I went dutch at the end. If you were her would you date me again?

[Untouchable_Fire]

thanks for the clarification...

By the way.. you are right.. I am from a different generation.. which is why in some of my earlier posts I made sure I said " younger" in front of some of my sentences..

I am also a blended traditional..

My wife is a SAH Mom raising the child during the day.. but when I'm home I'm all about the chores and child raising too.. unless I'm posting on LS:laugh:

While I would love for her to work and she would love to work a outside job too it is better for the little guy if she doesn't.

We have just chosen to put his interests above ours right now.

 

I'm 32 and damn close to starting each sentence with... "Back in MY day".

 

I grew up mixed traditional as well. I believe what you are doing is very much the best for the children, but most people either can't or are not willing to make the sacrifices needed to live that way.

 

I also get a really bad feeling from most stay at home mothers. I spent a year or so working from home, and I would go to the gym at odd hours during the day. The SAHM's constantly seemed on the prowl. I got to know the personal trainers fairly well... and several of them were involved in affairs.

 

The problem is that most guys respond to the pressure of being a sole provider by working tons of hours... plus they often feel in control of the marriage too much. The SAHM's respond by going a bit crazy after a while.

 

It's going to be up to Mango what kind of woman he wants to end up with... but if this girl rejects him because he didn't carry cash or plan enough ahead... he is better off without her.

[Imajerk17]

I agree more with Untouchable Fire.

 

It's not so much about the money, it's about being the sucker who spends money on a girl, only to see her blow him off. Extra suckiness if she blows him off and goes to "hang out with" (read: hook up with) some other guy who doesn't do anything for her.

 

No guy wants to be that sucker. When that happens, he feels in some way that he got used, even if $30 (her half of the date) and 90 minutes of his time isn't that much. He just feels less attractive, less masculine. It's hard to explain. A little of how a girl feels when she makes the first move and it isn't reciprocated ["This is why I don't make the first move"]. Or when she hooks up with a guy who never calls her. ["What's the big deal! You're no worse off than before! In fact, you still got to have some sweaty fun with a cute guy!"]

 

There might be a little bit of flashing back to junior high to when some of us might have put in all this effort to make a girl a really nice valentine, only to see her take it and share the candy with the boy she really likes. Ouch.

 

That said, I have no problem spending money on a girl when I feel she is invested too. It doesn't have to necessarily be sexual, but that does help. She's driving a couple of hours herself to meet me? Cool, she gets dinner for that.

Edited January 9, 2012 by Imajerk17

[kaylan]

I actually found that in a Canadian research article. They polled age boys, and something like 75% said they happily paid for dates. 12% of those admitted to expecting sex BECAUSE they paid... and felt force or aggressive coercion were acceptable means of getting sex... BECAUSE they paid. Those were just the guys willing to admit to it... chances are the number is actually higher. Also this is Canadian guys... imagine how U.S. guys would fare in this poll.

 

Last I heard 25% of the female population gets raped at some point. Most of that is date rape. I don't think anybody is really telling these girls how guys think. They think if a guy pays it makes them feel special... but many guys look at this totally different.

 

I forget the exact number but it's also worth a mention that nearly all of the guys who wanted an equal split... also wanted a partnership style relationship, and had a much higher overall respect level for women.

 

So... I say this to women in general. "You get what you pay for"

So because of 12% of 75% percent of men think forceable sex is ok, we should change how things are in dating?

 

Yes we should change things up, but not because 9% of guys are crazy idiots who want to abuse women.

 

And about that rape statistic. 1 in 6 women will be raped or have someone try to rape them in their lifetime. Thats 15%. Know your facts.

[kaylan]

I am fine with going dutch or splitting activities. My first date with my bf, he bought us coffee and paid for the first activity. When we got to our 2nd activity, he went to pay and I said "Let me get this, you just paid" and I paid for it. I certainly didn't think any less of him for letting me pay for that.

 

I think it's disturbing when women expect to be paid for, or have a rule of he needs to pay until we are exclusive, then I will chip in SOMETIMES. How stupid. Or, he bought me 4 dinners. I will cook for him at home now. Bleeech.

 

I don't like the feeling of someone paying for me all the time. It doesn't make the guy a gentleman. Lots of *********s have a lot of money and don't mind paying. Paying all the time says NOTHING about a guys character. How many threads are started by women who will be all "I mean why did he spend $$ on me and then not call?"

