Defining an EA: What it is and is not...

[Toodamnpragmatic]

That you can't have a friendship with someone of the opposite sex, discuss intimate details and it doesn't lead to love/sex? It does not happen by accident. It does if that is what you want.

[carhill]

Sure TDP, it does happen all the time. As long as the partner whom the intimate details regard is disclosed and/or in agreement with said relationship and disclosure style, it's appropriate for that relationship. The couple decides those boundaries for themselves, much as they decide the boundaries for heterosexual friendships/associations. As threads on LS underscore, there are no 'universal' boundaries which apply to everyone.

 

Here's a question: If someone tells you they love you, but only out of earshot of their spouse/partner, do you think that's inappropriate? Could they just be discussing 'intimate details' and it not be 'leading to love/sex'? That's one aspect of a boundary, and an experience I've had enough times to form an opinion about. Yes, I've had those discussions with my therapist hat on and not had it lead to love/sex for myself, but was the interaction inappropriate? Unknown. I'd have to ask the person's spouse/partner.

[Elizabeth Southerns]

That you can't have a friendship with someone of the opposite sex, discuss intimate details and it doesn't lead to love/sex?

 

I've never had it lead to sex. It would be a major turn-off for me - a sure way of ensuring that sex was forever off the table! I would NEVER discuss intimate R details - theirs or mine - with someone I had even an outside hope of shagging. It would kill that interest stone dead...

 

I recognise that that flies in the face of transference / counter-transference in a therapeutic R, but I've never done that, either. For me passion and intimacy are two distinct drives.

[2sure]

Im not sure. What defines betrayal is as different to each person and relationship as the answer to what kind of betrayal is worse.

 

But you know...the definition isnt whats important. Whats important is that There is a Problem. Problem being her husband is not comfortable with her relationship with this male friend.

 

Would it be different if the friend were female?

Would it be different if the friend were gay?

If the friend was unattractive?

If they never discussed the marriage?

If they were golf buddies?

 

Sure. All of those things MIGHT make it different. But those scenarios are not the case. And if they were the problem, the important part is that her Spouse has an issue.

 

Maybe the spouse is paranoid. Maybe he is too possessive. Maybe he doesnt like this particular friend for his own reasons.

 

If those issues apply, then they need to be addressed. But still...It remains that the important part is that there is an issue between the H and W.

 

If the husband is normally none of the above...then the friend goes.

 

As far as I am concerned, its less about either of the spouses definition of an affair...its about the fact that one spouse is uncomfortable with a relationship that does not include him or her and that is , right or wrong , effecting the Marriage.

 

What is more important?

[findingnemo]

Your friend sounds like she's not open to listening right now.

 

FN---I went through something very similar with a married female friend just over a year ago.

 

She confessed to me that she had strong feelings for a colleague.

 

(funny thing is--I'd already guessed as much, simply from observing their body language around each other. She was shocked that I wasn't shocked.

I said, "sorry, but the two of you are more transparent than you realize...")

 

I gently let her know what I predicted the outcome would be. I tried very hard to warn her about what she could end up going through---(this guy has had other affairs in the past---he's NOT going to leave his wife/meal ticket)

 

I even gave her a link to Loveshack here, and recommended that she take a couple of afternoons, or evenings, and simply read, read, read. I was hoping she would recognize aspects of her current mindset in some of the other OWs posts. She never did visit here---she wanted to keep her head in the sand.

 

Sure enough---someone got word back to his BS, and the proverbial feces hit the oscillating device. He's working on his marriage--and hers fell apart.

She's sporting bus tracks across her heart now.

 

It's hard to be in the position of third party observer, once you know how much damage can happen. I feel compassion for my friend's pain--but she chose to gamble anyways........and lost. She had a H who loved her, who busted his behind to help her--(I witnessed this personally)and she tossed him aside.

She also lost social standing, as well as her job---most of the women in the crowd want nothing to do with her now......word got out, gossip flew---and she was left holding the bag.

All of which I predicted..........*shaking my head , sadly*

 

That's a sad story and unfortunately my friend's story may end just like that. I still need to sit her down and tell her what I think. But I've also learned that people do whatever they want to do regardless of advice given to the contrary. Thanks for sharing your sfriend's story.

[findingnemo]

I agree with this in the larger sense, but have to play devil's advocate here and throw out...what if the H (or W if the roles were reversed) has issues with self esteem, jealousy or trust that have nothing to do with their own spouse? This causes the H or W to be overly suspicious and it becomes more of a control issue to appease their own insecurities rather than the actions of their spouse at all? Does the H or W have any responsibility to themselves and their partner to try to look past their own irrational fears?

 

Yes Sad, the H has his own issues including a temper and his inability when pissed to control himself. My friend should be careful about having an A with the issues her H has. My main fear is the fallout that will result.

[findingnemo]

Im not sure. What defines betrayal is as different to each person and relationship as the answer to what kind of betrayal is worse.

 

But you know...the definition isnt whats important. Whats important is that There is a Problem. Problem being her husband is not comfortable with her relationship with this male friend.

 

Would it be different if the friend were female?

Would it be different if the friend were gay?

If the friend was unattractive?

If they never discussed the marriage?

If they were golf buddies?

 

Sure. All of those things MIGHT make it different. But those scenarios are not the case. And if they were the problem, the important part is that her Spouse has an issue.

 

Maybe the spouse is paranoid. Maybe he is too possessive. Maybe he doesnt like this particular friend for his own reasons.

 

If those issues apply, then they need to be addressed. But still...It remains that the important part is that there is an issue between the H and W.

 

If the husband is normally none of the above...then the friend goes.

 

As far as I am concerned, its less about either of the spouses definition of an affair...its about the fact that one spouse is uncomfortable with a relationship that does not include him or her and that is , right or wrong , effecting the Marriage.

 

What is more important?

 

Good questions, 2sure. Her H has his weaknesses for sure. I'd rather she gets a separation since I think a bad M is primarily the reason she seeks solace elsewhere.

[MissBee]

Im not sure. What defines betrayal is as different to each person and relationship as the answer to what kind of betrayal is worse.

 

But you know...the definition isnt whats important. Whats important is that There is a Problem. Problem being her husband is not comfortable with her relationship with this male friend.

 

Would it be different if the friend were female?

Would it be different if the friend were gay?

If the friend was unattractive?

If they never discussed the marriage?

If they were golf buddies?

 

Sure. All of those things MIGHT make it different. But those scenarios are not the case. And if they were the problem, the important part is that her Spouse has an issue.

 

Maybe the spouse is paranoid. Maybe he is too possessive. Maybe he doesnt like this particular friend for his own reasons.

 

If those issues apply, then they need to be addressed. But still...It remains that the important part is that there is an issue between the H and W.

 

If the husband is normally none of the above...then the friend goes.

As far as I am concerned, its less about either of the spouses definition of an affair...its about the fact that one spouse is uncomfortable with a relationship that does not include him or her and that is , right or wrong , effecting the Marriage.

 

What is more important?

 

I concur with your entire post 100%!

[Toodamnpragmatic]

Good questions, 2sure. Her H has his weaknesses for sure. I'd rather she gets a separation since I think a bad M is primarily the reason she seeks solace elsewhere.

 

That is the crux of the issue a bad marriage..... That is for them to work on and the OM to understand before he gets in to deep.

 

The OP asked for a definition, and always it seems to comedown to marriages that aren't stable.