Was called a mean bitch the other day just because I have high standards.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

I hate to say it, but the fact that you believe in the Adam and eve story automatically discredits a lot of the stuff you believe or say for me. Your ability to reason logically is questionable for me just because of that.

 

In short, I couldn't care less about the book of genesis.

 

I'm a Christian and I believe in the Adam and Eve "story". You've agreed with a few of my posts mesmerized. Does that now discredit that?

 

If you look at the very fundementals of that "story" both men and women are still playing it out..over and over and over again. Eve's sin being that she didn't have enough trust and faith in God. She thought he was holding out for her. So she took control into her own hands and made a grave mistake. How many women today struggle with control in their daily lives? How many women struggle to give trust and faith in their own men and make themselves vunerable to them? Many.

 

And Adam's sin was that he stood next to Eve and did nothing. He was complacent because of his fear. How many men do you know that don't stand up and fight for themselves or for their partners? That zone out and shut down when things become too heated and walk away instead of talking charge of a situation or dealing with it straight on?

 

There are so many stereotypes about dynamics between men and women that are traced back to this core "story" of Adam and Eve.

Edited October 6, 2011 by Disenchantedly Yours

[musemaj11]

Yea, totally a true story.

 

I mean only a woman would fall for a talking snake's bullcrap. LOL

[joystickd]

You have a preference and that is what you like. All I say is that is something that maybe a challenge for you. I suggest coming up with a better way to say it.

My other thing is to the other people posting on here why the men this and women that. Both genders have issues in dating. I applaud the lady that posted this because at least she is honest and direct about something she knows she wants. Men and women hate to be honest and direct about things. If both genders would just cut the crap the dating experience would be a whole lot better.

[LittleTiger]

You can't possibly be serious??? I was sure those movies were all based on true stories

 

You're the one who pointed out that James Bond was 'a bad boy' and was using 'government money'!

 

So now you are a neuroscientist? Where exactly are you getting this nonsense? You brain is not built to be attracted to men who pay for dates (there was no such thing as "dating" until about 100 years ago).

 

I didn't say anywhere that women's brains are built to be attracted to men who pay for dates - the money and the 'paying' is not the point, it's the attitude that is attractive......and, yes, I do know something about brain chemistry!

 

Just as biology dictates men can't help but be aroused by the sight of a young, naked women, women can't help being attracted to a certain type of man.

 

I don't really understand why you have a bee in your bonnet about this anyway. According to this thread there are, apparently, plenty of women who presumably get 'turned on' by men who say 'your share of the bill is X' so why don't you just go out and find one?

 

When I was briefly single at the age of 43, I didn't moan about the undeniable fact that men are biologically drawn to women a lot younger than I am - instead I found one who, despite his perfectly normal 'biological tendencies', values other qualities over youth.

[LittleTiger]

I'm not twisting anyone's point.

 

You have your preferences, and they are your's alone. You don't speak for me or anyone else.

 

Ever heard of Kinsey? He did a very nice study of men's and women's sexual preferences. Rated them on a scale from 1-10. One being 100% homosexual. 10 being 100% heterosexual.

 

The fact that there are 9 numbers between there shows there is more variation in a single gender than there are between genders in terms of sexual tastes.

 

Again, your version of what makes someone hot or not is just yours. And the LS forum certainly is not a valid 'snapshot' of humanity either.

 

I'm not speaking for you - you're obviously one of the exceptions I mentioned - there are always exceptions, and what I'm talking about is not preference, it's biology.

 

Yes, I've heard of Kinsey's study which 'is' about preference and relates to a scale of heterosexuality and homosexuality (self-scored!), which is not what we're discussing here. We are, or at least I am, talking about the differences in men's and women's brains. 'Most' men's and women's brains - not every single one - obviously! You can argue with me on this until the cows come home but it won't make it any less factual. We don't know very much about the human brain, but we do know that men and women are wired differently!

 

My point is merely that people can't help what they are attracted to, because it is innate! A biological tendency! If you find it a turn on working out your share of the bill after dinner, I'm not going to argue with you. I do know that most women do not find that a turn on - they may be happy to do it and feel it's 'fair' etc but it doesn't 'turn them on'!.

 

We read so often from men on LS who are annoyed with women for being attracted to tall, confident, alpha males - a biological tendency. I've never read a single thread from a woman complaining about how men are always attracted to young 'hot' women - also a biological tendency.

