Sent papers off today..Holy crap; this is hard!

[Steen719]

I posted my story in May, when this was fresh and while I have answered a lot of posts, I have not started a thread in quite a while. Stuff has happened since then and I really am not quite sure why I am posting this today, other than I have a need to get it out. I guess I would like to hear from someone else that has been where I am today and give me encouragement. I’ll make it as brief as possible.

 

 

My H had a PA when we had been married 8 years. We had moved to another city and bought a house, moving into it July 1997. He decided he wanted to move back to the other city. Anyway, 5 months later, I finally figured it out. Our son was 7 and he asked that I stay, he was sorry, etc. and we stayed together. Life was pretty good, according to my thinking, anyway. In 2009, he became quite ill from tx for Hep C and the next 1 ½ were spent trying to keep him alive until a transplant in June 2010. The move to another city to wait for the transplant, the fact that he couldn’t work and the catastrophic deductibles on health insurance and my son’s college expenses have placed us in financial straits. He did very well after transplantation and we came home in August 2010. We did well until December or January 2010 when he found facebook.

 

 

He reconnected with old friends; that was good. Then it became 12 hours a day (he does not work, but I think he could ad Dr. says he can, but being a nurse, he is afraid of the bacteria..no immune system). Then, he evidently found an old gf (one he dated briefly and unknown to me, started contacting her frequently by phone and FB. I discovered this in May (phone), but recently found out, this started in March. In May, he gave me the speech I had heard before “I love you, but I am not in love with you”. Oh crap!

 

 

Since then, he called at least 2 other women when we went to transplant city, treated me like crap when we were there and added many young women on facebook, some stripper types, etc. Counseling with an inappropriate counselor did not help (told us her own infidelity story), but he took off the young women. I went home for one month to help my s-i-l (my brother died while H was in the hospital and I could not do much to help her) with some things on her house. He called, etc….wants things to work out. I come home, something still feels off, install keylogger, find conversations between he and new old gf (EA) and then one from old PA gf. I told him then I wanted a divorce. He has fought me ever since….he doesn’t want divorce, is not having an affair, has not f***ed this woman..blah, blah, blah. OK…..

 

 

I did go to a psychologist by myself and I think he wondered why in the heck I was having trouble making a decision to leave my H, but he did help me, particularly with issues around my son knowing.

 

 

What was my fault? EVERYTHING!!! He said that it was my fault as I had not given him sex in quite a while. At first, he said 2 years, which was not true, as we had tried right before then, but he had impotency problems during illness and after transplant and has very low testosterone. We did try..but ummm, well, anyway. Then, it became 3 years; currently we are up to 5 years and I have told him to be careful, that if he keeps going, he will have trouble explaining our son. It is true, we did not have a lot of sex..23 years married, older and I have had a complete hysterectomy thanks to his gift of HPV. BUT, it is not like he describes it. He also says I was sitting on the computer all of time, ignoring him. I WAS TEACHING ONLINE CLASSES, 3 AT A TIME, TO KEEP US OUT OF BANKRUPTCY. Of course, I was online all of the time.

 

 

 

This is too long…I am sorry. We worked out the financial details (I am helping with insurance until Medicare in one year) and other concessions and today, we had the papers notarized and sent off to the attorney.

Crap, this is really, really hard. H kept saying he did not want the divorce; he said he was sorry, but he still doesn't think what he did with EA woman was wrong. He said they thought about cheating with each other early on...I'm thinking for 2 or 3 months and did not do it and even though they are still friends, he does not want her anymore. I don't believe him. I know they talk every day and I believe he still cares for her and yearns for her. He still thinks that an EA is “stupid”..nothing happened. I said Emotional involvement then, as I think Carhill said on another thread and he glommed onto that…oh new word???

 

 

I feel better by posting this. I have always been faithful and have really tried to be a good wife. Perfect, I am not. I see that I could have done some things differently and wished I had. But, as I keep telling him, the EA is on him. Of course, when you don’t think it is wrong, how can you be sorry?

