OLD: People who say that they only date someone with a degree

[Stung]

Most of us aren't going to be the next Steve Jobs.

 

What is wrong with a woman just wanting to get married, have kids, and take care of her family? That's all my mom really wanted. She didn't care about having a career. She wanted to have her own children and family since she was a little girl. My father DID take care of her. But she took care of him too. And was a great mother. She did work part time, at times, while we were growing up. But she also was often home when we got off the bus, coached alot of our sport teams, and did a lot of things for us growing up. I see nothing wrong with a woman's goal in life being happily married, wanting kids and wanting her man to take care of her while she also takes care of her man and family.

 

For the record, I also see nothing wrong with this. Of course, I was a SAHM for 2 years and am only working-part time right now, so probably some people snidely refer to my "wife" degree behind my back, as well. I wouldn't be happy being full-time stay-at-home forever, personally, but I think it's awesome that I have both of those choices available to me.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

For the record, I also see nothing wrong with this. Of course, I was a SAHM for 2 years and am only working-part time right now, so probably some people snidely refer to my "wife" degree behind my back, as well. I wouldn't be happy being full-time stay-at-home forever, personally, but I think it's awesome that I have both of those choices available to me.

 

I think that's awesome. Because at the end of the day, what do you care about most? You're family. You can work and get out of the house AND be there more for your family. I am sick of women who want to and are financially able to stay home with their children and take care of their families being shamed for it. Some women want this. Some men want this. It's not for everyone but not everyone feels fulfilled from life for working in an office setting or whatever. For some people, a job is just a job. Some people feel fulfilled through their families. Not everyone is going to be fullfilled from the same thing. And my mother worked just as hard as many people who go to a job everyday. Probably even harder then some that where just filling a seat in a corporation. Both my brother and I have an excellent relationship with her. She was always there for us and both of us will always be there for her. When my dad retired, she retired too, even though she is younger then him. But that's what they BOTH wanted. People use to ask her snidely "what do you do all day?" And she would want to tell them "Watch Oprah and eat chocolates." Those comments hurt her feelings because she works hard and is dedicated to our family. She always took care of our family home and my father as he got sick.

 

By the way, some people have great jobs and work 5 days a week and spend a good portion of their day online, on Facebook, on their iphone or posting on message boards. Just because you have a regular job doesn't mean you're a hard worker.

Edited January 31, 2012 by Disenchantedly Yours

[Emilia]

 

By the way, some people have great jobs and work 5 days a week and spend a good portion of their day online, on Facebook, on their iphone or posting on message boards. Just because you have a regular job doesn't mean you're a hard worker.

 

Oh yeah, I'm the case in point. I'm only here in office hours

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Don't worry Emilia, you are in good company.

 

I wanted to add, and LS won't let me edit my other post. That when people would ask my mom what she "did all day", they were basically asking her to justfying her life to them. Whether they realized it or not. A couple life lessons recently taught me, where I once would have cared what people thought greatly (and still do too much which I am trying to work on), that I don't have to justify myself to anyone. On anything.

[kaylan]

I majored in Computer Science myself, but I had so many available elective credit hours I took English as a minor. That made me SO much more well-rounded and improved my ability to write, communicate, and think broadly about a wider variety of subjects than I ever could before I went through it.

Definitely agree with this. English courses made me a far better writer than I originally was.

[gaius]

B) Sometimes people enjoy seperating themselves into classification groups so they can label themselves or others according to a standard or whatever they place an importance on. So that they can feel better then other people. There is a distinction between just having preferences and actually holding the mentality that certain successes or attributes make you a "better" person in terms of being "better" then other people.

Pretty much this. I know in America we have a bit of a caste system starting up and there are many who would feel embarrassed bringing a partner around their friends who didn't have a degree of some sort. They would receive disrespect and scorn for it. Even if it's a useless one that leaves you owing 150k in student debt and can't get you work.

 

Turns out he's a high-level executive and engineer. He makes his own robots for fun, he makes his own wine. He wrote some books that were used in colleges to teach in his field. He doesn't have any degrees--in fact he dropped out of high school.

 

Anyway, he's successful and smart and interesting. Obviously he's thrived despite having no degree. However both of us want our kids to go to college. So perhaps that says something.

Can you even get an engineering job without a degree anymore? Opportunity for success was much more open in the past, I remember reading about enlisted guys coming back from WW2 and getting jobs as stock brokers and other stuff that requires a lot of formal, expensive training nowadays. You seem to have snagged a guy who made it without the degree but a lot of girls my sisters age are picking up on the fact it's the main ingredient for success and disqualifying those who don't have one. Not that they wouldn't take a guy like yours, but those kind are becoming more rare every year.

[Oxy Moronovich]

Degrees are always secondary to the primary desirable character/personality traits you look for in people--intelligence, creativity, drive, and confidence easily trump it. MANY people I admire dropped out of college or never went. Within the context of the thread topic of online dating, a well-written profile easily outshines a degree--yet they're quite rare from women who lack one. I can't remember seeing one yet, but I have no doubt they exist in significant numbers.

