Relationships can be such emotional roller coasters...

[Thinkalot]

Ever have those moments, maybe mid, or post fight, where you think "is this relationship really worth all this heartache, work, effort, emotion?"...then, of course, once you've made up, you feel all the normal love and happiness, and wonder how you could have ever thought such a thing?

 

What an emotional rollercoaster a relationship...even a great one...can be.

[moimeme]

Certainly they can require a fair bit of effort until you've both meshed all the connecting bits and smoothed out the rough spots. There have been times in my life when I've actively avoided all chances of embarking on relationships precisely because I knew I didn't have the time or emotional energy to devote all that's needed to begin one and develop it properly.

 

But you don't get the sorts of rewards that you can get from a good relationship anyplace else - so the work is worth it, even if every now and then it's tough slogging

[Thinkalot]

Indeed that is very true, and no doubt the reason some relationships at least, do last the distance. The rewards are many.

 

To give some insight into what prompted this thread. My love and I went away with our caravan for the weekend, and stayed in a national park, right on the beach. Aside from a gastro sickness I had for a whole night/day (!) we had a great time...relaxing, surfing, reading, just being, watching the stars...and so on. We loved being in our van, and imagined how wonderful it will be when we are on our journey around Australia.

 

Then when we got home last night...BANG ...big ugly fight. Him yelling and swearing at me and calling me names....me hurting, crying and insisting on a 20 point analysis of everything said...and insisting we talk it out till the death. Sigh. Will we ever learn to avoid such repeat patterns of behaviour?? This morning we were both sorry for our part, hugged and made up, but also felt a bit dissapointed with ourselves for even going there...and right at the end of our lovely weekend!

 

For my part, I think my OCD and insecurities contributed, even if indirectly. My love and I haven't had much one on one time together lately, owing to his work and study.... During those times, I cope quite well with the OCD, because there is distance, and I busy myself with my life and other things. But when we are back together full on...it's like the thoughts,obsessions sort of spike again, before they calm back down, slowly, and I adjust to the closeness, and the anxieties and thoughts it can trigger. Quite honestly, suffering those anxieties/obsessions can make me feel a bit distant from him...I almost want to step back to reduce the impact...but then I feel sad,because at the same time I love him, and want us to feel as close as possible. I then start to look for other possible reasons that might be triggering my unease, because I hate thinking it all comes from within my head! There are some other reasons...such as his work, frayed nerves and short fuse, and less quality time together than we used to have....but of course, the biggest problem is in my head. Ironically, we really need to spend MORE time together, so I can adjust to that level of intimacy and closeness, and cope with the OCD, even reduce it's impact to almost zero, in those circumstances as well. Well, that all makes sense to me anyway!

 

I think I may have lashed out and blamed him for my own anxieties, while he took some of his frustrations out on me.

 

Oh well....it's all part of growth , and makes us stronger! It feels nice to try and explain it in words, because it helps me understand what happened!

[moimeme]

because I hate thinking it all comes from within my head

 

Why?

 

It means you're not in control, yes, but that's ok and I think you need to be OK with that. It's not as if you gave over control to OCD of your own volition. It does it by itself which, admittedly, can be scary - but you have tools to defeat it and they will, eventually, do just that.

 

I think you're still battling with the idea that you 'should' be able to defeat the OCD by dint of will. However, OCD itself, like a computer virus, disables the very mechanism which would be able to do the defeating.

 

And, in the worst of Gordian knots, it could be that the thought that you 'should' be able to control it could itself be a product of OCD

 

Just keep in the back of your mind that it may win some battles, but you will win the war. And yes, this doesn't mean that he's a complete innocent or that the relationship doesn't have other issues, but the OCD's a magnifying glass and that's why it needs to be tackled and smacked to the ground. Then you can have a clear view of whatever else needs to be done without this distortion of the OCD.

[zarathustra]

It makes one wonder whether erotic relationships are overrated. Relationships should not define who you are, or your value as an individual. They're frequently messy, stressful, unsatisfying and suffocating. Also, the great majority of relationships end either too early or too late.

 

I'm leery anymore of deep relationships--when your heart (at least temporarily )is in another's death grip.

 

Are deep, emotionally "meaningful" relationships oversold by the mental heath advice industry? Are relationships, like smoking, actually hazardous to one's emotional health and equilibrium over the long term? Is it unhealthy to enjoy being a "lonely heart"?

 

Is this Hallmark schmaltz just a bill of goods? Emotionally utopian?

 

Perhaps it's time to jump off that Crazy Train (or roller coaster).

 

I offer a toast to all the unapologetic lonely hearts out there.