 

 

Thank you for reading, if you got this far. I read the threads to gain strength and I have done so by some of your stories, so even if you don’t answer me, many of you have helped me. If.you have any words to wisdom to share, please do. Thank you.

[itllgetbetter]

I'm fairly certain I'll be in the minority here but ... why don't you try another counsellor? It's a problem if he still doesn't think what he did with EA woman was wrong but, perhaps counsellor can explain that to him? Can you suggest to H that you'll hold off on filing the papers IF he agrees to go to a counsellor, then, make sure you go to a decent counsellor?

[andyg99]

God bless you Steen - you are a good person... you will pull through just fine...

[andyg99]

It's a problem if he still doesn't think what he did with EA woman was wrong but, perhaps counsellor can explain that to him?

 

EA, PA - it's an affair, period. I don't think he needs someone to explain it to him, he knows it's wrong - he's just BS-ing...

[Steen719]

God bless you Steen - you are a good person... you will pull through just fine...

 

Thank you, Andy. Really.

[Steen719]

I'm fairly certain I'll be in the minority here but ... why don't you try another counsellor? It's a problem if he still doesn't think what he did with EA woman was wrong but, perhaps counsellor can explain that to him? Can you suggest to H that you'll hold off on filing the papers IF he agrees to go to a counsellor, then, make sure you go to a decent counsellor?

 

I know what you are saying, but to me it is like beating a dead horse, IGB. I don't know how a person cannot see that talking with another old gf about cheating on their spouses and then continuing conversations about how he wishes he had more time with her back then and how her husband doesn't know they talk..she is in bed while on FB with H and her H is lying in bed next to her, sleeping, and she admits he would not be happy if he found out and they talk about how they made eye contact when they first met, etc., etc., puke puke puke.....how can you NOT KNOW that it is wrong? If the situation was reversed, he would not have stood for that for one minute. He knows it is not right. He just doesn't want to say it. What a waste of a marriage. Thanks for your answer and God, this is hard, but unless he had some kind of epiphany about this, I feel like I would be asking for more heartache and I have had more than I ever needed to make me humble.

[itllgetbetter]

Andyg99: I think you should consider giving inspirational-type courses to BS's - and, since you're on the west coast, best to do it where you are - ESPECIALLY if it's California.

 

Steen719: I'm sure you're probably right about filing the papers, but, as you can guess from my posts, I'd never want to look back and think "if only I'd done ..." And you're correct, he does know it's wrong and for some reason just isn't admitting it. All I'd say is, if you STILL love him and he agrees to MC, or, acknowledges he was wrong, maybe you should give him yet another chance?

[Steen719]

Thanks, Lucky. He does seem to be in denial, little insight, I think. Pride and arrogance.

 

He just talked to his best friend in the world, who lives in another city. I really like him a lot..he is a great guy. Anyway, I asked if he would mind if I just talked to him for a minute to sort of say goodbye, since I don't really think I will see him again after the divorce, and H said, as he handed me the phone "he says you are a wonderful woman". Soooo, I talked to friend and he asks me if there is any way to make it work? At this point I discover that while H has told him some of the stuff, he has not exactly been forthcoming about the extent of his EA and friend does agree it is not acceptable and I don't deserve it. He loves H, though, so no bad mouthing, of course (and I wouldn't do that with him, anyway). He says H has had a lot of issues dealing with his shortened life expectancy and he has seen a change in how much responsibility (more) he is taking for what has happened in the last few weeks, so could I please just not close the door completely? I told him, he better have his epiphany soon, or we will be divorced. Additionally, he needs to take full responsibility for his actions and start acting like a man and not a child. I am not his mother; I cannot keep holding his hand while he cleans up his messes. He said he understood..."please leave the door open"?

 

His family and friend understand.....want it to work out.

