is it going to start again?

[mr h]

Emme, Owl,Kansas,wo,and sunny and all the others that have helped me out. Something happened yesterday that may help me turn a corner on things, i was in supermarket and saw my xAp there we were 10feet from each other I said hello to her she looks up at me and says you have a big ego not a simple hi or a nod. Well my point is that it got me angry saying to myself that this woman is crazy and my wife and I deserve better then this. Told my wife the story she laughed about it, I told her this women doesn't like me and that we should limit our contact with her. My wife just said we will see I think she's just joking. And to clear things up no o don't want the A to start back up, I know I have to focus my energy away from this women I know it will be hard but it must be done.

[Owl]

OK...so what's changed?

 

You had an encounter with her in which she was rude...I get it.

 

I just don't understand what specifically has CHANGED in your situation?

[mr h]

Owl what is was I felt anger towards her which I didn't feel in the past. I'm not going to say I hate her because that's not true but I'm starting to realize that she's just playing my wife and I for fools.

[2sunny]

Emme, Owl,Kansas,wo,and sunny and all the others that have helped me out. Something happened yesterday that may help me turn a corner on things, i was in supermarket and saw my xAp there we were 10feet from each other I said hello to her she looks up at me and says you have a big ego not a simple hi or a nod. Well my point is that it got me angry saying to myself that this woman is crazy and my wife and I deserve better then this. Told my wife the story she laughed about it, I told her this women doesn't like me and that we should limit our contact with her. My wife just said we will see I think she's just joking. And to clear things up no o don't want the A to start back up, I know I have to focus my energy away from this women I know it will be hard but it must be done.

 

So this woman tells you blatantly that you have a big ego - and what was your response to her?

[Owl]

Owl what is was I felt anger towards her which I didn't feel in the past. I'm not going to say I hate her because that's not true but I'm starting to realize that she's just playing my wife and I for fools.

 

OK...you view her in a different light as a result...so what change in your actions or plan does this create?

[imperfectangel]

Owl what is was I felt anger towards her which I didn't feel in the past. I'm not going to say I hate her because that's not true but I'm starting to realize that she's just playing my wife and I for fools.

 

Wow hold on there mr h I think you'll find its YOU playing your wife for a fool here

[2sunny]

seems IF you got honest with your W - she may have an idea what this OW's agenda is "in being her friend".

 

i'm sure your W confides in her "friend" about you (her H) - then expect that your OW uses that info against the best interest of your marriage!

 

IF your W has something - anything at all - to say about YOU - i would hope she is telling YOU instead of your OW = but that's not likely... only healthy marriages speak directly to the person they have issues with...expect that your W is talking trash behind your back - to your OW - just like you talked trash about your W to this same OW.

 

i guess you are getting what you put out there... how does it feel?

 

how can you NOT do this to your wife anymore? it would take being honest with your wife instead of confiding in others outside the marriage.

 

YOU invited this OW into your M when you messed around with her head - now she is IN - how do YOU plan to be sure you eliminate her from your private life at this juncture?

 

you are going to need to fill your wife in on your truth! your wife is being played for the fool all the way around... and you can stop this - yet you don't!

[JaneyAmazed]

Owl what is was I felt anger towards her which I didn't feel in the past. I'm not going to say I hate her because that's not true but I'm starting to realize that she's just playing my wife and I for fools.

 

Just be careful. Emotions come and go. This anger will disappear eventually. Stay strong.

[mr h]

I know nobody here is trying to be mean or hurtful, but as i have stated before right now i do not plan on telling my wife about the A. Anyone that has been following this knows why and yes i know i was playing my wife for a fool and as bad as that is i think its even worse the my xAp was and is. I am doing my best to limit the contact we have with them. Maybe someone can answer this question for me has a marriage survived and gotten to be healthy after an A w/o the A being told about?

[mr h]

Sunny i felt it was best just to walk away, i didnt want to play into her head games. I felt if i would have said something back to her she would have won i think thats what she wanted was to get a rise or try and get me emotional. Was i wrong for just walking away?

[LilyBart]

Mr H -

I have spend a couple of DAYS reading your entire thread.

 

It seemed important for you to know whether this MOW cared for you, felt something for you. I am here to say - yes she did.

 

I do not know what happened during your A because I wasn't there. But no one, I repeat, NO ONE will spend that much time, invest that much effort into a R if they didn't feel "something".