 

Being attracted to a certain kind of man does not make a woman a 'mean b*itch' any more than a man being attracted to a certain kind of woman, makes him a 'b*stard'. We all make choices in our mates which override our biological tendencies because we have evolved since our caveman days but we are still human 'animals'. Why is it that people are so uncomfortable with that? It's not being used as an excuse for what society considers 'bad' or 'unacceptable' behaviour, it just is what it is.

[LittleTiger]

This thread has seriously made me rethink some things and made me realize that with the exception of the hyper militant misandrists traditional woman often have a lower opinion of men than feminists. No decent man wants a woman who thinks as lowly of men as the OP does. Most men don't want a woman who thinks of him as nothing good but sticks around because he has money. We might like generous with a woman that loves us but that love has to be their in the first place. If you really love each other why not just splurge on each other?

 

I'm a fairly traditional woman (not entirely because I do like to work and I'm probably more 'headstrong' than most) and I absolutely love men. I have a huge amount of respect for them and their unique masculine qualities, which I consider very different from my own feminine qualities.

 

I haven't read the whole thread but some of the OPs posts do indicate a lack of respect for men. Woggle, please do not take this one example and assume all 'traditional' thinking women are like this. We definitely are not.

 

In my own fairly traditional relationship my man makes more money than I do and, while he can and does 'splurge' on me occasionally, I can't afford to 'splurge' on him. If I could, I would. I would give him the world if it was in my power. As it stands, that's not possible, so instead I give him as much as I can in other ways. On balance, I may even 'give' more but since we don't 'keep score', who knows and who cares?

[ChessPieceFace]

I forgot I was in America. My bad. The men are different here.

 

I didn't walk out on him, but I don't want to see him again.

 

Dating profile? What dating profile?

 

And it's not shallow. When you bust your ass cleaning their entire place, doing their laundry and making sure there is a warm meal on the table for when they get home, they sure as hell be able to make up for the work and money I lost from staying home and doing all that for them.

 

Right right. This is America. No chivalry. Different mentality. *sigh* why did I bother making a thread about this...

 

You sound like what you claim you are not, in your thread title.

 

The women in America are far more to blame than the men.

 

Enjoy your bitterness...

[Woggle]

I don't believe all traditional women lack respect for men and I know there are some modern types who believe men are obsolete now that women have careers. What I meant to say was that attitudes like this are why more and more men want nothing to do nothing being gentlemen or being white knights for a woman. Attitudes like this are ruining it for good women who just want a gentlemen to sweep them off their feet.

 

I don't believe in making sure everything is 100% equal and splitting the bill every time but at least be flexible and don't treat me as a walking wallet.

[Eve]

I don't believe all traditional women lack respect for men and I know there are some modern types who believe men are obsolete now that women have careers. What I meant to say was that attitudes like this are why more and more men want nothing to do nothing being gentlemen or being white knights for a woman. Attitudes like this are ruining it for good women who just want a gentlemen to sweep them off their feet.

 

I don't believe in making sure everything is 100% equal and splitting the bill every time but at least be flexible and don't treat me as a walking wallet.

 

Glad you have thought more about this.

 

I reckon the OP thinks she must behave as such to get what she wants and probably has never been in love. Still, there are some men who will suscribe to the lifestyle she wants.

 

Overall, I would say that it is a bargain which could end up with her missing the boat entirely and could only really work if she was independantly wealthy herself.

 

*Shrugs*

 

Choices are choices. I do not see the OP as having a traditional mindset... more E-Entertainment Channel, without the money.

 

Take care,

Eve x

Edited October 6, 2011 by Eve

[LittleTiger]

I don't believe all traditional women lack respect for men and I know there are some modern types who believe men are obsolete now that women have careers. What I meant to say was that attitudes like this are why more and more men want nothing to do nothing being gentlemen or being white knights for a woman. Attitudes like this are ruining it for good women who just want a gentlemen to sweep them off their feet.

 

I don't believe in making sure everything is 100% equal and splitting the bill every time but at least be flexible and don't treat me as a walking wallet.

 

That's good Woggle. I'm glad you're not allowing one woman (or one thread) to sway you - as you sometimes do.

 

Don't worry too much about some women's attitudes ruining it for 'good women'. We usually find our gentlemen in the end - we just have to look a bit harder.

