Exposure: good for the goose...

[findingnemo]

I logged into Marriage Builders.com. I wanted to learn a bit about what it takes to make a M work. Why? I thought that if I understood the things that build up a M, maybe I'd know how to handle an R better for the future.

 

So I learned about the principle of Exposure. Basically, the on-site Dr(s). believe that a BS upon discovering an A should tell friends and family about it. This will force the WS to end the A, shame the AP into leaving the couple alone to work themselves out and give the BS a support system.

 

My question: if Exposure is good for the BS, can it also be good for the AP? The fact is that WS' lie through their teeth to the APs about the state of their Ms. If the AP were to "expose" to friends and family and BS, could the following be the result?

 

1. The WS is forced to choose one way or the other.

2. The BS, who has been in the dark, is now informed.

3. The AP now also has his/her own support system.

4. The AP brings a forced end to their personal hell and in some way starts the process of getting out of being an accomplice to the lies, cheating, gas lighting, etc.

 

We sometimes advise APs not to expose and bring pain to the BS, but if exposure is good for the BS, can it be good for the AP too? All opinions are welcome.

[Owl]

I've always been of the opinion that revealing the truth is the best thing possible for all parties in an affair.

 

Getting the truth out in the open pretty much tends to kill the affair, it allows all three parties to make an informed decision about their next course of action, and it forces the situation to be resolved, in some fashion or another.

[bentnotbroken]

I think the truth can only bring healing in the long run. You can't fix what you don't acknowledge(Dr. Phil occassionally gets something right). It doesn't matter what side you are on...if you desire to live in truth and light can only be helped. If your goal in life is to walk around with the rose tinted glasses while looking through a peep hole...then lies are a necessary tool to accomplish that.

[Spark1111]

I agree with Owl.

 

Another result? The MAP may choose the OW/OM.

 

But the affair is OVER no matter what informed choices for the future the three parties make.

 

So yes, I think it can definitely help the AP in either ending the affair for good, and creating a more authentic, out-loud future, whether with the MAP, or not.

 

It is the same for the BS, too.

 

The only one who stands to lose is the MAP, in that either the OW or the BS will not want them anymore.

[reboot]

We sometimes advise APs not to expose and bring pain to the BS

 

Who is 'we'?

[bentnotbroken]

I agree with Owl.

 

Another result? The MAP may choose the OW/OM.

 

But the affair is OVER no matter what informed choices for the future the three parties make.

 

So yes, I think it can definitely help the AP in either ending the affair for good, and creating a more authentic, out-loud future, whether with the MAP, or not.

 

It is the same for the BS, too.

 

The only one who stands to lose is the MAP, in that either the OW or the BS will not want them anymore.

 

 

All alone and free to roam. :laugh:Still brings a smile to my face.

[reboot]

The only one who stands to lose is the MAP, in that either the OW or the BS will not want them anymore.

 

Or maybe even both.

[PhoenixRise]

I logged into Marriage Builders.com. I wanted to learn a bit about what it takes to make a M work. Why? I thought that if I understood the things that build up a M, maybe I'd know how to handle an R better for the future.

 

So I learned about the principle of Exposure. Basically, the on-site Dr(s). believe that a BS upon discovering an A should tell friends and family about it. This will force the WS to end the A, shame the AP into leaving the couple alone to work themselves out and give the BS a support system.

 

My question: if Exposure is good for the BS, can it also be good for the AP? The fact is that WS' lie through their teeth to the APs about the state of their Ms. If the AP were to "expose" to friends and family and BS, could the following be the result?

 

1. The WS is forced to choose one way or the other.

2. The BS, who has been in the dark, is now informed.

3. The AP now also has his/her own support system.

4. The AP brings a forced end to their personal hell and in some way starts the process of getting out of being an accomplice to the lies, cheating, gas lighting, etc.

 

We sometimes advise APs not to expose and bring pain to the BS, but if exposure is good for the BS, can it be good for the AP too? All opinions are welcome.

 

 

I am a FBS and I did expose. Not for the reasons stated on MB because at the time I had not even heard of MB and I didn't do it as a tactic to save the marriage or to shame him.