 

My family and friends....how can he do this to you?

 

Good Lord, it gets complicated when it is long term.

[andyg99]

Steen - I don't know how it is where you live but here in CA once you file you can stop the proceedings anytime until it becomes final in 6 months... if there is a time period like that then go ahead and file and if any "miracles" happen before the final date then you can reconsider... you have done all you can IMO, but you know the situation best...

[jpundun]

S,

 

Good for you. I know what you have been through and I give you a lot of credit. Most wouldn't have gone as far as you did. No one can say that you didn't try. I realize that it is hard. I know I did it and it was hard but sometimes you are not given a choice and forced to make a haard decision. Part of you wnats to hold on and think that something will happen to make everything right. Then there is the other part that realizes that that is not going to happen.

 

I know that what you are doing is the right thing. You will be okay and once it is completely over you will be able to see that what you did was the right thing for you. Good luck....

[itllgetbetter]

Steen: I'm STILL in the minority, and, if you've got his family and friends on your side, that's really means a lot - maybe they could do an intervention on H (I've never participated in one so I'm not sure what they're all about but I understand the gist of them) and get him to take responsibility for his actions?

 

My concern with the suggestion (apologies in advance Andyg99) that you file and stop proceedings if things improve is that you & your H don't want to be on that path and perhaps just continue on it since you started it.

[Steen719]

Andy, Here in Florida, it is quicker..uncontested and I expect it to be done in a month. I am not expecting any miracles, btw. I had a very honest discussion with him after our conversation with his friend. He told his friend (and I heard this) that he wasn't going to live like he did for 14 years when I brought up his XOW every week. I told him he had just lied to his friend. I did not even remember the woman's last name and did not even think about her. I have been a little busy with other things, anyway. Usually he would bring it up if we were having an argument and he would say something about her and that I was still upset about it, and it usually had absolutely nothing to do with anything like that. It started with that and I just really gave it to him with both barrels and told him what I thought about his not taking responsibility for this. I laid it out in lavender..he fought back, but I think he finally might get how much this hurt me. I did not spare anything...I told him how low down he was for walking past me night after night to get a coke, snack whatever while I was working in the LR to keep us out of bankruptcy and he was on FB in the other room with her, both of them trying to decide whether they were going to have an affair or not. AND HE IS STILL TALKING TO HER!!!!!! A POS, that is what I told him he was and he did not argue with that.

 

Anyway, I don't know whether it got through his thick head, but I know I have told him how I feel and what else is there to say?

 

J, I know you know how this feels. I feel as if did what I could and at this point, I am not sure what else I could do to make him see what is in front of him. I sure hope you are right and I am feeling better soon and you are, too.

 

IGB, I sent the papers today, so I would have to stop them soon. The deed will be done in about 30 days. His family has tried to talk to him and his sister told me and him that if her husband did this, he would be out on the street with his bags. H knows that it is wrong. When I asked him tonight what he would think if I had done what he did, he said he would not be here anymore. I said, "and there you go...why should it be any different because it is me? It should not. There is no difference here. The only difference is that you are used to me bending to your will and forgiving everything. Not this time...I am not a freaking shark that can only go forward..I go backwards too, so live with it." This is the crux of the entire thing. He is so used to me forgiving and care-taking and nurturing, he just figures it will continue...but not this time. He does not need an intervention; he needs to go back to the hospital and have a morals and values transplant. I will say this; the psychologist that I saw did tell me that I was a care-taker by nature. My degrees and jobs were social work (including homeless veterans and mentally ill), I was a care-taker for H and it is my nature to be this way. He said I needed to take care of myself for a change and I am beginning to see his point.

 

Thanks for all of your replies.

[Steadfast]

I must have posted this a hundred times here, but don't feel bad about feeling bad. You're going through a divorce, and like most divorces it's laced with betrayal, mixed feelings, confusion and most of all, grieving.

