Is it time to just give up?

[toosoft]

Ive been with my W for 18 years, married 15. We have 4 children together.

 

3 years ago I did something absolutely stupid, I had an affair with an old flame. At the time I saw it as excitement and lusty sex. It went on for months undetected until she fell pregnant. The OW then turned into a bunny boiler and I had no choice but to come clean to W. It utterly devestated her. The look on her face as she realised I wasnt joking, I will never ever forget. I will go to the grave with the shame of what I did.

 

A testamony to who my W is, we spoke about it and decided to work together to fix things. We got the OW and her husband round and we spoke about this new child. We decided to play a part in its life and would have regular contact.

 

During the pregnancy, I found it hard to cut off contact with the OW, and often spoke to her, much to W's understandable dissaproval.

 

After baby was born, the reality hit my W again and she wobbled a bit. We were very up and down and at one point I moved out because I didn't know how I felt about W v OW. Didn't take me long to realise I didnt really love OW like I loved my W, so I asked if we could work on things. She in the mean time had met a bloke, but it hadnt worked out. So we recommited to sorting things out.

 

Feb this year we had a wedding vow ceremony and recommited publically to eachother. It was a wonderful day. Shortly after we moved into a new house which I spent a fortune on getting really nice for us all.

 

My W had lost a lot of weight and went for cosmetic surgery in March to remove excess skin. Soon after the op, she realy gained in confidence. She would often come home and tell me about all the blokes that had noticed her and all the nice clothes she could now wear. I can see now this was the start of my insecurity. I started to rein her in, trying to stop her going out alone etc etc. By May, I was so insecure and depressed I was taking it out on her and the kids. After an incident of me losing my rag, she told me she wanted a different life and it wasnt with me. I moved out.

 

Few days later a few blokes began to be added to her facebook. Within a week she was speaking heavily to one of them and she told me she was off on a night out. After the night out, she told me she was off on a date with him. To cut a long story short, it wasn't long before they were an item. He lived away, so she went with the kids to stay with him. Eventually she gave up our rented home and moved to be close to him. I moved on too, seeing an old work mate, I rushed and moved in with her (only for it to crash and burn a month later and I was back homeless).

 

About a month ago when I moved out my GF. W contacted me to ask how I was. I told her I was ok and relieved that I realised it wasnt going to work between me and GF before too much damage was done. She told me she was unhappy and couldnt stop thinking about me. She said she still loved me. She told me that OM had a lot of faults, including performance issues in the bedroom and drinking too much. A few days after that, she emailed me one morning to say she had realised she wanted to be with me and was coming back to the area. She arrived a few hours later with all the kids and some bags of clothes. I was living in a caravan, but we all squeezed in. For the next 4 weeks, she flitted between her feelings for me and those for OM. I helped her to move into a house just round the corner from where I stay. Last week, when I went cold on her after hearing about how great OM was for past few weeks, she spoke to me and begged me back, she didnt want to lose me. So I said to cut off all contact to OM, commit to me and working on marriage etc... she agreed, saying she would do anything it took. She told him it was over. He sent her some lovely emails wishing us luck and hoping we could be friends... I knew that had unsettled her, she kept saying what a nice bloke he was etc etc. Less than 48 hours later, she tells me she loves me, but isnt in love with me... she wants OM back. So, to be blunt, I told her to go then. So now they are back together and its all over for us. Ive gone to low contact and wished them both luck. But I sit here wanting her back. Why do I feel this way after the past events. It seems obvious our relationship is well and truely broken... but I know she is confused and am holding onto false hope I think.

 

Come on guys, you tell me what to do for the best! Im just sat quietly waiting for something to happen...

[Iheartme]

You are not a yoyo. Take pride in yourself and don't let her ways fool you. Yes you've done her wrong but there are only 2 choices, live with each other or separate. Have you even considered the feelings of your kids? You do know that they sense tension and they take it out on other things right?

[toosoft]

Yeah im well aware my kids have been messed about. She yo-yo's and has moved them 150 miles away and back again within a few weeks... its been a real termoil for them. Thats another reason why ive given up on her, because im hoping now she just gets on with things with the OM. Im hoping by making myself unavailable, ill restore some stability.

 

I did get contacted by her last night for the first time... she asked if id gone away. I ignored it, so then she sent me a 'are u not talking to me' message. I replied simply 'only if it involves the kids', she then asked what she'd done... I was so tempted to rant, but instead ignored it. Then she sent me another message asking if id spoken to a friend because they had emailed her (see just trying to get me to bite with that) - so i replied 'You know I only speak to a few trusted people, now stop bothering me, i dont want you and i dont need you' - it then went all quiet. So here starts LC... wish me luck.