 

I exposed because after dday I was a hysterical, grief stricken mess and I needed the support of the people who loved me. AND because it was such a burden, an unbearable weight on me to speak to my mom, his mom, his sister etc and pretend that everything was ok when in reality everything felt so broken. So I talked. In the normal course of a week I had normally talked to our extended family and friends at least once a week. After dday when they called and they asked what was new....I told them. Exposure is what let me know that I was not crazy. It was liberating.

 

I think that if a person has gone against their own personal values by getting into an affair exposing it could be liberating. It could be enlightening, It could force a change. It could be good.

Edited October 24, 2011 by PhoenixRise

[Silly_Girl]

I agree with Owl.

 

Another result? The MAP may choose the OW/OM.

 

But the affair is OVER no matter what informed choices for the future the three parties make.

 

That's often not the case though. I initially naively believed that if 'the truth was out there (Scully)' that it meant there wouldn't be - couldn't be on principle of the terminology (secret R) - an affair. But reading here it seems many MAPs will play it down, and carry on, many BSs will not necessarily react (or react as expected) and many APs will carry on seeing the MAP.

[bentnotbroken]

I am a FBS and I did expose. Not for the reasons stated on MB because at the time I had not even heard of MB and I didn't do it as a tactic to save the marriage or to shame him.

 

I exposed because after dday I was a hysterical, grief stricken mess and I needed the support of the people who loved me. AND because it was such a burden, an unbearable weight on me to speak to my mom, his mom, his sister etc and pretend that everything was ok when in reality everything felt so broken. So I talked. In the normal course of a week I had normally talked to our extended family and friends at least once a week. After dday when they called and they asked what was new....I told them. Exposure is what let me know that I was not crazy. It was liberating.

 

I think that if a person has gone against their own personal values by getting into an affair exposing it could be liberating. It could be enlightening, It could force a change. It could be good.

 

 

I hadn't thought of this but I so agree. It was liberating. I was no longer bogged down in the things that used to beat me down. I was free.....

[Snowflower]

 

My question: if Exposure is good for the BS, can it also be good for the AP? The fact is that WS' lie through their teeth to the APs about the state of their Ms. If the AP were to "expose" to friends and family and BS, could the following be the result?

 

 

This is an interesting question! In my time here on LS reading the OW/OM forum, I have not read of a scenario like this.

 

When you say "expose" to friends and family...do you mean the friends and family of the AP, or those of the WS or even those of the BS?

 

Somehow, I think it would bring a lot of drama...but I think exposure would bring about the end of the affair, one way or the other. If this is what the AP wants, then I can't see the harm in it. The BS would know the truth and the WS would get their just desserts!

[Lucky_One]

If the AP were to "expose" to friends and family and BS, could the following be the result?

 

1. The WS is forced to choose one way or the other.

2. The BS, who has been in the dark, is now informed.

3. The AP now also has his/her own support system.

4. The AP brings a forced end to their personal hell and in some way starts the process of getting out of being an accomplice to the lies, cheating, gas lighting, etc.

 

I assume you are going to expose on the WS's side, so that the WS is forced to choose, and the BS is now informed.

 

I am curious about #3. Who now becomes the AP's support system? There has been many an AP who is dropped by friends and family for telling that she is the OW. Are you thinking that someone on the WS side is going to support you? Are you thinking that all of the AP's friends and family are going to rush to her support?

 

And my thought on #4 is that if an AP feels that they are in their own personal hell, then they have a choice to get out of it. They are CHOOSING to stay in their hell. Annihilating other people's lives because the AP feels that the AP is in hell seems a bit...selfish or something. If the AP is that unhappy, then he/she needs to end the EMA.

 

Spark and Snowflower (I think it was them) said that it least it ends the EMA. Sometimes, possibly. But many, many times it does not. The heat dies down at home, the WS gets more freedom, the WS calls the AP, and the AP melts into a puddle of goo, and the EMA starts again.

[findingnemo]

Who is 'we'?