 

I do not know why she brought up ending it. Perhaps she is angry (even now) because you didn't fight for her or fight to keep the R alive. Instead you agreed with her. You were willing to let it go - so how was she supposed to know how important she was to you? Or maybe she expected you to make the first move and show her how serious you were about her (ie. talk about getting D'd/doing it/and being together) because you have less to deal with (ie. no kids).

 

You don't know what's going on in her head. She's definitely being "friends" with your W because it's an immature way to have a connection with you. She definitely does the hot/cold, nice/nasty thing for the same reason. Don't tell me those are the actions of someone who feels "nothing" for you. Yearning to have a connection to someone, no matter how slight, MEANS something.

 

I don't understand why all these people are pushing you to tell the W. I say, DON'T DO IT. Why do it now? Why do it when it feels like things are over with the OW? When there is no future in being able to jump from platform #1 to platform #2? Why leave "something for nothing"?

 

Mr H, I understand your thinking.

 

And as a satisfied OW, I will tell you this much. If your MOW wanted to tell your W, she would have done it a looooooong time ago.

[Owl]

I know nobody here is trying to be mean or hurtful, but as i have stated before right now i do not plan on telling my wife about the A. Anyone that has been following this knows why and yes i know i was playing my wife for a fool and as bad as that is i think its even worse the my xAp was and is. I am doing my best to limit the contact we have with them. Maybe someone can answer this question for me has a marriage survived and gotten to be healthy after an A w/o the A being told about?

 

In my years of posting here and on other relationship sights, and my real life experience, I cannot give you a single good example of a relationship that continued and became healthy after an affair where the truth was never revealed.

 

There's a reason why you're hearing the same advice from a large number of people.

 

You're insisting to try to create a healthy relationship based on your deception and lies totally done to protect yourself from the responsibility of your actions.

 

Can you not see the foolishness in that concept?

 

Yes, your wife may leave you if she knew the truth. Don't you believe that she truly deserves the freedom to make that decision based on the knowledge you're hiding from her? Why do YOU get to make that choice for her, without her knowledge or agreement...especially in light of your current history of selfish decisions?

 

You continue to deny that this is a critical, much needed step...simply because YOU are not willing to accept responsibility for your actions, and shoulder the burden of repairing the damage you've done as a result of them.

 

It's that simple.

[PhoenixRise]

I know nobody here is trying to be mean or hurtful, but as i have stated before right now i do not plan on telling my wife about the A. Anyone that has been following this knows why and yes i know i was playing my wife for a fool and as bad as that is i think its even worse the my xAp was and is. I am doing my best to limit the contact we have with them. Maybe someone can answer this question for me has a marriage survived and gotten to be healthy after an A w/o the A being told about?

 

Here is where you are dead wrong.

 

YOU playing your wife for a fool on top of sitting by while your AP plays your wife for a fool is FAR worse than anything the OW is doing.

 

It is YOUR job to protect your wife. It is YOUR job to protect your marriage.

 

The fact that you don't realize that YOU letting your OW rub your affair with her in your wife's face while pretending to be your wife's friend a far worse offence lets me know that you are not truly invested AT ALL in your wife's feelings or your marriage.

 

You feel no impetus to protect your wife from being blatantly humiliated by this OW. You only post about your need to protect yourself from the consequences of your actions. That is, when you are not wondering how the OW feels or what some action she has taken really means. You covering your own @$$ is the only real action you have taken and you even did that in an underhanded way. By denigrating the OW to your wife in the hope that when she tells, she won't be believed.

[2sunny]

Sunny i felt it was best just to walk away, i didnt want to play into her head games. I felt if i would have said something back to her she would have won i think thats what she wanted was to get a rise or try and get me emotional. Was i wrong for just walking away?[/QUOTE]

 

in my experience - YES!

 

you continue to give power to staying silent.

 

you gave your OW MORE evidence that you will stay quiet.

 

taking YOUR power back includes having a voice - speaking YOUR truth!

 

you just handed your OW more power by staying quiet... when you have a voice and speak YOUR TRUTH - you have a chance that this M may see some sense of recovery... until you start speaking your truth - you will get nothing but the negative backlash that your OW intends to bestow on your M.

 

when are you going to stand up for what is right?

 

start talking - have a voice!

 

call her up and tell her to stay the hell away from both of you!

 

tell your wife that woman intends to cause harm to your M - and that you acted inappropriately with her... and ask her to work on this marriage with you!

