Tough to let it go.

[bentnotbroken]

Too be completely honest, I have no idea what I am doing and why:( None.

 

 

The first completely honest thing that you have written.

[flutterbykiss]

Apology,

 

I noticed that in one of your previous posts you made mention of whether or not an A was an 'affair up' or an 'affair down'. I'm not going to tell you that your opinions are wrong but I'd like to share what I learnt from a situation that was very similar to yours.

 

I was 115pounds wringing wet, tall, have modeled and was a paid entertainer with an exciting life and a high sex drive. BW was quite overweight, sedentary, preoccupied with the demands of motherhood and work, had little interest in sex. I was MM's confidante, the keeper of his dirty little secrets and he was dazzled and besotted because he 'never thought he could get a girl like me'. Obviously an affair-up, right?

 

Bulls**t!!

 

I've now come to the conclusion that there is no such thing as an 'affair-up'. BW was by far the better woman. She loved him and was faithful to him and kept his home and raised his children with unswerving loyalty no matter what. I was just the skank that banged someone else's H.

 

No matter what he claimed (and he had made her out to be satan), it turned out that MM loved his W dearly and couldn't imagine life without her by his side. He valued her in a way he could never value me because she had morals and loyalty and trustworthiness (the things people truly value) and I had demonstrated to him very clearly that I didn't have any of those. I was disposable and replaceable but she was precious to him.

 

I learnt the hard way that an A can never be a step up because someone who will sleep with a MP will never be 'better' or more prized than a loyal loving spouse - no matter how good a wrapping that MP comes in.

 

Apology, I believe that this is the reason that so many posters have been at you about your comments towards the BW - not to tell you that you are wrong but to try to help you get a healthier perspective on the A so that you can be strong and heal.

 

The delusion that we, the OW, are in anyway superior to the BW keeps us in sympathy with the A, and MM, because it stops us from truly seeing the A as the lie it is. Feeling more desirable than the BW feeds the 'fog' of belief that MM had any genuine reasons for being in the A and stops us from gaining a more objective perspective of MM's intentions.

 

I'm saying all this to you because NC is 100 times easier once you realize and accept just how little the A was to MM. They play it up like it's a big deal to them and we believe it - that's what makes it hard to escape emotionally. IME, healing is so much easier once you realize that there is nothing to regret and no hope because there was nothing there to lose in the first place.

 

I know hard to truly accept that someone hasn't seen you or valued you as you deserve and never will. I have come from abusive Rs, too, so I know the mental games we play to excuse the poor behavior and find something (anything) to believe other than that we have been totally walked on (because believing it challenges our self-esteem and self-worth). I know you have had the strength to leave bad relationships before so I know you are aware that when you give up all hope it's suddenly easy to let go. I think we are all trying to help you give up the last remnants of futile hope so that you can keep NC, move on and heal. Good luck

Edited December 20, 2011 by flutterbykiss

[MissBee]

Apology,

 

I noticed that in one of your previous posts you made mention of whether or not an A was an 'affair up' or an 'affair down'. I'm not going to tell you that your opinions are wrong but I'd like to share what I learnt from a situation that was very similar to yours.

 

I was 115pounds wringing wet, tall, have modeled and was a paid entertainer with an exciting life and a high sex drive. BW was quite overweight, sedentary, preoccupied with the demands of motherhood and work, had little interest in sex. I was MM's confidante, the keeper of his dirty little secrets and he was dazzled and besotted because he 'never thought he could get a girl like me'. Obviously an affair-up, right?

 

Bulls**t!!

 

I've now come to the conclusion that there is no such thing as an 'affair-up'. BW was by far the better woman. She loved him and was faithful to him and kept his home and raised his children with unswerving loyalty no matter what. I was just the skank that banged someone else's H.

No matter what he claimed (and he had made her out to be satan), it turned out that MM loved his W dearly and couldn't imagine life without her by his side. He valued her in a way he could never value me because she had morals and loyalty and trustworthiness (the things people truly value) and I had demonstrated to him very clearly that I didn't have any of those. I was disposable and replaceable but she was precious to him.

 

I learnt the hard way that an A can never be a step up because someone who will sleep with a MP will never be 'better' or more prized than a loyal loving spouse - no matter how good a wrapping that MP comes in.

Apology, I believe that this is the reason that so many posters have been at you about your comments towards the BW - not to tell you that you are wrong but to try to help you get a healthier perspective on the A so that you can be strong and heal.

The delusion that we, the OW, are in anyway superior to the BW keeps us in sympathy with the A, and MM, because it stops us from truly seeing the A as the lie it is. Feeling more desirable than the BW feeds the 'fog' of belief that MM had any genuine reasons for being in the A and stops us from gaining a more objective perspective of MM's intentions.