 

"We" some of us on this forum (me included) have advised an AP not to disclose. I can only speak for myself as to the reason why. Reading their posts and sensing that the AP hopes to get the WS all to themselves by telling the BS, I baulked at the idea of suddenly and unceremoniously bringing an innocent person's life crushing around them. But having read about exposure...I'm beginning to think that it could be something to advise people to do.

[findingnemo]

I hadn't thought of this but I so agree. It was liberating. I was no longer bogged down in the things that used to beat me down. I was free.....

 

Liberating. That's interesting.

 

 

This is an interesting question! In my time here on LS reading the OW/OM forum, I have not read of a scenario like this.

 

When you say "expose" to friends and family...do you mean the friends and family of the AP, or those of the WS or even those of the BS?

 

AP exposes to mutual friends, his/her family and the BS. Some APs have exposed. Can't remember who exactly but I've read some threads here.

 

Somehow, I think it would bring a lot of drama...but I think exposure would bring about the end of the affair, one way or the other. If this is what the AP wants, then I can't see the harm in it. The BS would know the truth and the WS would get their just desserts!

[findingnemo]

I think truth is a good thing for all parties!

 

As for exposing, I think one has to think carefully about who they expose it to. As an example, if the BS tells family, will they support you if you reconcile? If you take it to their place of employment, are you willing to deal with it if they get fired?

 

The repercussions can't always be predicted so one should tread carefully and not do it on a knee jerk reaction.

 

I think on MB, they advise against exposing to the employer. They say that the WS could lose his/her job leading to financial difficulty for the family, or even if the AP is a workmate a sexual harassment suit. That's of course a BS exposing. But I bet the same goes for an AP.

[MissBee]

I logged into Marriage Builders.com. I wanted to learn a bit about what it takes to make a M work. Why? I thought that if I understood the things that build up a M, maybe I'd know how to handle an R better for the future.

 

So I learned about the principle of Exposure. Basically, the on-site Dr(s). believe that a BS upon discovering an A should tell friends and family about it. This will force the WS to end the A, shame the AP into leaving the couple alone to work themselves out and give the BS a support system.

 

My question: if Exposure is good for the BS, can it also be good for the AP? The fact is that WS' lie through their teeth to the APs about the state of their Ms. If the AP were to "expose" to friends and family and BS, could the following be the result?

 

1. The WS is forced to choose one way or the other.

2. The BS, who has been in the dark, is now informed.

3. The AP now also has his/her own support system.

4. The AP brings a forced end to their personal hell and in some way starts the process of getting out of being an accomplice to the lies, cheating, gas lighting, etc.

 

We sometimes advise APs not to expose and bring pain to the BS, but if exposure is good for the BS, can it be good for the AP too? All opinions are welcome.

 

I think the difference between APs and BS's are that, most APs choose to be in the A. Therefore it would be silly to choose to be involved with someone committed elsewhere then threaten to expose them and force them to choose, inform the BS, have a support system and the lot. You could just simply choose not to be involved, avoiding all of that. While the BS is already married and has a life with this person and cannot help being affected, whether or not he/she wants to.

 

Whether or not someone is lying about how their marriage really is...so long as they say they're married...you're more aware than the BS is and have a very different set of choices and dynamics going on. Therefore the above is specific to recovering a marriage and can't be applied to an affair...as what would be the goal one is trying to accomplish anyway?

[findingnemo]

I assume you are going to expose on the WS's side, so that the WS is forced to choose, and the BS is now informed.

 

I am curious about #3. Who now becomes the AP's support system? There has been many an AP who is dropped by friends and family for telling that she is the OW. Are you thinking that someone on the WS side is going to support you? Are you thinking that all of the AP's friends and family are going to rush to her support?

 

And my thought on #4 is that if an AP feels that they are in their own personal hell, then they have a choice to get out of it. They are CHOOSING to stay in their hell. Annihilating other people's lives because the AP feels that the AP is in hell seems a bit...selfish or something. If the AP is that unhappy, then he/she needs to end the EMA.