 

A man paying doesn't make him a good guy, a gentleman, or anything. Tons of other things about him make him those things. I was happy to pay for half of my first date with my bf, to me it showed him that I was interested as well!

^This ad infinitum

[FitChick]

I think this is a generational issue. I date older men who tend to have more money than younger men simply because they've been working for a longer period of time. They sometimes get insulted if I offer to pay, as if it's a reflection on their earning power. I personally wouldn't date anyone more than one time if I weren't interested in him just to get a free dinner. I have better things to do with my time.

[monkey00]

I think a lot of times if a guy tries too hard to impress a girl by paying for dates the first time around especially expensive dates. It almost always fails. I had an old roommate who would go crazy when he would score a date with an Asian girl. He would buy her expensive $100 dinners and wine... After a few dates he'd wonder why she ignores him or flakes on him.

 

In dating experiences I've had better luck going Dutch on the first meetup. Usually going drinks or coffee and keeping it casual or playful. Versus trying too hard and paying for everything the first date. If I like a girl then for the second time I set up a real date and then pay the tab for us both.

 

I have to admit sometimes when I meet a pretty girl by rationality gets the best of me sometimes and I may wind up boring her or paying for everything by playing it safe.

 

I'm surprised no one mentioned that how a guy treats a girl early on sets the standard if they wind up in a relationship.... Such as showering her with gifts.. Etc which is a no no.

[D-Lish]

I think this is a generational issue. I date older men who tend to have more money than younger men simply because they've been working for a longer period of time. They sometimes get insulted if I offer to pay, as if it's a reflection on their earning power. I personally wouldn't date anyone more than one time if I weren't interested in him just to get a free dinner. I have better things to do with my time.

 

I'm like you, I would never continue to date someone just to get fed and have some attention lavished upon me.

 

I've had men get offended for suggesting I pay half as well.

 

The worst offender I have ever met (going back to being cheap) is dealing with a guy my best friend was seeing. We would double date (with my exH) and he would pull out his phone when the bill came and calculate how much he owed, how much my friend owed, then direct us as to our portion owed. Then he would proceed to collect my gf's portion.... The worst thing about it was that he never added in taxes or tip on their balance leaving that up to myself and my H to kick in. After my exH scored a really good job, we'd meet for dinner, and when the bill came, the two of them would ignore the bill. They expected my exH to pick up the tab because he was making much more money than them.

 

I've also been on a POF date where my date drank and ate himself silly, then claimed to have forgotten his wallet.

[kaylan]

I think this is a generational issue. I date older men who tend to have more money than younger men simply because they've been working for a longer period of time. They sometimes get insulted if I offer to pay, as if it's a reflection on their earning power. I personally wouldn't date anyone more than one time if I weren't interested in him just to get a free dinner. I have better things to do with my time.

I think you have the generational thing mistaken.

 

Older guys have less of an issue with this whole deal not because they have more money, but because they grew up in a time with different social standards.

 

Younger guys I know, that is guys in their 20s, have an issue because times are different now. There are plenty of guys in their 20s with money who'd rather things be equal in a relationship right off the bat. The only folks who are rather broke in their 20s tend to be college kids. A lot of us have been there though.

[colliejoanie]

Definitely generational. But I have to say, I've been dating younger guys recently, and this issue just HAS NOT come up. It's never been uncomfortable when it comes time to pay. I guess I've been lucky with the kinds of venues we've chosen.

 

Most recently, with a 28 yr old guy I got to the bar earlier than he, and put my credit card down with every intention of us both running a tab on my card. When it came time to pay, the bartender just handed me my card and he was signing his cc slip. I was majorly confused, but apparently when I'd gone to the bathroom, the guy asked the bartender to switch cards.

 

Talk about a nice gesture!

 

Another time I picked up dinner for a first date and took it to his work. Again, paying for both of us was what I wanted and expected.......when I left after lunch, he'd put $40 in my purse.

 

I share this, because every situation is different.....but I absolutely did NOT go on these dates thinking I was entitled to dinner or drinks being bought for me........and I'm apparently of the OLDER generation

[xpaperxcutx]

Definitely generational. But I have to say, I've been dating younger guys recently, and this issue just HAS NOT come up. It's never been uncomfortable when it comes time to pay. I guess I've been lucky with the kinds of venues we've chosen.

 

Most recently, with a 28 yr old guy I got to the bar earlier than he, and put my credit card down with every intention of us both running a tab on my card. When it came time to pay, the bartender just handed me my card and he was signing his cc slip. I was majorly confused, but apparently when I'd gone to the bathroom, the guy asked the bartender to switch cards.

