how can I win her back?

[c0nfuzd]

I have been such a pr*ck to her all these years, and look at where it got me

 

I just want to give her everything so that she knows what a good man she had; he had his faults but had a good heart in the end

 

and I honestly believe that even though we will separate, even divorce, down the road she will realize that I am truly sorry for what I have done and always loved her and will continue to love her

 

if I fight anything now, it will just further reaffirm what she has thought all these years...that I am an a*hole

 

when she married me, I was a good guy...I just lost myself over the years and I believe I have found myself again; she just thinks it's fake but with time she will see I am for real....even if we are divorced

[c0nfuzd]

Figure out WHY you're being pushed out. Concentrate on what SHE is feeling and thinking. Make that your #1 focus - every chance you get, think of ways to get conversations going, ask questions, ask OTHER people what she's told them. If you can't figure out why she's pushing you out, you have no way to fix that part.

 

this part I've got figured out; she claims that in 15 years I only attended 10-20 family events; whenever it was time to go to one, I chose to stay home and get high; I'd like to think that the number of times I attended was higher but my recollection of events is obviously not what it should be, what with all the drugs I did

 

so she doesn't want me around family events now; says that overnight I've decided to attend every single one of them; unfortunately her view of family time involves her family with our kids every weekend; that is why she is pushing me out; she thinks I am simply bored at home and because I have no friends or drugs, want to be part of the family now; she is partially right, I will give her that; but, I also see and feel things differently now...I want to belong, I don't know how to explain that to her any other way

 

she has a problem with all the changes I made seemingly overnight; to her, it's fake; when I tell her to give us time to show that I am real, she doesn't want to...I just can't win

[ShatteredReality]

If she files and you give her sole custody you stand to lose your children in addition to your wife. Listen...if you have truly made these changes then you need to document the crap out of each thing you do for those kids. If you want to prove it's not about $ or anything give her 51%. Then she still gets the tax credit. This thread is documentation of your attempts at home to be a better husband and a better father. You have chronicled your changes as well as your vehemence to maintain them.

 

Also, at some point you have to make a decision...yes, you want your marriage to survive, but when do you stop working on the marriage and just concentrate on your own welfare? If you hold on to it forever while it's dead you will neglect yourself in the process and become sick in your heart...that ache will take much longer to go away if you don't start the healing process eventually. I honestly believe if I hadn't turned around and given my husband hope within the first two months he would have walked away...you cannot hold on forever to something that is no longer yours.

 

I am the last person to tell you to give up - but I am telling you to analyze truly whether or not you should.

 

Don't take an emotional outburst to heart, either...what she said in anger may dissipate as she calms down. If it doesn't then you kinda don't stand a chance.

 

I'd love to grab Turnera and the two of us sit you down for coffee and a good factual discussion - she's doing wonders in advising you...but since we can't do that you have to do it yourself. You have to sit and write it down...pros/cons or facts/wishes or whatever your lists need to read - do it. Make it up and find a way to decide what you're going to do...rent out the basement as her roommate but not her husband? If that's the case you need a separate life from hers. You need to establish who gets what time with the kids and you need to make plans to take them to YOUR family functions...if that's not possible then things you do with them without her.

 

Moving out? Fine...establish a schedule on when the kids will stay with you...maybe do this before the divorce even happens and any paperwork gets started. Then document the heck out of it so you can show a judge what she's willing to give you when there's no bottom line attached. Keep a calendar and mark every moment you spend with those kids. You can do that now too.

 

What you owe her and what you owe them are two completely different bills, my friend. You owe them a fight for the right to be a part of their lives and not have that taken away based on her emotional state of mind. You owe her respect and good treatment...if you're giving her that then the rest is on her - she needs to own her actions the way you have yours.

[c0nfuzd]

If she files and you give her sole custody you stand to lose your children in addition to your wife. Listen...if you have truly made these changes then you need to document the crap out of each thing you do for those kids. If you want to prove it's not about $ or anything give her 51%. Then she still gets the tax credit. This thread is documentation of your attempts at home to be a better husband and a better father. You have chronicled your changes as well as your vehemence to maintain them.

 

Also, at some point you have to make a decision...yes, you want your marriage to survive, but when do you stop working on the marriage and just concentrate on your own welfare? If you hold on to it forever while it's dead you will neglect yourself in the process and become sick in your heart...that ache will take much longer to go away if you don't start the healing process eventually. I honestly believe if I hadn't turned around and given my husband hope within the first two months he would have walked away...you cannot hold on forever to something that is no longer yours.

