How do you do it?

[TigerCub]

These are questions to anyone that's ever gotten married.

 

How did you believe that this was the right thing to do?

Did you not have any doubts?

 

How do people get married, when marriage doesn't guarantee anything.

 

I look at the concept of marriage and it scares me. I just see the downfalls:

- divorce

- cheating

- screwed up finances

- possible child custody issues

 

I really want to look at things in a more pleasant way, but I'm such a pessimist when it comes to marriage and it makes me sad.

 

My boyfriend has been talking a lot about us moving in together, he's talking about the future, and marriage in a few years, and it makes me sad that I can't look at it in the idealistic way that some other people do.

 

Its not an issue of loving my boyfriend, because I do love him, and I know that I would have those same fears regardless of who I was with.

 

So...how did you guys do it?

 

Does having doubts about "forever" mean that you doubt the person you're committing to? Or is that normal?

 

When I think of marriage, I do think of forever, but that's not the case usually, and I honestly don't believe that "forever" happens, I want to believe, but all evidence is to the contrary.

 

so how do you know if you're with the right person and can promise forever?

 

My bf knows of my concerns and he does think that I'm way too pessimistic - he also thinks that reading on LS is part of the reason

 

but in all honesty, its not just LS, so many people I know have troubled marriages and are trapped...and being trapped is my biggest fear.

 

I need to learn to be more optimistic, I just don't know how to get past these fears.

 

Thanks

[denise_xo]

I didn't 'know'. I just took a chance and jumped My decision was affected by external circumstances (living in a conservative community where there is no concept of 'having a boyfriend').

Edited November 7, 2011 by denise_xo
typo

[TigerCub]

I didn't 'know'. I just took a chance and jumped My decision was affected by external circumstances (living in a conservative community where there is not concept of 'having a boyfriend').

 

That's pretty courageous

so how did that work out? You still together?

If so, how long?

[kaleidoscope]

I think that's a great question.

 

Why are some marriages successful while others fall apart?

 

One can take the "leap of faith" approach and say I love my significant other and that's all I need to know to get married. Love is all you need, etc, etc.

 

Another approach is to look at things much more analytically. There is research on this subject. For example, google John Gottman and he has studied traits of successful and unsuccessful marriages.

 

Personally, I am all for the analytical approach because its too easy to be simply infatuated and infatuation wears off.

 

Sure, it may sound like it kills the romance but love in this world love should be both romantic and realistic in my opinion.

 

Personally, I say read, read read a lot of relationship books. Not just YOU. I believe both you and your partner should read.

 

And talk, talk talk about everything.

 

Love, sex, who does the dishes, kids, your future and where you want it to go. etc....

 

When you can do that, you won't have any doubts.

 

Just my 2 cents.

[TigerCub]

I think that's a great question.

 

Why are some marriages successful while others fall apart?

 

One can take the "leap of faith" approach and say I love my significant other and that's all I need to know to get married. Love is all you need, etc, etc.

 

Another approach is to look at things much more analytically. There is research on this subject. For example, google John Gottman and he has studied traits of successful and unsuccessful marriages.

 

Personally, I am all for the analytical approach because its too easy to be simply infatuated and infatuation wears off.

 

Sure, it may sound like it kills the romance but love in this world love should be both romantic and realistic in my opinion.

 

Personally, I say read, read read a lot of relationship books. Not just YOU. I believe both you and your partner should read.

 

Thank you very much!

I will look that guy up right now and read his stuff.

 

And talk, talk talk about everything.

 

Love, sex, who does the dishes, kids, your future and where you want it to go. etc....

 

When you can do that, you won't have any doubts.

 

Just my 2 cents.

That's the thing though - I love our level of communication and we talk and discuss anything.

BUT...I'm afraid of the unknown.

He's like that now, I'm like that now - but nothing lasts forever, something is bound to change and I'm afraid of what could change.

[kaleidoscope]

Yes, anything could change.

 

For example, someone could have a health issue and not appear as attractive anymore to someone.

 

What then? That's another question to discuss.

 

Or someone may make a mistake and say spend too much money and now you're in debt. Hmm..maybe some resentment may stay with you unless you can iron things out.

