Better if they love you more than you love them..

[rafallus]

Yes, the one who loves less, has upper hand and more control.

 

Yet, if you have to worry about who has the upper hand, you probably shouldn't be in that relationship.

[Woggle]

Replace all those masculine words with feminine ones and we get the same feeling...the feeling of being used.

 

But there are many men who truly do love a woman and are not using her.

[TigerCub]

Tigercub, how does one quantify love to the degree that you can compare it like bread boxes?

 

Exactly!! I don't know how to quantify love and I just find that whole saying confusing and something about it bugs me.

 

Very good point!

[TigerCub]

Now that I'm married, I think it's nonsensical. Yes, of course I needed to find a guy who actually loved me, but that didn't mean his love had to outweigh my love for him. In fact, I think it would be sad and really unfulfilling to experience a discernable imbalance in our feelings. I like how Mme. Chaucer says there is ebb and flow over the course of a long relationship, but the overall arc I think should be one of equitable levels of devotion and affection. I would feel really horrible if I knew my husband was willing to throw himself in front of a truck for me but I wasn't willing to do the same for him.

 

Thanks Sunshinegirl.

I personally feel the same. That's why that saying bothers me.

First how can we quantify love?

Second, why would anyone want to be with someone when they know that they themselves don't love that person the way their SO loves them?

 

Also, people show love in their own way.

 

I don't know, the way I see it is that as long as the 2 people love and respect each other, are willing to make some compromises to make the other happy, are willing to take the time and really be with their partner, then what else needs to be there? It sounds like a happy loving relationship to me.

So that means, no need to sit there and ponder on who loves who more.

[TigerCub]

It is only better if you seek to have the upper hand in ending the marriage. If you seek happiness in the marriage, waking up next to someone that you love with all of your heart is the way to go.

 

 

Since being married to someone that you love very much is better and more enjoyable for you than being married to someone that you love only love a little, the one being short changed is the one that loves the least. Again, if happiness is your goal, try to love your spouse as much as possible. It feels great.

 

Yes, the one who loves less, has upper hand and more control.

 

Yet, if you have to worry about who has the upper hand, you probably shouldn't be in that relationship.

 

You're both very correct.

While having the upper hand might be good in some cases, overall in the R, that shouldn't be the main concern, rather, the R should be enjoyed, the love cherished, and not be bogged down with silly questions of who loves who more.

 

I completely agree.

 

Thanks guys

[TigerCub]

I just wanted to say thanks to everyone for sharing their insight, and their opinions/experiences.

 

I really appreciate it

[SillyS]

In my last relationship this concept created this phobia within me, the idea that I would invest so much love and energy to someone that would not give me nearly as much in return. And that's exactly what happened, I was scared of it and then he ended up leaving me with rather strange justifications at that.

 

I led this question or concept hinder me, and I learned although our relationship is over now, that I have no right to really examine how deeply another loves me or I them in comparative standards. I don't know how he felt when he looked at me or how he felt every time he hugged me or looked deeply into my eyes. I know every time I now feel bad for myself for being dumped by him, I try to sometimes suggest that he didn't love me nearly as much as I did him, but it's pointless to think of that.

 

That's what we spent our lives searching for anyway, someone that will balance and match our love for them and that when we find that, we are fairly lucky people to have found someone that will put in the energy, work, and patience to love us for the people we are and could be.

[carhill]

What do you guys think?

 

The person who cares (loves) the least has the most power and control. People wield that dynamic in individual ways. At one extreme the person could greatly value and appreciate the overarching love of their partner and guard and protect it with great care, even if not 'feeling' the same way. OTOH, at the other extreme, the person could take great advantage of and 'use' the other person's love 'disparity' to achieve their goals/desires/needs without regard to the value of the other person. This, to me, is why an in-depth analysis of a person's family and relationship history is paramount. What kind of a person are they? Are they a 'giver' or a 'taker'? Are they a philanthropist or an opportunist?

 

Personally, I've only very rarely in life met someone who cared more for me than I for them and only exceedingly rarely has that been a woman. My response is to nurture that relationship as I know it is exceedingly rare. Perhaps others, having a different experience, belly-up to the gluttony table and think the world revolves around them. It takes all kinds. I'm a lot more watchful now.

[threebyfate]

Some of those actions evidence love.