 

Even the OP will eventually find the kind of man she wants if she waits long enough - some men don't mind being a walking wallet because they don't have much else to offer. I don't know why anyone would want that kind of man but some women clearly do and it's obviously their choice.

[denise_xo]

I'm a Christian and I believe in the Adam and Eve "story". You've agreed with a few of my posts mesmerized. Does that now discredit that?

 

If you look at the very fundementals of that "story" both men and women are still playing it out..over and over and over again. Eve's sin being that she didn't have enough trust and faith in God. She thought he was holding out for her. So she took control into her own hands and made a grave mistake. How many women today struggle with control in their daily lives? How many women struggle to give trust and faith in their own men and make themselves vunerable to them? Many.

 

And Adam's sin was that he stood next to Eve and did nothing. He was complacent because of his fear. How many men do you know that don't stand up and fight for themselves or for their partners? That zone out and shut down when things become too heated and walk away instead of talking charge of a situation or dealing with it straight on?

 

There are so many stereotypes about dynamics between men and women that are traced back to this core "story" of Adam and Eve.

 

How many men today struggle with control in their daily lives? How many men struggle to give trust and faith in their own women and make themselves vunerable to them? I know and hear of many.

 

How many women do you know that don't stand up and fight for themselves or for their partners? That zone out and shut down when things become too heated and walk away instead of talking charge of a situation or dealing with it straight on? I know and hear of many.

 

Anything can be made to fit into a story if you really want it to, especially one where the lessons are sufficiently general.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Yea, totally a true story.

 

I mean only a woman would fall for a talking snake's bullcrap. LOL

 

 

Adam stood next to Eve when the snake offered her the fruit. He took the snake's bullcrap just as much.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

How many men today struggle with control in their daily lives? How many men struggle to give trust and faith in their own women and make themselves vunerable to them? I know and hear of many.

 

How many women do you know that don't stand up and fight for themselves or for their partners? That zone out and shut down when things become too heated and walk away instead of talking charge of a situation or dealing with it straight on? I know and hear of many.

 

Anything can be made to fit into a story if you really want it to, especially one where the lessons are sufficiently general.

 

I'm sorry but I don't see the examples you stated reflected in real life nearly as much as the other way around. Naturally, there are variations to every story but if you strip away the gloss and get to the fundementals, you see that every story leads back to that one. The Bible isn't about "anything being made to fit a story". In general, men struggle with standing up for themselves or their families and really fighting/protecting something. And women struggle with issues of control and trust and thinking they always know best.

[stillafool]

I'm just gonna say... the OP has as much right to want what she wants as the rest of us...

 

She might be going about it the wrong way... but if she's willing to compromise on other things (fidelity, looks, age, love, etc) it is quite possible she can find someone willing to pay her way.

 

If she doesn't need to be 'in love'... then one could argue that opens up more options in other ways.

 

I think what I, and many others, might be objecting to is the ACT of pretending to love someone... just to get their $$.

 

 

Why can't she just be alone?

[xxoo]

I'm just gonna say... the OP has as much right to want what she wants as the rest of us....

 

She has the right to want it, but not the right to have what she wants.

 

Unrealistic expectations will often lead to frustration. Reality.

[ThsAmericanLife]

I dunno. Who is to say what is unrealistic?

 

I'm beginning to think wanting to be in a committed relationship again (ie marriage) is unrealistic.

 

And I'm a person who has been in love and very capable of it. Most of my relationships have been very long term (more than 5 years).

 

I'm honest. Sincere and very giving (although I realize my posts do come across as harsh sometimes).

 

My biggest disappointment has been with people who can't or won't be honest about what they are looking for.

 

At least the OP is honest. She doesn't seem to be looking for the same things as me... and that is fine.

 

What I'd hate to see though, is women with her needs messing things up for women LIKE me who don't have financial support as a criteria... and never have. This is why I get so pissed with the men vs women arguments. Like it is somehow 'natural' for women to want men to provide for them. BS. It is just their choice. Nothing more.

 

I'd only ask the OP to quit polluting our gender with her personal choices... They are her choices and nothing more.

[denise_xo]

I'm sorry but I don't see the examples you stated reflected in real life nearly as much as the other way around. Naturally, there are variations to every story but if you strip away the gloss and get to the fundementals, you see that every story leads back to that one. The Bible isn't about "anything being made to fit a story". In general, men struggle with standing up for themselves or their families and really fighting/protecting something. And women struggle with issues of control and trust and thinking they always know best.

