He calls her sweetheart, darling...

[findingnemo]

I have a new acquaintance who is seeing a MM. I dont know if I'm reading a bit too much into this but...

 

He calls her sweetheart and darling all the time. The thing that bothers me about this is that he does this in public. We had a business dinner last night and he treated her like he was in love big time. Once when I was in his office for a meeting he took a call from her. He kept calling her these names and I'm not close to them in anyway. In fact I'd venture to say that he could care less what I thought. Two managers walked in to join us while he spoke on the phone and the same thing happened. Now according to the gossip in my city, they've been seeing each other for 5 years and his W doesn't know (I wonder about that).

 

I got the feeling that perhaps this guy really loves his OW and it made me wonder about other As.

 

1. How did AP act in public?

2. Were terms of endearment something normal?

3. Can an MP comfortably use these terms even when just cake-eating?

 

I'm thinking that this is one guy who should get a D based on what I saw. But what do I know apart from my own situation. Anybody with a view on this, please share.

[seren]

Hi FNemo,

I think that for some people those terms are used generically, love, sweeheart, darling etc. For me it would be his actions toward the person, that he is still married after 5 years suggests that he is content for the OW to remain the OW, he sounds like a cake eater.

 

Remember, many MM still call their BS love, darling etc, say they love them and show (on the surface at least) all the signs of being in love, lust and like and still go off and have A's, telling the OW much the same things they may be saying to their BS. Compartmentalising is one way to explain his behaviour, in that when he is talking to the OW he means those things, when speaking to his wife ditto. Who knows what anyone really thinks in these situations other than the WS, the one with a foot in both camps. The longer it continues, the more 'normal' it becomes.

 

I hope the OW tells him to put his actions where his mouth is - either leave the marriage or jog on. That his wife apears to not know would suggest he is doing all the 'right' things at home to have her think their marriage is fine.

[findingnemo]

Yeah. The part about the W not knowing seems odd given the affection he shows the OW In public. I have never seen anything like that in an A.

 

But cake eater? I don't know if anyone can compartmentalize to that extent. What I saw was love and having seen too many threads with dysfunctional Ms, could it be that MM stays for some reason but loves the OW?

 

I hate to try to find out more about these people because it would be actively engaging in gossip for scientific purposes. I'm sure they'd not be amused.

[woinlove]

I have a new acquaintance who is seeing a MM. I dont know if I'm reading a bit too much into this but...

 

He calls her sweetheart and darling all the time. The thing that bothers me about this is that he does this in public. We had a business dinner last night and he treated her like he was in love big time. Once when I was in his office for a meeting he took a call from her. He kept calling her these names and I'm not close to them in anyway. In fact I'd venture to say that he could care less what I thought. Two managers walked in to join us while he spoke on the phone and the same thing happened. Now according to the gossip in my city, they've been seeing each other for 5 years and his W doesn't know (I wonder about that).

 

I got the feeling that perhaps this guy really loves his OW and it made me wonder about other As.

 

1. How did AP act in public?

2. Were terms of endearment something normal?

3. Can an MP comfortably use these terms even when just cake-eating?

 

I'm thinking that this is one guy who should get a D based on what I saw. But what do I know apart from my own situation. Anybody with a view on this, please share.

 

Maybe he's a flaunter? A certain kind of MM likes to flaunt because they think it makes them look desirable and powerful to have both a W and an OW. Depending on the atmosphere or culture, they may feel comfortable flaunting, knowing people will still keep it secret from the BS. His behavior plus the fact that this has been going on for 5 years, suggests to me he might be in this category.

 

ETA: Also what is the culture? - in many places this would be disrespectful to the OW, publicly showing her as a "mistress", where her professional image goes down, that of the W goes down, and the MM's goes up. That's typically what MM flaunting is about. Unless the culture is such that most people will think well of this woman that she has been involved with this MM for 5 years and he is publicly calling her sweetheart, I would not call this love, as it shows a lack of respect.

Edited November 11, 2011 by woinlove

[bentnotbroken]

My brother once told me that strippers and prostitutes call their clients "honey", "sweetheart", or some other term of endearment because they didn't have to remember any names. Wonder if some AP do the same? Could be a number of reasons.

