Trickle Truth

[Kidd]

Quick update...

 

My wife petitioned for an Injunction the day after I was released from jail. Based on probable cause, the judge granted a temporary injunction until a hearing could be scheduled. Other than staying away from her (including contact of any kind), her car, our house, and her workplace, there are no other tasks for me to perform. It's just a form of temporary protection until a judge can hear the case. I have complied. She also requested custody of the children with supervised visitation and $1k/mo in child support (both of which were declined). I have still complied with her desire for supervised visitation and I've seen the kids 3 times in the 3 weeks. I've basically had to wait for her to reach out to friends or relatives who would contact me with availability.

 

Our attorneys negotiated a deal which gives her exclusive use of the marital home for 90 days. I can park in the driveway to pick up the kids (my request). We can talk to discuss finances, kids, and the state of the marriage (also my request). I am barred from any violent contact (stalking, battery, etc). We both signed it and the attorneys will present it to the judge, who will probably approve it Tuesday. It simply expires at the end of the 90 days.

 

As for my criminal case, that also has a "no contact" stipulation. I have been arraigned but that's it. I believe my court date is Feb 14th but don't have confirmation. Happy Valentines Day. So even if the Injunction agreement goes thru this upcoming week, I can still have no contact for the another month. She would have to petition for the no contact order to be removed sooner and it would need to be reviewed (and I have no reason to expect that she's going there). I will have a lot going for me in that case but her testimony/perspective will matter considerably. We'll see. Have to be on my best behavior until that is adjudicated. Being proactive with anger mgmt and alcohol will help.

 

No idea if she is considering R or D. Suspect she doesn't know and needs to factor in my perspective, too. Not having spoken since Dec 26th has kinda slowed down that conversation.

 

Drifter, I'll have to give you reply when I have more time to do so. Trust me, I hear you.

[Kidd]

OK...demonstrating my lack of legal knowledge here.

 

The proposed seperation is a settlement for what?

 

The RO? I thought that most RO's are TRO's...with a set duration and specific limitations and boundaries. Your attorney agreed to the extension of the current agreement without your knowledge and consent...sounds to me like you need to set him straight, ASAP.

 

But as far as that goes...the RO will "expire" unless someone requests it to be extended or implemented for a longer duration...so I don't understand how the seperation would be a "settlement" for anything along those lines.

 

Usually, when I hear "settlement" that's talking about distrubution of assets as a result of a divorce...not sure what it means in the context you've listed here.

 

Before you agree to this "settlement"...why not have a sit down with your attorney and outline some changes that you feel that you want to make during this time to be documented in some fashion...and just as critically, why not also request that your wife make some specific changes that you require from her during this seperation period as well?

 

From my perspective...the both of you are equally culpable for the "state of affairs" (pun intended) at this point...you've both done serious damage to each other.

 

Use the chance to INSIST on changes she needs to make, and to make important changes in your own world as well.

 

Hopefully I've already clarified the legal process.

 

As for specific changes that I require from her during this separation period, I assume we'll be able to talk at some point (probably after 2/14), and that's when we would likely both communicate our needs and see if there is interest on both parts to do what is required for the other. At this point, I have no reason to be encouraged or discouraged. She is not denying her role/wrongdoing in her discussions with my family (acknowledges her mistakes) and appears to be doing a lot of reflecting but I otherwise have no indications of her intent.

[2sunny]

I have to think that a woman keeping that much distance isn't likely to be considering reconciling...

 

I hope I'm wrong.

 

Stay on path according to your best interest and the follow the court guidelines.

[Kidd]

I have to think that a woman keeping that much distance isn't likely to be considering reconciling...

 

I hope I'm wrong.

 

Stay on path according to your best interest and the follow the court guidelines.

 

I'm not holding my breath.

[Spark1111]

Well, Here is what I think Kidd.....

 

I think she panicked that night and called, naturally, her parents (daddy) after your arrest.

 

The next day, presumably at an attorneys, she was told what her options were. If her parents knew of her infidelity, this was the time she would tell them of your revenge affair and then, your night of lunacy.

 

They circled their wagons, as a way to justify her infidelity, and opted for this road.

 

You are now the bad guy and there is tons of familial support for this, as in, "well of course she did what she did....see how crazy, unstable, blah, blah, blah he is?" She is now surrounded by supportive and forgiving family advising her to probably dump your azz so they can justify her cheating to themselves. She may be relishing this sympathy right now.