Spark and Snowflower (I think it was them) said that it least it ends the EMA. Sometimes, possibly. But many, many times it does not. The heat dies down at home, the WS gets more freedom, the WS calls the AP, and the AP melts into a puddle of goo, and the EMA starts again.

 

I wasn't thinking about my case in particular. What would I say to BS? Your H and I had a PA almost a decade ago and I still have feelings for him? To what end? Shouldn't I rather be trying to figure out how to stop feeling since I figured out how to stop the physical stuff?

 

Regarding the AP's support system, it exists. It must. There's family which although they don't like your behavior love you all the same. Also the AP would be "coming out" and therefore would receive the benefit of doubt from true friends.

 

So do you think it's better not to expose then and work on getting out of one's personal hell? What about the hell the BS is in? Just because they don't know today and given the rate at which As are found out anyway, would it be better that the AP not participate in "informing" BS and leave it to someone else?

 

A WS who decides after exposure to "openly" see and talk to the AP should just leave IMO or better yet get kicked out. Because at this point, a decision must be made. If not working on the M, get out and go to your OP. Isn't it that simple? That scenario would be cruel to say the least and the BS would have to bear some responsibility in accepting it to last.

Edited October 24, 2011 by findingnemo

[findingnemo]

I think the difference between APs and BS's are that, most APs choose to be in the A. Therefore it would be silly to choose to be involved with someone committed elsewhere then threaten to expose them and force them to choose, inform the BS, have a support system and the lot. You could just simply choose not to be involved, avoiding all of that. While the BS is already married and has a life with this person and cannot help being affected, whether or not he/she wants to.

 

Whether or not someone is lying about how their marriage really is...so long as they say they're married...you're more aware than the BS is and have a very different set of choices and dynamics going on. Therefore the above is specific to recovering a marriage and can't be applied to an affair...as what would be the goal one is trying to accomplish anyway?

 

I agree with the differences. The goal would be to end the A, to get out of hiding, to stop lying and enabling a WS to continue betraying a BS with the AP working as an accomplice. And for an AP who has been lied to about the M perhaps thinking the WS is separated, unhappy with an unstable W, in divorce court, or even that he/she is unmarried, do you think exposure would be a good idea?

[woinlove]

Like others, I think it is best to live honestly and to try not to live in a way where you feel you need to hide important parts of your life. Still, as MissBee pointed out, there isn't much symmetry between the BS and AP in this regard. I think the AP is free to tell whoever they want about the A, but if the AP has leading the MM/MW to believe that they will do their part to hide the truth, then they need to consider whether a secret A is something they want and whether there is an agreement with the MM/MW to be reversed.

 

Once the A ends, tell whoever you wish. If the A and MM/MW was not a significant part of your life, there may be very few people you want to tell. However, usually when someone enters my life in a very significant way, there are a number of people who know (the first being my H, but also close friends and family) and I don't see why an AP should feel the need to behave any differently. Being open and honest about one's life could have a positive effect on the AP.

[jwi71]

I logged into Marriage Builders.com. I wanted to learn a bit about what it takes to make a M work. Why? I thought that if I understood the things that build up a M, maybe I'd know how to handle an R better for the future.

 

So I learned about the principle of Exposure. Basically, the on-site Dr(s). believe that a BS upon discovering an A should tell friends and family about it. This will force the WS to end the A, shame the AP into leaving the couple alone to work themselves out and give the BS a support system.

 

My question: if Exposure is good for the BS, can it also be good for the AP? The fact is that WS' lie through their teeth to the APs about the state of their Ms. If the AP were to "expose" to friends and family and BS, could the following be the result?

 

1. The WS is forced to choose one way or the other.

2. The BS, who has been in the dark, is now informed.

3. The AP now also has his/her own support system.

4. The AP brings a forced end to their personal hell and in some way starts the process of getting out of being an accomplice to the lies, cheating, gas lighting, etc.

 

We sometimes advise APs not to expose and bring pain to the BS, but if exposure is good for the BS, can it be good for the AP too? All opinions are welcome.

 

Be telling you set yourself free.

Focus on little more than that one selfish gain...you set yourself free.

Forget all the other bullshyte and remember that...by telling you set yourself free.