 

get honest!

 

you don't need to play the victim card anymore...

[RickFox]

I know what Mr. H wants to hear, I was there. He wants to hear that she will pursue him, tell him she loves him, that she is in love with him still and it's just a small break and the passion will pick back up and she will fall in his arms once again. That's what he wants to hear, that's what I wanted to hear, I was so interested if she would try to stay in contact that I didn't focus on the other things that were important.

 

We want the validation that someone else can find us desirable and it's a thrill quite frankly to have that type of relationship, an adrenaline rush, a perpetual date every day, the excitement becomes all consuming.

 

No one here can say definitevly whether this woman truly cared/cares for Mr. H, she may just be a cruel heartless person who also needed to be validated. My sister is an admitted former cruel heartless person who used to prey on men just to hurt them because she was hurting. She would play to them and then rip their hearts out and stomp on them, causing more damage when they pursued her and when they ignored her she went obsessive crazy.

 

After speaking with a certain memeber here in depth, a big part of me thinks my xOW cared for me, but then since im the one who was involved in it, I look back and think it was a thrilling game for her and her feelings were less involved than mine evidenced by the fact that she turned her back on me during my struggles and issues here, that she did a complete turnabout in attitude and actions, and chooses to go on as I dont exist and as of recently even turned her daughter against mine. That is not the action of someone who cared all that much.

 

Mr. H nobody here is going to tell you what you want to hear. You will not sail away in the sunset with the OW, she is, as far as Im concerned, enjoying watching you squirm and if she wanted to be close to you and cared so much, she'd still be 'seeing' you since you haven't been caught yet.

 

My advice is what I was told. Find out why it's so important for you for her to resume what once was, realize it is not important, that you will never, NEVER, get all the answers you want and if you get them you will question whether they are real or just more crap being shoved down your throat.

 

Fish or cut bait brother.

[mr h]

Rick WOW you are so right, I felt that same way about a month ago I have gotten better over the last few weeks but it still hurts. I'm not blaming anyone on here but I think there are 2 different perspectives in dealing with the aftermaths of an A. One being a women's point of view the other is the mans. I'm not embarrassed to say that in A I think the men are more emotional then the women are will that's the take i get from my own situation and ricks also. I think it's alot harder for us to let go of the past and to move on as men we tend to over think things instead of keeping things simple. My xAp seems to have no Ill effects from the A she is always smiling and having a good time while I feel like I'm rotting away from the inside out with no sleep or desire to eat and just on a daze and I think Rick felt the same way also. But I'm trying as from what I have read Rick is also I hope we will get past all of this and be happy one day.

[RickFox]

Rick WOW you are so right, I felt that same way about a month ago I have gotten better over the last few weeks but it still hurts. I'm not blaming anyone on here but I think there are 2 different perspectives in dealing with the aftermaths of an A. One being a women's point of view the other is the mans. I'm not embarrassed to say that in A I think the men are more emotional then the women are will that's the take i get from my own situation and ricks also. I think it's alot harder for us to let go of the past and to move on as men we tend to over think things instead of keeping things simple. My xAp seems to have no Ill effects from the A she is always smiling and having a good time while I feel like I'm rotting away from the inside out with no sleep or desire to eat and just on a daze and I think Rick felt the same way also. But I'm trying as from what I have read Rick is also I hope we will get past all of this and be happy one day.

 

You are absolutely correct. My xOW marches on with her life acting as I don't exist and carries on as before and yes i hurt alot but I am doing better and I am moving forward and I refuse to waste anymore time pining away. The fantasy is dead and so is she to me. You should tell her to move on...you move on....we can pine away but it is their actions that show us exactly who they really are. You and I did invest far more heavily with them emotionwise and they obviously did not. Don't waste more time on her ....you...me...we wasted enough. It will never be the same and it won't ever be what you want(ed)

[Emme]

This is what really astounds me, the constant place of blame. It has to fall in someone’s lap. It’s like no one can move on until the award is given.

 

I look at Mr. H and Rick posts and believe me when I say I appreciate the male perspective. I get a little miffed when I read statements of how your ex-lovers affection is not worn on their sleeve.

 

We all loved and we all lost. There is no reason for someone to wear their hurt so that you can feel “pleased”, ego or other wise. It doesn’t just go for the both of you, but others as well.