 

So you probably shot yourself in the foot on two levels: Your revenge affair and your couch=fire setting, bodily throwing her out of the house, arrest night. I would guess her family knows all now, and she is relishing those who are supporting her for her indiscretions.

 

Your night of lunacy became a welcome diversion to her infidelity. You understand this now, right?

 

It is what family and friends do: Circle their wagons around their loved one who they perceive was wronged, even if she was the one who cheated. It is what families do: look for reasons to justify poor behavior so they can forgive her and blame you.

 

That is why so many here told you to act blamelessly.

 

It is time for the 180, and if you are unsure what that is, please read up on it.

 

I think you get focused on your happiness now, and I do not think you discuss you, her, your relationship, or your marriage. You act calm and happy and confident, and of course, always respectful, but guardedly cautious about continuing a relationship with her.

 

Until she makes a decision and takes a stand amongst the family or in court, there is no marriage to bank on right now.

 

She is weak and cowardly (all cheaters are) and right now she is enjoying all that attention and sympathy she is receiving from others. While that lasts, she will not make a decision until it starts to fade. Take yourself out of that drama too.

 

Back away, conduct yourself honorably with all, and do not debate these circumstances with anyone/everyone accept your attorney.

 

IF she asks, tell her you love her but are now unsure you can reconcile because of her continued lying. While you are extremely remorseful you manhandling her, not disclosing sex on your couch might have been the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

SHE has to fight for the marriage or she will never change and it will never work.

 

Good luck here my friend. You are going to need it.

[goldengirl86]

Well, Here is what I think Kidd.....

 

I think she panicked that night and called, naturally, her parents (daddy) after your arrest.

 

The next day, presumably at an attorneys, she was told what her options were. If her parents knew of her infidelity, this was the time she would tell them of your revenge affair and then, your night of lunacy.

 

They circled their wagons, as a way to justify her infidelity, and opted for this road.

 

You are now the bad guy and there is tons of familial support for this, as in, "well of course she did what she did....see how crazy, unstable, blah, blah, blah he is?" She is now surrounded by supportive and forgiving family advising her to probably dump your azz so they can justify her cheating to themselves. She may be relishing this sympathy right now.

 

So you probably shot yourself in the foot on two levels: Your revenge affair and your couch=fire setting, bodily throwing her out of the house, arrest night. I would guess her family knows all now, and she is relishing those who are supporting her for her indiscretions.

 

Your night of lunacy became a welcome diversion to her infidelity. You understand this now, right?

 

It is what family and friends do: Circle their wagons around their loved one who they perceive was wronged, even if she was the one who cheated. It is what families do: look for reasons to justify poor behavior so they can forgive her and blame you.

 

That is why so many here told you to act blamelessly.

 

It is time for the 180, and if you are unsure what that is, please read up on it.

 

I think you get focused on your happiness now, and I do not think you discuss you, her, your relationship, or your marriage. You act calm and happy and confident, and of course, always respectful, but guardedly cautious about continuing a relationship with her.

 

Until she makes a decision and takes a stand amongst the family or in court, there is no marriage to bank on right now.

 

She is weak and cowardly (all cheaters are) and right now she is enjoying all that attention and sympathy she is receiving from others. While that lasts, she will not make a decision until it starts to fade. Take yourself out of that drama too.

 

Back away, conduct yourself honorably with all, and do not debate these circumstances with anyone/everyone accept your attorney.

 

IF she asks, tell her you love her but are now unsure you can reconcile because of her continued lying. While you are extremely remorseful you manhandling her, not disclosing sex on your couch might have been the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

SHE has to fight for the marriage or she will never change and it will never work.

 

Good luck here my friend. You are going to need it.

 

 

You make alot of good points and i think you are spot on in alot of ways. However, I have to disagree the moment she cheated there relationship was over, when he had his revenge affair it sealed there fate and when he physically abused her he drove the final nail in the coffin. Regardeless of whether they reconcile or not there lives will never be the same. Honestly perhaps it is time to grow up and realise that sometimes staying is worse then leaving, and sometimes strength lies not in the staying, but in the leaving.

 

I dont care if she cheated on you, once you decided to retaliate and get revenge you lost the victim status. And she obviously had good reason not too tell you the whole truth, because look at what you did when you found out about the couch. Yes her family will support her as they should and if i was her friend or family i would encourage her to divorce you.

