Do men avoid settling as women get older?

[Shaun-Dro]

OP, one other point I know a lot guys talk about with older women. As women get older, they tend to want marriage and kids faster due to biological issues. Most guys don't see it that may, a 35 year old guy likely still wants 2-3 years of relationship without marriage. The need women have to get married quickly often clashes with most men's need to wait and evaluate if this is the right relationship. I'm not sure this happens with you, but it might be an issue. Men tried to lock you up when you were younger because of the competition (the reason you did not commit), they have less reason to do that now.

 

Exactly, which was why, OP, you should've considered settling down when you got around 28-29 and not 34-35 or whatever.

 

But instead, you, like most women out here, think that spending a solid 10 years chasing some fancy college degree and tuning guys out would give you the advantage later on, when in fact, it becomes a useless weapon.

[allina]

I'm shocked that at 35 a woman is considered an "older woman."

[silvermercy]

I'm shocked that at 35 a woman is considered an "older woman."

True! I'm also equally shocked that women get the guilt trip for seeking a degree/carreer or whatever they want out of their life... As usual it's the women who get the blame again! LOL In the mean time men are supposed to do anything they fancy at any age they want blamelessly.

[azsinglegal]

Exactly, which was why, OP, you should've considered settling down when you got around 28-29 and not 34-35 or whatever.

 

But instead, you, like most women out here, think that spending a solid 10 years chasing some fancy college degree and tuning guys out would give you the advantage later on, when in fact, it becomes a useless weapon.

 

Maybe...but we still out live you. And at 55 a woman can still get a younger man (even if just for sex) and men at 55 can't get it up.

[alphamale]

I'm shocked that at 35 a woman is considered an "older woman."

men aren't considered "older" until around 50

[Woggle]

35 is not old for a man or a woman.

 

I don't condone what most of these men are saying but most men do not starting thinking like this until they are hurt by a woman. Being betrayed by a woman you care about can scar a man for life and after that they being much more cold towards women in general.

[azsinglegal]

men aren't considered "older" until around 50

 

BS. 45 is "older" for a man. "50" is my like dating my dad.

[Alma Mobley]

Well. Maybe it's due to being in "left coast" San Francisco during my 20's and early 30's, and my particular social scene, but I cannot say that my experience and that of my peers was anything like most of what's described here.

 

Virtually all of us were wild and gorgeous in our 20's. Nobody wanted to settle down.

 

Almost all of us (boys and girls) started moving towards settling down in our 30's. I can't think of a single guy friend (there was a very big social scene - boy, was it fun!) who reached his 30's and sought a woman in her 20's to "settle" with. The whole group gravitated towards their own peers for that.

 

This is my experience too. I see these kinds of threads and male responses on here all the time and always found it odd because it just didn't match up with what I was seeing in real life. No one, male or female, wanted to settle down in their 20's and married their peers once in their 30's. I dated younger men in my 30's simply because most men in their 30's were taken! And I never had trouble attracting those younger men and most were looking for a relationship with me.

 

But then again, I live in SF too -- maybe we're just completely abnormal!

 

OP, don't get focused on age. I simply had the attitude that I will live a wonderful life, whether I got married and had children or not. I focused on being happy and doing things that I love. I met my husband when I was 34, got married at 36, pregnant at 37, and had a beautiful son at 38. My husband is younger than I am and our relationship is still very strong.

[Sanman]

Sanman, in all seriousness, you are a very bitter man toward women. By now, I've become familiar with your comments. You couldn't say a positive thing about a woman if there was a gun pointed to your head to do it. So excuse me if your sarcasm here is ineffective.

 

I disagree with your assertion and have plenty of nice things to say about women. I have said plenty of them here about my gf and even other posters. Off the top of my head, I have great respect for Zen girl, Onyx, and Elswyth even if I do not always agree with their opinion. They are all also in relationships, IIRC. for what that is worth.

 

You accuse me of being bitter, yet in a later post agreed with my opinion of the OP. So, I am bitter for stating those ideas, but you are not? This really is not about being bitter. Call it social dynamics if you want and it has nothing to do with sperm count. Women are primarily considered to be highly sought after based on looks. Men are most sought after for a combination of looks and financial success. Men tend to have the greatest confluence of looks and financial status from 25-35 and, thus, they are most eligible at that age. No one here is forced to believe me, but look around these forums. Those who struggle the most with dating are men in the their teens/20s and women over 30. Men you are not independent and have at least some level of financial success are similarly at a disadvantage. I can't make $30k as a kindergarten teacher and have as many dating options as a woman. Similarly, the opposite is true for women, having a solid career does not give them as many options as looks fade. I never said the OP has not options, just that she may either need to offer guys more in a relationship or lower her standards.

