Hello

[reboot]

Another BH here, and trust me, he would rather know the truth.

[kareena]

Hey Rick,

I'm sorry that you are going through this it must really hurt but honestly It seems like you are obsessing too much about it(as A's tend to make you do,trust me I know!) I think that the fact that you never got your closure plays a huge role in the way you are feeling.

 

I can't tell you whether she loved you or not,but what I can tell you is that she doesn't seem to want this anymore.Whatever the reason is,you should try to let it go..let HER go.Maybe this is her way of dealing with it! I think that it would do you good to try and get her out of your system,I know that's easier said than done but regardless of what's going on with your marriage you need to try and move on from this woman for your own emotional health.

 

I would like to add one more thing,it seems to me that you and your W have deeper issues than this A and this was probably just the straw that broke the camels back so to speak. I f you are unhappy in your marriage,and if things are still not working out even after counseling and all that..then maybe the two of you should try to reach an agreement by which you end things peacefully and then you can both have the freedom to explore other options and find happiness. I hope this helps,best of luck

[awkward]

Wow this sounds like an incredibly hurtful situation. I'm sorry you are hurting. I'm not sure how the OW feels and don't have the big answer to "why". Her actions show that she isn't interested in continuing the affair right now and that's probably all the closure you will ever get from her.

 

Have you given much thought to how your wife is handling this? In your other thread you said she lost a bunch of weight. How is her health? Do you know if she is considering an affair/revenge affair of her own or does she seem interested in marriage counseling to try and reconcile?

[SoMovinOn]

Rick... as for telling her H ... as a BH, my advice to you would be to leave anything between OW and her H between them. I don't think you getting further involved in their life would help anyone.

 

A BS usually knows enough, or gets a gut feeling at least, that something is going on. They can use that as an opportunity to ask for the truth, and they will know enough or get a gut feeling as to whether or not they are getting the truth. The ability of their marriage to survive, if that is what they choose to shoot for, is largely dependent on those two things working well - that they are close enough and connected enough for the BS to at least have an idea that something is wrong, and that they can communicate well enough and honestly enough to work through it. If the marriage is dependent on third parties providing the "honesty", it's doomed anyway.

[wannabdone]

I agree there are good points on both end. However, I have never understood when a BS tells someone's spouse. Doesn't that leave a huge opportunity for the person that has been sleeping with their spouse to be possibly single? I've never understood why a BS would want that to happen. I would be working to make sure that person stayed as "unavailable" as possible.

 

But, in the end, personally I would just work on you and your M. Don't show her any emotion either way. As manipulative as she is....she might some how like the emotion, whether its negative or positive. You know narcasstics love any kind of attention they can get. Best and only way to deal with them is RUN.

[Gentlegirl]

I wonder since you married at a very young age, whether you and your wife have not grown together.

 

People change in every way over the years.

 

What you thought was ideal at one time might not be what you want now for the rest of your life.

 

JUst saying... it could be the reason you wanted to try the grass on the other side of the fence so to speak.

 

 

You need to have GREAT BIG THINKS about what YOU really want. If you aren't happy with your M... your W isn't going to be either.

 

Cheers,

GG

[RickFox]

First off, I want to thank most everyone for their civility, it's refreshing to see a disagreement without resorting to namecalling and I truly respect each person's thoughts as they've laid them out.

 

I can't explain it but after reading the responses from yesterday I find myself more at peace and willing to let the 'fantasy' of what once was, go.

 

I have seen her vehicle on the road and avoided even looking her way, I was in front of her this morning and avoided looking her way when she was dropping off her kid (who ran up to me and gave me a hug). I don't feel the tug or the intense sadness I was feeling the other day. I do want to make amends with my wife and will be working towards that on a daily basis.

 

If we do not survive then I will know that I and she gave it our very best shot with no outside interference. If my xMW acts as though I don't exist, she has done me a great favor and I will cease to exist to her as she will to me. I can't lie, there will always be memories but they are just that. her daughter was doused in the vanilla type perfume she wore around me and it was so heavy this morning it actually made my heart drop a bit and skip a beat because I thought she was near........but I didn't feel the need nor want...as I said, they are memories and that is what they will remain.

