn't have said anything on the phone, since she called just to say she 'loves' me. Why would she do this to me?

[FreeMe]

Just want to wish you luck talking to her about it.

 

Also wanted to mention something you had talked about (might have been in another thread) -that she had gone off her meds. I think that was a very foolish thing for her to do. Planning the wedding and going into counseling is not the most stable time to be going off meds. I also suffer from depression and I know what going off meds does to me. I can understand wanting to try to go off the meds, but she should have chosen a time when things are settled and stable, not when there are lots of things going on - including the anniversary of the death of her baby! If you stay together, I think you should ask her to go back on her meds. By the way, does the counselor know she went off meds recently?

[Debster]

As the calls were before counselling - they have nothing to do with closure due to issues brought up during counselling. She really should have brought the calls up with you - either by yourself or in counselling.

 

She doesn't have a background of cheating and I don't think she has cheated on me.

 

I thought that she cheated on her ex boyfriend with some other guy and got pregnant. She then tried to pass the baby off as her ex boyfriends. She ended up losing the baby. To me that is a background of cheating and lying.

 

Did I misunderstand? Am I confusing this with a different poster?

[FreeMe]

I hope that doesn't mean every time she's mad at you she thinks it's okay to call him!! That's just wrong - you'll be walking on eggshells like you were in your last relationship.

[jmargel]

With the cheating issue, she didn't want to get back together with him. Her parents were forcing her to and he was acting like they never broke up. She did have sex with that other guy & got pregnant right after her & her ex got back together. That was 5 years ago. But he did treat her bad, I seen it was I was just friends with her for a year.

 

I think she was more shocked than anything. On the phone I was not angry, but somber. I'm sure she'll be thinking quite a bit this afternoon about it. This will be brought up in counciling on Thursday.

 

As for the baby, plans had to be made that day that she delivered. She was all up on meds and couldn't make any decisions. He decided to tell everyone (since everyone really assumed it was his) that he is going to have him buried in his family plot. I believe that decision should have been left upto her to decide. When she was pregnant, he treated her very bad. Alot of arguing, etc.. She's told me she got so upset at times that she felt a miscarriage could happen. She didn't want to be with him or that other guy during that time.

 

And she wonders why i'm so damn insecure. She knew my past. She knew my ex was talking to my best friend for 6 months, and the last three months she was with me she wasn't in love with me. She knew I became suicidal after all that happened. She knew that I had zero trust in people for years. I've told her she is the first person I really ever trusted and this crap continues.

 

I honestly don't know if I can go on with her. I love her so much and she knows it. Even if you are mad at someone I would never call my ex. Part of me just wants to walk away right now for her to really see me leave. To feel how much she hurt me, and to feel not having me in her life. Finding this out just took me back like 20 steps. No excuses she can give will help this.

[jmargel]

No other advice, huh? I cancelled a consulting appointment because going to that I wouldn't be able to concentrate on it anyways. I need to get this sorted out.

 

How do you even trust someone when something like this happens? How can I trust what she says to me when I talk to her about it tonight?