They're actions expressing love but they're not the essence of love itself. Consider the five languages of love:

1. Words of affirmation.
   
2. Quality time.
   
3. Receiving gifts.
   
4. Acts of service.
   
5. Physical touch.
   

If one person "speaks of love" in physical touch and the other "speaks of love" in quality time, if you're the physical touch person, how would you view how much the other person loves you? Most likely, you would believe they don't love you since they're not "speaking" to you in a language you understand.

[xxoo]

They're actions expressing love but they're not the essence of love itself. Consider the five languages of love:

1. Words of affirmation.
   
2. Quality time.
   
3. Receiving gifts.
   
4. Acts of service.
   
5. Physical touch.
   

If one person "speaks of love" in physical touch and the other "speaks of love" in quality time, if you're the physical touch person, how would you view how much the other person loves you? Most likely, you would believe they don't love you since they're not "speaking" to you in a language you understand.

 

Not necessarily. We can learn to translate our partner's "language", even if it is different from our own.

 

But my point is that relatively more "love expression" (whatever the language) often means relatively more love.

[TigerCub]

I remember reading something like all relationships are just this...

One is the Lover, the other is the Beloved...

It can change but balance is not something I've ever experienced...

& I've been on both sides...

Maybe it's biological, but the most powerful feelings i've experienced is being the lover...

unfortunately, loving someone too much leaves one open to all kinds of disappointment, (and I think it creates an unnecessary burden on the beloved)

I will certainly avoid it in the future...

 

I think what you wrote is very interesting.

I know that in unhealthy relationships I've been in, the balance was off - but those Rs didn't work out probably because of that reason.

 

I'm certainly not questioning your experiences, but I'm finding that in a mature and healthy R, there is somewhat of a balance - we both do nice things for each other, we both want to be together, we both compromise on a few things to make the other happy - so to me, I would say that we're both putting in the same amount of effort, and the way I see it - that proves that we both care about each other and the R - or else why would we do all these things?

 

I'm really not saying that your Rs weren't healthy or mature, I'm just saying that for me, in the one that is, I just can't see a way to measure who loves who more - and I honestly don't really care - everything seems to be working out - so why the question (with regards to who loves who more).

Its just the saying that I question, don't really understand and don't like so much

 

I definitely see what you mean about the lover feeling disappointed over time - of course they would, they're not getting the same level of adoration and devotion that they're putting out.

 

Thanks Cheer

[denise_xo]

the most powerful feelings i've experienced is being the lover...

 

Agree with this. If I had to choose one, that's what I'd go for.

[stillafool]

I remember my grandmother saying it is best if the man loves more because then he less likely to cheat on the woman. I guess back then women didn't cheat as much as they do today and she felt that the woman's love would grow to equal the man's love and all would be happy. I too feel it sounds like the woman would be using the man.

[tigressA]

I have heard this a lot. Most of my relationships have consisted of me being the lover and the other the beloved. Didn't work out too well--though I do agree that was when my feelings were most intense. Caused me the most pain too.

[xxoo]

I have noticed that, instead of power struggles, my H and I sometimes "fight" to be the one to GIVE the most. This can be apparent in small things, or in big things.

 

Small things--but significant when they add up--we argue about who will do certain chores. But the argument is, "Have a seat, I'll do that." "No, I've got it. You sit." and around and around. Just yesterday he "fussed" at me for cleaning up a mess before I went to work, because he would do that after I went to work (and he would....), but I didn't want him to have to do it. We regularly have these "battles" over dishes and laundry.

 

It is the same with bigger things. When our babies were born, and sex was difficult, I was the one in the role of saying "come on, lets try again, let's work really hard to get these kids to bed so that we can be alone", and he was always saying "no pressure, let's wait until you want it, why don't you get some sleep?"

 

Ideally, the loving feelings and actions pay forward. They will inspire loving feelings and actions from your partner, and it is a beautiful thing.

 

When there is an imbalance, someone's loving feelings and actions are taken for granted--used and abused. And that is ugly

[Woggle]

Proof of some of my views is how women file for 75% of divorces and seem to be much happier after a divorce while men are left devestated. If they really loved the man as much as men love women this would not be the case.

 

Here is an example. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2036720/Why-DO-men-suffer-divorce-Women-better-beating-marriage-break-blues.html

[Woggle]

Here, Woggle. I'll give you back a little of your own.

 

That's because it's the MEN who are the worst behaved in a M, so the women have to get the hell AWAY from them!