 

I want to make new memories with my wife and I can say that it's because of reading these responses I've found the strength to make it day by day and not come home and cry.

 

On a side note, upon talking to a mutual acquaintance, she volunteered that the xMW has gained quite a bit of weight from where she once was, something I thougth I saw but wasn't sure. She's either depressed and is eating without exercising or she's happy at home and it's happy weight. Either way, it made me smile and Jimmy Crackcorn and I don't care.... she ain't mine, she never was, and she never will be.

[alexandria35]

I agree there are good points on both end. However, I have never understood when a BS tells someone's spouse. Doesn't that leave a huge opportunity for the person that has been sleeping with their spouse to be possibly single? I've never understood why a BS would want that to happen. I would be working to make sure that person stayed as "unavailable" as possible.

 

But, in the end, personally I would just work on you and your M. Don't show her any emotion either way. As manipulative as she is....she might some how like the emotion, whether its negative or positive. You know narcasstics love any kind of attention they can get. Best and only way to deal with them is RUN.

 

I see what you are saying but in reality I don't think the other BS just ups and tosses out their cheating spouse immediately. In the situation where both the affair partners are already married, obviously being married didn't make them unavailable in the first place. If the OP's spouse informed the other BS, his affair partner would most likely tell her husband that it was all lies. She might confess but I suspect she would lie. Either way her husband would start questioning her and paying more attention to what his wife is doing thereby making her less available.

[Emme]

Thank you, I know they will but it is sometimes hard to remember it when the world around you seems dark.

 

As far as dating history, I dated before I met my wife, but I wasn't a manwhore, being raised by my mom I was told and expected to treat women with respect (screwed up there eh). My relationships were not one night stands and when I met my wife, we were in junior college, we dated for three years before we decided to get married and yes, we were young. I was 22 and she was 20. My wife has even less dating history.

 

Normally, I have a specific look I go for and the 'alternative' look is not one of them so yeah I was shocked a bit but it was her outgoing personality and semi obnoxious behavior that intrigued me. My wife is very prim and proper, so essentially they are polar opposites.

 

You were young. The both of you. You never got he chance to know what your likes and dislikes were. Life surprises you all the time. Every day you are learning something new. Just be accepting of it and don't turn it into something negative.

 

 

My wife is a good woman, a patient and kind woman, and there are days where I have told her to call the xMW's H and tell him, meet him and show him the texts. Then I've gotten a voice in my head that says, that will free her from her punishment that her punishment is her marriage. I still wonder if he should know but then that opens up another set of issues and I think I've got enough of those.

 

STAY IN YOUR LANE! You have your own issues to deal with. If I could find a old post I made explaining why you should not tell the spouse I would post it. I tried looking for it but I can't find it. Worry about you and your family. The OW is on her own.

[RickFox]

Aargh,

 

Woke up and am feeling a bit sad, will this roller coaster of emotion ever end?!?!?!!

 

I'm sad because nothing is the same as it once was and it's all my fault. Why is it when I make progress in my emotions and feelings I it feels like I take two steps back. Why would smelling her perfume on her daughter evoke these feelings, why am I so dumb to think she sprayed it on her on purpose, why can't I realize that I'm holding onto memories that mean nothing at all as the last time I saw her and we were near each other I didnt feel that pull but I hold onto the pull I felt when we were sneaking around.......is this the addiction....I want to get thru this I don't want to be sad... I'm going back to sleep so I don't think anymore. F@@$& why am I doing this to myself

[Circular]

Rick, whatever you do don't beat yourself up about it, it's not abnormal at all what you are experiencing. It is going to take time.

 

What people typically underestimate is what actually happens within the brain when we meet someone and act on our attraction with them. Their is a lot of published research on this, but your brain releases a lot of chemicals that create that 'high' you feel when you are with that person, that infatuation, giddiness, etc.. one particular hormone is oxytocin this is a very potent chemical that creates the feeling of attachment/bond. While you're going through this process your brain is basically creating new neuropathways and those new paths are being positively reinforced every time you're with that person and the more intimate you become the higher the dose of those chemicals.

