So... It was ALL a lie?

[Ilmhb3]

As I try and continue moving on with my life and move past the extreme mess I got myself into for the last 3 and a half years, I find myself trying to convince myself of certain things.

 

I've accepted that I'm not his first choice, and that in itself is helping me to start moving on emotionally. Where I'm getting held up is - was the last nearly four years of my life an entire lie? Was none of his love for me real? Did we not share a special bond and connection? When he chose to come and spend every single morning with me and at least 2 nights every week with me, and asked me to spend weekends with him - when we called/txt each other daily and shared Everything with each other... Was all that NOT because he truly loved me? Did he ever really love me at all? Reconciling his actions AND words for the last few years with his actions since being concretely discovered is very difficult for me. While I am reminding myself "He did not chose to leave and be with you," I also believe that the love is still there, and just because he was Found Out, doesn't mean his feelings have changed. Does he really and truly want nothing to do with me now, and if that is true, how could he have felt the way he showed me he felt?

 

It's only been a week, and he has attempted to call/see me everyday since (it's been 24 hrs since the last) so I know that it is still way too soon to tell what will be. But does anybody have any advice about or insight into whether or not what you had with this person was real, or a total fantasy/lie?

 

PS - I know we all want our situations to be unique; I'm just trying to figure out how to move forward when I'm unsure about certain things, like the reality of what it was we had.

[Yianks]

As I try and continue moving on with my life and move past the extreme mess I got myself into for the last 3 and a half years, I find myself trying to convince myself of certain things.

 

I've accepted that I'm not his first choice, and that in itself is helping me to start moving on emotionally. Where I'm getting held up is - was the last nearly four years of my life an entire lie? Was none of his love for me real? Did we not share a special bond and connection? When he chose to come and spend every single morning with me and at least 2 nights every week with me, and asked me to spend weekends with him - when we called/txt each other daily and shared Everything with each other... Was all that NOT because he truly loved me? Did he ever really love me at all? Reconciling his actions AND words for the last few years with his actions since being concretely discovered is very difficult for me. While I am reminding myself "He did not chose to leave and be with you," I also believe that the love is still there, and just because he was Found Out, doesn't mean his feelings have changed. Does he really and truly want nothing to do with me now, and if that is true, how could he have felt the way he showed me he felt?

 

It's only been a week, and he has attempted to call/see me everyday since (it's been 24 hrs since the last) so I know that it is still way too soon to tell what will be. But does anybody have any advice about or insight into whether or not what you had with this person was real, or a total fantasy/lie?

 

PS - I know we all want our situations to be unique; I'm just trying to figure out how to move forward when I'm unsure about certain things, like the reality of what it was we had.

 

I feel your pain. Your questions are very natural and tortue your mind everyday.

 

Lets say his feelings are real, which I believe they are. Does it make you feel better or worst?

 

Being myself OM in an A, I sometimes feel is better if all it was just lies. It will help me get over it quicker.

[woinlove]

Not everyone is capable of really loving another person. Such a person can say "I love you" but it doesn't mean what someone who is really capable of loving means by that. I was that type of person. It meant I had some feelings, but, really, I came first and everyone else was pretty far behind my own needs and desires. Now that I am capable of love, what I felt then seems very shallow by comparison, but at the time, I wasn't aware of how shallow it was.

 

If I recall, the MM in your case encouraged you to be friends with his W so he would have better access to you. Very few people could pull that off - socializing continuously with their spouse and lover, for years, watching their spouse help their lover and not knowing what is really going on. That sounds like a very broken man. I'd be extremely surprised if such a man were capable of much love. I suspect he takes care of himself and when he says "I love you" it means that some of his needs are being met by you and he wants that to continue.

[Ilmhb3]

At this point, I think that knowing his feelings were real would actually help me move on. The thought of wasting so many years for something that was never true would make me feel more weak and worthless and unlovable Then again, while I feel strong in my convictions to not try and resume this relationship bc he has not Chosen me, I'm afraid if I knew his love for me were real it might serve as a temptation later on when I might not be feeling as strong in my convictions to let him go.

