Why Bash The W?

[frozensprouts]

That's what she pretends but she was not that detached or indifferent. Because the moment the OW contacted her H again, it was Spark who told her to back off.

I don't believe the story of Spark's H being back because she had mercy for him. I think Spark needs her H and marriage as badly as her H did and till now has difficulties accepting that her marriage has a dent in it because of the affair.

 

maybe it was because her husband had made his choice, and she didn't want to have to deal with any more "drama"...do you think the should have just folded up and let herself be walked all over? She gave him the choice to either leave or stay, he chose to stay and that his marriage to her was his top priority...spark was acting to protect herself within the confines of her marriage...like so many, she has a lot of empathy for her husbands former other woman, but she is also not going to allow herself to be dragged through any more nonsense...can't say as i blame her, and i do think that an awful lot of people may choose to do the same ( you don't have to answer, but if you were in her position, how would you have handled things? even if you would have handled things differently, can you understand why she made the choices she made? you may not agree with them, but can you understand them?)

 

and her marriage does have a dent in it...but so what? it sounds like she did what i did, and what a lot of husbands or wives do if their spouse has had an affair but chose to stay married ...you can either look at the the "dent" as permanent damage" or you can look at it as a reminder of a bad time you went through but were able to overcome...a "badge of courage" if you will...you can choose to stagnate or learn and grow from your experiences... she learned and grew, and is in a happier place... maybe she in a happier place and wants to help others by sharing what she has learned so maybe they have a little less hurt in their lives...how is that a negative?

( i hope spark doesn't mind me saying that, and that i am not totally off the mark here...if i am please feel free to correct me")

[thomasb]

That's interesting. If you already found her to be such a slag, yet not lesser than you, then you must not think that much of yourself.

 

 

 

And therein lies the source for a lot of OW's anguish and confusion at the time a MM chooses to reconcile with his wife. During the affair they had this smug attitude that they were so much better than the unappealing wife that why would he ever have dumped HER unless he was forced too. They just cannot fathom that he would ever prefer his wife. They attribute it to a personal attack on them rather than strengnth and unity within the marriage, as it should be.

[flutterbykiss]

I think Spark's main agenda is showing the OW that the things their MM says is not true.

 

Good on her, if it is. It's a truth that applies in many cases and someone just might benefit from being told to wake up. I know I did.

 

I understand why some OWs, particularly those that are still involved, don't want to hear that but don't shoot the messenger.

 

IMO, anyone who contributes constructively to the discussion is an asset to this forum and I, personally, have found sparks' posts to be insightful and well-reasoned

[thomasb]

Exactly. I do too. Have a great day! God Bless us everyone. Changed that up a little for christmas!

[RecordProducer]

That's what she pretends but she was not that detached or indifferent. Because the moment the OW contacted her H again, it was Spark who told her to back off.

I don't believe the story of Spark's H being back because she had mercy for him. I think Spark needs her H and marriage as badly as her H did and till now has difficulties accepting that her marriage has a dent in it because of the affair.

I don't know Spark and haven't followed her story, but my understanding is that she didn't lock the door and hide the keys - rather she opened the door for him and said 'go, if you must go, I'll live.'

 

As for the dent, marriages have many dents. Only she knows how she lives with that dent. The solution for any dent in life is to get detached from it. In reality, infidelity mostly hurts one's ego. An affair leaves a dent in the ego. The smaller the ego the smaller the dent and easier to move on.

[skylarblue]

Ha ha...Funny and disillusioned people cracked me up. Smiles all around all day.

[donnamaybe]

In address to NotMolly and as PhoenixRise pointed out, I was describing my feelings towards MM’s W as they were when I was in the A. I do not harbor those same feelings now. Sorry NotMolly but I was not the OW that your H was sleeping with as you are not the W that I hated. However, I can understand your disdain as it is BS like you that make me revert to the thought “glad your H f*cked around on you”.