 

The downside of all this is what you're experiencing right now, it's primarily withdraw from the chemicals but it's secondarily that you've formed these new paths in your brain that are part of attachment to another person. Thing is it takes a long time for those things to atrophy and quite honestly based on a lot of things I've read they don't ever disappear 100% -- What you can do to lessen the impact is work on being more intimate with your wife, be more playful, do more fun things, touch and cuddle a lot more, for me that's helped a ton but quite honestly I still have some bad days here and there.

 

It is like an addiction. I think the part about it that really is difficult is that there are times where I feel 100% over it, I'm fine, I feel 'whatever' about xmw, yet all it takes is an email or some form of contact and that path starts getting reinforced again and you'll be surprised how what you think in your head and how your body responds is 100% opposed.

[RickFox]

So heres a question for folks. For those who were involved with a MM or MW , whether you were married or not, was/is NC truly NC or did they always try to wiggle their way back in your life at some point. This scares me. Perhaps I should start a new thread

[thomasb]

Rick, the OW in my case went nuts when I dumped her and confessed to my wife. A barrage of emails, phone calls, etc. She even harrased my small children at a bus stop. It did not stop until we received a restraining order and moved out of state. Her cousin was a frie4nd and she tried to get her to give me messages for years. It made me sick that i brought that into my families lives.

I wonder how it made your wife feel smelling that perfume on you? You need to think of things like that rather than how it makes you feel. Turn it back around and see her pain and you will start healing your marriage.

[Circular]

Well, NC is about what YOU do to prevent contact. That said there are a lot of pieces to the puzzle about whether NC is going to work 100% or not. There's a high percentage rate of breaking NC, especially in an A because there's a lot of unfinished/unresolved feelings and 'what if' questions floating around in both APs minds. I think a lot of it has to do with how connected/attached you became during the A.

 

In my case it has been difficult. xMW and I were friends for a few years before things started changing between us and we started being more open about our mutual attraction for each other. We shared everything with each other and it became an EA and then evolved into a PA, I fell deeply for her. The A itself I'd say lasted around 20 months. In the end I made the decision that I needed to walk away from it for the best of everyone especially her children. We had no d-day.

 

NC lasted about 45 days, then she broke it I responded with a short response and left it at that. Then about two weeks later she broke NC again, I ignored it. Then I broke it, then she broke it... on and on. Probably the big irony of all the LC (Limited Contact) is none of it has been about the A, it's all been quite 'friendly' and a bit awkward. I'd say now we're at a point where it's every 3 months or so. Myself I've been treating it like we're slowly drifting apart, what communication we do have I don't focus on anything emotional really, just simple stuff. It's hard to lose someone that was once a good friend, you'll find a lot of people have the same sentiment that of all the things in an A the thing they miss the most is the friendship.

[East7]

Rick, whatever you do don't beat yourself up about it, it's not abnormal at all what you are experiencing. It is going to take time.

It is like an addiction. I think the part about it that really is difficult is that there are times where I feel 100% over it, I'm fine, I feel 'whatever' about xmw, yet all it takes is an email or some form of contact and that path starts getting reinforced again and you'll be surprised how what you think in your head and how your body responds is 100% opposed.

 

This explains perfectly what happens after the A ends.

 

For months after the the A ended I was so sad that sometimes I wanted to sit and cry ! No woman had broken my heart so badly than MW. I used to hate and miss her at same time. For many times I thought I was over her and feeling better and stronger; then it took an e-mail or a call to see how oddly I would throw away all the anger and would be so happy just because she talked to me How sick is that ?

 

I respected her too much for blocking her but everytime she came back it would destroy all the progress I had made to get over her. It is like being caught by hundreds of strings that you have slowly cut one by one then it takes a sweet talk to feel that "old feeling" and to tie them all over again.

 

What I learned is that whatever people tell you, you will not go NC until you are not ready in your heart to cut all the ties. But believe me, NC is the only way to heal.