[Sanman]

This is my experience too. I see these kinds of threads and male responses on here all the time and always found it odd because it just didn't match up with what I was seeing in real life. No one, male or female, wanted to settle down in their 20's and married their peers once in their 30's. I dated younger men in my 30's simply because most men in their 30's were taken! And I never had trouble attracting those younger men and most were looking for a relationship with me.

 

But then again, I live in SF too -- maybe we're just completely abnormal!

 

OP, don't get focused on age. I simply had the attitude that I will live a wonderful life, whether I got married and had children or not. I focused on being happy and doing things that I love. I met my husband when I was 34, got married at 36, pregnant at 37, and had a beautiful son at 38. My husband is younger than I am and our relationship is still very strong.

 

That is later than many of the couples I know. Most have been dating since they were ~25-27 and are getting married now that they are about 30. Most of the women I know seem to get serious about relationships about 25 and the guys around 27-28. I know very few people over 30 that are not in a steady relationship. Most of the singles are socially awkward guys.

[Febreze]

men aren't considered "older" until around 50

 

As should a woman, not at 35. I'm still bothered by this so now I think it might be safe to not reveal my age to a man unless we're serious.

 

Btw, I met a young resident today at work. He's 28 and doing his 1st of 4 years at the hospital and he instantly took a fancy to me

 

He didn't ask my age so I think he thinks I'm around his age or maybe few years younger which is nice and I will let him continue to think that since I do look and feel young.

[dasein]

It simply has to do with the fact that many of the single men over 30 have commitment issues and difficulties being in a relationship.

 

The relationship minded ones have already settled down.

 

Sure and it has nothing to do with the horror stories that men see going on with their married, settled down friends, watching as their wives become sexless, shapeless "mommy creatures" who have not one care about their husband other than as a human wallet once there are children, has nothing to do with men watching their friends get reamed in domestic court. It's nothing to do with any fault or blame at all on modern women and a skewed legal/political system. It's all about being "commitment phobes." Sure, it's all men's fault in the end, right?

[Woggle]

Sure and it has nothing to do with the horror stories that men see going on with their married, settled down friends, watching as their wives become sexless, shapeless "mommy creatures" who have not one care about their husband other than as a human wallet once there are children, has nothing to do with men watching their friends get reamed in domestic court. It's nothing to do with any fault or blame at all on modern women and a skewed legal/political system. It's all about being "commitment phobes." Sure, it's all men's fault in the end, right?

 

Very true. I love how people act like men have no good reason whatsoever to be afraid of commitment. I think a large part of this is that younger men have yet to be exposed to the nasty side of relationships.

[iris219]

Sure and it has nothing to do with the horror stories that men see going on with their married, settled down friends, watching as their wives become sexless, shapeless "mommy creatures" who have not one care about their husband other than as a human wallet once there are children, has nothing to do with men watching their friends get reamed in domestic court. It's nothing to do with any fault or blame at all on modern women and a skewed legal/political system. It's all about being "commitment phobes." Sure, it's all men's fault in the end, right?

 

I don't know or care why some men have these issues. As long as these men don't waste my time, they can be avoidant of or afraid of relationships forever if that's what they choose. I wasn't putting blame on anyone. I was pointing out what I've observed, and what I've observed as I've gotten older is that there are less "good" ones available.

 

The men I were referring to wouldn't settle down with a 25 year old or a 35 year old.

 

I complain a lot about my dating difficulties, but age discrimination has never been one them. I've had men tell me they weren't interested in me at first because they thought I was too young; these men are in their late 30s, early 40s, and they don't date women in their 20s.

[ascendotum]

As should a woman, not at 35. I'm still bothered by this so now I think it might be safe to not reveal my age to a man unless we're serious.

 

Btw, I met a young resident today at work. He's 28 and doing his 1st of 4 years at the hospital and he instantly took a fancy to me

 

He didn't ask my age so I think he thinks I'm around his age or maybe few years younger which is nice and I will let him continue to think that since I do look and feel young.

 

I have no idea what sort of guys you usually got for and whether you would have liked to have been married earlier. You obviously still got sex appeal and can get young guy's attention, which is great, things shouldn't be bleak at all for you getting a long term partner who wants to have a family with you. However I don't think going for younger doctors is the best course to take as for your dilemma regarding men avoiding settling as you get older, imo anyway.

 

Do you think things suddenly change with the guy when he knows your age more so than when you reveal that you want to settle down and have a family asap?

[123321]

35 is not old for a man or a woman.

 

Of course not, wouldn't dream of saying so. The question is, for a 35 year old guy who's built a good career, gotten his life in order, is ready to find the right woman now to start a family with in 2-5 years and is generally what a woman who wants to settle down is after; what does a 35 year old woman bring to him?

 

If he meets her today, marries her in a year (36) and they decide to have kids after spending 3 years together, she will be having kids into her 40s.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Age-and-miscarriage.png

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c3/Trisomy21_graph.jpg/300px-Trisomy21_graph.jpg

 

On the other hand, he has a lot of 25 year olds who are also ready to settle down. What a dilemma.

