Silly_Girl Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 ... then you (general you) head out and have an affair - which is based on lies, disrespect and no trust. It may not be possible for an affair to exist without lies, but that does not automatically mean there are lies within the extra-marital relationship. Link to post Share on other sites
Silly_Girl Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 But she obviously don't view you as a threat either since he hasn't left. You can be assured that the OW can be a most significant threat to the relationship whether the MM is still living in the marital home or not. And legally, the standard advice is to not abandon the family home in any case... Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 It may not be possible for an affair to exist without lies, but that does not automatically mean there are lies within the extra-marital relationship. Maybe your MM has never lied, or omitted truths from you but there are TONS of OW on here who have posted that their MM's turned out to lie to them and omit truths. Especially after a D-Day. Take Daisy's situation, do you truly believe this guy is 'completely' honest with her and not manipulating her, lying and omitting truths, bending things to suit him in the best possible light? Link to post Share on other sites
Silly_Girl Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 Maybe your MM has never lied, or omitted truths from you but there are TONS of OW on here who have posted that their MM's turned out to lie to them and omit truths. Especially after a D-Day. But your post doesn't render mine as wrong. I've seen posts from BSs who have said their spouse appears to have been fully honest with their OW and from OW who over time are satisfies they have not been lied to. I'm just saying it is not a prerequisite. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Jessica232 Posted August 31, 2011 Author Share Posted August 31, 2011 How can you be 110% sure? And of course not all of marriage is good. People have struggles, tension, stress, etc. Not sure if you have had other role modes, but I can say without a doubt, of my last 13+ years of marriage, we have had many things come up but instead of running away or cheating. I have also been divorced (not due to infidelity) and my son was 6 when we split. Yes, I said vows, but due to alcoholism and physical abuse, I decided to end the marriage - for me and for my son. Why in the world would I subject my son to that? As for respect, how can any child have respect for a cheater? How can any family members have respect for someone who cheats time and time again? I find it hard to believe any spouse would willingly continue to stay married to a habitual cheater. Then again, we don't know how the cheater reacts to a d day. We have seen on here so many times how the cheater begs and begs and says how he didn't love the OW, it was only about sex, she wouldn't leave him alone, etc. Rarely does a cheater own their actions, make amends and then cheats again. Someone who does that have no self respect, IMHO. I always find it 'interesting' how women won't forgive a cheater, but many times have no problems being a mistress I guess I can't wrap my head around that. You feel disrespected and lose trust from your spouse cheating, but then you (general you) head out and have an affair - which is based on lies, disrespect and no trust. You (general you) can't fathom forgiving someone for cheating, yet when involved with a MM, you willingly and 'happily' accept that he goes home to his wife and has sex (I know, I know -- he says he doesn't) and plans his future/vacation/holidays with her. I can't. Probably why I've never committed. Oh believe me, there are legitimate reasons to end a marriage immediately, and you've mentioned two of them. Good for you! I just feel like it's not my relationship, I'm not the betrayer, so I mostly have a clear conscience. There are times however, where I let him know I'm not happy with the deception he pulls with her. Definitely do NOT happily accept him going home to someone else. But yes, I without a doubt know there is no sex, no physical contact whatsoever. I do believe we are VERY unique though....I think there are many MM out there who lie and deceive. My MM is with me, physically or on the phone, all waking hours of the day. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Jessica232 Posted August 31, 2011 Author Share Posted August 31, 2011 So, basically, he isn't willing to leave his W for you. lolol it has NOTHING to do with his wife. Absolutely nothing. 100% kids, which I get. Say what you want, but every situation is unique, and even my therapist, who specializes in these situations, believes him. I'm beyond confident in his feelings, but I can understand others have been burned in similar situations, and that must suck. Link to post Share on other sites