 

However, that being said people do come back from worse, should they NO, but do they Yes.

Think about yourself and your kids and finding peace in your life.

Good luck and remember to look after yourself.

[2sunny]

What M was there really? I don't see any part of the R you two were in as kind and loving.

 

She harmed and hurt you

 

You harmed and hurt her back

 

The kids were harmed through this ugly process

 

Friends and family now are being hurt

 

Add fuel to the fire with angry and unreasonable reactions

 

 

NONE of this makes for a healthy, happy marriage!

 

You didn't have it to begin with - so what would make anyone consider going back to such misery?

 

I would like to understand what THAT motivation would be.

 

And don't say the kids- kids shouldn't have to be subjected to that as their sense of "normal" - its not normal!

 

There's no reason I can see why two toxic people should feel motivated to get back in the same living space.

 

The fact that you want her to consider it - is just asking for this destructive to continue.

 

There are good reasons, many times, in life to start fresh and new.

 

I suggest you get your mind in that healthier place.

[Spark1111]

You make alot of good points and i think you are spot on in alot of ways. However, I have to disagree the moment she cheated there relationship was over, when he had his revenge affair it sealed there fate and when he physically abused her he drove the final nail in the coffin. Regardeless of whether they reconcile or not there lives will never be the same. Honestly perhaps it is time to grow up and realise that sometimes staying is worse then leaving, and sometimes strength lies not in the staying, but in the leaving.

 

I dont care if she cheated on you, once you decided to retaliate and get revenge you lost the victim status. And she obviously had good reason not too tell you the whole truth, because look at what you did when you found out about the couch. Yes her family will support her as they should and if i was her friend or family i would encourage her to divorce you.

 

However, that being said people do come back from worse, should they NO, but do they Yes.

Think about yourself and your kids and finding peace in your life.

Good luck and remember to look after yourself.

 

I disagree it was over when she cheated, or he had his revenge affair, or he set the couch on fire.

 

I see two people in a lot of pain, passionately so, and not indifferent to each other at all!

 

Indifference is, I'm divorcing you now to get you permanently out of my life and I really do not care where you go, who you see. Not seeing that in this sitch.

 

I think they are both scared at the intensity of the emotions they are feeling and only they can decide how and if they can forgive each other and move forward into the future.

 

IF they seek counseling, treat each other with kindness and respect, and learn how to properly communicate their issues, this marriage is salvageable but it will take tons of effort on BOTH their parts.

 

And right now, I see her running away and staying safe with her family. She may not be strong enought to reconcile.

 

Sometimes, love ain't enough.

[Kidd]

All good replies; Spark, I agree with you the most, as usual.

 

I'm not sure I see her enjoying the attention as much as you might characterize but it's a valid assumption. I think the injunction, etc, is part of the typical safe rather than sorry approach that is recommened with domestic violence and it's tough to argue against. Her family seems to have remained somewhat neutral as I think my wife is indecisive about R.

 

I certainly know the 180 and as far as I'm concerned, it's already implemented unil I see sufficient remorse/changes to believe that the lying is being addressed. If the violence isn't the final nail for her, the lying very well could be for me. It's not the couch that set me off, it was f*cking lying to me about it still after 8 months of asking for honesty and openness. Coming clean would not have resulted in any of this. It would have resulted in forgiveness. Typical stupid miscalculation. And instead of fixing it, we're petitioning for injunctions.

[Spark1111]

All good replies; Spark, I agree with you the most, as usual.

 

I'm not sure I see her enjoying the attention as much as you might characterize but it's a valid assumption. I think the injunction, etc, is part of the typical safe rather than sorry approach that is recommened with domestic violence and it's tough to argue against. Her family seems to have remained somewhat neutral as I think my wife is indecisive about R.

 

I certainly know the 180 and as far as I'm concerned, it's already implemented unil I see sufficient remorse/changes to believe that the lying is being addressed. If the violence isn't the final nail for her, the lying very well could be for me. It's not the couch that set me off, it was f*cking lying to me about it still after 8 months of asking for honesty and openness. Coming clean would not have resulted in any of this. It would have resulted in forgiveness. Typical stupid miscalculation. And instead of fixing it, we're petitioning for injunctions.

 

I understand....and it takes tremendous courage to overcome the weakness that causes lying.