 

Talk about a nice gesture!

 

Another time I picked up dinner for a first date and took it to his work. Again, paying for both of us was what I wanted and expected.......when I left after lunch, he'd put $40 in my purse.

 

I share this, because every situation is different.....but I absolutely did NOT go on these dates thinking I was entitled to dinner or drinks being bought for me........and I'm apparently of the OLDER generation

 

Okay he sounds so sweet. Is he a keeper?

[kaylan]

Definitely generational. But I have to say, I've been dating younger guys recently, and this issue just HAS NOT come up. It's never been uncomfortable when it comes time to pay. I guess I've been lucky with the kinds of venues we've chosen.

 

Most recently, with a 28 yr old guy I got to the bar earlier than he, and put my credit card down with every intention of us both running a tab on my card. When it came time to pay, the bartender just handed me my card and he was signing his cc slip. I was majorly confused, but apparently when I'd gone to the bathroom, the guy asked the bartender to switch cards.

 

Talk about a nice gesture!

 

Another time I picked up dinner for a first date and took it to his work. Again, paying for both of us was what I wanted and expected.......when I left after lunch, he'd put $40 in my purse.

 

I share this, because every situation is different.....but I absolutely did NOT go on these dates thinking I was entitled to dinner or drinks being bought for me........and I'm apparently of the OLDER generation

 

Sounds like over compensation IMO...ive never needed to do those things to get kool points with a woman...they are smart to know itll impress older gals though.To each their own. As long as the chick would like to treat me as well

[Art_Critic]

Okay he sounds so sweet. Is he a keeper?

 

You calling dibs ?

[Els]

Oh, to each their own.

 

The idea that guys like Art are "holding everyone back," is nonsense, UF. Guys like Art have a particular idea of dating, as do guys like you. Art is generally open-handed -- he's paying for things above and beyond what most folks would expect and happy to do so, regardless of the outcome; he's happy with his way of doing things, and married, if I recall.

 

Saying you don't want him to be -- because you fear the comparison -- is silly. Even sillier because apparently you have a fiance you gave 8K to -- something many people wouldn't do.

 

I think a good rule is:

 

If you pay for anything, do it because you WANT to and feel good about it, regardless of what happens down the road with that person.

 

If you don't want to pay, don't pay.

 

The end.

 

If that eliminates some folks from your field, good. This is all a giant game of elimination anyway. There are plenty more folks out there.

 

Best post in this thread, I would think.

 

I can't speak for anyone else. However, one of the main reasons this particular topic strikes a chord with me is because I discovered that you don't NEED to follow the social convention of paying for women, doing all the planning, all the asking out, etc, for them to like you and to keep them interested.

 

Precisely. Glad you got the point I was trying to make. Nobody is twisting anyone's arm to pay or do anything else. Neither men nor women should feel that they have to do something they hate to get a partner. Men who don't want to pay should just not pay, period. I said the same thing in a thread where a girl said she hated clothes shopping and makeup, and posters kept trying to tell her that she HAD to do all that to get a man. Sure, breaking conventions would narrow your dating pool, but it's simply narrowing it to a more compatible group of people anyway. Why can't people just accept that?

 

 

I posted a thread here a few months ago documenting my experiences and, with few exceptions, I was insulted by most of the female posters on this board despite not saying a single thing that a reasonable person could consider offensive. All I did was say that I fail to understand or find justifiable any custom that requires me to pay for someone I barely know. I repeatedly stated that once you're in a committed relationship, things change. I received all the same accusations that you generalize upon the men who talk about this on a regular basis.

 

I'm sorry, but I completely disagree that 'they started it first' is a valid excuse. You don't NEED to lower yourself to their level just because they started it first.

 

The sense of entitlement is real, and just because I've chosen to talk about it on this board on occasion does not make it an obsession of mine. It doesn't mean I feel the need to be a victim. Nor do I think it makes women "golddiggers." I don't demand an even monetary split in all of my romantic relations with women. Implying that it's primarily about the money is a gross misrepresentation. It is about the principle of the matter, which is the sense of entitlement based on nothing other than outdated gender roles.

 

If you notice, many outdated gender roles and double standards still apply. Picking on only the ones that disadvantage one's own gender and ignoring or denying the others, as those men (and women) are wont to do, is not synonymous with preaching equality. True proponents of equality look at both sides; they truly want equality for all, not 'not being disadvantaged'.