 

I am the last person to tell you to give up - but I am telling you to analyze truly whether or not you should.

 

Don't take an emotional outburst to heart, either...what she said in anger may dissipate as she calms down. If it doesn't then you kinda don't stand a chance.

 

I'd love to grab Turnera and the two of us sit you down for coffee and a good factual discussion - she's doing wonders in advising you...but since we can't do that you have to do it yourself. You have to sit and write it down...pros/cons or facts/wishes or whatever your lists need to read - do it. Make it up and find a way to decide what you're going to do...rent out the basement as her roommate but not her husband? If that's the case you need a separate life from hers. You need to establish who gets what time with the kids and you need to make plans to take them to YOUR family functions...if that's not possible then things you do with them without her.

 

Moving out? Fine...establish a schedule on when the kids will stay with you...maybe do this before the divorce even happens and any paperwork gets started. Then document the heck out of it so you can show a judge what she's willing to give you when there's no bottom line attached. Keep a calendar and mark every moment you spend with those kids. You can do that now too.

 

What you owe her and what you owe them are two completely different bills, my friend. You owe them a fight for the right to be a part of their lives and not have that taken away based on her emotional state of mind. You owe her respect and good treatment...if you're giving her that then the rest is on her - she needs to own her actions the way you have yours.

 

it would be hyprocritical of me to ask for custody of the kids; I didn't want kids to begin with; she reminded me that I told her she could still get an abortion so many weeks into the pregnancy; I cannot turn this around at this point; I would never use this thread as evidence before a judge; she doesn't even want this to go thru the courts; she wants a no-fault divorce so that it's the cheapest possible outcome (I have no money anyways to go to court); besides, if I stay in the same suburb, I can have full visitation rights, which would probably mean I would see them everyday; I don't see her changing her work schedule if I stay close to her; but if I move to the BIG city, that creates problems for her...and I am aware of that

 

give up? I could never give up on my marriage; I married her for better or for worse, till death do us part; she will have to break that, not me; I know I know, I live in a dream but that is how I feel...call me stupid but I will not give up till she serves me

 

I wish I could explain to you in minute details what I have done to her all these years, and then you would understand my desire to fix everything now and forever; even if I separate, I want to help her as much as I can; I don't want to be mean to her ever again; I want her to see that the man I was, was due to the addiction to drugs I had; it was not the real me; and even if she doesn't care to see the new me, I will persist in demonstrating her the changes I have made for the rest of my life; she was an exceptional woman in putting up with my crap for 8 years; how can I bow out after 6 months? it would be an honour to be around for 8 more years, even if it means sleeping in the basement and being around the 3 of them

 

I know why I married this woman, because I love her with all my heart; until she kicks me out, I will not give up

[c0nfuzd]

even when she kicks me out, I will still do my best to help her and the kids any way I can

 

I've read stories of couples reuniting years later; if I am consistent in my approach, and she has no other man in her life, I don't see a reason why it could never work again

 

I charmed her once, I can charm her again me thinks

[ShatteredReality]

it would be hyprocritical of me to ask for custody of the kids; I didn't want kids to begin with;

 

I will read the rest in a sec...but about this one part...I have to have a knee jerk reaction. Bear with me. I am going to admit something awful to you right now - I sobbed like a baby both times I found out I was pregnant. I never wanted kids, much less two. I sobbed for the life I wasn't going to have...sobbed out of pure selfish pain for what I thought I was giving up.

 

I have a huge weight of guilt over that fact, but it remains...who I was before each child was actually a different woman than after. When my older son was born I did the healthy diet and everything...but considered other options...thought about whether or not my husband would leave me if he found out I got an abortion - and I am not a fan of abortion. I was awful...I was emotional and selfish. My H tells me that I entered that hospital in labor as one person and came out another. Even during labor - that baby wasn't mine. But the second they put him on my tummy right after...the moment I touched him and held him...he was. He was more important to me than my own life. My second child - well I gave up a career path I was just entering during that pregnancy. I wasn't marketable as a pregnant woman, and after having him I'd let too much time go by without working in that field - nearly a year - so I was again not marketable. Ask me if I care about any of that now? My kids are 8 and 10 years old. Ask me if I resent giving up a career, or giving up my "freedom" for the children I never planned to have? You won't bother to ask me because the answer is evident. My children are more important to me than drinking water for hydration or eating food for nourishment. I won't have any more - I am done having kids - but the ones that I have are everything to me.