[findingnemo]

Maybe he's a flaunter? A certain kind of MM likes to flaunt because they think it makes them look desirable and powerful to have both a W and an OW. Depending on the atmosphere or culture, they may feel comfortable flaunting, knowing people will still keep it secret from the BS. His behavior plus the fact that this has been going on for 5 years, suggests to me he might be in this category.

 

ETA: Also what is the culture? - in many places this would be disrespectful to the OW, publicly showing her as a "mistress", where her professional image goes down, that of the W goes down, and the MM's goes up. That's typically what MM flaunting is about. Unless the culture is such that most people will think well of this woman that she has been involved with this MM for 5 years and he is publicly calling her sweetheart, I would not call this love, as it shows a lack of respect.

 

A flaunter? Now why does that make sense?

 

In my culture being a OW is in itself wrong. Especially if you do it twice. What people expect is that a MM keep a second W and be open about it. It is a dying culture though. But of course, the richer the man, the more wives he had in the past. So yes, this guy could think that he's cool because he has two women.

[findingnemo]

My brother once told me that strippers and prostitutes call their clients "honey", "sweetheart", or some other term of endearment because they didn't have to remember any names. Wonder if some AP do the same? Could be a number of reasons.

 

:lmao:

 

No this guy knows her name. But now that I know about men calling pros darling, babe, sweetheart, I may not be accepting any of those names. Time to get creative.

[VivienViolet]

Yeah. The part about the W not knowing seems odd given the affection he shows the OW In public. I have never seen anything like that in an A.

 

But cake eater? I don't know if anyone can compartmentalize to that extent. What I saw was love and having seen too many threads with dysfunctional Ms, could it be that MM stays for some reason but loves the OW?

 

I hate to try to find out more about these people because it would be actively engaging in gossip for scientific purposes. I'm sure they'd not be amused.

 

It's not odd to me. He knows it's human nature for people to avoid conflict. He relies on people not wanting to rock the boat by telling his wife. They don't want to get involved.

 

Think about those poor boys that Sandusky raped. People either refrained from telling, or only told their immediate supervisor. A janitor saw him performing oral sex on a little boy. A second janitor saw them naked in the shower together. Neither told anyone for fear of losing their jobs. They didn't want to get involved.

 

Why don't you tell his wife? This MM can flaunt his affair because he knows most people are like you and won't tell.

Edited November 11, 2011 by VivienViolet

[VivienViolet]

My brother once told me that strippers and prostitutes call their clients "honey", "sweetheart", or some other term of endearment because they didn't have to remember any names. Wonder if some AP do the same? Could be a number of reasons.

 

So true! They don't have to remember names, but it also keeps the fantasy going.

 

My xOM and I never called each other by name. It was always an endearment, as if calling each other by name brought reality in; the reality that he wasn't really "darling" but a married man with a wife and kids.

 

This MM probably calls the mistress his girlfriend too sometimes.

[bentnotbroken]

So true! They don't have to remember names, but it also keeps the fantasy going.

 

My xOM and I never called each other by name. It was always an endearment, as if calling each other by name brought reality in; the reality that he wasn't really "darling" but a married man with a wife and kids.

 

This MM probably calls the mistress his girlfriend too sometimes.

 

 

Mr. Messy didn't call his ow by her real name either. I am sure he used those terms of endearment along with a shortened version of her name.

[MissBee]

I have a new acquaintance who is seeing a MM. I dont know if I'm reading a bit too much into this but...

 

He calls her sweetheart and darling all the time. The thing that bothers me about this is that he does this in public. We had a business dinner last night and he treated her like he was in love big time. Once when I was in his office for a meeting he took a call from her. He kept calling her these names and I'm not close to them in anyway. In fact I'd venture to say that he could care less what I thought. Two managers walked in to join us while he spoke on the phone and the same thing happened. Now according to the gossip in my city, they've been seeing each other for 5 years and his W doesn't know (I wonder about that).

 

I got the feeling that perhaps this guy really loves his OW and it made me wonder about other As.

 

1. How did AP act in public?

2. Were terms of endearment something normal?

3. Can an MP comfortably use these terms even when just cake-eating?

 

I'm thinking that this is one guy who should get a D based on what I saw. But what do I know apart from my own situation. Anybody with a view on this, please share.

 

Terms of endearment aren't that deep IMO....in fact I always joke that I don't trust people who are too quick to use them as I've experienced sometimes that it's a form of being nicey-nicey to disguise one being disingenuous.