[moimeme]

Sure relationships are difficult. Sure, they can be painful. And it's your option to get off the ride and stand with the crowd until the end of time. It's a safe choice, to be sure.

 

But have you lived?

[meanon]

It's not just erotic relationships that are a roller coaster, it's life

 

The OCD may have played a small part, Thinkalot, but I really think you would encounter the ups and downs regardless. Most of us do. You will always argue occasionally but over time you can learn to do it in a way that is less bruising. The most important thing is that you two always manage to sort it out quickly and get back to the business of being happy.

[Thinkalot]

zara...I'm not ready to jump off just yet...I love the ride too much...and I seem to have more exhilarating highs, than I do lows. I have way too much faith in life, and hope, and faith in love...and belief in the good things. I cling to that hope and love rather fiercely I must admit.

 

meanon: thanks for the warm words...you're right...we do recover much more quickly than we used to. The bruises are still a little sore though.

 

moi- why? because it feels pathetic to feel as insecure and anxious as I do when I am with him sometimes. He yells at me and gets frustrated, and says " surely you can get a grip on this, and learn to shut your mouth?". I try. Sometimes it just kinda sneaks up on me. I don't even know if I'd call those times part of the OCD, or just being insecure, and consistently comparing. I don't know. I just seems hopeless. And enough people keep telling me to get the hell over it and shape up....that I should have by now.

 

For example: we are in the surf, enjoying a lovely autumn day...sitting waiting for waves. We start talking about an island we wish to visit on our travels around Australia. I ask if he knows anyone who's been there, and what its like. He says his old group of friends (from his first marriage days) all went there as a group...but he didn't go. I asked why he didn't go. He said because of work committments. I start to feel anxious, and tense. I don't shut up in time though.

 

Why do I feel anxious you may ask? Because I am so insecure...obessed about the past...I worry about all differences... In my mind, on some level, I obviously still have trouble accepting he actually does enjoy his life with me better. One key difference is that I have never had a big group of friends...or couples. And we don't have that as part of our life now at all (partly due to circumstances, and where we live). I in fact, don't really like travelling with groups of people at all. I'm more interested in doing my own thing. My bf has always said he feels the same way, that he likes just hanging with me, or spending time alone. That his ex-wife was the more social one. I find that comforting (because of course, difference is threatening/frightening/and oh dear- could even mean he was happier then!). Soooo, when he says he would have gone on a group couples trip, if not for work, something inside me freaks out. Oh no I think! He actually does like more social activities...he actually was really happy then....and he hasn't even told me this before! He has in fact, always said otherwise!

 

 

So, back to that moment in time...driven by such irrational thoughts, based on fear, obsessive thinking about his past and worry, and trust issues, while we sit in the surf, my next statement was "but I didn't think you liked travelling in groups....at least that's what you said before". At this point I can almost see his hackles rise, and the tension cloud his eyes. He glares at me and says "we've been over this before. I prefer travelling just as a couple, but I don't mind going with a group. I'm not completely antisocial. You major in the minors. You're obsessed with my past. Get over it. Shape up. Get a f*cking grip. Don't screw this up".

 

I sat there, in the surf, on that beautiful morning feeling pathetic, and anxious. I stopped speaking for a while, and then said sorry. He said that's OK. We moved past it, and kept surfing and had a good time, then lay in the sun together and cuddled for a while, before returning to our campsite and having some lunch. I still felt a little troubled by my usual obsessive thoughts, so I sat by myself and read...and then felt content.

 

I felt so angry with myself on the inside, that I couldn't just relax and enjoy every moment of the weekend, without that kind of worry. The example listed here is just one. Over the course of the weekend, there were perhaps 4 such incidents, which is actually pretty good for me...but nowhere near 100%. By the end of the trip...I had relaxed...the thoughts were abating and getting more manageable, as I adjusted to being with him, and relaxed into the closeness again. But f*ck...it's really a pain having it at all. And blaming it all on OCD feels like a cop out. My bf said to me" you have everything in the world going for you...and yet you still find things to worry about!". I thought, he's right. He also said I still always compare things between our life now, and his past life, always hoping to prove our life is 'better". I do. I can't escape it. I do. I try not to think it, but it comes into my head...knocking away insistently...bugging me, pestering me.

 

So hey, we carried those feelings into the night I guess. We were tired when we got home. We flared up over something silly. Next thing, we are into each other. Each probably taking out our own inner frustrations. He attacks with much more venom than me though, and says nasty stuff in the heat of the moment. I am softer, and just end up crying more.