 

I don't know...lots of problems WILL happen in the relationship. It matters a lot how people handle them too.

[TigerCub]

Yes, anything could change.

 

For example, someone could have a health issue and not appear as attractive anymore to someone.

 

What then? That's another question to discuss.

 

Or someone may make a mistake and say spend too much money and now you're in debt. Hmm..maybe some resentment may stay with you unless you can iron things out.

 

I don't know...lots of problems WILL happen in the relationship. It matters a lot how people handle them too.

 

its funny that you mentioned those examples.

 

- I have MS - he knows and its very mild, but anything can happen to either one of us

 

- I have debts - but yeah, working on reducing them and doing very well right now, and for now its only MY debt - but again...totally see what you're saying.

 

As for the built up resentment, I totally get what you're saying, and that's why our communication is so important to me. If we didn't have it, I'm sure over time, we'd just bottle things up and totally resent one another.

 

Thanks

 

oh and btw, just looked up Gottman, and read a lil on him and saw a few youtube clips. I like his style so far

[Woggle]

I have a pretty negative view of modern marriage but at the end of day marriage is what the two people make it. If a couple is committed to having a healthy marriage then that is what will happen. It is the people in it and not the institution that is rotten.

 

That is what convinced me to give it a second try. Just because most other people have miserable and dysfunctional marriage doesn't mean we have to.

[TigerCub]

I have a pretty negative view of modern marriage but at the end of day marriage is what the two people make it. If a couple is committed to having a healthy marriage then that is what will happen. It is the people in it and not the institution that is rotten.

 

That is what convinced me to give it a second try. Just because most other people have miserable and dysfunctional marriage doesn't mean we have to.

 

Thanks woggle!

 

I will use that line in bold to help reshape my currently cynical view on marriage.

 

If I'm wrong, please correct me, but your first marriage ended because she cheated right? It must have been hard to trust again. I'm impressed when people can just believe again. Good for you!

[Woggle]

Thanks woggle!

 

I will use that line in bold to help reshape my currently cynical view on marriage.

 

If I'm wrong, please correct me, but your first marriage ended because she cheated right? It must have been hard to trust again. I'm impressed when people can just believe again. Good for you!

 

She cheated on me with damn near every guido at the Jersey Shore plus held a knife to my throat once and shot at me. To top it off she tried to paint me as an abusive husband in court when I never laid a hand on her. If I can have enough faith to give marriage another go I think anybody can.

 

Marriage is pretty much an empty vessel that is filled with whatever the couple puts in it. I also look at my in laws who have an enviable marriage and I see where she gets it from. It doesn't have to be rotten if the couple doesn't want it to be.

[Mme. Chaucer]

I recently got married - 2nd time. I was devastated by my divorce. I truly never thought that would happen to us.

 

Anyway, I know first hand that marriages fail. Still, I think that you need to make such a decision NOT based upon fears.

 

If you have doubts about YOUR relationship, and its potential for longevity, they need to be addressed. Maybe, too, you are "not the marrying kind." That is acceptable! I mean, as long as your SO is okay with it.

 

But if your relationship is solid and you ARE "the marrying kind," then please don't let fear of failure be the reason you don't marry. Fear of failure is a terrible reason not to do anything that is important to you. But, sadly, a very common one.

[xxoo]

That's the thing though - I love our level of communication and we talk and discuss anything.

BUT...I'm afraid of the unknown.

He's like that now, I'm like that now - but nothing lasts forever, something is bound to change and I'm afraid of what could change.

 

If you keep on talking, you won't be surprised by change.

 

Either changing feelings will come out in the conversation, or the conversation will shut down. Either way, if you stay aware, you know that you'll know. You can let go of the fear.

[TigerCub]

She cheated on me with damn near every guido at the Jersey Shore plus held a knife to my throat once and shot at me. To top it off she tried to paint me as an abusive husband in court when I never laid a hand on her. If I can have enough faith to give marriage another go I think anybody can.

yaawwza!! OMG, I had no idea that it was that bad. Wow, so glad you found a 2nd chance and are happy now!