donnamaybe Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 lolol it has NOTHING to do with his wife. Absolutely nothing. 100% kids, which I get. Say what you want, but every situation is unique, and even my therapist, who specializes in these situations, believes him. I'm beyond confident in his feelings, but I can understand others have been burned in similar situations, and that must suck. Yeah, I suppose that would suck. So you think two happy homes are better for kids than one miserable home with both parents. I agree and feel probably everyone in this thread would agree. I wonder why your MM doesn't. Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 Yeah, I suppose that would suck. So you think two happy homes are better for kids than one miserable home with both parents. I agree and feel probably everyone in this thread would agree. I wonder why your MM doesn't. Probably because men are in a unique situation where when they leave they are pretty well guaranteed that they lose a lot of what's left of their time with the kids and in case no one here realized it-a lot of women use kids to beat their exHs over the head with. My brother case in point. Worked all hours God sent so he could give the family everything. He kept weekends open so he could have that time with his daughters. They did everything together and sometimes his xW would be with them and sometimes it was her time away. The divorced, no infidelity, and he ended up having to work some weekends to support them all (including his bedsit) and I couldn't count the number of times she wouldn't rearrange weekends for him so he could see them. They've been apart almost 3 years now and the last time I saw him he was haunted. He said leaving the home was the biggest mistake of his life because his girls are gone. Of course he was talking about his relationship with them not that they left town. I see a lot of BS in here and in real life who don't leave a cheating spouse because they can't afford it. The reality is you can't always have the 2 happy home thing. Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 But your post doesn't render mine as wrong. I've seen posts from BSs who have said their spouse appears to have been fully honest with their OW and from OW who over time are satisfies they have not been lied to. I'm just saying it is not a prerequisite. We had multiple ddays and more than once she said to me that he seemed to be fully honest with me about things. If I'd have caught him in a lie to me it would have been over. Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 You can be assured that the OW can be a most significant threat to the relationship whether the MM is still living in the marital home or not. And legally, the standard advice is to not abandon the family home in any case... xMMs W told me that she would never leave him because she didn't want him with me. With their situation he was never going to leave so she was all set. Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 So she was better - for him. Not better period. Do you think it would have been easier to take if he had come to you and said he wasn't't happy in the R and ended it without the sneaking and lying? You're pretty well overstating the obvious but yes. He knew that cheating was a dealbreaker for me from day 1 and he found out I wasn't messing around. I would have preferred he worked with me on dealing with issues but we got out of control and he did what he did. I created some of the tension and issues and he cheated rather than stay within the M to resolve things. Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 How sad for all the people in these relationships. How sad that people don't want better for themselves or who are too scared to do anything. How sad that people accept such crappy treatment and disrespect. I will never understand not living life - I don't get why people just go through the emotions. Its not like we get a 'do over' after we are dead! Regarding what I bolded in the 2nd to last paragraph - I will never ever advocate 2 parents staying together and being miserable. It is ALWAYS better, IMHO, to show children 2 happy homes rather than 1 'nuclear' family full of tension, misery, hate, etc. No child should have to suffer because of the crappy decisions parents make. I knew without a doubt there was no way I was going to stay married to my son's father "just because'. Nope. Wanted to show him what a marriage was and what love was (love for a spouse). He thrived after we divorced and when I remarried, he and my now H have their own special relationship that is between them. I am very happy my son has such a great step dad and a wonderful role model in him and he gets to see what a happy marriage is totally Agree!! How sad for you While in your situation with your now xH, I understand that you don't believe a marriage can be reconciled. But in Owl and Spark and Seren's situation, I can totally see how their marriages were reconciled. Depends on personal belief's, what is 'non-negotiable' and truly if you can forgive. If you can't, then there isn't any reason to continue a marriage. If you can, and both people put the necessary work in, good for them. I definitely don't agree with people who cheat because marriage gets hard or tries to blame the spouse for their cheating. That's a pathetic excuse and doesn't show any respect or ownership for their actions. Why is this so sad for me? Link to post Share on other sites