I'm saying all this to you because NC is 100 times easier once you realize and accept just how little the A was to MM. They play it up like it's a big deal to them and we believe it - that's what makes it hard to escape emotionally. IME, healing is so much easier once you realize that there is nothing to regret and no hope because there was nothing there to lose in the first place.

 

I know hard to truly accept that someone hasn't seen you or valued you as you deserve and never will. I have come from abusive Rs, too, so I know the mental games we play to excuse the poor behavior and find something (anything) to believe other than that we have been totally walked on (because believing it challenges our self-esteem and self-worth). I know you have had the strength to leave bad relationships before so I know you are aware that when you give up all hope it's suddenly easy to let go. I think we are all trying to help you give up the last remnants of futile hope so that you can keep NC, move on and heal. Good luck

 

Absolutely amazing post!

 

I concur 100%!

 

I think so many of us have been in those shoes before and KNOW exactly the feelings, thought processes, futility of the situation and just want to help other women not to make that same mistake or to learn from it and get better. How some see this as being a hater is beyond me...but in any case, I do wish MyApology luck, although it's been frustrating. It is a process and most of us have been up to our eyeballs in fog before so can have empathy and sympathy, while dishing out tough love.

[MyApology]

I am just going to ignore the posts of those who protest too much. We have already gone over and over again that in writing my posts I have used honesty in describing the characters in them. Many of you are just drama...trying to make much much more of my comments then what they were meant to be and used to describe the situation and come to an understanding of it.

I already mentioned that comparing relationships JUST on looks alone is shallow. Looks mean nothing...Angelie Jolie is pretty and was an OW for a year and an equally pretty MW Aniston had her husband leave her for Angelie. I believe Bo Derek was an OW too whose man fell and left his equally pretty wife. It is the basis and substance of the relationship.

So in saying that, I am not looking to marry the guy!!!!!! I do not get where you are getting that from. I actually mentioned in many ways I was surprised a woman who had been cheated on countless times before having children with a man, had not left and brought children into the situation.

No affair is the same, many many men each year trade old wives for new, I do not get why many of you think this is uncommon.

Anytime my group had a friend who was cheated on the most common advice from the women and MORESO from the husbands was drop him immediately, he does not love you if he cheats. Most do leave that I have witnessed.

[LadyGrey]

I am just going to ignore the posts of those who protest too much. We have already gone over and over again that in writing my posts I have used honesty in describing the characters in them. Many of you are just drama...trying to make much much more of my comments then what they were meant to be and used to describe the situation and come to an understanding of it.

I already mentioned that comparing relationships JUST on looks alone is shallow. Looks mean nothing...Angelie Jolie is pretty and was an OW for a year and an equally pretty MW Aniston had her husband leave her for Angelie. I believe Bo Derek was an OW too whose man fell and left his equally pretty wife. It is the basis and substance of the relationship.

So in saying that, I am not looking to marry the guy!!!!!! I do not get where you are getting that from. I actually mentioned in many ways I was surprised a woman who had been cheated on countless times before having children with a man, had not left and brought children into the situation.

No affair is the same, many many men each year trade old wives for new, I do not get why many of you think this is uncommon.

Anytime my group had a friend who was cheated on the most common advice from the women and MORESO from the husbands was drop him immediately, he does not love you if he cheats. Most do leave that I have witnessed.

 

That is one of the most hypocritical posts I've ever read on here and the sad thing is, you don't see what is right in front of you and it's been brought up time and time again. You go on and on about how dysfunctional his wife is for not kicking him out, yet you are just as dysfunctional if not more for being and ow and getting in the middle of them. Take your rose colored glasses off, this man is an admitted serial cheater but yet you are rationalizing yourself into half way believing that you are what he has been looking for. You think his dowdy overweight wife is the problem and you are deluding yourself not realizing the problem is HIM, it is not his wife. Some day you are going to be in for rude awakening and frankly I'm not going to feel too bad for you because unlike many of us, you have been warned. Strangers have taken the time to write some truly excellent heartfelt posts that have many truths in them and knowledge that they have gained from similar deluded thinking but you aren't listening. Why do they do it, because they and I know just how bad it hurts and what it will cost you in self respect. One day when he brings you to your knees, if might wise up, you will look back and you will see the damage you have done to yourself and you will also know that you have been a party to pain caused to another woman. But of course........the other side is you won't care and you'll never get it.

 

I hope you wake up, sooner than later.

[weedsandposies]

Op,

 

Seems like you're holding out hope MM will leave BS for you. But don't you think he would've left by now if that was his plan? Instead he took a vaca with the W, one that he made YOU plan! How utterly disrespectful is that?