[toosoft]

The peace and quiet lasted two hours before the next message. She started off with telling me she had her counselling starting on Monday. I should of just ignored it, but im so fed up of the stupid messages, I said 'why you telling me'. Wrong move, just opened up more 'why are you being like this' messages. I ended the conversation by saying 'I dont feel the same about you, I disapprove of your actions. I can choose whether I want to talk to you or not and like I said, im only interested if it concerns the kids.Other than that, your on your own. Good Luck.' - she came back with 'best get divorce papers in then'. So I said 'unless you get yourself out the affair fog (google it), then thats what will be happening. Now go get on with your life and leave me to mine'. Again, she went quiet. No doubt she will google affair fog, but theres no way she will believe thats what she's suffering with...

 

I really am annoyed with her. For over a month ive pandered to her every breadcrumb. Now I couldnt give a toss if she stays with OM. Ive learnt there is more to life than a woman who treats you badly, hurts you and wants to be a cake eater.

 

I really must keep focus, come on guys, tell me off, get me back on the LC track!

[Surfer203]

toosoft: Sounds like you are on the right track now, keep it up. Don't go back on what you are putting into place. It takes most people a lot longer to get to where you are - don't stop even if it's just talking big to make yourself feel better.

[Iheartme]

Nice one! Keep it going and hang in there

[toosoft]

Had a really vivid dream last night that me and W were together and happy, woke up feeling rreally disturbed. Then she messages me about kids. Its gunna be a hard day today....

[toosoft]

Well well, what a bizarre day. W turned up with the kids, came in and sat down. Which is good, because I wanted to explain to her in person that I disapproved of what she was doing and I wasnt prepared to be her 'friend' while this continued. So politely I explained how I felt. Then she said 'you dont know how I feel', so I agreed and she proceeded to tell me. I said very very little, just sat and listened. The basics of it are, OM is very insecure and doesnt leave her alone, at all. She feels smothered. She also said she doesnt feel anything for him. She feels she just needs some space for herself. I asked her if she thought it was wise stringing him along if she felt this way... she knows it isnt, but she said to end it with him would destroy him. There was so much I would of liked to have laughed at or ranted about, but I was super calm... I surprised myself, it must be the new anti-depressants ive started??

 

So I left the conversation with 'good luck'. She came over, kissed me and hugged me. She said thank you for listening. She understands where I stand, im not interested.

 

I think its just a matter of time before it all ends with OM, but im maintaining a distance until its well and truely over for good. Then I may consider being friends. Im so hurt, I feel like I couldnt have her back.

[toosoft]

Hmmm... listen up people, here's how not to handle your W when she wants to reconcile...

 

She finished with OM shortly after we talked (last post). He showed his true colours to her and she didnt want him ever.

 

Few sticking points though, she wouldnt cut contact completely with him, which has been eating away at me subconsciously since. She did however put me back on her facebook etc.

 

We spoke in detail and decided to be friends. That didnt last long before we ended up much more than friends. I wanted to take things slow, but I was scared of losing her, so caved in and slept with her. She was trying a lot and the old W seemed back, with love, affection etc... BUT something was going on in my head... I felt very indifferent?? I wasn't sure how I felt about her anymore. Now I 'had her back', the adrenaline from the fight for her was over and I could relax. In this relaxed state of mind I started questioning my own feelings for her. I was very up and down. I also felt like I was getting dragged in too quick. Id gone from LC to her using me like a fulltime husband again, but without the benefit of the respect and position a husband has in the family. She got a job and just expected me to childmind (its evening bar work), she needed help financially (so I helped) and she doesnt like being alone (so when she is and calls, I come running). However, It all came to a head tonight when she told me I wasnt the head of the family... I saw red, told her bollocks and walked out. We then had a brief exchange of messages, which however I tried to explained how I felt, ended in her wanting to spin it round and argue about it. Now shes posted on facebook that she's been let down again and she will do things on her own now.

 

We're supposed to be starting MC tomorrow... hope I dont have to go alone... we so need their help.

[findingnemo]

Hey toosoft,

 

I don't know...you R with your W is sounding a bit crazy. Please don't get offended. First you had an A and it looks like things were working out in the reconciliation department. Then all hell broke loose. I can understand your W being upset about the baby but what you're describing is serious self-destructive behaviour. Well, you're going to MC. Hopefully, you can begin to communicate and reach a place where you can figure out what you both want.