 

If H and I ever separated they would forever be MY children - I would become mama bear and protect them the best way I knew how. He would be granted 49% custody to ensure I still had "mama bear" rights...and he knows better than to ask for more. However, he also knows I'm not cruel enough to take them from him entirely.

 

Bottom line - it doesn't matter what you wanted before they happened...it doesn't really even matter what you wanted while you were on drugs...You have turned your life around and you're a true father to them now. No one has a right to take that away from you.

[ShatteredReality]

it would be hyprocritical of me to ask for custody of the kids; I didn't want kids to begin with; she reminded me that I told her she could still get an abortion so many weeks into the pregnancy; I cannot turn this around at this point; I would never use this thread as evidence before a judge; she doesn't even want this to go thru the courts; she wants a no-fault divorce so that it's the cheapest possible outcome (I have no money anyways to go to court); besides, if I stay in the same suburb, I can have full visitation rights, which would probably mean I would see them everyday; I don't see her changing her work schedule if I stay close to her; but if I move to the BIG city, that creates problems for her...and I am aware of that

 

give up? I could never give up on my marriage; I married her for better or for worse, till death do us part; she will have to break that, not me; I know I know, I live in a dream but that is how I feel...call me stupid but I will not give up till she serves me

 

I wish I could explain to you in minute details what I have done to her all these years, and then you would understand my desire to fix everything now and forever; even if I separate, I want to help her as much as I can; I don't want to be mean to her ever again; I want her to see that the man I was, was due to the addiction to drugs I had; it was not the real me; and even if she doesn't care to see the new me, I will persist in demonstrating her the changes I have made for the rest of my life; she was an exceptional woman in putting up with my crap for 8 years; how can I bow out after 6 months? it would be an honour to be around for 8 more years, even if it means sleeping in the basement and being around the 3 of them

 

I know why I married this woman, because I love her with all my heart; until she kicks me out, I will not give up

 

Ok, so I didn't say give up - that's not my MO. I am the eternal optimist. I have hope she'll come around. What I don't like is that you're allowing her to stomp you down and discourage you at every turn in the name of "making it up" to her.

 

I am sure I have a very candid understanding of the levels of abuse she endured. You may have surpassed what I've put up with from H, and you may not have, but the fact remains that I stand in the circle of women who understand. I am fighting some more recent and heart wrenching battles with my husband and his need for substance...so if I am a little more emotional about these things right now just know there's reason behind it. A man who is willing to see his wrongs and move past them is worth the effort to stay with and to help and work with. Your love for your wife is evident. What she needs right now is to know you're your own man. She needs to know that you're not just another thing she has to take care of each day. She needs to know you can stand up for yourself - even against her. She's far from perfect - don't idealize her. She's the most beautiful and wonderful woman - to you - yes, but she's still human and imperfect. So that's where your self respect causes you to stand up for yourself, to protect and care for yourself...but to respect and care for her.

 

If you spend the next few months or even years in the basement I would say financially that's the best move. I would also say emotionally you'll eventually adjust, but at some point you'll have to accept the new life you live and actually live it.

[c0nfuzd]

to take away the kids would hurt her beyond belief; I know she works a lot but she would trade her career in a hearbeat to be with the kids more; at this point, I am there to take care of them and as such she is not making the changes; but there is no doubt in my mind she would change her work style

[c0nfuzd]

Ok, so I didn't say give up - that's not my MO. I am the eternal optimist. I have hope she'll come around. What I don't like is that you're allowing her to stomp you down and discourage you at every turn in the name of "making it up" to her.

 

I am sure I have a very candid understanding of the levels of abuse she endured. You may have surpassed what I've put up with from H, and you may not have, but the fact remains that I stand in the circle of women who understand. I am fighting some more recent and heart wrenching battles with my husband and his need for substance...so if I am a little more emotional about these things right now just know there's reason behind it. A man who is willing to see his wrongs and move past them is worth the effort to stay with and to help and work with. Your love for your wife is evident. What she needs right now is to know you're your own man. She needs to know that you're not just another thing she has to take care of each day. She needs to know you can stand up for yourself - even against her. She's far from perfect - don't idealize her. She's the most beautiful and wonderful woman - to you - yes, but she's still human and imperfect. So that's where your self respect causes you to stand up for yourself, to protect and care for yourself...but to respect and care for her.