 

Traditionally, women were prized for their beauty and men for being the courtier and provider. The 'outdated' gender role for women has persisted, except that now instead of corsets and crinolines, we have waxing, push-up bras and stiletto heels. Yet often the same men who becry their own 'outdated gender roles' still insist on the women fulfilling theirs. What's up with that?

 

I talk about it here because so many female posters rail against all sorts of double standards but fail to see a pretty major one because it just so happens to work to the benefit of their gender. This is something that is unfortunately still pervasive in Western society and in many circles is only getting worse. How many men do you know that would go up to a woman at a bar and demand her to buy him a drink? How many men do you know who would get uppity about a woman not paying for him? Probably not many, but both of these are common phenomena among women of all ages. Are these women spoiled, entitled brats? Sure. Are they probably that way in other areas of their life too? Sure. But in this particular scenario, the entitlement is undoubtedly gender-based, and unfortunately, few posters seem to be willing to discuss it for what it actually is.

 

I agree. But what I noticed, is that usually the very same men who often complain about this are incredibly entitled brats themselves. How many men do you know who turn up for a date with an old tee, old pants, and beer belly, and judge their date for having 10 extra pounds, no makeup, and small breasts? Quite a few. On the other hand, I don't know too many women who do that.

 

I agree with your list. I've found another fairly common characteristic - they are often found on my ignore list.

 

Hehe, time for me to expand mine.

Edited January 10, 2012 by Elswyth

[chryssy83]

To respond to the OP: I think that going dutch isn't necessarily horrible, but the way you did it wasn't very artful. I would have felt like you were saying "there I bought you some drinks, now take me to dinner so we are even." There is nothing I hate more than people who keep score in relationships.

 

I used to do the tug-of-war over the bill at the end of a dinner date or whatever when I was younger. About the same time period I used to intentionally order inexpensive things to be polite.

 

At some point as I got older, I realized that relationships either will be somewhat equal in the end, or they won't be. The first date doesn't tell you a lot about how that will turn out.

 

I almost never ask a guy out, and the guy always offers to pay. I decided to order as though I was spending my own money and get what I want. Then not fight for the bill if he went for it right away (here most waitstaff will put it in front of the guy anyway). And finally give him a SINCERE thank you after he pays, and usually before we part for the evening again. Sincerity signified by tone, facial expression, and word choice. Haven't had a date who didn't want to go out with me again since I started just letting them pay, so I guess it works. I think most guys like to feel like they are taking care of a girl and appreciate a sincere "thank you."

 

If I don't like you at all, I will fight to pay my half because I know we won't see each other again and I don't want it to be like "I took her to dinner and she never talked to me again." A guy who told me to pay for something wouldn't get a second date because I don't like a guy who tells me to do anything.

 

I usually make as much or more than the guys I date. I will usually offer to pay every other time we pay for something, or sometimes every third or fourth time if they refuse regularly enough. Most guys will say they have got it a lot of the time, then every so often let me pay if I offer. I don't take money after the fact if I pick up food for you, or drive your car and put gas in it, or grab you something you needed at the store. And it seems like we manage to work things out where we are both happy.

 

I don't expect a guy to pay my way in the world, but I do want someone who wants to treat me generously and allows me to be generous without either of us feeling badly about it. And I only date guys who are financially responsible, so usually we don't have any concern about doing things we can't afford.

 

Maybe that makes me a 1950s b-word. Hahaha...but the strategy has never failed me yet, and I'm far from a gold digger. I do think a guy takes a greater risk of offending the woman by going dutch or letting her pay for the first few dates than he does just ponying up for dinner. (P.S. I usually buy a new outfit every time we see each other for a while, so I'm investing in the date as well, and that costs more than dinner...just saying.)

Edited January 10, 2012 by chryssy83

[monkey00]

Well anyway I texted her today around noon saying I had a good time and she texted me back 10 hours later saying the same thing, making mini-chat. But anyway I'm not going to bother pushing it or asking her out this week since she said this week isn't good and next week would be better. I'm going to keep communication to a minimum. I'll have to see what happens next week.

 

Seems to me her IL is mediocre or low at best and she's still logging into her OLD profile. I understand being on the other side actually because I've done it to girls that contact me and I'm not really interested in.

[johan]

 

You are simply from a different generation.