 

And you base this on what? Your own personal experience? If yes, how do you generalise it? Or you base it on the Bible? Or on research? What is your basis for this claim?

[ThsAmericanLife]

Why can't she just be alone?

 

good point. If one doesn't believe in love, makes money on their own, doesn't want children etc.. then being alone should be fine.

 

There are other benefits to marriage though... Some careers are enhanced by being married... or at least leaving the impression of being married.

[ThsAmericanLife]

And you base this on what? Your own personal experience? If yes, how do you generalise it? Or you base it on the Bible? Or on research? What is your basis for this claim?

 

DY is 29... and now an expert on male/female dynamics apparently.

[ThsAmericanLife]

I'm sorry but I don't see the examples you stated reflected in real life nearly as much as the other way around. Naturally, there are variations to every story but if you strip away the gloss and get to the fundementals, you see that every story leads back to that one. The Bible isn't about "anything being made to fit a story". In general, men struggle with standing up for themselves or their families and really fighting/protecting something. And women struggle with issues of control and trust and thinking they always know best.

 

'Every story' does not lead back to that one...

 

Like most religious texts, the human beings that wrote them sought to describe a state of being that was appropriate to their time... or made sense for their particular social condition. If the one in the Bible speaks to you, that's fine.

 

The universal truths amongst many or most religions have zero to do with gender. None.

 

Some even have female 'gods'... and not all of them are 'nicey-nice' tenders of hearth and home either.

[xxoo]

I dunno. Who is to say what is unrealistic?

 

Naming yourself "frustrated standards" is one clue....

[joystickd]

I look at this and think to myself this is crazy. When I say that I mean the way this post went from being about a woman's frustration about finding a man that met her standards to becoming a man vs woman argument. I see misogyny and misandry and lets be honest here no man on here hates women to that degree and no woman on here is like Valerie Solanas who encouraged male gendercide to create an all female society. So why use such extreme word toward each other.

 

Now back to what this post is about. I will say that I am 29 and have only had one girlfriend and quite a few romps with married women and women with boyfriends so some of you may not think I have any creditability in this. Well we all have preferences. I know for myself I am a black male and I have a preference not to date black women, but that is not to say that I never would date a black woman. Its just when I really started having some level of success with dating and I mean actually having someone to go out with it was with someone outside my race. My dating choices has more horrible talk from other people than being called a golddigger or a mean b*tch. Frustrated Standards just has to look deeper for more qualities than just money. I mean you find someone with money what other qualities do you want this man to have. Another thing is the thing is when you look for something like that some will ultimately question your loyalty. There is always the possibility of them thinking you will leave them for someone with more money if you had the chance. On both sides of the coin the risk is great in this type of relationship. you run the risk of being with a controlling, abusive man. The thing is you have to be more defined about what you want in a wealthy man and you have to be able to demonstrate some more personal qualities when the time comes and I mean something more than housework and sex.

[Mme. Chaucer]

(and I love my work more than anything else).

 

FS, maybe your standards are not true to who you really are, anyway.

 

Not many people really like deadbeats - but WHY give up your work, which you say is the most important thing in your life, in order to cook, clean, and give lingerie shows to a man in return for his financial support?

 

It really sounds like your values are all confused, and you might want to reevaluate some things.

 

For the record, the USA is full of great men and women, many of whom are fantastic at cooking and all kinds of things you claim here they can't do.

[Woggle]

That's good Woggle. I'm glad you're not allowing one woman (or one thread) to sway you - as you sometimes do.

 

Don't worry too much about some women's attitudes ruining it for 'good women'. We usually find our gentlemen in the end - we just have to look a bit harder.

 

Even the OP will eventually find the kind of man she wants if she waits long enough - some men don't mind being a walking wallet because they don't have much else to offer. I don't know why anyone would want that kind of man but some women clearly do and it's obviously their choice.

 

I agree. Many men can't stand the kind of men who cheat on women and abuse them because they make it that much harder for good and sincere men. I think women like the OP do the same for women with sincere intentions. I used to work with two women who cheated on their husbands and were proud of it. There was another women who was just as disgusted as I was about it and she said that women like her are what kill the gentlemen instinct in a man.

[Content]

If you're doign as well as you claim and dont believe in love then why not just stay single and enjoy the freedom? why do you need even more money if youre doing fine on your own?

 

Or just do what most russian women who come here do..get on a pole