 

If anyone truly wants their love pull up your bootstraps and go fight for him/her. You don’t get to comment about how the love was not returned unless you’ve at least entered the race. Being on the side lines does not count. Risk it all. Let a divorce and/or restraining order be a part of your future. Only then can you say you have tried and failed.

[confusedinkansas]

I'm not so sure how either of you guys thinks your right.

 

Just because your OW did not fall to the ground in a puddle when she saw you after the affair was over DOES NOT....& I repeat DOES NOT mean that she did not suffer as well.

 

Putting on a front for the "general public" is what we all do. Seriously?

Rick & Mr.H. When you saw your other women after it was all said & done, did you look as if you had just been punched in the gut at that particular time? I'll just bet not.

I'll bet MrH with your market encounter - were you schlepping yourself around the market, in dirty clothes (because god forbid you do laundry because you feel so badly)or as if your best friend had at that moment died? I doubt it.

Come on people......we're all grown ups here.

As Emme said - you/WE all LOST. We were ALL in love - or what we believed to be love at the time.(Or as some may still be in love with their OW/OM)

 

Just because your OW puts on a happy face in public.............MEANS NOTHING.

 

I believe we all hurt pretty equally (depending on the depth & length of the A)

 

The few times I've seen my XAP out & about since the A ended I DID NOT cry, I did not look SAD, I did not anything. I went about what I was doing as if he weren't in the room. Did I want to cry a few times AFTER - You betcha.

However, NOW If I saw him I'd probably go up & say hello. Introduce my husband too. But mine's been over for a very long time. Healed up pretty nicely if I do say so myself.

[2sunny]

It's still a big lie - its part of the pretending. If he would be honest there would be no need for any pretending.

 

Do you intend to stay married or intend to focus on your OW?

 

If you intend to stay married - I would have told the OW in the market to get the hell away from my family or a restraining order would be filed.

[spice4life]

You are absolutely correct. My xOW marches on with her life acting as I don't exist and carries on as before and yes i hurt alot but I am doing better and I am moving forward and I refuse to waste anymore time pining away. The fantasy is dead and so is she to me. You should tell her to move on...you move on....we can pine away but it is their actions that show us exactly who they really are. You and I did invest far more heavily with them emotionwise and they obviously did not. Don't waste more time on her ....you...me...we wasted enough. It will never be the same and it won't ever be what you want(ed)

 

What you are saying here can be applied to relationships in general and not just affairs. The OW decided, for whatever reason, that the relationship was not for her so she ended it. It happens when unattached people are dating too. One might decide it's not the relationship for them so they break it off, leaving the one who is more emotionally attached hurt and devastated. It happens all the time.

 

You may be feeling the same bewilderment that mrH is, but your situatons are completely different. Your MW made a choice and stuck to it and stayed out of your life out of respect for you (I assume anyway). This shows that she did truly care for you on some level because she stayed out of the way so healing could commense. MrH's MW is a whole different story. She is stalking him and playing mind games (conscious or not) with him to feed her own selfish needs, whether she knows it or not. Unfortunately, mrH is too caught up in his own need for validation that he can't see that this situation is about to blow up in his face. It's like he is trying to repair the leaks in the damm with gum hoping it holds.

 

On the other hand, women are VERY intuitive and I'm surprised that his wife has not picked up that something is not quite jiving with this MW. Her red flag meter should be going bonkers right now and it appears (at least in mrH's posts anyway) that it is not. Unless she is staying under the radar because she is hatching a plan of her own. I dunno...this whole situation seems off to me.

Edited November 4, 2011 by spice4life

[RickFox]

This is what really astounds me, the constant place of blame. It has to fall in someone’s lap. It’s like no one can move on until the award is given.

 

I look at Mr. H and Rick posts and believe me when I say I appreciate the male perspective. I get a little miffed when I read statements of how your ex-lovers affection is not worn on their sleeve.

 

We all loved and we all lost. There is no reason for someone to wear their hurt so that you can feel “pleased”, ego or other wise. It doesn’t just go for the both of you, but others as well.

 

If anyone truly wants their love pull up your bootstraps and go fight for him/her. You don’t get to comment about how the love was not returned unless you’ve at least entered the race. Being on the side lines does not count. Risk it all. Let a divorce and/or restraining order be a part of your future. Only then can you say you have tried and failed.