 

So yea....calling someone sweetheart or darling doesn't mean anything to me. I call friends, kids and strangers I've just met that sometimes (maybe it's a Southern thing too as a lot of people in the South use those terms). In my A, I actually was upset at my AP because I felt like he called every woman "hon" and "sweetheart" and we had an argument about it in which he asked me if I couldn't tell the difference between when he used it to me versus others Also, the players I know like calling the many women they mess with generic terms like "baby", "babes" etc as you can call everyone that without messing up their names and it is impersonal.

 

It is possible for a MM to love his OW....that has never been argued by me personally. However, how much? More than the wife? More than financial security? More than reputation? Or what? I would also be suspicious of looking at very simplistic things like using terms of endearment to signal love....versus larger, more meaningful actions. It doesn't cost anyone a dime to call someone sweetheart and darling....so I'm not sure how it is equated with love or the idea that you can only say those words if you love someone. In fact, we probably all know people who go as far to say "I love you" and not mean it or not know what it means! Also one can be very fond of someone, attracted to them, affectionate towards them but not love them enough to commit to them. There is so much grey area where it is not really love...but since it is not hate, many loving things/seemingly loving things exist in that middle ground.

[MissBee]

Maybe he's a flaunter? A certain kind of MM likes to flaunt because they think it makes them look desirable and powerful to have both a W and an OW. Depending on the atmosphere or culture, they may feel comfortable flaunting, knowing people will still keep it secret from the BS. His behavior plus the fact that this has been going on for 5 years, suggests to me he might be in this category.

 

ETA: Also what is the culture? - in many places this would be disrespectful to the OW, publicly showing her as a "mistress", where her professional image goes down, that of the W goes down, and the MM's goes up. That's typically what MM flaunting is about. Unless the culture is such that most people will think well of this woman that she has been involved with this MM for 5 years and he is publicly calling her sweetheart, I would not call this love, as it shows a lack of respect.

 

Excellent point!

 

In the culture I'm from originally, such a show could in fact occur for all the reasons you've cited.

 

Also in that culture, many women are resigned to the idea that men cheat, so their goal is to be the wife/wifey; which means you're #1 and OW are ridiculed in that they feel like at the end of the day you're still not #1 and not "the wife", the legitimate one etc. And there are entire codes of conduct for this sort of thing where the OW needs to know her place and the wife doesn't acknowledge her presence unless she oversteps, and in public people realize that this is so and so's OW and people just don't bring it up to the wife as they are also steeped into the idea that men have OW and the wife spot is the coveted and central position, so what he does on the periphery doesn't matter...it's all really a mess to me lol, but the point is, yes depending on the culture people can turn a blind eye to that kind of thing.

[MissBee]

It's not odd to me. He knows it's human nature for people to avoid conflict. He relies on people not wanting to rock the boat by telling his wife. They don't want to get involved.

 

Think about those poor boys that Sandusky raped. People either refrained from telling, or only told their immediate supervisor. A janitor saw him performing oral sex on a little boy. A second janitor saw them naked in the shower together. Neither told anyone for fear of losing their jobs. They didn't want to get involved.

 

Why don't you tell his wife? This MM can flaunt his affair because he knows most people are like you and won't tell.

 

This is so true

 

I also think that it's this thing where to be honest, if you see someone being that brazen, you'd probably just believe their wife HAS to know, there is no way she couldn't, so you don't tell, as you figure the cat is already out of the bag. With my AP, I honestly thought there wouldn't be any way that he was pursuing me if he wasn't single and there is no way he's introducing me to friends as his woman if he wasn't....but how wrong! I think that brazenness does serve a purpose to kind of shock people and make them think that oh, since he isn't hiding, it's not a secret, this other person knows but maybe they have an arrangement

 

 

Imagine this: you saw an acquaintance's husband out with another woman, holding hands, looking quite romantic, and when you see them together, he does not run for cover or quickly walk away and act like he didn't see you, but comes over, kisses you on the cheek and introduces you to two...I think you would be so shocked and confused and kind of wonder if maybe your friend knows about this too...as if it was a secret A....he would never do that! It can work. Whereas, if he did slink away for cover once your eyes met, you'd definitely know that he felt he was doing something wrong and maybe you'd be more inclined to tell. Although in both scenarios, unless you are good friends, people as you say stay out of it.