 

Spark, I don’t feel MM’s W is the lesser woman anymore. My thoughts of her are she is a woman, a W, simply trying to do her best by her H, M and family. MM’s comments, though quite disparaging, were not the main influence of my perception of her. I’d already had her (as well as all other BSs) tagged long before I even knew a thing about her as a physically unappealing woman who didn’t know how to treat/keep her man. A woman who started off as one person and then changed not long after the ring and/or children into something the H didn’t deserve, desire, or want. MM’s W is not perfect, as no one is, but I believe she tries her best to be a good W and mother.

 

And no, I didn’t blame MM for cheating on his W. No, I don’t hold the same expectations for him as her. I admit to having somewhat archaic/traditional/unrealistic views of M and H/W roles that are quite unfair to the W, and I don’t hold the H to the same standards. I felt MM lived up to his part as the protector, provider, and father. He was a good H. He just made a bad decision.

 

BTW, Spark seems to be a lovely person. The type of person that I try not to believe MM’s W was because I hate to feel like I helped to destroyed such a good heart.

 

Who would you blame if YOU got cheated on?

[nofool4u]

What about the BS's that bash the OW's?...

 

What about them? The BS didn't do anything to the OW. However the reverse isn't true.

 

Ya, I know the OW/OM will chime in and say they aren't doing anything to the BS:rolleyes:

[donnamaybe]

And therein lies the source for a lot of OW's anguish and confusion at the time a MM chooses to reconcile with his wife. During the affair they had this smug attitude that they were so much better than the unappealing wife that why would he ever have dumped HER unless he was forced too. They just cannot fathom that he would ever prefer his wife. They attribute it to a personal attack on them rather than strengnth and unity within the marriage, as it should be.

 

Yep, although this applies only to SOME OW.

[Brokenlady]

And therein lies the source for a lot of OW's anguish and confusion at the time a MM chooses to reconcile with his wife. During the affair they had this smug attitude that they were so much better than the unappealing wife that why would he ever have dumped HER unless he was forced too. They just cannot fathom that he would ever prefer his wife. They attribute it to a personal attack on them rather than strengnth and unity within the marriage, as it should be.

 

And here we come back to women nor thinking like men. Women figure men must really be unhappy in a M to cheat. MM quite often are actually unhappy, of varying degrees. It's not about being smug - its a reaction to what the mm is doing (risking his M) and telling the ow how much better she can meet his needs than his wife can. It's the single people's dating equivalent of "you're the best I've ever had". Maybe it's true, maybe it isn't and the person wants to flatter the one they are with. Who knows? Baloney is unfortunately part of human courting and you can't fault the ow for believing him when he says he'd rather be with her anymore than you can fault the wife for not questioning it when he said he was working late.

[Brokenlady]

Uh, no. How can you compare this to courting? The wife does not know that she's being lied to.

 

The OW who knows that a married man is married, knows that the MM is lying to his wife. She knows right from the get-go that he's a liar. It's completely arrogant to know that he's lying to his own wife but think that he's not lying to her.

 

In a way, I'm surprised to see that from you. You're married now. If your H takes on a new OW, would you expect your H to lie only to you but tell his new OW the complete truth?

 

You're not looking at this from an ow perspective. Just because he lies to wife, doesn't mean he'll lie to ow- bc why lie to the ow? He has nothing to lose with her. Ow come to think of lies he's telling to the wife as temporary "justified" lies. Consider a mm who saying he's going to leave the M - it appears more compassionate for him to leave his W without an affair coming to light, and it's only until he makes good on his promise anyway. I'm not saying its right, but that was what I thought at the time.

 

If he were stupid enough to have an A on me, I would expect he would behave just as he did before - lying all over the place- bc it would show that he hadn't really changed at all. But I wouldn't trouble myself thinking about it too long- unlike his xW, I wouldn't be begging and pleading, our M would be over immediately.