 

As for his watching W unknowingly help and become friends with me, the OW, I don't really know how that affected him honestly. I suppose that how he "loves" may be different from how most others do... I'm sure this is typical, but he always seemed to try and do his best to keep both of us happy, and not hurt either one. My perception is beginning to shift from him trying to keep us both happy, as to his motives being to really keep HIMSELF happy by continuing to keep us both.

 

I'm doing a lot of self convincing right now, and I'm trying to identify which things are best going to help me in the long run. I've been reciting "If he doesn't want you, let him go" over and over, so that fact in itself is enough for now, but I just keep wondering if the WHOLE thing was a big charade and whether or not it was just some sick game for him.

[wannabdone]

Hi ILM (not going to type the rest...too long) ....

 

I'm sorry for what you are going through. I know exactly how you are feeling. You want answers. The unfortunate part is quite typically, we never get those answers, and we never get the closure we want/need/desire.

 

The important thing here, is that you allow yourself to continue to work through the grieving process, and with that you will find more clairity.

 

I have had to learn to seperate my emotional part of my brain (heart), and my logical part of my brain. I have been NC for little over 5 weeks. I miss him, everday, I love him. But, I love me too and I deserve better. It is literally like I agrue with myself daily as to contact him or not. If I can get out of this without having split personalities....it will be a true testimony that their is a God!!!

 

You are right, every relationship is different. They do all carry the same undertones, but the dynamics of them are different. If it was all alike and b/w there would be no forums, and no hurting.

 

Right now, you have to go with what you know. You know you loved him deeply, thats the truth, you convinced yourself that his actions where other wise, but you did this because of your love for him. He very well possibly loved you. He just didn't love you enough. That is where I have come to... my xMM loved me, but not enough for me. And it boils down to...he could not give me what I wanted and I couldn't give him what he wanted. Try not to dive down into the specifics, there are no answers for those and it will just drive you crazy. Just keep it on general terms.

 

Good luck!

[Ilmhb3]

...AND here's the text from him, asking who some guy I work with is

 

Thanks wbd, the concept of just not loving me enough is a good point to consider. That helps me not feel like I'm completely worthless, just deserving of more.

 

I can't wait to see 5 weeks of NC. I can't imagine feeling removed from the whole thing yet but am trying to envision that as the light at the end of the tunnel. At some point this will all be a distant (yet still disturbing) memory and I will be happy in something else.

[donnamaybe]

He probably thought he loved you, but he really loved how you made him feel. That speaks to his emotional maturity, not yours. What it does mean about you, though, is that you ARE lovable.

 

Hang in there. You will feel better in time.

[2sunny]

as long as you ask all the "why" questions - you will be stuck in your past - which you can't change... accept that "it is what it is" and move forward. you deserve to be treated as the only woman in a man's life. you will be THAT woman some day - if you allow it... by letting go of thoughts of this MM.

 

in order to move forward... you need to ask yourself "how am I never going to make it look like THAT again?" DO everything you can to make everything different now.

 

DO things that make you happy - get busy living and moving forward.

[MissBee]

As I try and continue moving on with my life and move past the extreme mess I got myself into for the last 3 and a half years, I find myself trying to convince myself of certain things.

 

I've accepted that I'm not his first choice, and that in itself is helping me to start moving on emotionally. Where I'm getting held up is - was the last nearly four years of my life an entire lie? Was none of his love for me real? Did we not share a special bond and connection? When he chose to come and spend every single morning with me and at least 2 nights every week with me, and asked me to spend weekends with him - when we called/txt each other daily and shared Everything with each other... Was all that NOT because he truly loved me? Did he ever really love me at all? Reconciling his actions AND words for the last few years with his actions since being concretely discovered is very difficult for me. While I am reminding myself "He did not chose to leave and be with you," I also believe that the love is still there, and just because he was Found Out, doesn't mean his feelings have changed. Does he really and truly want nothing to do with me now, and if that is true, how could he have felt the way he showed me he felt?

 

It's only been a week, and he has attempted to call/see me everyday since (it's been 24 hrs since the last) so I know that it is still way too soon to tell what will be. But does anybody have any advice about or insight into whether or not what you had with this person was real, or a total fantasy/lie?