 

Again Emme, I've said it before, I did. I had it all set up and ready to go, I told her what I wanted, I showed her, and with all due respect I refuse to go so far as to get a restraining order or a protective order issued against me to 'prove' anything to anyone. The love was there until we got caught, then she ran right back home, at first concerned my wife would tell her husband and when she didn't, she became the good wife who made a mistake with the man she was so in love with, that she had never felt a connection with like anyone else, but despite being so in love, "still loved" her husband "and wasn't ready to leave him" and that was even said during the A.

 

Even after, as I tried to talk to her I was shut out, thrown a bone here and there and then told to leave her alone, move on, don't ever contact her again, despite me telling her I missed my friend. While some here may appreciate the male perspective, it is always shot down and dismissed in that we are wrong. Why is it I have to fight for her (which I did), why is it Im the one who has to show emotion (I did), but if she did none of these things it was purely out of respect for me?

[RickFox]

What you are saying here can be applied to relationships in general and not just affairs. The OW decided, for whatever reason, that the relationship was not for her so she ended it. It happens when unattached people are dating too. One might decide it's not the relationship for them so they break it off, leaving the one who is more emotionally attached hurt and devastated. It happens all the time.

 

You may be feeling the same bewilderment that mrH is, but your situatons are completely different. Your MW made a choice and stuck to it and stayed out of your life out of respect for you (I assume anyway). This shows that she did truly care for you on some level because she stayed out of the way so healing could commense. MrH's MW is a whole different story. She is stalking him and playing mind games (conscious or not) with him to feed her own selfish needs, whether she knows it or not. Unfortunately, mrH is too caught up in his own need for validation that he can't see that this situation is about to blow up in his face. It's like he is trying to repair the leaks in the damm with gum hoping it holds.

 

On the other hand, women are VERY intuitive and I'm surprised that his wife has not picked up that something is not quite jiving with this MW. Her red flag meter should be going bonkers right now and it appears (at least in mrH's posts anyway) that it is not. Unless she is staying under the radar because she is hatching a plan of her own. I dunno...this whole situation seems off to me.

 

This I will agree with, I believe that I was far more attached to her than she was to me and yes Mr. H and my situations are totally different however his feelings of what he's looking for are not. Yes, my xMW made a choice, it didn't involve me, she went right back home and became the good wife since my spouse opted not to tell her H. Even in pursuing her after it was 'over' I was met with resistance, she made her decision and I assume, it was exciting, fun, taboo, new, UNTIL, we got caught and then it was none of those things for her, just a way for her security at home to be destroyed.

 

I understand women are master's of hiding their emotions, but when I stand in front of you, tell you what I want, what Im willing to do with my eyes filled with tears (insert violins here), and you look at me with nothing....I think I know exactly where I stand and I don't think she stayed away out of respect for me since at that time, I was pretty much out the door. Her response when I told her what I was doing so we could be together, "yeah, let me know how that goes."

[mr h]

Trust me when I say I was not bashing women in my post, I was saying that men or just more visually emotional. I can tell you as of right now I'm not the same person I was before the A started. I feel alone and sad at times for the obvious reasons and alot of people of noticed it in my face and posture. I never said that I wanted my xAp to hurt I was just curious if she was because it never showed it and she never said it. Where I have told her. But that's all in the past now I just want to move forward in my life now with my W. But I still hurt and from what I'm reading I probably will for a long time to come.

[myname]

This I will agree with, I believe that I was far more attached to her than she was to me and yes Mr. H and my situations are totally different however his feelings of what he's looking for are not. Yes, my xMW made a choice, it didn't involve me, she went right back home and became the good wife since my spouse opted not to tell her H. Even in pursuing her after it was 'over' I was met with resistance, she made her decision and I assume, it was exciting, fun, taboo, new, UNTIL, we got caught and then it was none of those things for her, just a way for her security at home to be destroyed.

 

I understand women are master's of hiding their emotions, but when I stand in front of you, tell you what I want, what Im willing to do with my eyes filled with tears (insert violins here), and you look at me with nothing....I think I know exactly where I stand and I don't think she stayed away out of respect for me since at that time, I was pretty much out the door. Her response when I told her what I was doing so we could be together, "yeah, let me know how that goes."

 

Rick, if you were a single man then what you're saying is fair, but you're still with your wife, what do you really expect of your AP? What is she doing that's so different to what you're doing?

 

You're still married, from what I've read of your posts you're still staying with your wife and trying to reconcile your marriage. You're not alone, you've not been left, so what exactly are you complaining about what your AP's done? That she's not willing to continue having an affair with you while you both stay married?