 

Phew! This was a bit of an essay...sorry 'bout that.

[zarathustra]

No, Think, I was NOT recommending anything as to your relationship. Your post, though, and others I have read on LS, which are much, much worse than your relationship travails, got me thinking against relationships.

 

I know, the very idea is heretical. I mean one might as well be against erotic love, or breathing.

 

Still, I'm not convinced that every time a relationship goes under it's someone's fault.Nor am I convinced that relationships (or erotic love) necessarily make us better. Are relationships, like marriage, over sold?

 

I wonder.

 

Enjoy yours, Think, while it lasts and I do hope it lasts for a very, very long time.

[Thinkalot]

In some instances, they possibly are oversold zara. But the truly good ones are not. They are all they are made out to be, for they offer a lot.

 

However, being single and living the single independent life, should not be UNDERsold either. I have been guilty (in my insecure moments) of thinking my guy must have done more...experienced more about love or something, because he was married, and I was not. However, on the flip side, I experienced a lot of things he did not, both in and out of relationships. Both ways of living have merit. For the longterm however, most of us aspire to be part of a couple, something bigger than just us, and there must be a reason for that!

 

BTW, I did not think you were referring specifically to my relationship, and I was answering in a general sense myself...meaning..I will probably always live in hope of love, and good things.

[moimeme]

And enough people keep telling me to get the hell over it and shape up....that I should have by now.

 

Put it this way; had they been telling you to get over allergies, would that feel reasonable and should you feel it's your fault that you haven't? What about nearsightedness?

 

and says " surely you can get a grip on this, and learn to shut your mouth?".

 

And you say to him exactly what I just said to you. Remember, it is hard for someone to remember that you are not in control of your thoughts because you 'look' normal. Stupid and bizarre, but that's how we seem to be constructed. Maybe you can wear a silly hat or a sign or a button to remind him that he's looking at someone who's been stuck with an annoying condition. I'm not kidding. One of my biggest battles with ADHD guy was to remind myself that he wasn't doing what he did out of volition. I had 'compulsion is more powerful than love' posted above my computer to remind me.

 

Or maybe you could come up with some sort of humourous reminder to yourselves - like he could growl like a dog or something when you start and then you could reply by growling back - or use code words or something. Something to jolt you both out of a discussion and into something else. Heck, maybe he should just keep you quiet by planting a big one right on your lips!

 

But, like I said, the very thought that you 'should' be over it may well be part of the OCD itself. I can see being impatient that you are not, but that's something to take up with the doc.

[Thinkalot]

Originally posted by Thinkalot

. I don't even know if I'd call those times part of the OCD, or just being insecure, and consistently comparing. I don't know. I just seems hopeless. And enough people keep telling me to get the hell over it and shape up....that I should have by now.

 

For example: we are in the surf, enjoying a lovely autumn day...sitting waiting for waves. We start talking about an island we wish to visit on our travels around Australia. I ask if he knows anyone who's been there, and what its like. He says his old group of friends (from his first marriage days) all went there as a group...but he didn't go. I asked why he didn't go. He said because of work committments. I start to feel anxious, and tense. I don't shut up in time though.

 

Why do I feel anxious you may ask? Because I am so insecure...obessed about the past...I worry about all differences... In my mind, on some level, I obviously still have trouble accepting he actually does enjoy his life with me better. One key difference is that I have never had a big group of friends...or couples. And we don't have that as part of our life now at all (partly due to circumstances, and where we live). I in fact, don't really like travelling with groups of people at all. I'm more interested in doing my own thing. My bf has always said he feels the same way, that he likes just hanging with me, or spending time alone. That his ex-wife was the more social one. I find that comforting (because of course, difference is threatening/frightening/and oh dear- could even mean he was happier then!). Soooo, when he says he would have gone on a group couples trip, if not for work, something inside me freaks out. Oh no I think! He actually does like more social activities...he actually was really happy then....and he hasn't even told me this before! He has in fact, always said otherwise!

 

 

So, back to that moment in time...driven by such irrational thoughts, based on fear, obsessive thinking about his past and worry, and trust issues, while we sit in the surf, my next statement was "but I didn't think you liked travelling in groups....at least that's what you said before". At this point I can almost see his hackles rise, and the tension cloud his eyes.

 

So am I right in putting this type of behaviour down to the OCD? Irrational stuff like this. Or is it simply an insecurity/lack of self esteem/anxiety issue which I SHOULD be able to get over?