[woinlove]

I am just going to ignore the posts of those who protest too much. We have already gone over and over again that in writing my posts I have used honesty in describing the characters in them. Many of you are just drama...trying to make much much more of my comments then what they were meant to be and used to describe the situation and come to an understanding of it.

I already mentioned that comparing relationships JUST on looks alone is shallow. Looks mean nothing...Angelie Jolie is pretty and was an OW for a year and an equally pretty MW Aniston had her husband leave her for Angelie. I believe Bo Derek was an OW too whose man fell and left his equally pretty wife. It is the basis and substance of the relationship.

So in saying that, I am not looking to marry the guy!!!!!! I do not get where you are getting that from. I actually mentioned in many ways I was surprised a woman who had been cheated on countless times before having children with a man, had not left and brought children into the situation.

No affair is the same, many many men each year trade old wives for new, I do not get why many of you think this is uncommon.

Anytime my group had a friend who was cheated on the most common advice from the women and MORESO from the husbands was drop him immediately, he does not love you if he cheats. Most do leave that I have witnessed.

 

MyApology, why are you are still going on about the W, why she had children, what she should do? Do you find her life more interesting than your own? You first posted here saying you were just in the affair for fun and it was a light FWB type thing, but you have posted so much about MM's marriage, trying to understand his R with his W, wondering why she stays married, why he stays married. How about figuring out yourself instead?

[Owl]

Apology...what "advice" or "support" are you hoping to find here?

[alexandria35]

MyApology, I don't think I've posted on your thread up until now. Mostly because there really wasn't anything I could say that the other posters weren't already saying. Also because for several pages you emphatically stated that you were done with being an OW, you didn't want his drama and dysfunction, they need counselling but you're fine, etc etc...and even though I thought you were still kind of focusing on him and his wife too much I sort of believed you when you said you weren't going to be part of it anymore. As a matter of fact I was wondering why the other posters kept harping on you about things when you kept saying you didn't want him anymore. Guess I'm not as sharp as everyone else because they all knew that you were full of crap and I missed it.

 

You have not been honest here, you have not been honest with yourself. You claim that your MM is straight up with you and doesn't lie to you but I don't think you can even distinguish lies from the truth at this moment. You are telling yourself so many lies right now that you don't see what is real anymore. Everyone here saw right through the bs you were feeding us about being done with the affair, they paid attention to the contradictions and read between the lines and knew you weren't telling the truth. Yet you get defensive when the posters don't take what you say at face value. You have posted a couple of times about posters twisting your words and putting their own spin on things when obviously you were the one twisting the meaning of your words. You have not been honest.

 

Your MM is wearing you down and chipping away bit by bit at your core. He has already made some great progress. All this time you have thought that he was angry at you and wouldn't want to talk to you anymore. Now you feel special because after whatever you did to piss him off he still wants to see you. What you are not getting is that you have turned the situation around on yourself. Now instead of being rightfully pissed at the situation he has put you in as the OW, you are grateful that he is going to allow you to be the OW. You took a stand and then you caved, putting yourself into an even weaker position then you were before. Now he knows that your words and convictions are weak and meaningless. You might talk a good game but you're not going anywhere. Not only are you staying right where you wants you, you are even more accepting of the role he has cast you in. You will find yourself accepting more and more crap over time. He will train you to accept his crap in much the same way he has already trained you. You will get pissed about something he has done, he will retreat from you and leave you to stew in your own insecurity about him, yourself and your relationship. While you are worried and stressed out he is happily going about his business, not giving you much thought at all because he knows you're right where he left you. At just the right moment, maybe a few days or a few weeks, he will come back and declare his undying love for you. You will be so relieved that you will happily accept him back, more willing then ever to overlook whatever he did to cause the incident in the first place. Before long you will be amazed at just how much crap you are willing to accept and how low you have become. Now I'm sure you will read this and think "no way! that's not going to happen" but it has already happened. He has already done this very thing and you have reacted just the way he hoped you would. He is a serial cheater, he has done this dance many times before and he's good at it. Do you really believe that you are so remarkable that you will somehow be different than his wife and all the OW before you?

 

So what's your game plan? On another posters thread I noticed you posted something about selling yourself to the MM and on this thread you posted about how you told him something negative about his wife. So is that the next phase? You're going to make the MM see how much better you are than his wife in the hopes that one day he will choose you over her? Hey it happens. There are actually OW here who have won their MM after years and years of pain and drama and loss of self worth and self respect. It's not true when people say the MM never leaves their marriage. Some do. I just can't for the life of me understand why anyone would even want him at that point. I don't think the OW would even truly want him except for that she has already lost so much of herself to the affair that she feels like she has to at least get the "prize" for her efforts and sacrafice.