[Silly_Girl]

Some people use terms of endearment very casually and quite easily. I also know for a fact (wish I didn't) that some mm will use a term of endearment to avoid a mix up of names. At the time I didn't know that, but I found out later and it's one of those things that still sting.

 

People do sometimes use terms of endearment VERY easily. It's really not my bag but to some it's dead natural. I have a temp right now at the lowest rung of the department who calls me sweetie, and darling. It shocked me at first to be honest. Maybe he's just like that.

[sp2007]

My brother once told me that strippers and prostitutes call their clients "honey", "sweetheart", or some other term of endearment because they didn't have to remember any names. Wonder if some AP do the same? Could be a number of reasons.

 

LOL. Well, I guess we know your perspective bnb ;-) Sorry, just couldn't resist :-)

[findingnemo]

Terms of endearment aren't that deep IMO....in fact I always joke that I don't trust people who are too quick to use them as I've experienced sometimes that it's a form of being nicey-nicey to disguise one being disingenuous.

 

So yea....calling someone sweetheart or darling doesn't mean anything to me. I call friends, kids and strangers I've just met that sometimes (maybe it's a Southern thing too as a lot of people in the South use those terms). In my A, I actually was upset at my AP because I felt like he called every woman "hon" and "sweetheart" and we had an argument about it in which he asked me if I couldn't tell the difference between when he used it to me versus others Also, the players I know like calling the many women they mess with generic terms like "baby", "babes" etc as you can call everyone that without messing up their names and it is impersonal.

 

It is possible for a MM to love his OW....that has never been argued by me personally. However, how much? More than the wife? More than financial security? More than reputation? Or what? I would also be suspicious of looking at very simplistic things like using terms of endearment to signal love....versus larger, more meaningful actions. It doesn't cost anyone a dime to call someone sweetheart and darling....so I'm not sure how it is equated with love or the idea that you can only say those words if you love someone. In fact, we probably all know people who go as far to say "I love you" and not mean it or not know what it means! Also one can be very fond of someone, attracted to them, affectionate towards them but not love them enough to commit to them. There is so much grey area where it is not really love...but since it is not hate, many loving things/seemingly loving things exist in that middle ground.

 

That makes sense somehow. Public display of affection is considered tacky. Things are changing so much though. There are those who tackily inform us all about how much money they have. A new phenomenon. Perhaps this guy is flaunting and thinks that calling her all these things and displaying "loving" behaviour makes him look better in some way.

 

Yes, it's probably me being naive thinking that sweet names equates to love.

[findingnemo]

It's not odd to me. He knows it's human nature for people to avoid conflict. He relies on people not wanting to rock the boat by telling his wife. They don't want to get involved.

 

Think about those poor boys that Sandusky raped. People either refrained from telling, or only told their immediate supervisor. A janitor saw him performing oral sex on a little boy. A second janitor saw them naked in the shower together. Neither told anyone for fear of losing their jobs. They didn't want to get involved.

 

Why don't you tell his wife? This MM can flaunt his affair because he knows most people are like you and won't tell.

 

I can't tell his W. And I have the best excuses.

 

1. I don't know these people apart from meeting them because of business.

2. Given the length of the A, surely the BS knows. If not, doesn't she have friends like we all do who would have told her? Why would she believe me?

3. The messenger usually gets shot in these scenarios unless it is patently clear that they love the BS and have no ulterior motives. A universal motive of fairness on my part can cause untold misery for me.

 

Basically, I plead "none of my business" on this one.

[jj33]

Yeah. The part about the W not knowing seems odd given the affection he shows the OW In public. I have never seen anything like that in an A.

 

But cake eater? I don't know if anyone can compartmentalize to that extent. What I saw was love and having seen too many threads with dysfunctional Ms, could it be that MM stays for some reason but loves the OW?

 

I hate to try to find out more about these people because it would be actively engaging in gossip for scientific purposes. I'm sure they'd not be amused.

 

There are some men who use these terms with ease and its a term of affection but does not mean as much as you might think it does. He cares for her and for all you know he calls his daughters, wife, his sister in law and other people with whom he has a close relationship darling I mean its not like he was calling her some sort of intimate pet name