[Owl]

You're not looking at this from an ow perspective. Just because he lies to wife, doesn't mean he'll lie to ow- bc why lie to the ow? He has nothing to lose with her. Ow come to think of lies he's telling to the wife as temporary "justified" lies. Consider a mm who saying he's going to leave the M - it appears more compassionate for him to leave his W without an affair coming to light, and it's only until he makes good on his promise anyway. I'm not saying its right, but that was what I thought at the time.

 

If he were stupid enough to have an A on me, I would expect he would behave just as he did before - lying all over the place- bc it would show that he hadn't really changed at all. But I wouldn't trouble myself thinking about it too long- unlike his xW, I wouldn't be begging and pleading, our M would be over immediately.

 

I disagree with this.

 

The MM has every bit as much reason to lie to the OW about the state of his marriage, the faults of the participants in the marriage, and the overall status of his relationships.

 

I've seen time and again on here and other sites where MM greatly, massively exaggerated the faults/problems in his marriage...or claimed that he was seperated/pending divorce/actually divorced...because he knew the OW wouldn't participate in an affair with him under any different circumstances.

 

He demonstrates that he's capable of lying to one person he's claimed to love...and he's typically got plenty of motive to do the same to the OW as well.

 

If he told her he wanted to cheat with her "just to get some strange"...odds are, she'd refuse.

[MyApology]

In my reading lately and reading the posts, I believe OW actually help in keeping the majority of these marriages intact. The man gets to get out and drive a sports car for awhile gets his fix and can handle the pressures back at home.

I say this, because for instance, if all women worldwide agreed and intitated that they would in no way have an affair with a married man and married men had absolutely zero option to cheat, not even hookers or high class call girls, nothing to work with, there would be a HUGE upsurge of men divorcing their wives, in order to date again.

[ladydesigner]

In my reading lately and reading the posts, I believe OW actually help in keeping the majority of these marriages intact. The man gets to get out and drive a sports car for awhile gets his fix and can handle the pressures back at home.

I say this, because for instance, if all women worldwide agreed and intitated that they would in no way have an affair with a married man and married men had absolutely zero option to cheat, not even hookers or high class call girls, nothing to work with, there would be a HUGE upsurge of men divorcing their wives, in order to date again.

 

I'm not sure about this. I think a lot of men prefer the stability and nurturing from the wife as well. I know my husband likes to be mothered . You mention the OW being like a sports car. In my situation I was the sports car and the OW well..ahem. Anyways apparently I wasn't "meeting his needs" = not having sex more than 2-3x a week. These OW met his needs temporarily until he got caught. I didn't restrain him or chain him down. I actually had a revenge affair but that is another story. I really think it's sad we all get caught in this mess WS's, BW's and OW. If there was no cheating going on in the first place there would be no bashing.

[Spark1111]

That's not my impression, Spark. You sure talk a lot about how good and empathic you are but I just don't buy it.

You certainly have never been good and empathic towards your H's OW. I don't see how and where you were!!! Were you not very angry with her because she did not want to talk to you?

 

Are we back to me again?????

 

I never contacted that woman or enacted any sort of revenge. I talked friends and family out of that stupid scenario because I truly believed she was an inncoent victim in it all.

 

I called her to extend an olive branch as they are colleagues who no longer work in the same office and there was a large company event we were attending and did not want to blindside her. Very, very vindictive of me, I know.

 

I was truly surprised she did not return my three phone calls NINE MONTHS later. Yes I was, but I let it go as everyone here had said she moved on and I thought so be it.

 

They were wrong. Over two years later she blatantly broke NC to waltz into his office and see if he was interested in intitiating again. He wasn't. He told me. HE ASKED ME TO CALL HER.

 

I did. It was the most venomous, angry, contemptuous and then hysterical three-minute conversation I have maybe ever heard in my life. And it shocked me to learn that she, for whatever reason, hates me.

 

Ok, that and being stalked for awhile changed my opinions of her. That and learning my H was not her first affair with a MM. So much for true love.