 

PS - I know we all want our situations to be unique; I'm just trying to figure out how to move forward when I'm unsure about certain things, like the reality of what it was we had.

 

Those are some pressing questions that I think all people who experience betrayal, BS and OW/OM, as well as those whose regular relationships end abruptly or by one party, want to know.

 

Having been through that myself both in an A and in a regular relationship, I have come to realize that 1. It takes some time for you to have adequate enough distance to accurately size up your relationship and be able to look at it and see what was...the good, bad, ugly. Some things you may have thought were one way, as time goes on, it is revealed that it was another and 2. Feelings are a tricky thing and loving someone is so much more than feelings, so someone may feel for you, but if that doesn't make them willing to do certain things for you/for your relationship, the feelings don't hold much water.

 

I am sure this man cared for you but I've also realized that sometimes two people have very different ideas about love and someone can be involved in a relationship where there is affection, care, fondness, liking how being around that person made them feel but not a deep love. I actually believe most relationships even when the word loved is used, it's based more on care, fondness, companionship, attraction, liking the feelings this person makes you feel and not a deep-seated love. I think you should take comfort in the fact that it was not some huge lie and he does care but it may not be to the level that you need...as evidently you wouldn't be in this position now if his love and care were enough for you.

[MissBee]

Hi ILM (not going to type the rest...too long) ....

I'm sorry for what you are going through. I know exactly how you are feeling. You want answers. The unfortunate part is quite typically, we never get those answers, and we never get the closure we want/need/desire.

 

Good news is...you in fact do!

 

As time goes by, from my experience, you do get to a point of closure through your own growth and understanding. Sometimes this other person is included in the closure but even if they aren't you usually get to a place of peace in which you have no more questions and have explained it to yourself in a way that satisfies you.

[MissBee]

Not everyone is capable of really loving another person. Such a person can say "I love you" but it doesn't mean what someone who is really capable of loving means by that. I was that type of person. It meant I had some feelings, but, really, I came first and everyone else was pretty far behind my own needs and desires. Now that I am capable of love, what I felt then seems very shallow by comparison, but at the time, I wasn't aware of how shallow it was.

 

If I recall, the MM in your case encouraged you to be friends with his W so he would have better access to you. Very few people could pull that off - socializing continuously with their spouse and lover, for years, watching their spouse help their lover and not knowing what is really going on. That sounds like a very broken man. I'd be extremely surprised if such a man were capable of much love. I suspect he takes care of himself and when he says "I love you" it means that some of his needs are being met by you and he wants that to continue .

Excellent post! You've explained what I was trying to convey in a much better way

[Ilmhb3]

Thanks MB. Posting here is definitely helping me see things; I hadn't really considered the different ways people feel and perceive "love". That coupled with not caring/loving enough, I'm slowly starting to gain some understanding and closure I think.

 

Also, he also claims to still have "love" for W, but the more I think about what he has put her through (with my participation of course, I take full responsibility) really does make me question how he feels/interprets/understands "love".

[wannabdone]

Ladies, I understand what you are going through right now, it's a normal part of it and as others have said, don't allow yourself to get stuck there.

 

I just wanted to let you know that this stage will pass, it won't torment you forever and you'll be able to let go of this and move on. You'll get to the point till where you arrive at a place where you just accept that you can't know all the answers and you'll look back and it won't matter so much if he did or he didn't. It can and does happen.

 

 

SO TRUE!!

 

ILM.... at 5.5 weeks of NC.... here is where I am.

-miss him (everday

-still love him

-have realized that I will not get answers I was so desperately seeking

-have come to the conclusion that he did love me, just not enough. And that is okay. There is nothing in life that is a guarantee.

-He has lied to me

-I have allowed him to lie to me

-He has disrespected me

-I have allowed him to disrespect me

-As long as I allow him to continue to lie and disrespect me, I will be caught in this limbo for the rest of my life

-I deserve better

-I can not continue to love someone this much and not have him in my life 100%.

-I can not give him what he needs by staying as the OW until he gets off his dead ass and gets a D.

-He can not give me what I need, and get off that dead ass and get a D.

 

Like I said, I have constant battles between my heart and my head. Heart says... Pick up the phone and call him, just to hear his voice. (I NEED A FIX!!!), head says....NO! You know its going to be the same thing, and there you will be.