[phillyfan]

I wonder how it made your wife feel smelling that perfume on you?

 

Dude best eva post. U aint thinkin how much damage u r doin, how u mite be damagin things at home so bad n u dont even know it.

 

Rite now losin the OW mite feel like the worst thing eva but thts becos u take 4 granted u stil have ur wife, ur home, ur life togetha, ur families. But when/if that disapears wen the wife has had enuf then losin the OW aint gona seem like the center of ur world no more.

[RickFox]

Rick, the OW in my case went nuts when I dumped her and confessed to my wife. A barrage of emails, phone calls, etc. She even harrased my small children at a bus stop. It did not stop until we received a restraining order and moved out of state. Her cousin was a frie4nd and she tried to get her to give me messages for years. It made me sick that i brought that into my families lives.

I wonder how it made your wife feel smelling that perfume on you? You need to think of things like that rather than how it makes you feel. Turn it back around and see her pain and you will start healing your marriage.

 

Interesting you mention her smelling her on me, as my wife told me she used to pick up my clothes and smell them, but she never smelled her on me, for whatever reason. My wife has a nose that can pick up one small smoke particle and know I was around someone smoking or if I was the one doing it.

 

It has made me sick about what I've done to my wife, worse about what I feel right, I mean the choice is clear, my wife is loyal and has never done to me what this woman did and I see her pain every day I look at her and see her struggle to smile. It kills me inside, so much so that sometimes I think she'd be better off without me and that I don't deserve a woman like her, someone so loving, loyal and forgiving.

 

It kills me even more knowing I am a selfish person who thought of only their own needs and wants at the expense of hers and that I still have those thoughts...I want them gone..I want my head cleared.

[RickFox]

This explains perfectly what happens after the A ends.

 

For months after the the A ended I was so sad that sometimes I wanted to sit and cry ! No woman had broken my heart so badly than MW. I used to hate and miss her at same time. For many times I thought I was over her and feeling better and stronger; then it took an e-mail or a call to see how oddly I would throw away all the anger and would be so happy just because she talked to me How sick is that ?

 

I respected her too much for blocking her but everytime she came back it would destroy all the progress I had made to get over her. It is like being caught by hundreds of strings that you have slowly cut one by one then it takes a sweet talk to feel that "old feeling" and to tie them all over again.

 

What I learned is that whatever people tell you, you will not go NC until you are not ready in your heart to cut all the ties. But believe me, NC is the only way to heal.

 

Pretty much sums up how my emotions are except when Im around my wife, for the most part, I am able to focus on her. Working night shift, I have too much down time during the day, the thoughts come right on in no matter how much I fight them. Add to that it is somehow inevitable I will see the OW on the road and even if I don't look over I know it's her.

 

We never contacted by email, the fake facebook page I made is not valid and she unfriended me almost immediately, our primary communications was texting. She was texting all the time to people so her husband never questioned her, he had grown accustomed to it.

 

I look at all the things she's done, I look back and see it was all about her, how she disrespected her husband (as did I) and my wife and me, how she had the control of the whole thing and there are times in a moment of weakness if she were to contact me I imagine running to her and f'ing everything up again.

 

Many mention narcissism, I don't know if that's her, I was hoping I could get a vague analyzation of her by my description as Im the kind of person that likes to understand everything I can. I was told by a female friend who used to go after married men that the OW was in her "self preservation phase", doing everything to save her marriage, her security, but that she was going to end up contacting me soon when the dust settled

 

At first I was excited, this was a little while back, I thought we could re establish our friendship as the ending of that hurts alot more than other aspects, and then I kept counting the days and wondering when and torturing myself. I make myself realize that her NCing me was a good thing but that small part still wishes she would, knowing it would destroy any progress I made and that I swore to my wife I'd tell her if it happened.

 

I'd almost rather suffer all this than have her try and reintroduce herself into my life, and I wonder how she'd approach it seeing as to how she has acted since it ended. I'm sure it might be a text saying Hi, I know you hate me but...... see even now I torture myself.