 

Good luck.

[toosoft]

In its basic form, its two people who cant live with and cant live without eachother... I long for a stable relationship...

 

I really hope MC can help, or even help us to see if we have a future or not??

[toosoft]

MC day today... Ive been this morning to talk to W and by talk I mean listen. She said a lot of valid things. My own conclusion is that after waiting and fighting for her, once I 'had her back', i wanted to see her work hard for my affection - WRONG! I see now what I was doing.

 

Anywhoo, after a good chat, some more thinking and then a heart felt email to her which basically said please dont give up when we are so close to getting help, she has agreed to go to MC with me this afternoon.

 

So now im nervous, cos things arnt as good as they were a few days ago. But I guess thats what MC is for...

[robf1971]

MC day today... Ive been this morning to talk to W and by talk I mean listen. She said a lot of valid things. My own conclusion is that after waiting and fighting for her, once I 'had her back', i wanted to see her work hard for my affection - WRONG! I see now what I was doing.

 

Anywhoo, after a good chat, some more thinking and then a heart felt email to her which basically said please dont give up when we are so close to getting help, she has agreed to go to MC with me this afternoon.

 

So now im nervous, cos things arnt as good as they were a few days ago. But I guess thats what MC is for...

 

You allow her to treat you less than a husband... Instead of just doing what she says, and 5 days later exploding in a row and walking out, How about

 

' Wife, I like spending time with you but tonight I've made plans for xyz'

 

Sounds like your scared of conflict with her, when she starts shouting you need to be the stable one,

 

'Wife until you can speak to me in a civilised tone this conversation is over' then walk away.

 

Your wife probably thinks of you like a child, that's why she's all wishy washy about being attracted to you. Deep down she would love it if you stood up for yourself in a strong calm way.

 

I bet you are passive aggressive too, you'll do what she says but act really angry at her while doing it. That is the world's biggest turnoff to women.

 

I reconciled my marriage by working this out so I'm worth listening to.

[toosoft]

You allow her to treat you less than a husband... Instead of just doing what she says, and 5 days later exploding in a row and walking out, How about

 

' Wife, I like spending time with you but tonight I've made plans for xyz'

 

Sounds like your scared of conflict with her, when she starts shouting you need to be the stable one,

 

'Wife until you can speak to me in a civilised tone this conversation is over' then walk away.

 

Your wife probably thinks of you like a child, that's why she's all wishy washy about being attracted to you. Deep down she would love it if you stood up for yourself in a strong calm way.

 

I bet you are passive aggressive too, you'll do what she says but act really angry at her while doing it. That is the world's biggest turnoff to women.

 

I reconciled my marriage by working this out so I'm worth listening to.

 

Hmmm, I wouldnt say im passive aggressive... definetly passive though. There is definetly a polarity shift in our relationship attaining to me affair previously... I became 'so soooo sorry' all the time and 'gave up' my alpha male role to her. She then wore the trousers and now its hard to get em back.

 

So since yesterday ive gone back to LC. Ive sat and thought about things overnight and this morning. Im actually quite annoyed that yet again ive sat and took all the blame... she is becoming a professional victim, not willing to accept any proportion of the blame. After all, she has put me through hell recently and none of that was taken into account... just everything ive ever done and said wrong. I dont think it helps having a female MC... I think it would be fairer to have one of each gender there, so you get a mixed opinion! I felt very threatened in MC yesterday. Next week we have someone different (yesterday was just an assessment), so im hoping things are more balanced. Ive also started to keep a diary, so I can relate back to it, seen as my memory is so poor!

 

As for your suggestions, im gunna try em buddy, I got nothing to lose. But im almost sure at first that 'attitude' to things will not be welcomed - she loves conflict and will hate that I end it calmly lol

[robf1971]

Hmmm, I wouldnt say im passive aggressive... definetly passive though. There is definetly a polarity shift in our relationship attaining to me affair previously... I became 'so soooo sorry' all the time and 'gave up' my alpha male role to her. She then wore the trousers and now its hard to get em back.

 

So since yesterday ive gone back to LC. Ive sat and thought about things overnight and this morning. Im actually quite annoyed that yet again ive sat and took all the blame... she is becoming a professional victim, not willing to accept any proportion of the blame. After all, she has put me through hell recently and none of that was taken into account... just everything ive ever done and said wrong. I dont think it helps having a female MC... I think it would be fairer to have one of each gender there, so you get a mixed opinion! I felt very threatened in MC yesterday. Next week we have someone different (yesterday was just an assessment), so im hoping things are more balanced. Ive also started to keep a diary, so I can relate back to it, seen as my memory is so poor!