 

Or you can muddle along in option two for a few more years. Up to you really.

 

So what's it gonna be? Gonna wallow in this a few more years...or are you going to set yourself free?

 

Or do you already have yet another excuse to not act?

[SidLyon]

I logged into Marriage Builders.com. I wanted to learn a bit about what it takes to make a M work. Why? I thought that if I understood the things that build up a M, maybe I'd know how to handle an R better for the future.

 

So I learned about the principle of Exposure. Basically, the on-site Dr(s). believe that a BS upon discovering an A should tell friends and family about it. This will force the WS to end the A, shame the AP into leaving the couple alone to work themselves out and give the BS a support system.

 

My question: if Exposure is good for the BS, can it also be good for the AP? The fact is that WS' lie through their teeth to the APs about the state of their Ms. If the AP were to "expose" to friends and family and BS, could the following be the result?

 

1. The WS is forced to choose one way or the other.

2. The BS, who has been in the dark, is now informed.

3. The AP now also has his/her own support system.

4. The AP brings a forced end to their personal hell and in some way starts the process of getting out of being an accomplice to the lies, cheating, gas lighting, etc.

 

We sometimes advise APs not to expose and bring pain to the BS, but if exposure is good for the BS, can it be good for the AP too? All opinions are welcome.

 

I think exposure is best. Sometimes the consequences are not predictable. I would have thought that there could be detrimental consequences to an OW when she exposes the MM because she will also be exposing her own participation.

 

While I believe it is best, I think anybody exposing takes a risk to themselves. For example as a BW when I exposed my H's activities to all and sundry I also exposed my own weaknesses. Some people were critical of me for not ending the marriage.

[findingnemo]

Be telling you set yourself free.

Focus on little more than that one selfish gain...you set yourself free.

Forget all the other bullshyte and remember that...by telling you set yourself free.

 

Or you can muddle along in option two for a few more years. Up to you really.

 

So what's it gonna be? Gonna wallow in this a few more years...or are you going to set yourself free?

 

Or do you already have yet another excuse to not act?

 

Lol! It took me a while to figure out what Option 2 was.

 

I'm still thinking about my options and I tell you, it is not easy. But neither is staying where I am. Thus my need to understand how to make a future R work given that I have had major issues to date. So what did I do? Visited MB and was struck by the Exposure concept.

 

In my case, I don't see how it would apply. Maybe I'm wrong but would exposure stop me from feeling what I feel? Would it induce NC for a longer period than before? And if it did, would LT NC make a difference? Had I exposed during our R (before his M), it probably would have resolved things. Had I exposed at the beginning of the A, it may have worked. To expose now just feels weird somehow.

 

In the case of others I wonder, should Exposure be something we advise APs to do as procedurally as NC for example?

[findingnemo]

I think exposure is best. Sometimes the consequences are not predictable. I would have thought that there could be detrimental consequences to an OW when she exposes the MM because she will also be exposing her own participation.

 

While I believe it is best, I think anybody exposing takes a risk to themselves. For example as a BW when I exposed my H's activities to all and sundry I also exposed my own weaknesses. Some people were critical of me for not ending the marriage.

 

There's the ideal, then there's reality. I understand what you're saying. The ideal would be that whoever exposes is honest and therefore a remorseful person (AP) or the betrayed (bS) who deserves sympathy and understanding.

 

For the AP, the consequences include everybody knowing that one lacks some morals (there's really no two ways about this one:o: IMO) and for the BS people get to know your business and if WS goes into self-defence mode, they'll get to know some nasty things (true or untrue) about you. In my culture, a W is told to refrain from telling the people that love her (friends and family) too many bad things about her H. The reason? She may eventually forgive and forget but they won't. They are not in love with him as she is.

 

I'm sorry to hear that anyone blamed you for fighting for your M. It would be interesting to know whether such people were themselves M or in An R and had gone through that sitch. Don't mind them.