 

How do you stop your mind from working...I sleep Im okay, I work out, Im okay, Im at work Im okay...but when Im home, it's the devils playground in my mind. I felt the same as the quoted poster, no one has hurt me so intensely as this xMW has, nobody has made me sit around and cry for no reason other than a song on than her.....

 

When I told her at one point how much I missed her she said, "Im nothing special, you'll see" I told her she was to me and she brushed it off....I can see her smiling at my pain and yet I would have dropped everything to be with her just one more time. I hate this psychological addiction............f'in hate it.

 

Even now I can feel the tears welling up and I tell myself quit it dumbass, suck it up and move on and so I do.......slowly........with alot of trouble.

[East7]

This is so painful to read.

 

She will come back ! That is for sure, they always come back when the dust settles. And while hating her, you will secretly hope that she will contact you because part of you won't let go.

 

It will be hard but you are lucky to have a loving wife. Many OM suffer in silence because either they can't tell their wives or they are single and too ashamed to share their pain with friends.

[RickFox]

It's painful to talk about, because Im tired of being in pain. I can say that during this ordeal, for the FIRST TIME in my entire life, I understood exactly why some people commit suicide. Because they feel there is no end in sight to the pain they are feeling. I said I understand it, but not that I want to do it. I know the pain will end and I will move on and I will get thru this.

 

I have talked my friends ears off, so much so that I know they are tired of it, and I can't talk about it anymore but it truly does help, even coming on here and crying and typing and snotting all over myself while talking to anonymous folks, it helps me move forward a bit. I felt so empowered yesterday after talking to you all....I live in a world, a career where feelings are not a part of the game.

 

I know it seems like Im not focused on my wife, and I am, but the damage is done and Im trying to find ways to deal with it and continue to heal...and if it means I have to be honest and say that there is a small small part of me that longs for contact from the OW then i am not doing myself any good by lying and saying I hate her and never want to hear from her again. Just like someone said before, they hate the OW and then find themselves not hating them.

 

I always wanted her to be happy, but not at my misery. I just want to forget she and I ever happened and that is impossible. I'd rather suffer these emotions every day than have her contact me and reopen wounds.

 

Why? Why would she come back? What would she have to gain? Doesn't she know or care that she caused pain, what kind of person wants to hurt someone so bad again?

 

Thanks for listening or reading as the case may be.

[East7]

Why? Why would she come back? What would she have to gain? Doesn't she know or care that she caused pain, what kind of person wants to hurt someone so bad again?

 

Because she knows you love her and when she will be bored or have a fight with hubby, she will come back to you to caress her ego. Because she doesn't care what you feel or how much it hurts you, it is all about her and if she wants to have you back she will do anything to drag you back.

 

It is like the Wolf in the Little Redhood tale . She will tell you ALL the sweet words it takes to make you cave in.

[Gentlegirl]

Because she knows you love her and when she will be bored or have a fight with hubby, she will come back to you to caress her ego. Because she doesn't care what you feel or how much it hurts you, it is all about her and if she wants to have you back she will do anything to drag you back.

 

It is like the Wolf in the Little Redhood tale . She will tell you ALL the sweet words it takes to make you cave in.

xMM even promised we would go to Africa together because he knew how much I wanted to go back there.

 

I caved so many times because he scattered crumbs of hope.

 

If you go back, it will be harder on you next time you split with her.

 

GG

[Circular]

It's painful to talk about, because Im tired of being in pain. I can say that during this ordeal, for the FIRST TIME in my entire life, I understood exactly why some people commit suicide. Because they feel there is no end in sight to the pain they are feeling. I said I understand it, but not that I want to do it. I know the pain will end and I will move on and I will get thru this.

 

I have talked my friends ears off, so much so that I know they are tired of it, and I can't talk about it anymore but it truly does help, even coming on here and crying and typing and snotting all over myself while talking to anonymous folks, it helps me move forward a bit. I felt so empowered yesterday after talking to you all....I live in a world, a career where feelings are not a part of the game.