 

If you spend the next few months or even years in the basement I would say financially that's the best move. I would also say emotionally you'll eventually adjust, but at some point you'll have to accept the new life you live and actually live it.

 

my changes only happened 6 months ago and were quite drastic; I understand why she can't believe them; what I can't understand is why she won't give me time to show they are for real

[c0nfuzd]

she just got back from her trip and she was so upbeat; we talked for 20 minutes about her work and her trip and she was laughing at times...she was so different than I have seen her recently; it's like the argument we had 2 days ago never happened; so this is what I see as hope; she even sent me a pic of herself to my smartphone (which I quickly set up as wallpaper hehe)

 

when she is happy she glows...and she made more eye contact than usual too

 

all my pain is wiped away...if only for tonight; still going to sleep in the basement but I feel a microscopic hint of hope

 

staying positive and strong

 

Bottom line - it doesn't matter what you wanted before they happened...it doesn't really even matter what you wanted while you were on drugs...You have turned your life around and you're a true father to them now. No one has a right to take that away from you.

 

this is what I wish and pray for nightly....if she understood this fully, this thread would already have ended

Edited November 16, 2011 by c0nfuzd

[ShatteredReality]

my changes only happened 6 months ago and were quite drastic; I understand why she can't believe them; what I can't understand is why she won't give me time to show they are for real

 

I completely understand that they "only" happened 6 months ago. But you haven't done any backsliding. That's huge. They say it takes 3 weeks to form a habit and 3 weeks to break one. After 3 weeks, if a person has kept up a change, then there's hope.

 

I am nearly 3 yrs into my reconciliation. Every minor backslide strikes fear into my core. But, what I am saying, is that at some point your wife either needs to admit you've made some progress, even though she still fears it's not real, or she needs to admit she just cannot get beyond the past. I had to put our past in a box in my mental attic. I don't bring up the things he did as a tool against him. I haven't forgotten them completely - but that's because I can't.

 

When we first started to reconcile...each argument we had I thought "that's it, I'm done, it's over". And then, once I cooled down and was less emotional and more logical I would realize it could not be an easy road for us to fix what we'd so horribly broken. That we'd fight. It's what we've always done - we have always argued and it has always gotten heated. So I had to accept the arguing would never stop, but that the topics were what would change. Once I came to terms with that I was able to be a bit more objective. Now...when the old topics come to light again now and again - that still scares me.

 

I am glad you had a nice time with her when she got back, though. And I am glad she gave you the hope of sending you a photo - that's a positive sign.

 

Just don't forget to give yourself the credit for the changes you've made that you deserve. And hopefully sometime soon she begins to give you that credit also!

[c0nfuzd]

letting go of the past is a HUGE problem for her...everytime she gets worked up about disciplining the kids, the past rears its ugly head; she just can't forgive it seems; says she forgave me so many times in the past but honestly, I wasn't even aware she forgave me; she never told me I forgive you, she never said this marriage is in trouble, she never once spoke the D word...it's like I was supposed to read her mind....as an example, I went to sleep in the basement a number of years ago because I couldn't deal with the yelling at night of the babies; I thought I was doing her a favor as well since she wouldn't have to hear me cuss and yell when the babies acted up; she says I slept in the basement for 2 years (again I can't verify this myself, it felt more like 6 months but I will take her word for it) while she took care of the babies after a C-section; obviously it was no easy task for her; when I came back into our bed, she had forgiven me for what I did to her; when she told me this recently, it was a complete surprise to me..and I forgot to mention that during our last argument, she said she doesn't want me to go with the kids and her to her family's Xmas or New Year's parties...and for the record, I went to all Xmases and New Year's Eve parties with her and the kids....those are 2 events I never missed but somehow this doesn't seem to matter

[c0nfuzd]

...........When we first started to reconcile...each argument we had I thought "that's it, I'm done, it's over". And then, once I cooled down and was less emotional and more logical I would realize it could not be an easy road for us to fix what we'd so horribly broken.