 

It is my story, but not everyone's. I have a friend that was played and hurt and used big time by a separated MM.

 

I love my H. Always have. I am happy we are together. No one is more surprised than I am.

 

I want women to understand the degree of lying that goes on to OW as well as the spouse. I know because I super-sleuthed their texts and emails after DDAy. He was saying one thing to me, and another to her.

 

I want to empower all people to have the very best relationship they can; an honest one that can be lived out loud.

 

I do not hate any OW, not even the one in my sitch. Many come to LS and I see them learn and grow and begin to expect, no, hell demand respect.

 

I do not know what you see or even, why you see it, or why the truth of my sitch so upsets you.

[Brokenlady]

And if OW came on LS to bash you, would you feel that she was justified in

[bentnotbroken]

'cause we love you, punkin.

You don't need to explain yourself.

:bunny::bunny::bunny:ditto!

[Brokenlady]

I disagree with this.

 

The MM has every bit as much reason to lie to the OW about the state of his marriage, the faults of the participants in the marriage, and the overall status of his relationships.

 

I've seen time and again on here and other sites where MM greatly, massively exaggerated the faults/problems in his marriage...or claimed that he was seperated/pending divorce/actually divorced...because he knew the OW wouldn't participate in an affair with him under any different circumstances.

 

He demonstrates that he's capable of lying to one person he's claimed to love...and he's typically got plenty of motive to do the same to the OW as well.

 

If he told her he wanted to cheat with her "just to get some strange"...odds are, she'd refuse.

 

Owl,

I totally agree with you - my point was that you don't tend to see that when you're in the affair. You tend to be in that fabulous limerance stage. You are flattered that someone so wonderful would risk life as he knows it for you. You figure things must be really bad at home and that you must be pretty special, and sure enough mm says exactly this to you.

[MyApology]

I'm not sure about this. I think a lot of men prefer the stability and nurturing from the wife as well. I know my husband likes to be mothered . You mention the OW being like a sports car. In my situation I was the sports car and the OW well..ahem. Anyways apparently I wasn't "meeting his needs" = not having sex more than 2-3x a week. These OW met his needs temporarily until he got caught. I didn't restrain him or chain him down. I actually had a revenge affair but that is another story. I really think it's sad we all get caught in this mess WS's, BW's and OW. If there was no cheating going on in the first place there would be no bashing.

 

Not really the point. That all depends if the man is the type to affair up or the type to affair down. The point is if all women worldwide decided in union to never have an affair and these men had no outlet to get their needs met....then it boiled over into complete fustration and in order to get his needs met it meant resolution of marriage and leaving to find other women, the divorce rate would surge tremendously, But as long as there are women available, they can have their desires, fantasies, or needs met and simply go back home.

[Brokenlady]

BL knows that her MM now-H lied to her too many times during the A, so that confused me as well. Maybe a general perspective into what an OW might be thinking?

 

Strangely he didn't really start lying to me until he was sepersted and later divorced. He had to learn what healthy boundaries were and he resisted like crazy bc he was enmeshed his whole life. He never lied to me about the state of their M or how xw is as a person, which is ironically why I no understanding of his inability to really drop that hot potato. No, his lies at that time concerned the time he spent with her, how he dealt with her pleas for R, and other boundary issues.

[SidLyon]

...my blog-writing H's OW...,

 

Wow does this mean that LFH is in fact your H's OW? Please share if you can, bearing in mind she will probably be reading.

 

I notice her blog has taken on a rather desperate tone...

[ladydesigner]

Not really the point. That all depends if the man is the type to affair up or the type to affair down. The point is if all women worldwide decided in union to never have an affair and these men had no outlet to get their needs met....then it boiled over into complete fustration and in order to get his needs met it meant resolution of marriage and leaving to find other women, the divorce rate would surge tremendously, But as long as there are women available, they can have their desires, fantasies, or needs met and simply go back home.