 

 

 

But then again, I live in SF too -- maybe we're just completely abnormal!

 

I've spent a few years there, no, there is almost nothing normal about SF, from banning happy meals onward it's just a very odd little microcosm of .... something.

 

 

 

Men may WANT a younger version... but if younger women don't comply, there isn't much the guys can do about it.

 

But they do comply so, moving on.

 

 

 

I'm shocked that at 35 a woman is considered an "older woman."

 

Not older, but you have to ask (see above) what she brings to a well established 35 year old mans life that would compel him to marry. That is the question.

[musemaj11]

Its very hard to discuss an issue with women from purely logical point of view without them mixing up emotional mumbo jumbo into it.

 

Its like a man says that the sun sets to the West simply based on empirical evidence and a woman will still call him bitter toward the sun.

 

I think intergender debate is pointless because both sexes think differently. Women are idealistic while men are realistic.

Edited October 21, 2011 by musemaj11

[123321]

Its very hard to discuss an issue with women from purely logical point of view without them mixing up emotional mumbo jumbo into it.

 

Indeed, I'm just saying what is and isn't, not what "should" and "shouldn't".

[Disenchantedly Yours]

True! I'm also equally shocked that women get the guilt trip for seeking a degree/carreer or whatever they want out of their life... As usual it's the women who get the blame again! LOL In the mean time men are supposed to do anything they fancy at any age they want blamelessly.

 

Especially when a lot of men have expressed a desire for women to be independent and share equal expeditures today! So somehow, we are all suppose to be sweet, kind and giving, settle down before 24, meanwhile having enough resources to pay for dates while being independent but not having a real "serious" carreer in the process. Amazing isn't it? And despite being told how worthless we are as human beings and as women for living, a lot of these guys want us to fall at their feet in adoration and gratitude. Or at the very least, expect us to want to be open and vunerable and kind with them when they are just about dispalying the very opposite to women in general. Good luck with that guys.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

men aren't considered "older" until around 50

 

Actually, I consider men older anything 40+ at this stage in my life. However, when I was younger, that number was lower. When I was 20, 30 year old men were clearly "older" and when they hit on me..sometimes just plain "old" and "gross". And I don't say that to be cruel but to show how perception changes with age. And that's pretty natural. Why would I want to be with a man that placed so much stock in my age? That wouldn't bode well for me in the future. Just as it doesn't bode well for a man to be envolved with a woman that is overly interested in the money he makes.

 

I know men really want to believe that older men are better. But men aging is no different then women aging and older men are not without absolutes "better". I would take Ryan Gosling over George Clooney any day. Of course, I am around Ryan Goslings age myself and I suspect as we both age, I would still take him over his younger counterparts.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Sanman

I disagree with your assertion and have plenty of nice things to say about women. I have said plenty of them here about my gf and even other posters. Off the top of my head, I have great respect for Zen girl, Onyx, and Elswyth even if I do not always agree with their opinion. They are all also in relationships, IIRC. for what that is worth.

 

I have yet to see you say a nice thing about a woman Sanman. All I've seen is about how much less women are then you. Must be nice to believe that.

 

You accuse me of being bitter, yet in a later post agreed with my opinion of the OP.

 

Not clear what you are refering to here.

 

This really is not about being bitter. Call it social dynamics if you want and it has nothing to do with sperm count. Women are primarily considered to be highly sought after based on looks. Men are most sought after for a combination of looks and financial success. Men tend to have the greatest confluence of looks and financial status from 25-35 and, thus, they are most eligible at that age. No one here is forced to believe me, but look around these forums. Those who struggle the most with dating are men in the their teens/20s and women over 30.

 

Well actually, men's declining sperm count is an important issue to consider. They contribute to birth defects in their children if they decide to have children later in life, just like women. It's more high risk when it's a man or woman. Although the men here like to ignore that little piece of science because it would mean that you weren't as important to the world as you wish you were. It goes to show that nature doesn't support a system where men are forever in their primes despite what men like you like to tout.

 

Most of us are pretty normal people. I doubt that most men here are dating 20 year olds and are such high successful individual that women are throwing their panties at them. I remember the older men that hit on me when I was 20, I also remember how much I rejected the because of their age.

 

I have looked around this forum and what I see is men and women of all ages struggling. I see older women struggling and then there are older women in wonderful relationships. I see younger women struggling and then there are younger women in wonderful relationships. Much the same with men. Across the board, you're going to have dating troubles no matter your age. Just because there are 50 posts, posted by unhappy men, about how worthless women are on this forum, doesn't mean women are worthless or that's the reality. Dating and relationships are hard at any age. And it would behoove both men and women to try and understand each other instead of reinforcing stereotypes about each other that only make each other more upset and frustrated and bitter with one another.