 

this is the difference with us....I am the only one at fault; she did nothing wrong so she has no reason to try to fix this....I am alone in fixing this.....there is no us or so it seems

 

the only fault I can find with her is for bottling it up for this long; had she made her intentions known earlier, my changes could have happened then; she says she tried to talk to me but was not listening at the time no matter what she said

 

it could be true especially since I was high most of the time, but if I had heard "our marriage is in trouble, or if things don't change I am filing for divorce", I would have stopped what I was doing wrong back then as well

 

I swear to God I had no idea I was this deep in trouble with our marriage...I knew what I was doing wasn't how a husband should behave, I guess I thought I could speak my mind openly and uncensored in a marriage

 

and she says it's a convenient excuse to say that I was high; she does not understand what an addiction to drugs is because she never had any addictions

Edited November 17, 2011 by c0nfuzd

[turnera]

Go to the family events anyway. She needs to see you standing up for the family. You're practically kicked out anyway; at least do this one last thing to show you're fighting to keep the family together.

 

She lost respect for you years ago. You have to start earning it back by acting like the man of the house.

[c0nfuzd]

Go to the family events anyway. She needs to see you standing up for the family. You're practically kicked out anyway; at least do this one last thing to show you're fighting to keep the family together.

 

She lost respect for you years ago. You have to start earning it back by acting like the man of the house.

 

this will definitely rock the boat and will ensure she has miserable holidays....furthermore, it will precipitate my demise

 

are you sure about this? I think I will wait till the last minute to see if she changes her mind, I can't believe she would do this to me; she was upset and in the middle of our argument when I asked if I could attend these events; she didn't even say no, she just sighed and I immediately assumed her response is no

 

I been reading you on TAM, turnera, and I know your stance on abuse victims; I am trying to figure out whether you're trying to help me or help her; these are risky propositions you are offering

 

from all the reading I have done thus far, I am instructed time and again to not agitate her, to give her time and space, to understand her position and most of all remain silent as much as I can....yet, your many advices suggest antagonizing and instigating

 

the question I have for you given the details I have offered so far in this thread.......do you believe I am an abuser and do you really believe I can be or am reformed? in other words, can emotional abusers of the likes of me change?

[turnera]

Anyone can change and you certainly seem to have done so. The advice I'm giving you is from a psychological/sociological perspective and has nothing to do with past abuse.

 

She likely fell out of love with you a long time ago; your LBs cemented that over the years. I'm guessing that at this point, she tolerates you like a pesky dog she feels too guilty to kick out.

 

The 'man' in you has long been missing and she probably has no idea who that man is any more. It's a simple fact of sociology that women cannot love a man they don't respect. If you are anything like you are here, at home - bowing and scraping, acting like you don't deserve anything, begging for crumbs of her time - you're now looking even worse to her. ASKING her if you can come. What husband does that? That's a doormat and women can't respect doormats.

 

IMO, she needs to see you acting like a man again, not the disfigured cousin the family keeps in the basement and ignores. SHE is not going to just turn around and say 'hey, come on back into the family.' IMO, she needs to hear YOU say 'I can never undo the harm I caused you but I want back in; I want to be a vital part of this family again. I'll do whatever it takes to win you back. And the first thing I want to do is be part of the Thanksgiving holidays with the whole family. If it's an issue for you, I'll stay out of your way, but I want to be with the family. Now, what can I bring that would be a good peace offering to your family?'

[c0nfuzd]

it's hard to disagree with you turnera...you make a lot of sense; but something tells me to hold still a while longer

 

just did a simple google search on separation in my neck of the woods and it clearly states that there is no such thing as filing for legal separation; all that is required is a written out statement on how we will deal with it (ie. child custody, division of assets, payment obligations of outstanding debts, etc.); this piece of paper needs to be signed by both parties and a witness to be legally binding; fairly straightforward if you ask me and no need for a lawyer, unless we disagree on the terms or we don't have a witness; since I willfully give her everything unconditionally, the cost of this agreement is purely...time; also, the fact I live in the basement qualifies as separation

 

after 6 months, you would think that a woman as intelligent as she is would have not only researched her options but already completed and presented me with this separation document; this leads me to believe she is not as determined as I think; you could say it's convenience for her to remain in this limbo, seeing that all her parenting needs are met (taking/picking up kids to/from school, bathing/feeding them, putting out the garbage and cleaning the house, whilst offering nothing in return); and it could be because she is so busy at work