 

Albert Einstien said "definition of insanity, is repeating the same things over and over again and expecting diffrent results".

 

If I continue to go down the path I have, I will have the exact same things I have always had. The ONLY thing I haven't done is NC. Drawing my BOUNDARIES, and being FIRM.

 

You will be okay. It will get better.

[MissBee]

Thanks MB. Posting here is definitely helping me see things; I hadn't really considered the different ways people feel and perceive "love". That coupled with not caring/loving enough, I'm slowly starting to gain some understanding and closure I think.

 

Also, he also claims to still have "love" for W, but the more I think about what he has put her through (with my participation of course, I take full responsibility) really does make me question how he feels/interprets/understands "love".

 

Exactly....that does raise an eyebrow.

 

I had another thread about whether or not love is enough....

 

Love nor "love" is not enough and if you and the person you're involved with don't share compatible understandings of love and practices of love...then they may love you with all they are, but it still won't be enough.

[wannabdone]

Since love is an emotion (feeling), we all define what love is differently. What might make you love someone is not what makes someone else love.

 

The very definition of love shows that:

noun

1.[COLOR=#333333] [/COLOR]a profoundly tender, passionate affection for another person.

 

2.[COLOR=#333333] [/COLOR]a feeling of warm personal attachment or deep affection, as for a parent, child, or friend.

 

3.[COLOR=#333333] [/COLOR]sexual passion or desire.

 

4.[COLOR=#333333] [/COLOR]a person toward whom love is felt; beloved person; sweetheart.

 

5.[COLOR=#333333] [/COLOR](used in direct address as a term of endearment, affection, or the like): Would you like to see a movie, love?

 

 

We all have different thoughts and opions on love, and what makes us love. We also all have different love languages. Notice the dictionary doesn't break out different kinds of love....ie selfish, unconditional. Love is basically what that emotion is to that particular person.

 

I just think you and him have two different ideas of love.

[Ilmhb3]

Yes, I think there is absolutely a difference between what he and I consider "love" to be.

 

For me, it is wanting to share your entire life with that person. Not to get caught up in the details, but I guess to reaffirm there were manipulations of sort, MM also told me on multiple occasions he wanted me to father his children, and was fiercely protective over me. Why I was supposed to be so loyal when he split his love for me with someone else was beyond me, but I took those actions to mean that he wanted us to be "together". Particularly since he hadn't had children with W and always acted like he didn't want kids! As messed up as it is, the belief that what we had was truly special and meaningful gave me hope and helped me be able to continue with it.

 

Whatever it was, "real" love or not, it wasn't enough. I know that logically and am trying to get my heart to catch on!

[wannabdone]

Yes, I think there is absolutely a difference between what he and I consider "love" to be.

 

For me, it is wanting to share your entire life with that person. Not to get caught up in the details, but I guess to reaffirm there were manipulations of sort, MM also told me on multiple occasions he wanted me to father his children, and was fiercely protective over me. Why I was supposed to be so loyal when he split his love for me with someone else was beyond me, but I took those actions to mean that he wanted us to be "together". Particularly since he hadn't had children with W and always acted like he didn't want kids! As messed up as it is, the belief that what we had was truly special and meaningful gave me hope and helped me be able to continue with it.

 

Whatever it was, "real" love or not, it wasn't enough. I know that logically and am trying to get my heart to catch on!

 

 

So did mine. Although he does have children with his W ...and I mean A LOT of children. But he was overly protective as well, always wanted me to "have his babies". I often wonder if this wasn't intentionally a game, you know give the words since his actions damn sure don't show it. OR if those were things that he wished.

 

Again, I will never know the answers.

[SoMovinOn]

He probably thought he loved you, but he really loved how you made him feel. That speaks to his emotional maturity, not yours. What it does mean about you, though, is that you ARE lovable.

 

Hang in there. You will feel better in time.

 

That's kind of where I was going to go ... that it's possible that *he* believed everything he felt and did over the past 4 years was real. He may even still feel those things, or, he may have discovered he feels differently, or, he may have changed how he feels. Just because someone says one thing, then says the opposite or acts differently, doesn't mean they were lying - although, that is one of the possibilities as well.