 

 

Men you are not independent and have at least some level of financial success are similarly at a disadvantage. I can't make $30k as a kindergarten teacher and have as many dating options as a woman. Similarly, the opposite is true for women, having a solid career does not give them as many options as looks fade. I never said the OP has not options, just that she may either need to offer guys more in a relationship or lower her standards.

 

Yes, we are familiar with the fear mongulling that a number of men here like to engage in concerning women an their worth. I've gone out with all kinds of men from men that made really good salaries to more blue collar kind of guys. I suspect in the real world, that more healthy men also approach dating that way instead of making all encompassing statements about how much better men are then women. Cling tight to those beliefs Sanman. It's not anything men having been doing for billions of years now. And yet, women are moving ahead and still living the lives they want.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

35 is not old for a man or a woman.

 

I don't condone what most of these men are saying but most men do not starting thinking like this until they are hurt by a woman. Being betrayed by a woman you care about can scar a man for life and after that they being much more cold towards women in general.

 

Everything is justifyable to you as long as you can lay on the idea that men are always hurt, always first. Welcome to the real world Woggle where both men and women experience deep pain. Keep justifying degrading commentary about women expressed here on the back of how much pain men *only* feel. Let us know how that works out for you.

 

And for once, take a stand either way. You DO condone what hte men here are saying. You condone it because you think only men get hurt and you only care when men get hurt. Women be damned..once again it's the idea that women "deserve what they get". And apparently it makes a lot of men here happy that women "get" everything short of the black plague.

[iris219]

I know men really want to believe that older men are better. But men aging is no different then women aging and older men are not without absolutes "better". I would take Ryan Gosling over George Clooney any day. Of course, I am around Ryan Goslings age myself and I suspect as we both age, I would still take him over his younger counterparts.

 

Yes, I'd pick Ryan over George any day.

 

Interestingly, Ryan Gosling, who could have any hot 22 year old, is dating 37 year old Eva Mendes. Guess she hasn't heard that dating is pretty much over for women after 30.

 

[Shaun-Dro]

Especially when a lot of men have expressed a desire for women to be independent and share equal expeditures today! So somehow, we are all suppose to be sweet, kind and giving, settle down before 24, meanwhile having enough resources to pay for dates while being independent but not having a real "serious" carreer in the process. Amazing isn't it? And despite being told how worthless we are as human beings and as women for living, a lot of these guys want us to fall at their feet in adoration and gratitude. Or at the very least, expect us to want to be open and vunerable and kind with them when they are just about dispalying the very opposite to women in general. Good luck with that guys.

 

Where do you get this silliness? It's like you pull out of the air and assume that "we" as in the male population on here must be thinking that crap.

 

This is exactly the point that Musej made earlier in that women, you as a case in point, run far away with emotional tirades while men lay back and think on logical, realistic terms before opening our mouths.

[Queen Zenobia]

I think older women have plenty of chances to find husbands.

 

Unfortunately, too many are holding on to what I think are unrealistic standards.

 

I see some who still want a tall athletic male with a full head of hair and financial success to a certain degree...but they find that all the guys who fit that standard won't get married, or they're already married. Then they look at their available dating pool and think there's no good men left.

 

People age...it happens. I won't fault someone who takes amazing care of themselves mentally, physically, and financially if they want someone like-minded. I will fault them if they set the bar too high.

 

So the guy who makes 6-7 figures and works out four days a week wants a "retired model" who has a career making good money and no kids in her life...he's also going to hit a lot of difficulty because IMHO he's being unrealistic.

 

 

In the end, men and women either have to pick from what's available to them...which also means men and women who want the same things in life that they do...or choose to be alone.

 

This sums up the issue fairly well.

 

I honestly don't see why this thread is so controversial. All things being equal, people in general have fewer options once they hit 35 (or thereabouts) than they did when they were 25. I mean it seems like fairly straightforward common sense.

 

Now, we don't live in a world where all things are equal. It's never been a secret that it's more socially acceptable for a man to date a woman 10 years his junior than for a woman to do the same. Thus for a man who works off his social awkwardness or anxieties and makes a good life for himself, his options will tend to expand while comparably women's dwindle. How much dwindling depends on various factors and varies from person to person. Some women will undoubtedly have no problems attracting men for serious relationships when they're 35 while some will. Now, we can gripe about whether or not it's fair or right or sexist or whatever. OR, we can simply figure out the best way to fix the situation we find ourselves in. It's maddening that I'm the only one who sees simple reality and mathematics instead of malice. It's simply too much effort to worry about possibly sexist people, because even if they are sexist (which I highly doubt most are) berating them for it is hardly a good strategy for getting them to change their views.

 

But hey, what do I know? I'm just that crazy gal who's getting married at 23 .