 

But we BSs so NEED TO SEE COURAGE AND STRENGTH in our fWS. It reassures us that they are strong enough to take a second chance on....

 

Hope it happens for both of you.

[goldengirl86]

I disagree it was over when she cheated, or he had his revenge affair, or he set the couch on fire.

 

I see two people in a lot of pain, passionately so, and not indifferent to each other at all!

 

Indifference is, I'm divorcing you now to get you permanently out of my life and I really do not care where you go, who you see. Not seeing that in this sitch.

 

I think they are both scared at the intensity of the emotions they are feeling and only they can decide how and if they can forgive each other and move forward into the future.

 

IF they seek counseling, treat each other with kindness and respect, and learn how to properly communicate their issues, this marriage is salvageable but it will take tons of effort on BOTH their parts.

 

And right now, I see her running away and staying safe with her family. She may not be strong enought to reconcile.

 

Sometimes, love ain't enough.

 

 

I can definately see the motivation behind what you are saying and your belief in what you are saying. I personally would rather leave a relationship with love still in my heart, than feel nothing at all and be indifferent. Why flog a dead relationship which is obviously toxic and harmful to both and end up indifferent or worse dispising one another, when if you had just left you would not have hurt one another so bad.

 

People like this, (do not take this the wrong way KIDD) are the ones that end up shooting the spouse when they cheat on them, people who are passionate and let there emotions rule them end up on the news, and its not love, love is not self distructive or cruel. Love has different meaning to different people.

 

I honestly would look at the mental stability of someone that would take someone back who did this too them and of someone that would do it. If i was a councellor i would address her issues of why she would even consider staying with someone like that.

 

However, that being said KIDD i dont think your dangerous too the point of killing her, and yes if she had not lied it may or may not have turned out like this.

[Spark1111]

I can definately see the motivation behind what you are saying and your belief in what you are saying. I personally would rather leave a relationship with love still in my heart, than feel nothing at all and be indifferent. Why flog a dead relationship which is obviously toxic and harmful to both and end up indifferent or worse dispising one another, when if you had just left you would not have hurt one another so bad.

 

People like this, (do not take this the wrong way KIDD) are the ones that end up shooting the spouse when they cheat on them, people who are passionate and let there emotions rule them end up on the news, and its not love, love is not self distructive or cruel. Love has different meaning to different people.

 

I honestly would look at the mental stability of someone that would take someone back who did this too them and of someone that would do it. If i was a councellor i would address her issues of why she would even consider staying with someone like that.

 

However, that being said KIDD i dont think your dangerous too the point of killing her, and yes if she had not lied it may or may not have turned out like this.

 

Staying with someone LIKE WHAT? Are you projecting your sitch onto Kidd?

 

Love shouldn't cheat or lie. It shouldn't throw bodies out of the house or f**K secret lovers on the couch in our home. No one disagrees with ANY of the above. Both are forms of abuse.

 

Not sure why YOU think she is the only victim in this relational drama.

 

Neither one is blameless for the current mess.

 

And if I were their counselor I would try to ascertain if they still loved each other and if they wanted to put in the effort to fixing the mess caused by her infidelity and his overreaction to having been lied to.

[Kidd]

I would argue that sometimes the depth of the pain and the emotional reaction to infidelity indicates exactly how much love the BS had for the WS. While my reaction was a terrible choice, it is not accurate to say that I didn't love my wife. My reaction demonstrates just the opposite. Indifference would have been the response if I didn't care. I was far from indifferent. A year of betrayal followed by 8 months of false reconciliation (more betrayal) might have been the culprit here.

[2sunny]

Staying in that victim role will never help you to move forward.

 

This last post of yours - it focuses on what she did or didn't do... Blame shifting won't move you forward.

 

You aren't acting accountable for YOUR actions! No one forced YOU to have that revenge affair. No one forced you to act violent on several occasions. YOU did those things! Those were YOUR choices and you acted out of bitterness and anger. THAT isn't even close to ANYTHING that looks loving -or like love at all!

 

Focus on YOU! Focus on changing YOU to become the best you can be. Stop focusing on her. You can't change her - you can only change you. She's never gonna believe you've changed until you show consistent good behavior LONG term!

 

Sifting the blame to her gets you off the hook

Also makes you feel less guilt

Makes her to blame

Doesn't hold YOU accountable for YOUR actions

Fools you into thinking you did nothing wrong

Helps to to stay miserable in denial and unhappy with your choices

 

 

Well guess what - you evidently DID do some things that were hurtful.