 

but if you listen to Mort Fertel and divorcebusting site, along with so many other online marital sources, the message is clear...endure endure endure...there is hope and it's never too late until the divorce is officially enforced

 

we agree that with consistency and time, she will determine that I am not a fake and have indeed transformed; as long as she gives me this time, I will stick to my guns...which is to show her that I am committed not only to being a family man, but also to my changes

 

so even if it takes 3, 5, or 10 years for her to arrive at this conclusion it will have been worthwhile, not only for our kids but for us too; I have never been more determined at anything in my life; it's sad that it had to happen at this point in our marriage

 

the trick for me is to accept that nothing will happen anytime soon; if I can manage to stay busy when she does take away the kids, I can outlast this period; shortly I will start some physical activity as my surgery recovery is going well and have been cleared by the surgeon to proceed

 

I will keep in mind your advice about the holidays and tell her about it the day of..not before

 

oh and btw, turns out I can ask for joint custody; I (and she) was confusing it with shared custody which is what she doesn't want because of the havoc it would bestow on the kids; but I can see her agreeing on joint custody since it simply means we both get decision-making powers over the welfare of our children

Edited November 18, 2011 by c0nfuzd

[c0nfuzd]

I put a red rose on her pillow few nights ago with a simple note reading I love you (thanks SR for the idea)...she did not even acknowledge it; she put it in a vase on the dresser beside her bed (was hoping it would stay on her night table); last night she threw out the rose because it had wilted, the note is still there

 

I don't get the "get out of here" vibe from her...especially after last week; she was very positive and upbeat and initiated many conversations; it was probably the best week we've had so far since she broke the news 6 months ago; I hope to keep this going

[ShatteredReality]

I put a red rose on her pillow few nights ago with a simple note reading I love you (thanks SR for the idea)...she did not even acknowledge it; she put it in a vase on the dresser beside her bed (was hoping it would stay on her night table); last night she threw out the rose because it had wilted, the note is still there

 

I don't get the "get out of here" vibe from her...especially after last week; she was very positive and upbeat and initiated many conversations; it was probably the best week we've had so far since she broke the news 6 months ago; I hope to keep this going

 

I am glad she kept it until it wilted. That's a good sign. If she truly had nothing left for you she would have tossed it...note and all. So there is an element of sentimentality going on still. I once held on to the sleeve of a latte H got me during our reconciliation where he wrote a little note with a heart on it for me. It's the little things. We also exchanged a lot of little greeting cards during that time. Him at first, then I jumped on board getting them also for him. Hallmark made a killing off of us that year! I even went so far as to get like 10 of them and stash them in my sock drawer so I could pull one out after a fight and hide it in his workplace...I picked all the ones I couldn't choose from because I liked them all and took turns with them. I have a feeling he did something similar.

 

For right now, try to become a part of whatever holiday functions - you can say you want to be with the kids and then at the function do that - spend your time with the kids. Have some grown up time and chat with her some, but gauge on feeling...if she becomes stand offish then go be with the kids...sit a kid between the two of you at the table if there isn't a kiddie table also. We do that as a practice anyway - easier for keeping them calm and mess free - but for you two it can be you giving her space if you feel you need to.

[c0nfuzd]

I like the greeting card idea...thanks for that

 

went in for some more therapy today and presented my situation; the initial response of my therapist was "it's game over, move on"....but I went into more detail and by the end of the session, the solution was more like "if you can put up with not getting anything in return, then lie low and keep doing what you're doing"

 

although it's hard for me to fathom doing all the work and for her not to give anything in return, I still am ok with it; at times, it's difficult to accept this but I find strength in my faith and the kids; I tell myself that I am not going to give up; given how easy it is to write that separation agreement and make it legally binding, I choose to wait for her to make that move

 

am I foolish? perhaps; I fully understand that moving on could open up new doors, but I also know how much more miserable I would be

[ShatteredReality]

Bottom line is, no matter how this ends - you will be able to hold your head high and say that for yourself you did all you could think to do to save it.

 

How did the weekend go?

[c0nfuzd]

all is quiet and well as long as I don't bring up our situation; spent most of the time with the kids as she was away doing various things; when she was around, she whisked the kids away to her mom's

 

what is worthy of note is this Thursday coming up; during our last argument 2 weeks ago I told her I could move out by Jan 1st if she gave me the separation document with a month's notice, to which she agreed...but I know that she was upset at the time so my gut feeling tells me this won't happen if I am to judge by what her mood has been since then

 

deep inside though, I feel like we are done; there is nothing left between us; I want to show her how much I love her but how can I when she constantly evades me at every opportunity she gets and keeps me so far away from her even in our house?