 

Marriage is pretty much an empty vessel that is filled with whatever the couple puts in it. I also look at my in laws who have an enviable marriage and I see where she gets it from. It doesn't have to be rotten if the couple doesn't want it to be.

That's very wise. Thanks for sharing your experiences and advice woggle. I appreciate it

[TigerCub]

I recently got married - 2nd time. I was devastated by my divorce. I truly never thought that would happen to us.

On the one had, that in bold is exactly what holds me back from even entertaining the thought of marriage seriously.

but....

 

Anyway, I know first hand that marriages fail. Still, I think that you need to make such a decision NOT based upon fears.

 

If you have doubts about YOUR relationship, and its potential for longevity, they need to be addressed. Maybe, too, you are "not the marrying kind." That is acceptable! I mean, as long as your SO is okay with it.

 

But if your relationship is solid and you ARE "the marrying kind," then please don't let fear of failure be the reason you don't marry. Fear of failure is a terrible reason not to do anything that is important to you. But, sadly, a very common one.

This part in bold kind of reminds me or what my neurologist said to me about my fears of being paralyzed because of MS

 

he actually said to me "don't let that fear paralyze you from living your life" and its kinda true, that we really shouldn't let any fear paralyze us from living a life that would make us happy.

 

I get what you're saying, and I appreciate your help and openness.

I just feel very bipolar when it comes to this issue.

 

A part of me wants to believe and just see how things go in the future, but the part of me that's holding back because of whatever cynical thoughts or fears makes me actually pull back when the subject is being presented by my bf and that makes me sad.

 

I love him and I wish we can be happy forever, I just don't fully believe.

 

I will really try to keep in mind what everyone has said here. I appreciate it

[carhill]

How did you believe that this was the right thing to do?

 

I was modeled in the dynamic of a healthy marriage and family and watched it progress until death. The dynamic matched up with what I believed to be a healthy path for myself personally and my goals for a family.

 

Did you not have any doubts?

 

Specifically, with the person I married, a few, yes, but I was also modeled to give people the benefit of the doubt and be accepting of differences. My error, retrospectively, was having less than clearly defined boundaries as to those aspects of acceptance and benefit.

 

 

My general perspective remains unchanged; the main difference is that my boundaries are clearer; I'm less inclined to give people the benefit of the doubt and am more discriminating of family and relationship history, from the standpoint of compatibility. Further, I'm now ready to walk away if those incompatibilities appear irreconcilable. Lastly, I'll never get married again without a pre-nuptial agreement and PMC. It just won't happen. Hope that helps

[TigerCub]

If you keep on talking, you won't be surprised by change.

 

Either changing feelings will come out in the conversation, or the conversation will shut down. Either way, if you stay aware, you know that you'll know. You can let go of the fear.

 

That's true, I suppose. Thanks xxoo

 

Actually, I have a terrible memory so I associate certain impressions with certain posters to help me remember, but you are actually a poster I associate a happy M with - it seems like you guys communicate well and are always goin at it

[Afishwithabike]

This won't be helpful but it was a no brainer for me. I had dated him for years. We talked about everything under the sun from religion, finances, kids, life goals, sex, where we wanted to live. Most everyone we knew said "About time!" when we said we were engaged.

 

I think people aren't necessarily afraid of marriage but rather marriage to the wrong person for them.

 

Getting married requires a certain vulnerability. You have to open yourself up to the possibility that you may get hurt and all the things you've mentioned in your first post could happen. You have to realize that even if those things happen, you're strong and you're able to go on.I live my life by the following quote. " Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable." I knew if I didn't marry him years later in my old age I would have "what if" thoughts and I didn't want to be in a position where I would have those regrets about a life not lived to the fullest. When you open yourself up to another by marrying him/her, it's scary but you may be able to protect yourself from getting hurt by that person, but you will never be able to experience the depth of love that comes from opening yourself up to that risk.

 

For a marriage to be successful you have to have two emotionally healthy individuals who are willing to share their lives realizing they're both imperfect individuals, and neither one is looking for a soulmate or someone to complete them.