 

Now you have work to do to repair that damage.

 

Better to start being honest with yourself and doing the work necessary here... To grow and learn from YOUR mistakes.

 

At this point - whatever she did and what she feels is completely beside the point.

 

Wen you acknowledge that you can only change YOU - and that does affect others - is when you may find some peace of mind.

 

You've got work to do - first things first - the starting point is getting honest with yourself and others. Sop blaming her for your bad behavior.

[goldengirl86]

Staying with someone LIKE WHAT? Are you projecting your sitch onto Kidd?

 

Love shouldn't cheat or lie. It shouldn't throw bodies out of the house or f**K secret lovers on the couch in our home. No one disagrees with ANY of the above. Both are forms of abuse.

 

Not sure why YOU think she is the only victim in this relational drama.

 

Neither one is blameless for the current mess.

 

And if I were their counselor I would try to ascertain if they still loved each other and if they wanted to put in the effort to fixing the mess caused by her infidelity and his overreaction to having been lied to.

 

Because the moment he manhandled her she became the victim, you seem to be off the opinion that even though someone is abused they should return to the relationship given they have help, only 1-5 % of abusers actually change, and those people who advocate councelling and reconciling after abuse have no idea, they think because they have read a couples of books, and done a little bit of research and studied a little that there way will save any problem within a relationship, because any relationship can be saved as long as the partners are not indifferent to one another.

 

I will never ever advocate/support a woman or a man returning to an abusive relationship especially if children are involved, regardless of if that person has changed or not, because the risk is too high that they will do it again. I imagine and know that most abusers who act passionately and emotionally when hearing about a betrayal from there spouse love that person and vice versa, people dont just behave randomly and unexpectally. His wife obviously belived he could not handle the whole truth, look what he did when he found out about the affair, she was right in her judgment.

 

This is not an infedility issue anymore it is a domestic violence issue!

 

Kidd said that if she had not lied this would not have happened or if i had not been drinking etc, Kidd said that she needs to do this and that etc if they were to reconcile. This is not about infedility it is about children witness alcohol misuse, violence and i imagine if they were home and saw there couch on fire it would be very confusing and scary.

 

But hey there parents are not indifferent to one another yet, they love one another alot, so until they are indifferent they should really stick with this relationship!

 

I could say that KIDD may be a one off abuser, as i know some BS who have acted out at the WS when they find out about the affair right at that moment and have hitted them in some way, like slapping them, punching them etc. I could almost justify it, but i would also be worried about it happening again and in my eyes if there is even 1% chance that this could happen again and either she could be hurt or the kids will be hurt than im sorry i wont agree with your opinion, unless of course you actually watched your father hurt your mother or vice versa, because take it from someone who knows, as a child you never forget that 1 time, that first time that your parent becomes a victim and is scared, because at that 1 time they were too consumed with there own selfishness too stand up and teach there children that yes thay can protect themselves and there children and that no one has a right to physically hurt your or mentally hurt in anyway and that type of behaviour will never be tolerated.

[frozensprouts]

Because the moment he manhandled her she became the victim, you seem to be off the opinion that even though someone is abused they should return to the relationship given they have help, only 1-5 % of abusers actually change, and those people who advocate councelling and reconciling after abuse have no idea, they think because they have read a couples of books, and done a little bit of research and studied a little that there way will save any problem within a relationship, because any relationship can be saved as long as the partners are not indifferent to one another.

 

I will never ever advocate/support a woman or a man returning to an abusive relationship especially if children are involved, regardless of if that person has changed or not, because the risk is too high that they will do it again. I imagine and know that most abusers who act passionately and emotionally when hearing about a betrayal from there spouse love that person and vice versa, people dont just behave randomly and unexpectally. His wife obviously belived he could not handle the whole truth, look what he did when he found out about the affair, she was right in her judgment.

 

This is not an infedility issue anymore it is a domestic violence issue!

 

Kidd said that if she had not lied this would not have happened or if i had not been drinking etc, Kidd said that she needs to do this and that etc if they were to reconcile. This is not about infedility it is about children witness alcohol misuse, violence and i imagine if they were home and saw there couch on fire it would be very confusing and scary.

 

But hey there parents are not indifferent to one another yet, they love one another alot, so until they are indifferent they should really stick with this relationship!