 

Keep the party balloons in the drawer. Concentrate on your comfort.

 

When the time is right, put some thought into what would help you move on and grow from that point forward. The past is the past. Don't get caught up in trying to figure them out or being proven right. If you're right, you're right. It doesn't need proving. I think many confuse broken hearts with broken egos. Make positive changes but avoid the 'what ifs.'

 

Reality is here. You can make it a friend, or an enemy. It's up to you.

[Frank13]

Steen, based on what I have read, if you go through with the divorce the only thing you will regret is not having done it a lot sooner.

[Steen719]

I must have posted this a hundred times here, but don't feel bad about feeling bad. You're going through a divorce, and like most divorces it's laced with betrayal, mixed feelings, confusion and most of all, grieving.

 

Keep the party balloons in the drawer. Concentrate on your comfort.

 

When the time is right, put some thought into what would help you move on and grow from that point forward. The past is the past. Don't get caught up in trying to figure them out or being proven right. If you're right, you're right. It doesn't need proving. I think many confuse broken hearts with broken egos. Make positive changes but avoid the 'what ifs.'

 

Reality is here. You can make it a friend, or an enemy. It's up to you.

 

Well, yes, that is true..all of it. I know that it doesn't matter, really, if he ever "gets it'. I guess that is a need of mine that I should work on getting over. AND, I will.

 

He and I are sharing the house. Neither can afford to leave and still help with house payment. So, he is after me a lot. He knows the buttons...23 years...and he pushes them. I have to get up and go to another room, lugging my laptop to be able to work, until he leaves the room I work in. I try, I really do, to not engage in the conversation and when I don't, it ends up in a fight and he is right, I am wrong. ALWAYS!!!

 

I can't make him clear out the garage and replace the side door...we need to get the house on the market. He is lagging behind in hopes I will change my mind, but I won't. I want to have some peace, really I do.

 

Thanks.

[Steen719]

Steen, based on what I have read, if you go through with the divorce the only thing you will regret is not having done it a lot sooner.

 

Frank,

A friend of mine just told me that about her divorce. She said that while she was divorcing him, she moved in and out so much, she wore her furniture out!

 

Looking back, she could not understand what took her so long to make the move permanently. I hope you are right, Frank, I really do. I am worried about being older and doing this. If I were younger, still in a great career and in better financial shape, I think it would not have taken me so long to get to this point.

 

Thank you.

[andyg99]

comments in BOLD

 

Andy, both of them trying to decide whether they were going to have an affair or not. AND HE IS STILL TALKING TO HER!!!!!! A POS, that is what I told him he was and he did not argue with that.

 

cased closed IMO - I would hope that you are 100% sure about this now

 

I will say this; the psychologist that I saw did tell me that I was a care-taker by nature. My degrees and jobs were social work (including homeless veterans and mentally ill), I was a care-taker for H and it is my nature to be this way. He said I needed to take care of myself for a change and I am beginning to see his point.

 

he's right! you are the most important person in your life! take care of that person!

 

someone made a great point, this is a divorce, if you weren't in pain and had doubts then something would be wrong... but you tried and you can never look back and have any regrets that you didn't do everything you could...

 

.

[LifesontheUp]

He is serial cheat I'm afraid. So yes I think you will get peace of mind by divorcing him.

 

I know life goes on. Just believe it will get better. Take your time and you will be fine.

[Steen719]

Yeah, Andy, I have told him that he has really done nothing to win me back. There are a lot of issues here, but his arrogance in his unwillingness to see the seriousness of his behavior and the fact that he still thinks I will change my mind makes him hard to be around (since we are both living here). He keeps trying and trying to tell me he will be different. How? What will be different? How are you resolving this thing with OW? "But I did not do it (PA) because I love you". Crap, all crap. He is so used to me forgiving and moving forward, he can't believe it.