[TigerCub]

Specifically, with the person I married, a few, yes, but I was also modeled to give people the benefit of the doubt and be accepting of differences. My error, retrospectively, was having less than clearly defined boundaries as to those aspects of acceptance and benefit.

May I ask what sort of things set off your "doubts" alarm?

 

My general perspective remains unchanged; the main difference is that my boundaries are clearer; I'm less inclined to give people the benefit of the doubt and am more discriminating of family and relationship history, from the standpoint of compatibility. Further, I'm now ready to walk away if those incompatibilities appear irreconcilable. Lastly, I'll never get married again without a pre-nuptial agreement and PMC. It just won't happen. Hope that helps

 

I'm just confused on how family history can impact compatibility. If you could explain that to me, that would be awesome!!

 

Thank Carhill for your response.

 

As for the prenup - I get ya - I like that you're a man with a plan

 

I don't know what a PMC is.

[TigerCub]

This won't be helpful but it was a no brainer for me. I had dated him for years. We talked about everything under the sun from religion, finances, kids, life goals, sex, where we wanted to live. Most everyone we knew said "About time!" when we said we were engaged.

 

I think people aren't necessarily afraid of marriage but rather marriage to the wrong person for them.

Actually you've been quite helpful thank you

Its that part in bold - its true, but how does anyone know that person is right for them.

 

He's right for me NOW - forever is long bloody time!!

that's the thing I can't wrap my head around, because people change, circumstances change, I dunno, its just that thought of being right for someone for "forever" - how does anybody ever really know?

 

Getting married requires a certain vulnerability. You have to open yourself up to the possibility that you may get hurt and all the things you've mentioned in your first post could happen. You have to realize that even if those things happen, you're strong and you're able to go on.I live my life by the following quote. " Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable." I knew if I didn't marry him years later in my old age I would have "what if" thoughts and I didn't want to be in a position where I would have those regrets about a life not lived to the fullest. When you open yourself up to another by marrying him/her, it's scary but you may be able to protect yourself from getting hurt by that person, but you will never be able to experience the depth of love that comes from opening yourself up to that risk.

 

For a marriage to be successful you have to have two emotionally healthy individuals who are willing to share their lives realizing they're both imperfect individuals, and neither one is looking for a soulmate or someone to complete them.

 

I really like your post. I love the quote and I know that you're speaking your truth and its heartfelt and it does speak to me, I just have to learn to really believe that.

 

I was talking to my sister the other day. She's married and she says to me "marriage is really great, its priceless to be with someone you love that you know will love you till the end" - and it touched me so much that she believes that. I love that she sees things that way, and I hope that her and her H are happy forever.

 

I just wish that I can see things more like that.

 

Thanks so much AFWAB

[carhill]

May I ask what sort of things set off your "doubts" alarm?

 

The most specific item I can easily go to was the peculiar and nonsensical way my exW would ignore me. There was no context, but rather it would come out of the blue. I've mentioned it many times on LS. I would later learn in MC that she adopted this 'zone' due to her abusive childhood.

 

 

 

I'm just confused on how family history can impact compatibility. If you could explain that to me, that would be awesome!!

 

Sure. Probably the single most obvious aspect, retrospectively, was differing styles and environments. My exW referred to this occasionally and in a derisive tone, as the 'Beaver Cleaver' factor. Essentially, I grew up as Beaver Cleaver and adopted adult perspectives and viewpoints based on that environment and she grew up (her words) 'raised by wolves and going to a different school each year' and such family environment shaped her adult perspectives and viewpoints.

 

I don't wish to be more specific than that out of respect to her.

 

Just suffice to say we came at the marriage from disparate backgrounds. An indicator of that was my being her third husband. I met her second husband and his father. He was a good man from a good family. No one is perfect, to be sure, but they both impressed me as decent men and he continued to exhibit those behaviors in their occasional future contacts.

 

My error, as I described prior, was being too accepting of our differences and giving too many benefits of the doubt. That was on me. As they say on LS, we teach people how to treat us. Owned.

 

As for the prenup - I get ya - I like that you're a man with a plan

 

That is primarily to protect what assets I have left since I have only so many years of work left in me and what I do is pretty physically demanding and occasionally dangerous. I think such is a specific tool and not generally applicable.