 

I could say that KIDD may be a one off abuser, as i know some BS who have acted out at the WS when they find out about the affair right at that moment and have hitted them in some way, like slapping them, punching them etc. I could almost justify it, but i would also be worried about it happening again and in my eyes if there is even 1% chance that this could happen again and either she could be hurt or the kids will be hurt than im sorry i wont agree with your opinion, unless of course you actually watched your father hurt your mother or vice versa, because take it from someone who knows, as a child you never forget that 1 time, that first time that your parent becomes a victim and is scared, because at that 1 time they were too consumed with there own selfishness too stand up and teach there children that yes thay can protect themselves and there children and that no one has a right to physically hurt your or mentally hurt in anyway and that type of behaviour will never be tolerated.

 

 

Goldengirl,

( and please know that as someone who helped raised funds for, helped set up, volunteers at and helps govern a shelter for abused women that I speak with some experience)

 

Kidd should never, ever have laid his hands on his wife in anger. But the fact that he did does not negate his wife's actions ( cheating). they are both in the wrong here.

 

The question now becomes what to do to make things better. It sounds like Kidd is willing to try and do something to change his behavior. He recognizes what he did that was wrong and wants to change. Does his wife?

 

What is SHE doing to make changes in herself? Maybe she's doing nothing.maybe she's doing a lot...I don't know. But she obviously has some issues of her own to deal with, and the fact that he put his hands on her in anger does not suddenly erase what she did. She's still responsible for her half of the equation.

 

Kidd, my advice to you is to not make changes in yourself for your wife...make them for yourself and your children. Focus on being the best dad you can be, and if your wife is willing to address her issues, then maybe consider reconciling. If she is not, then perhaps the two of you are better off apart.

 

whatever you decide to do, best of luck to you

[Kidd]

I don't mind the t/j. The whole violence thing is brand new to me. I have a lot to learn to make sure it is never possible in my life again. I feel horrible for having hurt my wife. Period. I will accept if it is a dealbreaker for her.

 

As for my wife being afraid to tell me the truth and for such obvious good reasons, I'm sorry but it's complete crap. You know what I did when I found about her affair and confronted her? I held her as she cried in my arms. Then a few days later I suffered through 3 hours of hearing details like how he was more dominant in bed, better understood where that line was and how much she enjoyed their physical chemistry. Guess what? No violent reaction, no yelling. And I stayed thru another 8 months of developing PTSD, going on meds, and trying to convince myself that 2+2=5. When I caught her secretly breaking NC with the OM, no violence. Never once did I call her a slut, bitch, whore, etc.. I stayed and tried to believe her claims that NOW she understood how important openness and honesty was. I worked thru the Surviving an Affair emotional needs exercises and did everything I could to fix my parts in the marriage that had made her so unhappy. I beat myself up trying to get over her affair. How did she reciprocate? Avoidance and lies. And no man should ever have to read their wife's passionate description about sex with OM in their home and how much she relished that I would never know what had happened on my couch.

 

Was I wrong? Absolutely. I'm not likely to stop paying for that anytime soon. Am I an ongoing danger to my kids? Give me a break. Put me in the "abuser" bucket if you like but I'm not an abuser and she knows it. But I am the one that continues to pay the price for her decisions, including needing a planetary alignment to occur to arrange supervised visitation of my kids. Unless they had sex with the OM on my couch, I don't have any beef with them.

 

In the meantime, she's doing what? Hell if I know.

[heartinlove]

Hi Kidd.

 

I agree with you that this whole line of you as the abuser is off course. You know what you did couch, revenge affair, physically throwing her out is wrong. It does however point to the level of brokenness in your whole situation.

 

I agree with Spark that people can recover when it gets to that level, but i believe its rare, and I believe Sparks way of dealing with life is a rarity that allowed her to really have a great marriage again. It will take a massive turnaround on both of your parts to really have a healthy marriage again.

 

Also, that she is insisting still on supervised visits and setting up these visits so sporadically is really a bad sign as to the state of your marriage. I dont think you deserve that, but the reality that she feels you deserve that is troubling to say the least.

 

I am curious though why you see it as a false reconciliation of 8 months. From reading your posts, it seemed she did everything you wanted and this was the only lie, and it was a lie to protect the past, not a lie about current behavior. Im not sure why that sent you so off the deep end and why that colored the whole reconciliation as false. Did she know that if she covered any questions with a lie that you could potentially react this way? I just dont understand why she didn't tell the truth about this when she came clean on everything else and as you said, you didn't have a violent response, you just dealt with it. Just trying to understand, because you seemed like you were on a good path and that you would be a couple that made it.