[whichwayisup]

Now you feel special because after whatever you did to piss him off he still wants to see you.

 

Thanks for posting this bit..I'd like to say (just popped into my head) and this goes with many things in life, not just affairs - But, some just don't care. Meaning, she felt she may have pissed him off, he'd stop talking to her or stay mad, make her suffer (play passive agressive games), but chances are quite hight that he just doesn't care either way.. It takes care and love to get under someone's skin enough to react out of anger and stay mad for a while (unless it's a game, then that's intentional and immature) so it could be what he means to her is much more than what she means to him.. Just another angle to look at this.

[SunsetRed]

This is far from over because you're absolutey NO WHERE near rock bottom, can't take it anymore, lost weight, stressed out, depressed, on meds. Go read some stories in this section..

 

Anyway, you could save yourself tons of pain and heartache if you just be strong and suffer now rather than a year or two down the road when you can't take it anymore and near a nervous breakdown.

 

GET STRONG so you can end this affair. It's going to kill your heart and kill who you are if you stay.

 

Good luck.

 

 

LOL Whichwayisup, you made me laugh! I've hit that rock bottom and am climbing up out of the darkness. I am thankful about the weight loss. I'd have never reached this weight again with diet and exercise I'm off the meds now and I will never again return to a place or person that took me to such a dark place. I'm glad I'm on my way to being OVER IT now, as opposed to waiting another year or two to go thru this hell. Hopefully the weight stays off!

[StrongerThanB4]

10 pages of replies...and then you get a reply like that from the OP?!?!

Seriously people...dont even bother. This OP is either 17 or too immature to even comprehend anything. Sounds like a child with these wishy washy posts...how pathetic!

[Hazyhead]

MyApology, I think what you're hoping for is that you'll read advice about steps you can take to secure him once and or all... or something. It makes me sad that you dont think you deserve to be treated better than the way he's treated you, that you don't want more. You have received excellent advice here, but I feel it's falling on deaf ears.

 

Perhaps time for you to have a rethink? This is a path full of heartbreak for you.

[Kitsune77]

I have read through all these posts, and the replies, and I really feel that you should be aware that you are getting the majority of advice from a very select audiance.

 

You sound like a kind and caring person, follow your heart and intuition. If it tells you that your man is a good man in a difficult place in his life, is not playing you, and you are happy most of the time, then talk to him , resolve these issues, NC is not the way to go for 2 mature individuals who respect and care about each other.

 

You have also said you do not know what you want out of the relationship, maybe that should be the first thing you look at. Do you want an uncommitted relationship? A committed affair, they can exist, BTW.

 

A part time one? or perhaps something leading to a future commitment. I think until you sort this out, you will be all over the place...and being aware that this can also change.

 

Find out who you are,and what you want ( not nessesarily from advice given here, either) then once that is done, any relationship you have will hopefully be a healthy one. And an affair can be a healthy relationship. Or not. It can be as healthy or unhealthy as any other realtionship.

 

BTW, I also dont agree with the common perception here on LS that there has to be a competition between MM/ OW and his wife. I know nothing about my mans wife, nor do i want to know. i m not having a reltionship with her.

 

Again, follow your heart. xx

[LadyGrey]

I don't get it, anyone is free to advise the op with any advice they choose, but to include in that advice (dissing those you disagree with) shows insecurity and inability to open your mind to anything other than what you want to hear and you are advising the op to do the same. Why couldn't you just say what you wanted to say without dissing everyone else?

 

Anyway the op seems to have abandoned the thread, probably because she didn't get the advice she wanted to hear.

 

 

 

I have read through all these posts, and the replies, and I really feel that you should be aware that you are getting the majority of advice from a very select audiance.

 

You sound like a kind and caring person, follow your heart and intuition. If it tells you that your man is a good man in a difficult place in his life, is not playing you, and you are happy most of the time, then talk to him , resolve these issues, NC is not the way to go for 2 mature individuals who respect and care about each other.

 

You have also said you do not know what you want out of the relationship, maybe that should be the first thing you look at. Do you want an uncommitted relationship? A committed affair, they can exist, BTW.

 

A part time one? or perhaps something leading to a future commitment. I think until you sort this out, you will be all over the place...and being aware that this can also change.

 

Find out who you are,and what you want ( not nessesarily from advice given here, either) then once that is done, any relationship you have will hopefully be a healthy one. And an affair can be a healthy relationship. Or not. It can be as healthy or unhealthy as any other realtionship.

 

BTW, I also dont agree with the common perception here on LS that there has to be a competition between MM/ OW and his wife. I know nothing about my mans wife, nor do i want to know. i m not having a reltionship with her.

 

Again, follow your heart. xx