donnamaybe Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 Probably because men are in a unique situation where when they leave they are pretty well guaranteed that they lose a lot of what's left of their time with the kids and in case no one here realized it-a lot of women use kids to beat their exHs over the head with. My brother case in point. Worked all hours God sent so he could give the family everything. He kept weekends open so he could have that time with his daughters. They did everything together and sometimes his xW would be with them and sometimes it was her time away. The divorced, no infidelity, and he ended up having to work some weekends to support them all (including his bedsit) and I couldn't count the number of times she wouldn't rearrange weekends for him so he could see them. They've been apart almost 3 years now and the last time I saw him he was haunted. He said leaving the home was the biggest mistake of his life because his girls are gone. Of course he was talking about his relationship with them not that they left town. I see a lot of BS in here and in real life who don't leave a cheating spouse because they can't afford it. The reality is you can't always have the 2 happy home thing. You mean all that time the particular MM in question currently spends with his kids? The way the OP tells it he spends zero time with them. After all, when they aren't at work together or sleeping they are on the phone together 24/7. Yeah. Dad of the year. NOT! Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 List the reasons YOU stay. Yes OP, why do you stay? Link to post Share on other sites
serial muse Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 lolol it has NOTHING to do with his wife. Absolutely nothing. 100% kids, which I get. Say what you want, but every situation is unique, and even my therapist, who specializes in these situations, believes him. I'm beyond confident in his feelings, but I can understand others have been burned in similar situations, and that must suck. Wait - your therapist has talked with your MM? You mean he came in for a session?? Link to post Share on other sites
Sweetgold Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 I think as BS as far as an EA goes, not an actual A that involved any sexual contact. No one wants to let go and each woman is hoping that that man will chose to stay with her instead of the other woman. If you are married you are hoping that you can get past this and your H wants to work it out. In the end every one wants to feel wanted especially if you have invested many years into a marriage Link to post Share on other sites
bentnotbroken Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 I think as BS as far as an EA goes, not an actual A that involved any sexual contact. No one wants to let go and each woman is hoping that that man will chose to stay with her instead of the other woman. If you are married you are hoping that you can get past this and your H wants to work it out. In the end every one wants to feel wanted especially if you have invested many years into a marriage An EA is an actual affair. Link to post Share on other sites
fooled once Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 lolol it has NOTHING to do with his wife. Absolutely nothing. 100% kids, which I get. Say what you want, but every situation is unique, and even my therapist, who specializes in these situations, believes him. I'm beyond confident in his feelings, but I can understand others have been burned in similar situations, and that must suck. So how can he really be spending so much time with his kids if he is spending 18 hours a day with you? How can you use 'the kids' as an excuse for leaving when you said when not at work, he is on the phone with you immediately thereafter and until bed time? So again, why does he stay? He may actually see his kids and spend time with them if he left. Why is this so sad for me? Just my opinion, but to me it is sad that you chose to not forgive your H, yet you then chose to participate in an affair. So you know how you hurt, and yet you chose to participate in hurting someone else like you were hurt. I know you don't believe the OW bears any responsibility nor blame, but that's just your view. You as an OW willingly help him deceive and lie to his wife, which makes you an accomplice. Just my view but you are culpable in the hurt and destruction of his wife. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 You mean all that time the particular MM in question currently spends with his kids? The way the OP tells it he spends zero time with them. After all, when they aren't at work together or sleeping they are on the phone together 24/7. Yeah. Dad of the year. NOT! No I mean the example I used. My brother. The example I know the details of. I could use a few others that are directly in my life too but I stuck with 1. Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 So how can he really be spending so much time with his kids if he is spending 18 hours a day with you? How can you use 'the kids' as an excuse for leaving when you said when not at work, he is on the phone with you immediately thereafter and until bed time? So again, why does he stay? He may actually see his kids and spend time with them if he left. Just my opinion, but to me it is sad that you chose to not forgive your H, yet you then chose to participate in an affair. So you know how you hurt, and yet you chose to participate in hurting someone else like you were hurt. I know you don't believe the OW bears any responsibility nor blame, but that's just your view. You as an OW willingly help him deceive and lie to his wife, which makes you an accomplice. Just my view but you are culpable in the hurt and destruction of his wife. I forgave my xH. It took a while but I did it. No matter whether or not I forgave him I knew I couldn't trust him. I know how much my xH hurt me. You can read the other posts I've put on this thread for my thoughts on the rest. In all honesty your view really is of no relevance to me. I disagree with it and I disagree with it based on my views from being a BS. If anything I wrote previously in this thread aren't clear (not meaning that you disagree with them) I'll gladly explain. Link to post Share on other sites