[2sunny]

I understand anyone being angry with what you have endured.

 

It is what we DO with those situations that can hurt others.the recent way you participated is yours.

 

Blaming her for your reaction and over reaction will not help you now.

 

It is up to you to have a voice and speak your truth...doing that without raising your voice and acting violent - will show change... But it needs to be consistent and long term for anyone to trust you again.

 

Owning how you behaved is your first step - its not because of HER - it's because of YOU.

[Kidd]

Hi Kidd.

 

I agree with you that this whole line of you as the abuser is off course. You know what you did couch, revenge affair, physically throwing her out is wrong. It does however point to the level of brokenness in your whole situation.

 

I agree with Spark that people can recover when it gets to that level, but i believe its rare, and I believe Sparks way of dealing with life is a rarity that allowed her to really have a great marriage again. It will take a massive turnaround on both of your parts to really have a healthy marriage again.

 

Also, that she is insisting still on supervised visits and setting up these visits so sporadically is really a bad sign as to the state of your marriage. I dont think you deserve that, but the reality that she feels you deserve that is troubling to say the least.

 

I am curious though why you see it as a false reconciliation of 8 months. From reading your posts, it seemed she did everything you wanted and this was the only lie, and it was a lie to protect the past, not a lie about current behavior. Im not sure why that sent you so off the deep end and why that colored the whole reconciliation as false. Did she know that if she covered any questions with a lie that you could potentially react this way? I just dont understand why she didn't tell the truth about this when she came clean on everything else and as you said, you didn't have a violent response, you just dealt with it. Just trying to understand, because you seemed like you were on a good path and that you would be a couple that made it.

 

I don't understand the supervised visitation, at all.

I don't understand why she lied, at all. Why come halfway clean when I had to endure really painful stuff already? And I will credit myself for handling it well. Rip the damn bandaid off.

I suppose it is a misnomer to call it a false reconciliation. On the same night of this incident, she also came clean on other things (via text while I was drinking) that were lies. Since that night, I've thought of about 10 other things that I just don't believe. Not sure I ever will. Makes the whole thing seem like a pile of crap. Thus, the "false."

 

Sunny, I agree I have work to do. I'm trying. I will never raise my voice, threaten, or certainly physically do anything to her ever again. I agree it will take consistent actions over time to prove it, if it can be proven. But what her intent is, it's not irrelevant. It's half the equation.

[2sunny]

Trust is earned... And yes, it will take time to earn it back.

 

Her half of the equation - I don't know why you'd be considering any reconciliation at all at this point - because she's certainly not DOING everything SHE can to earn your trust - so you really don't have an equation if she's not even ALL IN...

 

She's not attempting to rebuild the M - so act as if she's not interested.

 

Until she changes everything - there's nothing to consider except figuring out how YOU can be a better man.

[goldengirl86]

I don't understand the supervised visitation, at all.

I don't understand why she lied, at all. Why come halfway clean when I had to endure really painful stuff already? And I will credit myself for handling it well. Rip the damn bandaid off.

I suppose it is a misnomer to call it a false reconciliation. On the same night of this incident, she also came clean on other things (via text while I was drinking) that were lies. Since that night, I've thought of about 10 other things that I just don't believe. Not sure I ever will. Makes the whole thing seem like a pile of crap. Thus, the "false."

 

Sunny, I agree I have work to do. I'm trying. I will never raise my voice, threaten, or certainly physically do anything to her ever again. I agree it will take consistent actions over time to prove it, if it can be proven. But what her intent is, it's not irrelevant. It's half the equation.

 

Kidd do i think you are a full blown abuser, no, do i think you have been abusive yes! You can say that this will never happen again etc, you have learned from this etc, but it is just words, there is obviously something in your being that is violent to a point. However, it did take you alot to get to that point!! I can see that.

But most women i hope will not return to anyone that is abusive to them physically, and i think she may be one of them. Do i think the supervised visitations are a bit much YES from what you have said. However, she may think you are menatlly unstable and think that she is doing the best thing for her kids, there are two sides to this story and we only have yours. There has to be a reason why she wants the supervised visits other than to hurt you.