[MissBee]

I agree with the differences. The goal would be to end the A, to get out of hiding, to stop lying and enabling a WS to continue betraying a BS with the AP working as an accomplice. And for an AP who has been lied to about the M perhaps thinking the WS is separated, unhappy with an unstable W, in divorce court, or even that he/she is unmarried, do you think exposure would be a good idea?

 

I'm not really one to spread my business far and wide so in general, my response to the idea of telling employers, family, friends, anyone willing to hear, about my H's affair doesn't gel with me. Sid's point about people being critical of you as well, admittedly does factor in. However, I'd most likely tell my family and close friends because I need support to go through it and as I go forward in deciding whether or not reconciliation is possible and not because I am using it as a tactic to force him to stop seeing the OW or make a choice or for revenge.

 

My dad has cheated several times and one thing my mom has said about that is: "I don't go around telling people because if you tell everyone, if you decide to forgive, then people are going to talk about you and they're also going to judge him". I both agree and disagree on the principle. I am not going to keep it to myself, but I'd probably tell as few folks as possible, my two bestfriends would be the first I'd confide in, even before my family, and through their support and advice, I'd play it by ear and very carefully to see how I am going to deal with it. The assumption I am making here is that my husband still wants to be with me....in that case I have a lot to think about and marriage counseling would be in order to work through where things are going. If he is announcing his cheating or it has come to light and he wants to be with the other woman...then I'd probably tell everyone.I'd be very hurt and have the attitude that fine, do whatever the heck you want to do, I'm going to tell everyone though! That's the truth . If I wanted to reconcile or he wanted to reconcile then I'd be a lot more strategic...as my mom points out that, that's the life you will have to live and what you tell people will surely live on, even after you work through your issues.

 

On the side of the OW...which I was before, to an unmarried man. Again - I do not see the point of someone who is aware of the person's status (whether they are happily or unhappily married, they are still married, and still not "fair game") telling/exposing. Who are they going to tell and expose it to? Only the BS probably, as in my case, telling people in my life would have made no difference and would have had no repercussions for me, and my friends knew the dilemma anyway and he was not a coworker or anything that further scandalizes it. I also think him not being married does make the weight less in terms of how me telling others would look.Me telling his gf would also not benefit me in any way. If you want to stop living a lie...you can do so without "exposing" it; you can still expose it if you want, as the truth is the truth, but I think an OW/OM who knew about the MP's status would seem hypocritical if he or she continued the A for a while then all of a sudden decided to tell. Surely, something makes you want to tell now than 2 months ago, 6 months ago, 6 years ago? I'd rather bow out gracefully (if there is such a thing) rather than go on a telling-spree, especially if I was no victim in the scenario. And if I were a BS and an OW exposed the A to me, but told me that she had no clue he was married or he said he was legally separated or even that he told her I said he could date others, I'd probably have empathy and sympathy for her moreso than one who admits to knowing he was married, she just thought he was unhappy, I was a biiaatch, we slept in different rooms, some other lie that renders him married and secretly dating another. I'd feel like it was a case of sour grapes or something and I'd just want her to get out of my face, as she was not a victim. He lied about his happiness...but that didn't render him unmarried and that was your indiscretion for choosing to date a MP based on their happiness and ignoring their married-ness.

Edited October 24, 2011 by MissBee

[Spark1111]

Lol! It took me a while to figure out what Option 2 was.

 

I'm still thinking about my options and I tell you, it is not easy. But neither is staying where I am. Thus my need to understand how to make a future R work given that I have had major issues to date. So what did I do? Visited MB and was struck by the Exposure concept.

 

In my case, I don't see how it would apply. Maybe I'm wrong but would exposure stop me from feeling what I feel? Would it induce NC for a longer period than before? And if it did, would LT NC make a difference? Had I exposed during our R (before his M), it probably would have resolved things. Had I exposed at the beginning of the A, it may have worked. To expose now just feels weird somehow.

 

In the case of others I wonder, should Exposure be something we advise APs to do as procedurally as NC for example?

 

This is a very interesting point, FN!

 

I think, almost NEVER is the affair exposed by the AP DURING the affair!

 

Why do YOU think that is?

 

I cannot think of one good clear reason for it.

 

Can you?