 

As for your suggestions, im gunna try em buddy, I got nothing to lose. But im almost sure at first that 'attitude' to things will not be welcomed - she loves conflict and will hate that I end it calmly lol

 

Yes she will at first!!

 

she is subconciously fitness testing you as all women do, everytime you fly of the handle, walk out, be too passive you are failing.

 

Even now my relationship is reconciled I keep practicing this. The other day she started trying to blame me for the way she felt about something. In the old days I'd have just nodded my head and kept quiet. The new me said 'sorry, you chose to do this, so it was your decision, stop blaming me' Ten minutes later she comes back in the room and gives me a huge hug and apology.

 

This is what relationships are built on, it doesn't take much and you need to become an alpha male again. i repeat that does not mean being nasty. Good luck

[toosoft]

I hear ya brother! Ive put it into practice already and yes she didnt react too well, but ill stick at it... ive got nowt to lose lol

[toosoft]

Well, yet again everything is changed. W seemed different after talking to my mum yesterday. Then today shes been really 'playful'. She has been very friendly and then earlier cornered me and hugged and kissed me. I was shocked. I made a quick exit. She messaged me and said she wanted to work on things. Its my turn to look after the kids tonight while she's at work. Before she left, she said to me 'will you be waiting for me in my bed when I get in??' ... I know what your all going to say, be cautious. But when I rejected her before it pushed her away. She seems sincere. Im worried what to do for the best

Edited November 9, 2011 by toosoft

[toosoft]

Quick update. I decided to take her at her word. So far so good, but she still keeps her exOM on fb which upsets me. Im hoping MC will pick that out.

 

She has said she cant ever live with me. So if MC cant work that out either, it may be a deciding factor in our future as a couple. I get the feeling she likes being the trouser wearer and doesnt want to give that up?? what do I know, im just a bloke!

[Steadfast]

With all of those kids, when do you ever get the time to do anything else?

 

I don't have much in the way of personal advice for reconciliation, but reading over your story it's obvious you rocked her world with the affair and a child out of wedlock. What kind of wife was she before that? What kind of person? Don't look back with bias, try to get in touch with that time, and while you're there come to grips with why you cheated her...for so long.

 

IMO, you have no right to complain about anything...except how the constant chaos is affecting the kids. You and your wife should talk about what kind of example you're setting. What they're hearing, and seeing. That's more important that bumping bongos, FB friends or the rest of the petty crap you described. Time to be adults and learn what love really is.

 

Ask your wife what kind of life she wants, then see if your honest answer fits in with hers. If it does, remind yourself that love (and dedication) is a decision; not an emotion. I 'feel' every time I see Salma Hayek on tv, but the 'reality' is she doesn't give two squats about me. Reinforce the decisions with mutual respect, and stop being so damn needy. You're allowed to have a life and career outside of marriage, and so is she.

 

Be somebody. Stop wasting life. Don't be the problem, be the answer.

[toosoft]

Good advice Steadfast, I take it all on board.

 

Just little update. Im doing what I promised her, helping out when im needed. She offers to cook meals for me and wash my clothes. We went to week 2 of MC this week, was quite positive.

 

We are both very cautious around eachother, our relationship is strictly business at the moment.

 

Ive removed her off fb, so that doesnt serve as a trigger point for me, seeing the OM replying on all her postings.. I also signed for the keys to my own place today. So im hoping with me being more settled and having my own space, I should be able to chill more.

 

As for how I feel. I miss her and the closeness we had. But things are more stable at the moment because we are taking things easy. Im tired of being on a rollercoaster, id rather do without cuddles but be happier in myself (if that makes sense).

[whichwayisup]

Quick update. I decided to take her at her word. So far so good, but she still keeps her exOM on fb which upsets me. Im hoping MC will pick that out.

 

She has said she cant ever live with me. So if MC cant work that out either, it may be a deciding factor in our future as a couple. I get the feeling she likes being the trouser wearer and doesnt want to give that up?? what do I know, im just a bloke!

 

If she can't live without you, then the exOM must GO. Be deleted and blocked on her facebook. She should see how it upsets you and put you first.

The problem is, it seems she's still emotionally attached to the exOM. Doesn't mean she is in love with him and wants him back, but it certainly means she's not working towards detaching and going NC (no contact) mode with him. As long as she is in contact with him, he'll be in the way of your marriage, how she feels towards you.