 

I know it seems like Im not focused on my wife, and I am, but the damage is done and Im trying to find ways to deal with it and continue to heal...and if it means I have to be honest and say that there is a small small part of me that longs for contact from the OW then i am not doing myself any good by lying and saying I hate her and never want to hear from her again. Just like someone said before, they hate the OW and then find themselves not hating them.

 

I always wanted her to be happy, but not at my misery. I just want to forget she and I ever happened and that is impossible. I'd rather suffer these emotions every day than have her contact me and reopen wounds.

 

Why? Why would she come back? What would she have to gain? Doesn't she know or care that she caused pain, what kind of person wants to hurt someone so bad again?

 

Thanks for listening or reading as the case may be.

 

Why would she contact you? Everyone seems to ask that question. It's actually a quite simple answer.

 

YOU are her addiction as much as SHE is your addiction. It's a two-way road, this wasn't just Rick, it takes two people for this to happen, the sooner you realize that the sooner you'll understand the dilemma and why most likely she will contact you. If she doesn't it's actually more likely she's showing you respect for screwing up your home life. I know that sounds crazy but really think about it, the only other path is that she's mentally ill, which isn't beyond the realm of possibility.

 

What typically happens when you first 'break up' is both parties treat it like they are breaking up in reality, you know when you date someone for a period of time. Now in the real-world of dating we all know we're qualifying the people we date as we go along. If something becomes a deal-breaker then we break-up knowing it's not a good fit and move on to the next person, we'll eventually meet someone and date them for a longer period of time 2-3 years, maybe we'll decide to break up at that point, BUT if we don't find anything that's a real deal-killer than we go the next levels in the relationship; like you and your wife. An A never gets to that point, how can it? You never spend that much time with the person, when you see them you know you have limited time, you always make the best of the situation, there's never any real closure because you're never certain if it's the A dynamic or if it's reality.

[wannabdone]

It's painful to talk about, because Im tired of being in pain. I can say that during this ordeal, for the FIRST TIME in my entire life, I understood exactly why some people commit suicide. Because they feel there is no end in sight to the pain they are feeling. I said I understand it, but not that I want to do it. I know the pain will end and I will move on and I will get thru this.

 

I have talked my friends ears off, so much so that I know they are tired of it, and I can't talk about it anymore but it truly does help, even coming on here and crying and typing and snotting all over myself while talking to anonymous folks, it helps me move forward a bit. I felt so empowered yesterday after talking to you all....I live in a world, a career where feelings are not a part of the game.

 

I know it seems like Im not focused on my wife, and I am, but the damage is done and Im trying to find ways to deal with it and continue to heal...and if it means I have to be honest and say that there is a small small part of me that longs for contact from the OW then i am not doing myself any good by lying and saying I hate her and never want to hear from her again. Just like someone said before, they hate the OW and then find themselves not hating them.

 

I always wanted her to be happy, but not at my misery. I just want to forget she and I ever happened and that is impossible. I'd rather suffer these emotions every day than have her contact me and reopen wounds.

 

Why? Why would she come back? What would she have to gain? Doesn't she know or care that she caused pain, what kind of person wants to hurt someone so bad again?

 

Thanks for listening or reading as the case may be.

 

 

I think that one of the HARDEST things to do is rebuilding a M, and wanting to, but all the while, hurting and grieving the loss of another R. You can't talk through it, and many times your spouse will probably ask you what is wrong. And you so badly want to say "i'm hurting", but so are they, and we did it to them, so we can't talk through it. Its awful. I understand what you are saying.

[Emme]

Even now I can feel the tears welling up and I tell myself quit it dumbass, suck it up and move on and so I do.......slowly........with alot of trouble.

 

 

It's all a part of the healing process. I still have days and nights where I catch myself in tears. It's a overwhelming feeling that rushes from your brain all the way down to your feet. It was a relationship. Just as loosing something in your life that you were attached to you do have to mourn. I'm past 6 months and still I feel it every day. Its not as powerful. But I feel the emotions still. Give it time, accept the process. Don't dismiss it. Eventually you will hopefully feel no more pain.