 

I dont know she may just be done with it all, it seems like it has been a really hard time for you both and she is just tired from it all, which i can understand.

 

Spark111 and ladygrey: Have i projected my sit on to Kidd maybe a little, but we are all projecting our sits onto everything we do in life. Spark111 has her views as does everyone.

 

Yes the issues relating to the cheating need to be addressed, and yes it is a serious issue.

 

However, as i have said i dont care how many books someone has read or whether they have raised money for domestic violence victims than you still dont know anything, you can advocate MC, C but you have no idea the damage that Domestic Violence does to someone. I think it is the people who read lots of books, these educated textbook fanatics (i am one) who have no real idea of the severity of what it means to be phycially, mentally or sexually absued by someone. I have seen domestic violence first hand and experienced it and know alot of people who are still in or who have left abusive relationships, and it is something that stays with them forever. Can you forgive them yes, forget never, reconcile perhaps half heartenly, but only a certain kind of person does this as well.

[Spark1111]

Look, I can take your afternoon trysts at seedy hotels (shower, anyone?), parking lots, parks, and your place when the kids were with your x at court-ordered weekend visitations. I can abide by the endless texts and emails and sexting and thong photos and out-of-town hotels, blah, blah,, blah.

 

I can understand your endless future faking and NEVER hopping off the fence because the grown up in you does not want to LOSE the mature family life you have created.

 

But I can understand the mental unhinging that comes with learning you f##ked your lover on MY COUCH in MY/OUR home and relished in your email that "you got away with it," BUT never told me. I found out on my own 8 months after the fact.

 

THAT is something you should disclose right after DDAy if you have any intent of reconciling and take my feelings into account. They sat, talked, cried, held each other, maybe made love on that couch for 8 months and she never thought to tell him she and her xOM trysted there?????

 

C'MON ladies...even as OW you understand the devastation of this revelation. Your MM tells YOU he has sex with another OW on your couch in your home while you were at work months after you decided to forgive him and try to reconcile as he .....oops, made a mistake and never thought this was important enough to tell you.

 

Where is BentNot Broken? I think she could shed some personal insights here.....

 

I can't think of a greater violation except f**king your lover in OUR bed where we made love.

 

I think, all in all, Kidd showed amazing restraint under the circumstances.

 

I am the most level headed person you could ever meet....and yet, under those circumstances, where you feel played for a total fool, I may have thrown the kids, H, out of the house, set the couch and house on fire, and sought to smash my car into the car of the OW/OM.

 

And you would have too.

 

You are missing the point here....and hyperfocusing on one irrational act by a man at the breaking point....and I do NOT condone physical force on any level at any time.

[goldengirl86]

Im not missing the point!

 

She cheated, told him the majority of the gory details, except for one. He supporter her, listen to all those things she did while it slowly ripped his heart out and crushed his soul. In a means too get even and to make her undertand the pain she had put him through he had a revenge affair. She forgave him, as she felt like she deserved it, she was not allowed to validate her feelings about his affair as he would never have had that affair in the first place if it was not for her. So slowly for months and months, Kidd and her were eaten up by the guilt, by the shame, by the actions after and then one night he finds outs another thing, it probally would not have matter what it was because he had reached his breaking point and he snapped.

 

However, this was enough for her and right now she cant deal with it, it is all too much. Enough is enough!!!!

[Spark1111]

Im not missing the point!

 

She cheated, told him the majority of the gory details, except for one. He supporter her, listen to all those things she did while it slowly ripped his heart out and crushed his soul. In a means too get even and to make her undertand the pain she had put him through he had a revenge affair. She forgave him, as she felt like she deserved it, she was not allowed to validate her feelings about his affair as he would never have had that affair in the first place if it was not for her. So slowly for months and months, Kidd and her were eaten up by the guilt, by the shame, by the actions after and then one night he finds outs another thing, it probally would not have matter what it was because he had reached his breaking point and he snapped.

 

However, this was enough for her and right now she cant deal with it, it is all too much. Enough is enough!!!!

 

Because she can't deal! If she could, she wouldn't have had an affair in the first place.

 

His revenge ONS with someone (where nothing really happened and he was honest with her about that eventually) in NO WAY compares to having a long-term affair with a man where she had sex on our couch and neglected to tell me that very major most important fact.

 

We could've burned the damn couch together two weeks after DDAY and felt strenghtened by it.