[So Very Confused]

I don't think it was all a lie. I'm sure he loved you in his own way. It's impossible to know what his motivations were or what his feeling were. All you really have is what his actions were.

 

I agree with the others that it's not really useful to spend a lot of time dwelling on that aspect of it though. The thing you really need to focus on is how to move on with the rest of your life.

 

The bottom line is, when push came to shove, he shoved. You need to do what's best for you and choose YOU first!

[kareena]

I really want to tell you something that would be helpful but I am in no position to do so since I am still in an A with MM,so I guess what I'm trying to say is..I feel your pain and I'm so sorry you are hurting,I truly hope things get better for you and for what its worth,I think he did love you(but like wannabdone said) just not enough..Take Care.

[Gentlegirl]

As I try and continue moving on with my life and move past the extreme mess I got myself into for the last 3 and a half years, I find myself trying to convince myself of certain things.

 

I've accepted that I'm not his first choice, and that in itself is helping me to start moving on emotionally. Where I'm getting held up is - was the last nearly four years of my life an entire lie? Was none of his love for me real? Did we not share a special bond and connection? When he chose to come and spend every single morning with me and at least 2 nights every week with me, and asked me to spend weekends with him - when we called/txt each other daily and shared Everything with each other... Was all that NOT because he truly loved me? Did he ever really love me at all? Reconciling his actions AND words for the last few years with his actions since being concretely discovered is very difficult for me. While I am reminding myself "He did not chose to leave and be with you," I also believe that the love is still there, and just because he was Found Out, doesn't mean his feelings have changed. Does he really and truly want nothing to do with me now, and if that is true, how could he have felt the way he showed me he felt?

 

It's only been a week, and he has attempted to call/see me everyday since (it's been 24 hrs since the last) so I know that it is still way too soon to tell what will be. But does anybody have any advice about or insight into whether or not what you had with this person was real, or a total fantasy/lie?

 

PS - I know we all want our situations to be unique; I'm just trying to figure out how to move forward when I'm unsure about certain things, like the reality of what it was we had.

 

Sorry , but your situation wasn't unique. It almost mirrors my own. If you read here, you will find that there are monay others like your won also.

 

I am over 9 months NC now.

 

From time to time I still struggle with those same questions that you ask yourself. I sitll get the same replies...... zilch.

 

I am accepting that I will never know the answers. It is becoming less important to me now. It's just a matter of time and acceptance that I will never see him again or know the truth.

 

Even if I were to speak with xMM there's no way on god's good earth I'd believe one word he said anymore.

 

GG

[mzdolphin]

He probably thought he loved you, but he really loved how you made him feel. That speaks to his emotional maturity, not yours. What it does mean about you, though, is that you ARE lovable.

 

Hang in there. You will feel better in time.

 

 

 

Awesome post. I'll add, try to forget what they wanted and think about getting what you want. That situation was not what you wanted and so you're opting out. He was not offering you what you wanted and you had the strength to recognize this and end it.

[freestyle]

There are times in life when the only closure you will ever get from a relationship is what you create for yourself................

 

(*not trying to come across as if I'm on a high-horse---this is just something I'm coming to discover for myself............*)

 

There are some people who will never be able to provide you with closure, because they are too broken themselves---they are incapable of owning their own behavior, they can't face their own demons----so you may never get an apology, or an explanation, or the truth.........

[Confused4Now]

Sorry , but your situation wasn't unique. It almost mirrors my own. If you read here, you will find that there are monay others like your won also.

 

I am over 9 months NC now.

 

From time to time I still struggle with those same questions that you ask yourself. I sitll get the same replies...... zilch.

 

I am accepting that I will never know the answers. It is becoming less important to me now. It's just a matter of time and acceptance that I will never see him again or know the truth.

 

Even if I were to speak with xMM there's no way on god's good earth I'd believe one word he said anymore.

 

GG

I echo what you said...mine is 6 months of NC and mine was a xMW. There is nothing she could say to me...it would be lies and excuses.

[shakti]

I like this thread, these are thoughts I'm feeling right now. Thank you for sharing and giving me the strength NOT to reply...