donnamaybe Posted August 31, 2011 Share Posted August 31, 2011 So how can he really be spending so much time with his kids if he is spending 18 hours a day with you? How can you use 'the kids' as an excuse for leaving when you said when not at work, he is on the phone with you immediately thereafter and until bed time? So again, why does he stay? He may actually see his kids and spend time with them if he left. Exactly my point. He doesn't want to leave is my take on it. Has nothing to do with time with his kids since, according to the OP, he spends zero time with them anyway. Link to post Share on other sites
fooled once Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 I forgave my xH. It took a while but I did it. No matter whether or not I forgave him I knew I couldn't trust him. I know how much my xH hurt me. You can read the other posts I've put on this thread for my thoughts on the rest. In all honesty your view really is of no relevance to me. I disagree with it and I disagree with it based on my views from being a BS. If anything I wrote previously in this thread aren't clear (not meaning that you disagree with them) I'll gladly explain. And in all honesty, your view is of no relevance to me Not sure why you take such offense with my opinion, but 'eh, to each their own. I just find it sad that you state you really loved him, he cheated (which I don't agree with) and you decided he was untrustworthy and you were done. It seems as if you belittle those that do reconcile. I applaud them for putting in the work and effort needed to work on their issues in their marriage. It is "easy" to cut and run. Find it interesting that you can't trust your H because he cheated, but you trust the MM you are cheating with as he cheats on his wife. Seems hypocritical to me, but then again, my views are of no relevance to you so all is good Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Since her view is of no relevance to you, why did you ask? Maybe because when I read it I was curious exactly why she was sad for me? She explained it and when I responded I told her that her view had no relevance to me. I thought it was pretty simple but maybe not. Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 And in all honesty, your view is of no relevance to me I didn't have any notion they were of any relevance to you. How sweetly condescending you were in feeling sad for me though. Not sure why you take such offense with my opinion, but 'eh, to each their own. I just find it sad that you state you really loved him, he cheated (which I don't agree with) and you decided he was untrustworthy and you were done. It seems as if you belittle those that do reconcile. I applaud them for putting in the work and effort needed to work on their issues in their marriage. It is "easy" to cut and run. I haven't taken any offense to your opinion at all. It has no relevance to me or my life. You obviously haven't read my posts as I suggested (so I wouldn't bore everyone writing it yet again) so here it is. My xH cheated on me. Period. My xMM cheated on his W. Period. I don't agree with either of them doing it but they did. I do not remotely belittle people who have reconciled. Previous posts will attest to that. I couldn't do it and I don't understand it. I don't get the mindset that could ever allow anyone to trust someone that has so viciously violated their trust. That's my view but I accept not everyone believes the same. Am I skeptical about their spouses-you betcha. Having said that I don't live their lives with them so as long as they trust and are happy and are rebuilding then I'm very happy for them. As fas as trusting my xMM. With my life. He never lied to me and he knew full well that if he did it was done. It was finally done when I eventually wanted more and said goodbye. That simple. What he did in his R with his W was his business. She and I spoke at every dday and I told her everything she wanted to know and I walked away gracefully letting them get on with it. I know my situation is of no relevance to you but I'm sure if I hadn't written a little explanation I'd have been called on it. So that's it in a nutshell. Find it interesting that you can't trust your H because he cheated, but you trust the MM you are cheating with as he cheats on his wife. Seems hypocritical to me, but then again, my views are of no relevance to you so all is good You said it yourself-my xH cheated on me. His betrayal was to me. My xMM cheated on his W. His betrayal was to her. It really is that simple. Your views are of no relevance to me but I do respond to anything that is directly a question even if it is disguised as a snide remark. My responses are in bold. Link to post Share on other sites
Summer Breeze Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Exactly my point. He doesn't want to leave is my take on it. Has nothing to do with time with his kids since, according to the OP, he spends zero time with them anyway. Then your point should have been made in a different way rather than at my comments about a situation that involved no infidelity but was meant as an explanation of why men tend to think twice about leaving their kids. Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts