Is Being Average Bad?

[verhrzn]

I was reading an article over the weekend about the correct way to talk to your daughter about beauty in a way that wouldn't lead to self image problems down the line. There seemed to be a split both within the article and the comments about how to approach it. One side said that beauty should not be discussed at all, and parents should instead focus on how smart/intelligent/academic-oriented their daughter is, and one said you should be telling your daughter (if not constantly) consistently about how beautiful/pretty AND smart she is, to raise self esteem and avoid image issues.

 

I also noticed in the comments how many people (particularly women) talked about how their parents really emphasized their intelligence, or balanced out their compliments to both looks and smarts. It seemed like every single poster described herself as "incredibly smart, successful and very attractive."

 

But... we can't all be smart. If we're all "smart," then "smart" is actually average (because average, by definition, is what everybody is.) And we can't all be "incredibly attractive" if beauty is actually a spectrum, unless we're espousing the philosophy that "everyone is a beautiful little snow flake/there's no such thing as an ugly woman/beauty is in the eye of the beholder." (Which may be true on an individual level, but society-wise... come on. There are mountains of studies demonstrating that it's not true.)

 

It makes me wonder.... is there something bad about being average? Why are we ALL "smart, beautiful and successful!" Are we actually perhaps over-selling ourselves? I've noticed this in other places as well... that if you think you're anything LESS than "smart and attractive" people label you as having self image problems or low self esteem.

 

So, if you describe yourself as average, does that actually mean you think poorly of yourself?? What if you actually are just average? What do you say about yourself, or how do you compliment your daughter, when in fact she's not that smart? (Not saying she's dumb, just.... of average intelligence?)

 

 

This made me think back to how I was raised. My father is a stoic, practical type, and took the parental road of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"... meaning, we only heard about something if we were doing it wrong. (And the topics were limited only to: money, grades, chores, and how to throw a softball correctly.) My mother occasionally told us she was proud of us, but mostly she would make comments about how it was perfectly all right to be average. "If much is given, much is expected," she'd say. She emphasized that it was a good thing I was "average"... that I wasn't particularly good looking, that I was of average intelligence, and not really possessing of any talents, because "most people have an average life" and if I'd been given more, I would have been expected to excel.

 

And it's pretty true, my life is very, very average. I have a good-but average-paying job, I graduated from an average college with average grades (3.0-3.6 GPA range), and I haven't really had any big life adventures. (Could never afford it.)

 

My friends, however, think it's awful that my mother told me I was average, and think I have low self esteem for describing my life as," Meh, average, neither better or worse than an average person's."

 

Why is average such a dirty word when it comes to describing ourselves?

[Mme. Chaucer]

I believe that we should notice all the specific gifts, talents and efforts that our child has or makes and praise and encourage those. Rather than "you are so brilliant," commenting specifically on what the kid did well or on improvement they made is more appropriate and nurturing.

 

Regarding looks - I think it's just as harmful to make a child (especially a girl) feel like she is amazingly gorgeous as is is to make her feel ugly.

 

I raised a daughter - she (like most of us) had / has self esteem issues around her appearance. But I always found it pretty easy to compliment all the great things about the way she looked, and not mention negatives. I still do (she is 24).

 

It's not that difficult for a loving parent to find lots of things to praise about their child without telling them that they are "incredibly smart, successful and very attractive," "average," or "an ugly loser." Lots of things that are actually worthy of praise. Even if the child might be developmentally disabled, I assure you - there will still be MANY things deserving of praise without labeling the kid "incredibly smart," or "stupid" or "average."

 

Clearly, and sadly, you are a person who values physical appearances above all else, and also a person who only sees her own value (and that of others) in comparative terms. Thus, in your world view, no one can be really brilliant, because there is always someone more brilliant. No one can be pretty if there are many people more pretty, and no kid probably can draw an amazing picture of a pony because "Guernica" exists.

[tman666]

I completely disagree with consistently reinforcing children with the belief that they are amazing little snowflakes. Kids brought up like that turn into weird adults. I'm sure you can think of a bunch of examples of this in the group of people you interact with.

 

I don't think there's anything wrong with complimenting your kids or being supportive, but I've seen the effects of constant "oh sweetie, you're such a perfect princess" coddling within my own extended (thankfully, not immediate) family. I think it inflates the child's sense of self worth RELATIVE to those around them, i.e. lends itself to creating a narcissistic, arrogant, self-centered adult.

 

Regarding being average: being competitive with yourself and others in an attempt to improve yourself is a healthy thing, in my opinion. However, it can be a slippery slope when you're too hard on yourself. There's a difference between self criticism and introspection. Self criticism focuses on the negative, while introspection focuses on positives while acknowledging areas to improve on, and attempts to improve via positive processes. At the end of the day, we are who we are, and for most of us, we fall somewhere in the middle on most things. There's nothing tragic about this.

 

For example, my job is also good but fairly average (in both pay and excitement); my looks are probably fairly average; I have traveled a bit, but I'm far from worldly; I went to a state university, etc.

 

I'm extremely grateful that I have my average job, and I'm glad to have had the opportunity to go to the university I went to, and I'm thankful that I have traveled to the places I've been. I don't think that I'm "less" than the guy/gal who makes $500k a year, has traveled all over the world, or went to MIT. My experiences are unique and my own, and I am responsible for creating my own happiness and adventure, and fortunate to be free to do so. I know and capitalize on what my above-average strengths are. They give me the confidence to be content with the "average" parts of my life.

Edited January 3, 2012 by tman666

[verhrzn]

It's not that difficult for a loving parent to find lots of things to praise about their child without telling them that they are "incredibly smart, successful and very attractive," "average," or "an ugly loser." Lots of things that are actually worthy of praise. Even if the child might be developmentally disabled, I assure you - there will still be MANY things deserving of praise without labeling the kid "incredibly smart," or "stupid" or "average."

 

Clearly, and sadly, you are a person who values physical appearances above all else, and also a person who only sees her own value (and that of others) in comparative terms. Thus, in your world view, no one can be really brilliant, because there is always someone more brilliant. No one can be pretty if there are many people more pretty, and no kid probably can draw an amazing picture of a pony because "Guernica" exists.

 

So, what exactly is deserving of praise? There are certain qualities and certain behaviors that society defines as worthy as praise, and others that-while you might be exceptional at-are ignored or lauded.

 

For example, if your child's only talent is that they are darn good at switching between channels during commercials without missing any of the program... is that really praise worthy? And can a child really build their self esteem on it?

 

I have some minor talents. Annoying everyone around me silly is apparently one of them. But I focus on looks (and intelligence, frankly) because that's what society values. There's no Nobel Peace Prize for having really nice hand writing, no "Top 10 Best" list for getting the dishes clean on the first run through the dishwasher.

 

There's a reason everyone on their dating profiles defines themselves as "smart and fun" (and at least subtly, good-looking.) These are the things that are valued. So if your child doesn't have those, or has those in much smaller quantities than everyone around them, what then? How DO you raise an ugly, stupid child to be confident?

[norajane]

How DO you raise an ugly, stupid child to be confident?

You tell them how much you love them, and how special they are to you, and how they make your life so much happier to have them in your life.

 

You raise them to value kindness, being thoughtful of others, and hard work - which you praise every time you see it exhibited by your kids, and which you embody yourself in your daily life.

 

You raise them to make the most of what they have been given: do the BEST you can in school and do not settle for just ok; take good care of yourself by eating well and exercising and grooming and dressing and social skills; you teach them confidence by encouraging them to go outside their comfort zone and take risks because that is how people learn and grow and become the best person they can; you teach them to try new things and seek out new experiences because that will be rewarding to them their whole lives.

 

I think your mother did you wrong - she did not motivate you to excel. What's wrong with having high expectations of yourself? Maybe you wouldn't have been an average student if you weren't told you shouldn't have high expectations.

 

Most people, by definition, are average. That they describe themselves as above average is a reflection of how happy they are with themselves. It doesn't matter to them how others describe them - they are happy with themselves regardless and see themselves as above average. Depressed people, on the other hand, do not, even if they ARE above average in every way.

Edited January 3, 2012 by norajane

[choppedkittens]

I don't believe in praising a child's beauty or looks. Growing up my relatives were obsessively focused on appearance and calling me pretty. They were also always comparing and contrasting to others, picking apart people's appearances. Constantly. I interpreted this as meaning that attractiveness was the only important thing a woman had to offer.

 

It had a disastrous effect on my self esteem because it raised the expectation that I should receive the same attention in the outside world and when I didn't get it I felt like I was worthless. If I ever have kids, I will rarely (if ever) mention the way they look.

 

I think it's healthy to praise less superficial qualities in moderation. If you go to an extreme, the kid may become addicted to ego validation.

Edited January 4, 2012 by choppedkittens

[Mme. Chaucer]

So, what exactly is deserving of praise? There are certain qualities and certain behaviors that society defines as worthy as praise, and others that-while you might be exceptional at-are ignored or lauded.

 

For example, if your child's only talent is that they are darn good at switching between channels during commercials without missing any of the program... is that really praise worthy? And can a child really build their self esteem on it?

 

Do you seriously think that this is a worthwhile platform for a discussion? Really?

 

I have some minor talents. Annoying everyone around me silly is apparently one of them. But I focus on looks (and intelligence, frankly) because that's what society values. There's no Nobel Peace Prize for having really nice hand writing,

 

Is there a Nobel Peace Prize for being "HOTT"?

 

Are you going to deny that there is a whole world of positive between nice handwriting and winning a Nobel Prize?

 

Oh, of course you are. You refute every single thing any poster here says to you that does not support your tiny tunnel vision.

 

How DO you raise an ugly, stupid child to be confident?

 

Bla, bla, bla.

 

Reasonably good parents don't have ugly, stupid children. We would never see our kids as stupid or ugly, or as ONLY having the television changing talent that you used in your fine example above.

 

You know what? There is a whole world of people of your age who are not obsessed with "top ten lists," what a "tragedy" it is not to look like a celebrity, and all that. You should really start hanging out with some of them.

[Eve]

I went with nurturing them towards finding and accentuating their inborn talents, with the focus being on inner beauty, self awareness, fairness and a strong sense of justice.

 

Didn't follow the line of over praising them or focusing on their looks or intelligence mainly because I don't think this really works well in real life. 'Real life' being an authentic lifestyle, not media processed bs.

 

As for competitiveness and comparison making, I taught them to be competitive only with themselves and to not compare as comparisons only make a person vain or bitter. In my view, comparisons are a product of ego and by and large turns people into 'collectors' rather than participants in life.

 

They have internalised what I have taught them for themselves and are good beautiful people, inside and out. The boys of the family got the same treatment. One boy listened, one boy didn't and they both have entirely different lives.

 

So, I don't think it is about being average. I think it is about becoming oneself and many do not make it because they want to be like someone else.

 

Take care,

Eve x

[Els]

I think it depends on the sort of person. Which is why I'd never believe what a person says about themselves - that is affected more by the sort of viewpoint they have (pragmatic, overly modest, overly confident, etc), than what they actually are. An overly-modest but very intelligent person would call himself average, a pragmatic smart-but-not-hyperintelligent person would call himself average, and a not-really-smart-but-overconfident person would call himself smart.

 

Being perfectly honest, I do think far too many people are raised to be overconfident and think too highly of themselves. I mean, schools not having fail grades? Geez, if you failed, you SHOULD have a fail grade. Real life does not buffer you from failure; real life does not give you false praise. Those kids are in for a horrible shock when they exit school.

 

I think it takes a certain degree of pragmatism to truly know where your strength and weaknesses are, and to sugarcoat neither. People generally are not terribly accepting of such, as you have noticed.

[Ross MwcFan]

I'd be very happy to know that I'm average. I don't see average as bad at all, it just means you're pretty much the same as anyone else, and not any worse.

[carhill]

So, if you describe yourself as average, does that actually mean you think poorly of yourself??

IME, no, quite the opposite. I have confidence in the reality of that assessment. I recognize my limitations and accept them. I recognize my strengths and accept them. There are times I 'stand out' and times where I am 'part of the background'. Life is a journey which ends in the same place for all of us.

 

To a large degree, this was socialized into me; to be thankful for the genetic gifts and nurture which was bestowed and to never take them for granted. To use those gifts to uplift others rather than put them down or tread over them. To be accepting of others blend of strengths and limitations.

 

So far, being average and accepting and celebrating it has been a healthy personal journey, romantic relationship failures notwithstanding. I really don't care what society thinks. They don't have to live my life and I'm happy to not have them in it if that is their choice.

[Buttercup84]

Growing up , it was my older sister who got the compliments about her looks and talents . I was just the weird kid with side burns , bushy eyebrows who dressed like a dude and was obsessed with Sailor Moon . People thought I was funny and that is about it .

 

My sister had a great body , did well at school , had a lot of friends , boys liked her and she could single and draw . Boys never paid attention to me until I was maybe 24 .

 

My parents said I was always attractive but back in the day no one called me pretty or smart so I still see myself as that dork .

 

I work with kids and while I do compliment them on their looks like " you look so pretty in that dress " I make sure they get educated and I compliment them when they do something great .

 

But as someone said , you don't want them to think they are better than anyone else either . Make sure they are nice to people and use their skills to help others and not bring them down

[Eve]

Growing up , it was my older sister who got the compliments about her looks and talents . I was just the weird kid with side burns , bushy eyebrows who dressed like a dude and was obsessed with Sailor Moon . People thought I was funny and that is about it .

 

My sister had a great body , did well at school , had a lot of friends , boys liked her and she could single and draw . Boys never paid attention to me until I was maybe 24 .

 

My parents said I was always attractive but back in the day no one called me pretty or smart so I still see myself as that dork .

 

I work with kids and while I do compliment them on their looks like " you look so pretty in that dress " I make sure they get educated and I compliment them when they do something great .

 

But as someone said , you don't want them to think they are better than anyone else either . Make sure they are nice to people and use their skills to help others and not bring them down

 

This made me howl!

 

I was a weird kid too, very weird indeed, still am a bit weird really even though I changed in terms of my looks. Which I didn't really expect to happen.

 

My people picker (Carhill signature saying ) is aligned to people who are different, though I can admire those who are classically beautiful. I guess this is why I am not struck with the term 'average'. I like people who are so still with themselves that they can't be graded or labelled.

 

I would put good money on you being a really good worker with the kids.

 

Take care,

Eve x

Edited January 5, 2012 by Eve

[Kamille]

I feel like you're interpreting average to mean all the same. An average is a superficial number meant to find regularity within multiple possibilities. So, an average is always, to some extent, a superficial gathering of data.

 

Why am I saying this? Because I'm average and yet I'm unique. I have strengths and weaknesses, I have things I like about my body and things I don't. I have beautiful eyes and great curves (though not as amazing as yours... still jealous!) I have a particular outlook on life that friends and a few guys here and there find attractive. Being average doesn't meant there isn't anything unique about you.

 

There's a difference between the glorification of "everyone a snowflake" and recognizing that everyone has strengths.

 

It also seems paradoxical that while you're arguing for the value of "average", you're applying to mean that it explains your difficulties in dating. Average people, by definition, would have average luck in dating... Please consider the possibility that your looks might not be the reason dating is causing you so much sorrow.

[oldguy]

It makes me wonder.... is there something bad about being average? Why are we ALL "smart, beautiful and successful!" Are we actually perhaps over-selling ourselves? I've noticed this in other places as well... that if you think you're anything LESS than "smart and attractive" people label you as having self image problems or low self esteem.

There is nothing wrong with being average but you wouldn’t try to inspire self esteem by saying to someone; “you are so average, I’m so proud of you”, LOL

 

So, if you describe yourself as average, does that actually mean you think poorly of yourself?? What if you actually are just average? What do you say about yourself, or how do you compliment your daughter, when in fact she's not that smart? (Not saying she's dumb, just.... of average intelligence?)

I think it’s more than just alright to not only tell your daughter she’s pretty & smart because the act of doing so will make her feel better about herself & build self esteem. It reminds her also that in her mothers & fathers eyes she is pretty & smart and that alone is so important. It also teaches her positive reinforcement. And when it comes right down to it, kids learn what they see & feel, (good & bad), not so much what they are told, so I think it’s important for the parent too, to tell their children and spouses that they are loved, that they are worth something, they are smart, ect. I don’t open the door for my wife because she is incapable, & don’t even do it because I’m such a nice guy, I do it to remind myself of the person I want to be, a nice, considerate husband. My children are awesome & they know I think so.

I wasn’t one of those parents who never told his children he was disappointed in what they did or failed to do but I never told them I was disappointed with them.

I also don’t believe a child should be rewarded with the same enthusiasm for participating as they do for winning. Otherwise they would never learn that putting in the extra effort to win has a payoff.

 

Why is average such a dirty word when it comes to describing yourself; over 85% of all drivers believe they are better than average & “We will never be more than we believe we are”. I think this is a terrific thread & appreciate you posting it. Now doesn’t that make you feel better than if I had said; this is just another average post? Even if it didn’t it made me feel better

Tell your kids you love them & their great because you believe it & if you show it, they might believe it. And don’t settle for an SO who doesn’t believe your terrific either.

[Els]

I feel like you're interpreting average to mean all the same. An average is a superficial number meant to find regularity within multiple possibilities. So, an average is always, to some extent, a superficial gathering of data.

 

Why am I saying this? Because I'm average and yet I'm unique. I have strengths and weaknesses, I have things I like about my body and things I don't. I have beautiful eyes and great curves (though not as amazing as yours... still jealous!) I have a particular outlook on life that friends and a few guys here and there find attractive. Being average doesn't meant there isn't anything unique about you.

 

There's a difference between the glorification of "everyone a snowflake" and recognizing that everyone has strengths.

 

It also seems paradoxical that while you're arguing for the value of "average", you're applying to mean that it explains your difficulties in dating. Average people, by definition, would have average luck in dating... Please consider the possibility that your looks might not be the reason dating is causing you so much sorrow.

 

Great post, K. I completely echo the bolded.

[Mme. Chaucer]

Really. "Average" is basically a mathematical way of looking at things.

 

The "special snowflake" idea - well, it really is true. All the people who fall in the "average" range of any scale, whether it is height, IQ, looks, whatever - really ARE absolutely unique. Every last person. Being "average" and still being unique is not only possible, it's inevitable.

 

There are certainly "good" parts about the uniqueness in each one of us. Parents are charged with helping a child develop these and to feel good about them. And then, that becomes the responsibility of the individual themselves.

[Eve]

Still not feeling the average thing. I am average only in height. I would not want to be called below or above average either.

 

Take care,

Eve x

[oldguy]

I was once told that if I wore a red bow tie, (fully clothed, perverts:laugh:) I could rob banks because I'm so average that's all anyone would remember. Beyond an average appearance I'm pretty terrific however. Just ask me:laugh:

[eerie_reverie]

In the grand scheme of life, comparisons are stupid. There will always be someone better than u, and someone worse. What's important is figuring out what your values are and living your life accordingly. Life is so short, it is pointless to spend time figuring out how you measure up. If u try your best, you've done everything u can.

 

I think parents should praise effort and kindness.

Edited January 6, 2012 by eerie_reverie

[johan]

And beauty.

[eerie_reverie]

And beauty.

 

And thinness and c-cup tits.

[josie54]

"Average" is a pretty meaningless term, when you're using it without context. We are all "below average," "average," and "above average" in different areas of our lives.

 

I am a way below average bowler (i.e., I suck at it.) I am average at math and science (I can add, substract, and multiply in my head, did well in geometry, but I got straight "C's" in calculus--didn't understand a word of it). I am above average when it comes to creativity, and I consider myself a more-than-above-average writer (and that's why I write for a living).

 

I do not have average looks because, as I've said in other posts, I'm pretty different looking! I really don't look like anyone else (I'm biracial, which can add up to some wacky features sometimes.) So, I would say I have "unique" looks. But if you were measuring according to some universally agreed-upon measure of beauty, then I'm below-average to average in that area.

 

I guess what I'm trying to say is that no parent has an average child, unless you have broadened the definition of "average" so wide that it becomes meaningless. Every child is unique and above average in his or her own ways. I don't have children, but I would guess that great parents celebrate the areas where children show the most promise and interest, while still encouraging their children in other areas that they might want to explore, but may not have as much of an inherent advantage. When it comes to appearance, the same thing applies--every child is beautiful in his or her way, and great parents would celebrate that as well.