 

Your generation seems to be the condescending one. If you really thought about this, you would realize this isn't generational at all. It's just your violently held personal opinion, and a flimsy attempt to enlist a vague "generation" of apparently like-minded, enlightened, whipper-snappers to back you up.

 

The fact is that there are plenty of guys your age and younger who gladly pay for their dates. And there are plenty of guys Art's age and older whose wallets make creaking noises when they open up. My step-dad made my mom pay for their first date. My uncle was always a cheap bastard.

 

Stop inflicting your opinions on your cohort, like there is some absolute truth you kids have discovered. Art isn't so much older than you that he qualifies as a seperate generation. He just has different values from yours. And in my opinion, superior values. If you want evidence of that compare the number of times the two of you have been called "dickhead" just in this one thread.

[Els]

Your generation seems to be the condescending one. If you really thought about this, you would realize this isn't generational at all. It's just your violently held personal opinion, and a flimsy attempt to enlist a vague "generation" of apparently like-minded, enlightened, whipper-snappers to back you up.

 

The fact is that there are plenty of guys your age and younger who gladly pay for their dates. And there are plenty of guys Art's age and older whose wallets make creaking noises when they open up. My step-dad made my mom pay for their first date. My uncle was always a cheap bastard.

 

Stop inflicting your opinions on your cohort, like there is some absolute truth you kids have discovered. Art isn't so much older than you that he qualifies as a seperate generation. He just has different values from yours. And in my opinion, superior values. If you want evidence of that compare the number of times the two of you have been called "dickhead" just in this one thread.

 

Precisely. Some of the guys on here wish to not be judged and called names for not paying, and that is a perfectly reasonable request, as I don't feel anyone deserves to be called names for a dating preference. But then they feel they're perfectly justified in doing the same thing they abhor towards others who don't share their opinions. Gender freedom and equality isn't about calling other men who pay for dates desperate, stupid, unable to find a girl, or setting others back. Gender freedom is about accepting that those men have every bit as much right to their own preferences as one does!

[zengirl]

So because of 12% of 75% percent of men think forceable sex is ok, we should change how things are in dating?

 

Yes we should change things up, but not because 9% of guys are crazy idiots who want to abuse women.

 

And about that rape statistic. 1 in 6 women will be raped or have someone try to rape them in their lifetime. Thats 15%. Know your facts.

 

Yes, and also the whole idea of saying the men are date rapists because they feel justified since they paid for dinner is nonsense. Guys who are going to be date rapists are going to FIND justifications. If the girl didn't let them pay for dinner, it'd be because of what she wore, or something she said, or whatever. There is no, "Oh, poor misunderstood date rapist, he just didn't know any better," and linking it to who pays for dinner is completely insulting to rape victims. You cannot correlate rape to the cost of dinner; that's insane.

 

I think this is a generational issue. I date older men who tend to have more money than younger men simply because theyI've been working for a longer period of time. They sometimes get insulted if I offer to pay, as if it's a reflection on their earning power. I personally wouldn't date anyone more than one time if I weren't interested in him just to get a free dinner. I have better things to do with my time.

 

I don't think it's really that big a generational issue---being insulted by the woman paying might be, yes. I suppose it could be a regional or a socio-economic issue, but I've never been out with a guy who didn't insist on paying for the first few dates. My hubby (who is almost 30) let me grab the second round of drinks, after paying for dinner and the first round, on our first date, and he'd let me get stuff like that when I offered (or just set down the money before he could), but he had the full expectation of paying for everything on our early dates. Granted, he (like many men) liked it when I offered or chipped in here or there, but he wouldn't have liked it (his own words) if I'd stopped him from treating me entirely.

 

To him, that was part of the fun of dating. Who is some other guy to tell him or Art or anyone who wants to treat someone that they're "wrong" in enjoying doing so? And who is anyone to tell someone they have to? As I said above, let's just all do what we do. If you find your mindset is scaring people away, and that bothers you, maybe look at it then. I do think a mindset that is too over the top in either direction (meaning either looking to buy love or being overly miserly) is problematic, but mostly, people do just fine.

 

I've never actually met anyone, male or female, who had this issue the way people on LS do. Then again, my circle is educated and fairly well off. And I've never lived in a city like NYC or San Fran where cost of living kills you. So, could be socio-economic, as I said.