 

 

Women cheat just as much as men and 60% of divorces are initiated in low conflict marriages.

[Woggle]

Time to put you back in my own personal timeout I guess.

 

Otherwise, you just bring me down, man.

 

You are one of the good ones but if you look at what I post with an unbiased mind you will have to see that statistically what I say is true.

[Severely Unamused]

I don't see love as a competition or a power struggle.

 

So I don't know if it is "better".

[TigerCub]

I have heard this a lot. Most of my relationships have consisted of me being the lover and the other the beloved. Didn't work out too well--though I do agree that was when my feelings were most intense. Caused me the most pain too.

 

Thanks Tigress,

 

I've been in that position before - who hasn't?

but looking back on it now, I see that those relationships, weren't healthy to begin with (for me at least), and not because I loved someone so much, but because it was clear that there was an imbalance.

[TigerCub]

Personally, I think the saying is misguided, probably said by someone hurt by another and afraid of being hurt again.

 

A healthy relationship is a partnership, not a power struggle. Those that feel like they have to keep score are basically asking for failure. A relationship is about supporting each other, not keeping count of who's one-up.

 

To answer your question, sometimes I am overwhelmed by how much my H loves me, but I don't feel like he loves me more than I love him. It just makes me want to show him how much I love him in return.

 

I completely agree Jthorne.

and I get the same way (as described in your last paragraph) with my boyfriend, and its true, I just want to be as good to him, its not that I feel he loves me more, but the way he treats me, makes me want to give him the world.

 

I just find that saying (that got this thread started) so selfish - I just don't like it, and personally I don't think it applies to healthy relationships, but that's just my opinion.

[TigerCub]

I don't see love as a competition or a power struggle.

 

So I don't know if it is "better".

 

Amen to that!

[StoneCold]

Well...it "puts the ball in your court" ... I dont see a saying like that as an argument for manipulation (though it often ends up that way)...more of armour for defense...well thats the origin of the argument at least more often than not...

 

Idealistically you want to be able to say...we love eachother the "same" ....but how is this measured? how is that substantiated? See its not measurable or definitively substantiable...its merely a point of view which means it is very debateable. As a result hard its to conceive for many that a perfect balance can be achieved....so they defer to what they know and can understand...which is a degree (and degrees vary folks) of unbalance and if that has to be the case...may as well have the scales tip to your favour.

[xxoo]

Well...it "puts the ball in your court" ... I dont see a saying like that as an argument for manipulation (though it often ends up that way)...more of armour for defense...well thats the origin of the argument at least more often than not...

 

Idealistically you want to be able to say...we love eachother the "same" ....but how is this measured? how is that substantiated? See its not measurable or definitively substantiable...its merely a point of view which means it is very debateable. As a result hard its to conceive for many that a perfect balance can be achieved....so they defer to what they know and can understand...which is a degree (and degrees vary folks) of unbalance and if that has to be the case...may as well have the scales tip to your favour.

 

If both people are striving to love each other the most (love in the verb form), the effect can be a growth of love overall. More willingness to give, more good feelings, more happiness. There may be degrees, but they will all be moving in the generally upward direction, and both benefit from more love.

 

If one, or both, are overly concerned with loving more, and holding back, the effect can be overall movement in the opposite direction--less willingness to give, fewer good feelings, less happiness. Lose/lose.

[TigerCub]

....but how is this measured? how is that substantiated? See its not measurable or definitively substantiable...its merely a point of view which means it is very debateable. As a result hard its to conceive for many that a perfect balance can be achieved....so they defer to what they know and can understand...which is a degree (and degrees vary folks) of unbalance and if that has to be the case...may as well have the scales tip to your favour.

 

I agree that its not quantifiable.

I also agree that it can be what you want to see and interpret (the degrees vary).

 

I know a woman that told me that her husband is the one that loves her more than she loves him. But she also told me how that same husband is the one that told her "if you don't show up tomorrow (their wedding day), I'll kill you"

 

hmmm, really makes you think?

Maybe he loves her too much?? To the point where he's crazy? I dunno, but that supports my theory that the loving more than the other stuff is in unhealthy Rs

 

I guess people just see what they want to see sometimes and if it gives them a sense of power or "armor" to think that they have the upper hand in the R because they love less - then so be it.

 

Its because of delusional people and selfish people, coupled with the fact that love isn't quantifiable that I just don't like that saying.

 

ETA: bout time you got a pic - I approve