They are the thoughts I think sometimes, when I start to think always blaming the OCD is maybe a copout/ Sure, I do obsess, no question...but is the drive to question, check, countercheck, feel anxious, worry...all part of the same thing? Obviously it is an issue, and part of what I am working to completely overcome, and part of what I have discussed in counselling....but can I really blame it all on the chemicals?

[Thinkalot]

Originally posted by moimeme

[

 

Or maybe you could come up with some sort of humourous reminder to yourselves - like he could growl like a dog or something when you start and then you could reply by growling back - or use code words or something. Something to jolt you both out of a discussion and into something else. Heck, maybe he should just keep you quiet by planting a big one right on your lips!

.

 

This is actually a good suggestion. Humour helps, when we actually succeed in using it. The problem is, he is at a point where his tolerance for me, is pretty well gone...and who could blame him? He's been putting up with this stuff for years now, as he reminds me when he's frustrated. "how much is a man supposed to be able to take?"...is not an uncommon question. And what can I say? I just feel bad. Then of course, the next day or whatever, we're both sorry...but the pain of those words (and others) still remains. And I can understand how he would feel that way! In the reverse, so would I!

 

Don't get me wrong...we did have a lovely time together, and our love is very strong. I am just focussing here on the bits I would like to fix.

[moimeme]

So am I right in putting this type of behaviour down to the OCD?

 

Yes.

 

Irrational stuff like this. Or is it simply an insecurity/lack of self esteem/anxiety issue which I SHOULD be able to get over?

 

You feel a compulsion to do it, right? You can't stop yourself, right? If that isn't the defiition of OCD, what is? In fact, what are you being treated for but exactly that?

 

They are the thoughts I think sometimes, when I start to think always blaming the OCD is maybe a copout

 

That's because people who haven't a clue think that and have persuaded you they are right.

 

Sure, I do obsess, no question...but is the drive to question, check, countercheck, feel anxious, worry...all part of the same thing?

 

Yes, yes, yes. One of my friends used to have to go back and check the door numerous times before she could leave. That is exactly what OCD is. It's all about checking, counterchecking, and stressing if you don't.

 

Obviously it is an issue, and part of what I am working to completely overcome, and part of what I have discussed in counselling....but can I really blame it all on the chemicals?

 

You should maybe go back and do some reading about what OCD is and how it works.

[Thinkalot]

Think I'll do just that. Doesn't hurt to be reminded every now and then I guess.

 

You are way to rational for my liking Merry..LOL!

[moimeme]

You are way to rational for my liking Merry..LOL!

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

[johan]

I've been battling with my girlfriend lately. Today actually. Starting last night. Our fights are very similar to yours, especially the way they start. Some probing questions from her or some analysis that puts me right into a corner. Her mind is just always working.

 

I can see how his responses can hurt you. I KNOW how he feels. I wonder if it's clear to him that he's hurting you. I kind of think most of what I do or say in response to her doesn't really register with her. Or maybe I just feel defensive and get aggressive, because her questions and doubts imply a total lack of trust in me.

 

I've been wondering if she's doing this as a way to keep distance in our relationship.

 

Is there are way he could respond to you that would put you at ease with him? You've probably dated other guys who didn't freak you out so much. That's what my girlfriend tells me. I'm the only one ever to bring this out in her. I just wonder what is special about me. What is special about yours that you do this? What was it about those other guys who didn't cause this reaction in her (or you)?

[moimeme]

Johan

 

Thinkalot - and maybe your gf - has a condition which compels her to worry, obsess, and question. In your case, it may have nothing to do with you or with lack of trust. This is an ailment. Think of the people who can't stop washing their hands - same thing exactly, except the compulsion is to question, not to wash hands.

[johan]

Thanks, I know the diagnosis. But I'm wondering if ThinkAlot wishes for a different kind of interaction when these things come up. And maybe there is something he/I can do or say that would be more productive. He and I are both responding with frustration and our patience is wearing thin. I'm sure that isn't necessary, but it comes from expecting something more typical. It comes from thinking that the good times indicate that all the frustration is finally in the past, and then getting disappointed. And more importantly, it fouls up MY trust in her, because I'm wondering if I can predict her behavior. Is some better way for me to act or to respond that can keep the sparks to a minimum and the reassurance high.

 

She presses me until I can't take it sometimes, and even if I sidestep the direct pressure, she'll find some other (often more damaging) way to get her energy out.

[Thinkalot]

Hello there! I can certainly add a few insightful points here johan...and I wish you and my bf could meet and have a chat!

 

For starters, I was anxious in my relationship prior to this, but not to this extent. I suffered some hurt, manipulation and so on in that relationship, which made me even more wary!