[Queen Zenobia]

Yes, and also the whole idea of saying the men are date rapists because they feel justified since they paid for dinner is nonsense. Guys who are going to be date rapists are going to FIND justifications. If the girl didn't let them pay for dinner, it'd be because of what she wore, or something she said, or whatever. There is no, "Oh, poor misunderstood date rapist, he just didn't know any better," and linking it to who pays for dinner is completely insulting to rape victims. You cannot correlate rape to the cost of dinner; that's insane.

 

That's not really what UF was saying though, if you read his original statement about the issue. He basically said if he were a woman he'd be a bit skeptical about a man who insisted on paying as some would feel that it obligates the woman to sleep with them. Or perhaps, it might obligate a second date (or third and so and so forth). A poster on here said he didn't mind paying because "it's just goods he paid for", I think that's the mindset UF was criticizing. And in some respects he has a very good point.

 

No one is saying that paying for dinner equals rape, I don't know how anyone would get that out of the postings on here unless they lacked sufficient reading comprehension skills or they were being deliberately disingenuous with their interpretation.

[musemaj11]

Men pay to impress. All men know women like to get paid for and they dont want to lose their chance by not paying and this is also the reason why I always paid despite hating it. It made me sad that a woman couldnt love me without me paying her.

 

Men insist to pay for the same reason that women give up sex early. They are afraid that if they say 'no', they will lose their chance.

[Emilia]

It made me sad that a woman couldnt love me without me paying her.

 

Maybe you should try it one day.

[fortyninethousand322]

Men pay to impress. All men know women like to get paid for and they dont want to lose their chance by not paying and this is also the reason why I always paid despite hating it. It made me sad that a woman couldnt love me without me paying her.

 

Men insist to pay for the same reason that women give up sex early. They are afraid that if they say 'no', they will lose their chance.

 

Yeah well, women are much more mercenary than they give themselves credit for. I'd be really surprised if any women actually truly believed in unconditional love.

[Untouchable_Fire]

Your generation seems to be the condescending one. If you really thought about this, you would realize this isn't generational at all. It's just your violently held personal opinion, and a flimsy attempt to enlist a vague "generation" of apparently like-minded, enlightened, whipper-snappers to back you up.

The fact is that there are plenty of guys your age and younger who gladly pay for their dates. And there are plenty of guys Art's age and older whose wallets make creaking noises when they open up. My step-dad made my mom pay for their first date. My uncle was always a cheap bastard.

Stop inflicting your opinions on your cohort, like there is some absolute truth you kids have discovered. Art isn't so much older than you that he qualifies as a seperate generation. He just has different values from yours. And in my opinion, superior values. If you want evidence of that compare the number of times the two of you have been called "dickhead" just in this one thread.

 

Johan... Things have changed in the last 30 years.... it's a fact. Just look over at your cell phone.

 

Guys my age who "gladly" pay do so for tons of reasons... many not honorable at all. I've got nothing against Art. He is overly sarcastic and insulting in many cases... but so am I. However, his views DO represent aged traditions. This thread isn't really about who should pay. It's about whether it's acceptable for this woman to reject Monkey00 because he didn't bring cash. To my opinion, that's a bitch move and totally unacceptable.

 

BTW... It doesn't really bother me that someone calls me a dickhead, a jerk, or whatever. Sometimes I am. I'm not going to kiss butt to make people like me... or even agree with me.

 

Precisely. Some of the guys on here wish to not be judged and called names for not paying, and that is a perfectly reasonable request, as I don't feel anyone deserves to be called names for a dating preference. But then they feel they're perfectly justified in doing the same thing they abhor towards others who don't share their opinions. Gender freedom and equality isn't about calling other men who pay for dates desperate, stupid, unable to find a girl, or setting others back. Gender freedom is about accepting that those men have every bit as much right to their own preferences as one does!

 

This might be news to you... but dating is in essence a competition. If you are paying somebody to spend time with you... chances are that means you are compensating. THAT is what I said.

 

Do you think that is insulting?

[musemaj11]

Maybe you should try it one day.

I tried twice in my life. Didnt end well and the embarrassment was unbearable.

[kaylan]

Men pay to impress. All men know women like to get paid for and they dont want to lose their chance by not paying and this is also the reason why I always paid despite hating it. It made me sad that a woman couldnt love me without me paying her.

 

Men insist to pay for the same reason that women give up sex early. They are afraid that if they say 'no', they will lose their chance.

Im starting to think Im the only guy here who happens to meet women who dont care about this crap.

 

Maybe I just have good luck?

 

Or maybe my pickiness sorts the entitled chicks out...whatevs.

 

Good luck gents =P