[c0nfuzd]

it's not that we can't work this out; it's that she does not want to work this out; this is the essence of the problem...understanding that love is a choice would go a long way in starting the reconciliation; as long as she expects love to sprout in her heart with no work on her part, it's a mission impossible

[c0nfuzd]

well, it didn't happen....no separation letter yesterday (not too surprised)

 

momma said it wasn't gonna happen and she was right; looks like I will be home past the new year

 

therapist gave me a good idea what to do on the weekends when I feel like crap because she takes the kids away...volunteer

 

so until I get into better shape and can start doing sports again, someone is gonna get my free time and appreciate it more than my wife does; it's too bad because I would rather spend my free time with the family on the weekends but what can I do?

[flutterbykiss]

I hope you will forgive me entering this discussion at this late stage. I have made the effort to read through the thread and I would like to share my thoughts with you because I am going through the same thing (from your wifes' perspective). He is sleeping in our spare room right now.

 

it's not that we can't work this out; it's that she does not want to work this out; this is the essence of the problem...understanding that love is a choice would go a long way in starting the reconciliation; as long as she expects love to sprout in her heart with no work on her part, it's a mission impossible

 

What you have said here is very similar (and a lot more polite) than what I hear regularly from my significant other. He gets so frustrated and angry with me that I can't engage in this wonderful new life he believes we can have now that he is sorting his problems out. He says that he is making so many efforts so why can't I at least try to let the past go and work on the future with him. I know it makes him fell like I don't love him and don't want to fix it and like it's not worth trying, anymore. In fact, he went to bed without even speaking to me for exactly that reason. If you are starting to feel this way then I hope the following perspective helps.

 

If I am honest with myself, I do want things to work between us. I couldn't have hung around for so long and put up with so much if I wasn't hoping desperately that things could be better. I want things to work but I can't show it. I can't reach out to him and I can barely even show appreciation for the things he does to try to fix us. I notice them and they mean the world to me but showing that feels like putting myself in the firing line again. After everything that I have been through, it is paralyzingly scary to even think about letting myself be open to him, again. I feel so, so stupid for staying around to be hurt, again and again, and something inside me refuses to set myself up to have it all happen again. After-all, I KNOW what to expect out of this relationship so how stupid would I have to be to go back for more? That said, I do deep down love him. I love him so much that I can't willingly walk away and make the final, permanent steps to separate from him forever. So, I'm in no man's land. I can't move forward with him or without him. Actually, it's probably only because i do love him so much that I'm even prepared to put my emotional life on hold like this rather than just let the whole messed up situation go and leave him. I know he thinks I am cold to his efforts and I'm terrified he will stop trying because he isn't getting the encouragement he needs from me. The sad thing is that when he starts to say it's impossible and he might as well give up, I freeze up even more because it's even more dangerous for me to invest in him if he is still so flakey and I'm still so low a priority that he would just give up. It feels like the 'old' irresponsible him coming back when he says that because it feels like he is dodging out on his responsibility to fix what he broke and I feel even less safe trusting him. I don't know what to do because every course of action seems to lead to more pain so I'm paralyzed doing nothing, which only seems to make things worse anyway.

 

Please don't think that I'm accusing you of not trying or saying you haven't changed or that you are not totally committed to your responsibility of changing your life. I can tell from your posts that fixing your marriage means everything to you and I applaud you for that. But, from the perspective of the person who was hurt, putting my heart on the line for someone who has already broken it is a really difficult, scary thing to do - especially if I'm not yet convinced that they are totally, permanently changed. I know I will need a lot of reassurance and consistency before I'm even able to want to meet my man in the middle. I agree with the others who have suggested that you just continue to be there patiently and consistently. Only being consistent, over time, will convince her that you have changed permanently. I know it's a big ask but take hope in the fact that she is living this hell, too, rather than just cutting it all off completely - which would be easier.

 

Sorry for such a long post. Good luck and take care.

 

Ps: I think volunteering is a great idea. It keeps you busy AND it shows your wife interest and responsibility to others - which can only help