 

Plus, I feel more and have given over more of myself to my current love than I ever have before. Therefore risk is highest and I have the most to lose. It's possibly that way for your gf too. Also, there just happened to be certain things which have happened in our relationship (which we have since overcome) which actually caused more insecurity and concern at the time. Even though they are long gone now (fights/judgements on both sides/put downs etc) sometimes it would seem they still have a tiny effect...like a ripple which has not quite smoothed out yet.

 

Looking at the interaction...my bf and I have spent a lot of time reading up on my issues, OCD and so on, and talking to people, and also together reading advice given on here. We've tried to modify our interactions, and often now, we are successful. I have improved significantly (according to my bf...more than 50% better) and he has also changed and grown with me, adapting the way he handles my questioning and so on. Sometimes we laugh, sometimes he gives me a hug, and says "Is this a neurotic/obsessing question?" and I say "yes"..and he says "well, lets go no further".

 

Other times, I simply halt a conversation when I feel the tell tale signs of tension in the pit of my stomach, and say "I really cant handle discussing this topic, as it is triggering bad thoughts".

 

Other times still, he'll say "what are you thinking about"...and rather than unloading the details, I simply say "Things I shouldn't be"...and he says "Ok then...I love you".

 

All these things help deflect attention away from the issues, and stop giving them more power. Sometimes though, as in the examples I mentioned in this thread...things sneak up...and it's not immediately obvious to my guy what's driving them...before he has a chance to think or shut HIS mouth...he's angry and frustrated and telling me off. Like you, he feels it implies a lack of trust...he also sometimes feels it should be just about gone by now (probably an expectation on both our parts, which was abit too high). The bad side effect then is, I feel more insecure, which of course triggers more bad thoughts, and more questions... So it ain't a good path to walk down.

 

Sometimes, he even thinks I am trying to put HIS life down...! It's more like me trying to make sure what we have is the best ever, because I get insecure.

 

I hope this helps a little.

 

Today, we've spoken about last night's argument. We have forgiven some angry words said in the heat of the moment...and let them go (hard as that can be for me). We've also sifted through all the words we exchanged, and found a few morsels of truth. Things we can both improve in our relationship, and in our handling of this. So something good has come out of it...even though our communication last night could certainly have been calmer! We also agreed we had an excellent weekend overall...and last night's fight, was certainly not reflective of the whole weekend, when we had many more good moments than bad. We actually can't wait to get back to the same spot for another weekend, it was so lovely.

 

P.S. I forgot to add, that...when questioning, we can indeed get sneaky, just as you said your gf finds new ways of asking something. I do it too...I try to weave something into the conversation, so it seems innocent..when really it is something I have been obsessing about for a while, and must know the answer too!

Others here (gaia for example) have also agreed they've been guilty of the same tactics. Sometimes I even bring up a conversation about something, just so I can sneak in a question I'm burning to ask. Sometimes I get away with it...I get an answer, and I feel relieved and leave it. Other times, my bf sees straight through me, and refuses to answer or humour me (we've agreed it isn't good to feed the desire to ask questions).

[meanon]

Now I know the detail, Thinkalot, I'm sure this is the OCD too. All you can do is your best. I know it can be frustrating for partners and they are only human - it shows sometimes of course. Still it does neither of you any good for you to feel guilty that your best is sometimes just not good enough when it comes to repressing those thoughts and you need to remind him (and yourself!) that it's an illness when it happens. As you say, sometimes it's instantly obvious what's happening, a glance is all it takes to tell you you need to back off. You already have methods of preventing escalation that are successful sometimes. The briefer you can make these, the more likely they are to be used when someone is angry. You have come so far and you are still finding ways to overcome this problem. You know people that have done it, you will too. Remember that when you have a bad day.

 

Zara, I agree that relationships are not a panacea. A good relationship can be a source of great happiness, certainly something worth aiming for and investing in. So many of us, however, think that being part of a couple is the be all and end all and so stay in bad relationships out of fear of being alone. We need to learn to be happy alone so that when we do choose a relationship we know it's worth it, that it's good for us.

[Layla]

Hi Thinkalot

 

I know exactly what you are talking about. In fact I am in a beautiful relationship with a lot of love and kindness but sometimes feel that those fights, REPETITION AND EXPLAINING YOURSELF, draging on etc. will eventually destroy even the best relationship.

 

And I am so scared of that!

[Layla]

Hi Thinkalot

 

Just read a few of your post and feel like you are my "twin-sister" wondering where all that obsessive thinking could come from.

 

Do you feel like it is stronger at times?

 

Anything in the past that could have triggered it?

 

Feeling with you!