 

I don't know what a PMC is.

 

PMC= pre marital counseling.

 

I saw the great benefits of MC, benefits that saved my sanity and life and apprised me of my own failings and definitely will engage in that process again, if nothing else to 'tune-up' myself for marriage.

[carhill]

so how do you know if you're with the right person and can promise forever?

 

IMO, one never knows for sure. One believes in the present and accepts that the future may bring an infinite number of possibilities. The commitment is each day, one day at a time, as the future becomes the present and the present becomes the past.

 

Question: Why would you want to get married?

[Afishwithabike]

Actually you've been quite helpful thank you

Its that part in bold - its true, but how does anyone know that person is right for them.

 

He's right for me NOW - forever is long bloody time!!

that's the thing I can't wrap my head around, because people change, circumstances change, I dunno, its just that thought of being right for someone for "forever" - how does anybody ever really know?

 

 

 

I really like your post. I love the quote and I know that you're speaking your truth and its heartfelt and it does speak to me, I just have to learn to really believe that.

 

I was talking to my sister the other day. She's married and she says to me "marriage is really great, its priceless to be with someone you love that you know will love you till the end" - and it touched me so much that she believes that. I love that she sees things that way, and I hope that her and her H are happy forever.

 

I just wish that I can see things more like that.

 

Thanks so much AFWAB

 

I'm an analytical person and I tend to ruminate. Is he Mr. Right or Mr. Right Now? Is he a keeper or a loser? If I marry him will I meet someone else who seems like an even better match for me? Decisions, decisions. If only relationships weren't so confusing. If only we had a crystal ball we could look into.

 

Is there anything you can do that would make you feel safe in a marriage? A prenup? Premarital counseling as Carhill mentioned. Something else?

One way I minimized the risk for me was by getting an advanced degree in a lucrative field. I knew with my own career I wouldn't be completely financially dependent on my spouse. If it ever came to it, I could walk away from this marriage now and be ok financially. Perhaps that doesn't sound very romantic but I think it's ok to think practically about marriage.

 

Realizing that he was the right person for me was a combination of intuition and experience with previous partners. Marriage is hard work. There are times when you wonder why you ever married the other person. Both people need to be committed to the commitment. Monogamy is a choice that you make every day. A good marriage requires two people who are willing to decide again and again to stay and do the work to keep the marriage going. So pick someone with good boundaries, someone whom you trust will do that hard work for you and the marriage, someone who will not stray when the bad times hit.

[findingnemo]

These are questions to anyone that's ever gotten married.

 

How did you believe that this was the right thing to do? Conditioning. In my culture, getting married is like the next step in the evolution of a young adult.

Did you not have any doubts?Absolutely. I was 30 and loving my new found financial independence. But...I also wanted to have kids and was frustrated that I just couldn't have them. I doubted I'd be happy with my H but settled for being comfortable.

 

How do people get married, when marriage doesn't guarantee anything.

 

I look at the concept of marriage and it scares me. I just see the downfalls:

- divorce

- cheating

- screwed up finances

- possible child custody issues

 

I really want to look at things in a more pleasant way, but I'm such a pessimist when it comes to marriage and it makes me sad.

 

My boyfriend has been talking a lot about us moving in together, he's talking about the future, and marriage in a few years, and it makes me sad that I can't look at it in the idealistic way that some other people do.

 

Its not an issue of loving my boyfriend, because I do love him, and I know that I would have those same fears regardless of who I was with.

 

So...how did you guys do it?just jumped in, really.

 

Does having doubts about "forever" mean that you doubt the person you're committing to? Or is that normal? It's being realistic. There are too many things that can mess "forever" up.

 

When I think of marriage, I do think of forever, but that's not the case usually, and I honestly don't believe that "forever" happens, I want to believe, but all evidence is to the contrary.

 

so how do you know if you're with the right person and can promise forever?for me, it was an evaluation based on family background and having known him since I was 15. Unfortunately, it turned out that I only knew surface things about his family. The real stuff would do me in later.