 

Who knows that may be true. But the tables are turning and women nowadays are starting to exceed men in the salaries out there, so who really cares what these men do. I know I sure as hell am not concerned. My life now is all about me and my kids, to put so much focus and importance on a man is just silly to me now. Women can divorce as easily as a man and women have desires too. Not all men are desperate for strange either.

[MissBee]

In my reading lately and reading the posts, I believe OW actually help in keeping the majority of these marriages intact. The man gets to get out and drive a sports car for awhile gets his fix and can handle the pressures back at home.

I say this, because for instance, if all women worldwide agreed and intitated that they would in no way have an affair with a married man and married men had absolutely zero option to cheat, not even hookers or high class call girls, nothing to work with, there would be a HUGE upsurge of men divorcing their wives, in order to date again.

 

I think in my culture people sometimes see it like that...but it's still looked down upon, as in they call the OW "the unpaid helper".

 

In any case....as an OW if your goal is to help the MM keep his marriage intact then by all means. The problem is the OW who is thinking he is closer and closer to divorcing the more they are together when she is in a situation of helping him to stay.

[D-Lish]

This is real sweet. Too sweet. If the OW knew your H was married, she should have had some standards; even if your H didn't.

 

I hear what you are saying- and she should be held accountable as much as him. I have to tell you, and I am not being overly sweet- I wasn't without blame myself in the demise of our marriage.

 

Our marriage was in trouble, we both contributed to those problems. What I have come to realize over time is that my exH had a contract with me- so his choice to cheat on me was exactly that- his choice to cheat on me.

 

Nothing I have said above makes any of what happened okay- He should have left me before cheating, the OW could have respected he was married, I could have been a better wife to him and he could have been a better husband to me.

 

My point is that I that it just seems like women waging war on women prevails in a lot of these threads and sometimes we all forget that there is a MM in the middle that deserves just as much of the wrath as we place on one another as women on opposite sides of the coin.

 

Ultimately, I don't blame the OW in my situation because I had a contract with my Husband, a contract he violated. I'm not mad anymore, it's been so long.

[MissBee]

I hear what you are saying- and she should be held accountable as much as him. I have to tell you, and I am not being overly sweet- I wasn't without blame myself in the demise of our marriage.

 

Our marriage was in trouble, we both contributed to those problems. What I have come to realize over time is that my exH had a contract with me- so his choice to cheat on me was exactly that- his choice to cheat on me.

 

Nothing I have said above makes any of what happened okay- He should have left me before cheating, the OW could have respected he was married, I could have been a better wife to him and he could have been a better husband to me.

 

My point is that I that it just seems like women waging war on women prevails in a lot of these threads and sometimes we all forget that there is a MM in the middle that deserves just as much of the wrath as we place on one another as women on opposite sides of the coin.

 

Ultimately, I don't blame the OW in my situation because I had a contract with my Husband, a contract he violated. I'm not mad anymore, it's been so long.

 

I agree...there was a similar discussion in the Infidelity board once. I think that is my stance as well. Of course I am going to be upset at the OW....just the idea of it...but to be frank, if she is someone who doesn't know me from a can of paint, her choices are her own and I cannot hold her personally accountable to me. Her bad choices are hers but I am not going to spend my time chastising her...the man who made the vow to me, who looks into my face, sleeps in my bed, eats my food, etc is the one who I am going to direct 99% of my anger towards. If the OW is a friend of mine, an acquaintance or relative....then God help her...as in that case, it is a double betrayal! If she doesn't know me, the betrayal is only on my husband's part but if she is someone I'm friends with or she at least knows us as a couple then I'd feel justified to be angry at her and approach her.

 

As the OW it makes even less sense to me how one can be venomous towards the wife....Well it only makes sense in terms of misplaced anger, feeling envious, not of her as a person necessarily but that you share your "love" with her or she being around prevents you from having your man and things like that.

Edited December 14, 2011 by MissBee