 

You are right; we should hurt. How can you not hurt after being with one person for so long? Memories of raising our son together, good times, fun, laughing, tears, all of it. It is hard, really hard. On the positive side, I am not rising to his bait today, so although we have talked, I have not yelled. (too much)

 

LifesontheUp...it is my mantra...it will get better, it will get better. Just wish this was not happening...ha ha..who doesn't right? Thanks.

[Josephina]

Steen, I can certainly relate as my X never could understand that what he was doing was wrong. As long as they don't think it is wrong, there will always be another girl, another friend, and another inappropriate relationship. To this day my X doesn't think he did things wrong, even though some of it was very blatant and even physical. What finally set him free was I told him that I want him to be free to explore these relationships without the baggage of guilt and conflict from me. He obviously wasn't going to stop, so I set him free.

 

Your ex is an adult, as is mine. We can try to help them see the light via counseling, etc, but in the end they will never understand if they don't want to. They have their own personal responsibility to seek out what is right and wrong.

 

Anyways, I wish you all the best, and I'm sorry to hear that today is hard on you, albeit understandably so.

[Steen719]

Thanks, Josephina. Mornings are the worst for me. I wake up every morning so incredibly sad to know that my life has changed so much and bigger changes are on the way. I never thought my 22 year marriage would be in shambles this way. I feel the same every morning...just really sad.

 

I know everyone who has lost their marriage this way must feel like this. It stinks. Really bad morning today.

[jpundun]

Mornings are the worst for me. I wake up every morning so incredibly sad to know that my life has changed so much and bigger changes are on the way. I never thought my 22 year marriage would be in shambles this way. I feel the same every morning...just really sad.

 

I know everyone who has lost their marriage this way must feel like this. It stinks. Really bad morning today.

 

S,

 

I do the same thing. I don't know how it is even possible but as soon as I wake the thoughts are right there. I try to ignore them but on some days it's impossible. It is sad but what can you do? I and you have done everything in our power to make things work but as you know it takes two. Hang in there and eventually it will lessen I hope.

[andyg99]

S,

 

I and you have done everything in our power to make things work but as you know it takes two. Hang in there and eventually it will lessen I hope.

 

the pain does lesson - you don't have to hope but you have to act... hope is for things out of your control, as in "I hope my team wins the Super Bowl"... we all have it in our control to make our lives what we want - we should know that we can be happy by ourselves or with someone else, but we should NEVER base our happiness ON someone else. A sad fact of life is that people come and go in our lives, sometimes people we love very much and we have to heal after they are gone... don't HOPE - ACT!

[jpundun]

the pain does lesson - you don't have to hope but you have to act... hope is for things out of your control, as in "I hope my team wins the Super Bowl"... we all have it in our control to make our lives what we want - we should know that we can be happy by ourselves or with someone else, but we should NEVER base our happiness ON someone else. A sad fact of life is that people come and go in our lives, sometimes people we love very much and we have to heal after they are gone... don't HOPE - ACT!

 

Andy,

 

You are right it is up to each of us to be happy. I guess what I was trying to refer to is the feeling that is associated with loss. It's not because of the loss of the person themselves but the loss of something more abstract. I guess you would call it the loss of a dream.

[Steen719]

the pain does lesson - you don't have to hope but you have to act... hope is for things out of your control, as in "I hope my team wins the Super Bowl"... we all have it in our control to make our lives what we want - we should know that we can be happy by ourselves or with someone else, but we should NEVER base our happiness ON someone else. A sad fact of life is that people come and go in our lives, sometimes people we love very much and we have to heal after they are gone... don't HOPE - ACT!

 

I agree that we do need to be responsible ultimately for our own happiness. I also think it is easy to look to another person to provide that, but I think the loss we feel and the subsequent sadness is sometimes overwhelming at times. We just have to go on until we get better.

 

NOW, for a really unreasonable hope "I hope my team (the Buffalo Bills) wins the Super Bowl!!!! How is that for hoping??