 

My bf knows of my concerns and he does think that I'm way too pessimistic - he also thinks that reading on LS is part of the reason

 

but in all honesty, its not just LS, so many people I know have troubled marriages and are trapped...and being trapped is my biggest fear.

 

I need to learn to be more optimistic, I just don't know how to get past these fears.

 

Thanks

 

You have legitimate fears and these should help you set your expectations. Although I went in "blind", I knew what I would and would not take. This helped me tremendously to realize that I'd made a horrible mistake. I didn't act on that realization immediately because I was worried about what others would think. I was also worried that perhaps I would be jumping out as carelessly as I'd jumped in. But in the end, my boundaries helped me determine in less than 3 years of M what it was a sinking ship.

 

Now I hate marriage. At this point, I just want to get the D done and hope to never ever again legally tie myself to another human being. Do I blame myself for a bad M? No I don't. I made the decision with the knowledge that I had at the time. But I think carhill is spot on with PMC. Anything that will give you a better sense of the person you want to marry is a good thing.

[TigerCub]

The most specific item I can easily go to was the peculiar and nonsensical way my exW would ignore me. There was no context, but rather it would come out of the blue. I've mentioned it many times on LS. I would later learn in MC that she adopted this 'zone' due to her abusive childhood.

 

 

 

 

 

Sure. Probably the single most obvious aspect, retrospectively, was differing styles and environments. My exW referred to this occasionally and in a derisive tone, as the 'Beaver Cleaver' factor. Essentially, I grew up as Beaver Cleaver and adopted adult perspectives and viewpoints based on that environment and she grew up (her words) 'raised by wolves and going to a different school each year' and such family environment shaped her adult perspectives and viewpoints.

 

I don't wish to be more specific than that out of respect to her.

 

Just suffice to say we came at the marriage from disparate backgrounds. An indicator of that was my being her third husband. I met her second husband and his father. He was a good man from a good family. No one is perfect, to be sure, but they both impressed me as decent men and he continued to exhibit those behaviors in their occasional future contacts.

 

My error, as I described prior, was being too accepting of our differences and giving too many benefits of the doubt. That was on me. As they say on LS, we teach people how to treat us. Owned.

 

 

 

That is primarily to protect what assets I have left since I have only so many years of work left in me and what I do is pretty physically demanding and occasionally dangerous. I think such is a specific tool and not generally applicable.

 

 

 

PMC= pre marital counseling.

 

I saw the great benefits of MC, benefits that saved my sanity and life and apprised me of my own failings and definitely will engage in that process again, if nothing else to 'tune-up' myself for marriage.

 

Thank you very much for replying Carhill.

 

I sort of get what you're saying about the family backgroud differences and how the 2 people grew up and were affected by their upbringing. I see what you're saying.

 

As for the pre marital counseling - that's actually a really great idea. I think that's definitely something I'd want if I were to say "I do".

 

Thank you

 

oh and to answer you question about why would I want to get married?

 

I honestly don't know. I don't think I want marriage. I'd want us to be happy together, but that's that, I don't want marriage and all that hoopla that goes with it.

 

But then...there are times when I think - what's the difference between living together and getting married? - If there really isn't any, then why not get married?...If we are committed to one another and want it for the long term...

 

I confuse myself when I over think everything.

 

Does that give you anything to work with ? To figure me out and give me a direction to walk in

[TigerCub]

You know when it's time to get married is when you're tired of not being married.

really? People should just get married when they are sick of the dating game or feeling a little lonely?

I dunno, seems like a bad reason to commit forever to someone IMO.

 

 

As for you Tiger Cub--unfortunately ime when a man like your bf talks about getting married in a "few years" it translates to "never."

 

Keep that in mind if marriage is something that you want at some point because this guy isn't down for it.

 

Maybe you're right, maybe not. In the R, I'm the one who doesn't want to move fast, move in together, talkk about marriage seriously, and he's the one that's bringing it up.

 

Maybe he's doing it because it really is on his mind and he's like it

 

or... maybe he is doing it because he knows I shy away from it, and so its safe to just talk and joke about it.

 

who knows...

 

Thanks for your response QW