I agree. Wasn't there a thread topics about hot chicks on dating sites with bad grammar?

And he was a HORRIBLE relationship partner. Not the least bit emotionally aware.

What the hell is "emotionally aware"? Serious question.

[sweetjasmine]

That's fair enough. I do think however that a lot of people filter out others not from an intellectual perspective but more from a socio-economic background one.

 

If it is a question of socio-economic background, is that a bad thing?

 

As an example, one of my old college friends comes from a very wealthy family. They have multiple homes across the country, including one in Martha's Vineyard. For graduation, his family was kind enough to have a few of us over for a few days to stay at the little house attached to their big fancy house right on one of the lakes.

 

Honestly, although his family was very kind and welcoming, I felt kind of uncomfortable being around them. They might as well have been from a different planet. I would've felt more comfortable with a middle class family like my own, an upper middle class family, or a lower middle class family. I can't recall feeling uncomfortable with other friends' families, but these people's lives were so incredibly different from what I was used to that it was a little off-putting.

 

So if I were to feel uncomfortable dating an extremely wealthy man, would that be wrong or offensive?

 

Anyway, he's successful and smart and interesting. Obviously he's thrived despite having no degree. However both of us want our kids to go to college. So perhaps that says something.

 

This is a guess, but I think it says that you're both aware that things are different now and that it's becoming increasingly more important to have a degree to get your foot in the door. In the past, employers may have overlooked the absence of a degree because the applicant was impressive in other ways. These days, they automatically filter for some criteria, and any person that doesn't fit has their resume thrown in the trash, even if they would've made a better fit for the position than someone with a degree. Nobody ever figures that out because the resume ended up in the garbage.

 

As an example, a friend of mine has a brother who had no interest in college. Before the crash, he was able to find a good position at a firm in the aircraft industry. He does a great job and is valued, but he's been complaining about this new kid they hired fresh out of school with a BS in engineering. He taught the new kid a few things about the machines, the designs, etc., and they worked together on something that ended up going very well. Who got the credit for it? The new kid, and it wasn't the kid himself who said, "I did it." It was management who assumed he must've contributed more to the project. Who's likely to be promoted? The new kid. It's horribly unfair, but that seems to be the way things are going these days.

[EnigmaticClarity]

I know in America we have a bit of a caste system starting up

 

Historically, the opposite is true from what I've been able to gather. The caste system in America is winding down, not starting up. I don't know of any time in the history of Western civilization where your family name, your personal wealth, and your past accomplishments have mattered less than your current abilities matter to people today. I'm certainly not saying your station is meaningless--just less valued than it has been in the past. In Europe and America, caste has historically been far more respected and valued than it is today.

 

Anyone else know of a past time when caste mattered less than now?

[Stung]

I wanted to add, and LS won't let me edit my other post. That when people would ask my mom what she "did all day", they were basically asking her to justfying her life to them. Whether they realized it or not. A couple life lessons recently taught me, where I once would have cared what people thought greatly (and still do too much which I am trying to work on), that I don't have to justify myself to anyone. On anything.

 

Yeah, people have asked me that too. Particularly when my son was a colicky infant who had to be rocked for hours and nursed every hour and a half and was up half the night while I walked him back and forth, I thought very hard about punching those people in the face. I still consider it a triumph of nurture over nature that I restrained myself. Seriously, what a rude, condescending, clueless thing to say to somebody.

 

Over the years I have worked full time while taking care of kids at night, been at home full time with kids, and worked part-time while doing the kid thing the rest of the time. There were advantages and disadvantages for all of us with each situation. For me, what seems to work best right now is working part-time. Other individuals and families have different needs/wants.

 

However, I feel like we're veering off-topic.

[EnigmaticClarity]

Yeah, people have asked me that too. Particularly when my son was a colicky infant who had to be rocked for hours and nursed every hour and a half and was up half the night while I walked him back and forth, I thought very hard about punching those people in the face. I still consider it a triumph of nurture over nature that I restrained myself. Seriously, what a rude, condescending, clueless thing to say to somebody.

 

Count me amongst the clueless--not because I think homemakers do nothing or their efforts in life are worth less than my own, but every time I've asked and tried to get a feel for what the life would be like if I were to do it myself, I get the kind of hostility you're currently relaying. So yea, I'm clueless, because I've never done it and people get offended when you ask them what they do.

 

I'm particularly curious because if I had a child with a woman who made more money than myself, I'd consider being a homemaker myself. I wish homemakers weren't so touchy about what they do so I knew more the lifestyle.

[Stung]

Pretty much this. I know in America we have a bit of a caste system starting up and there are many who would feel embarrassed bringing a partner around their friends who didn't have a degree of some sort. They would receive disrespect and scorn for it. Even if it's a useless one that leaves you owing 150k in student debt and can't get you work.

 

 

Can you even get an engineering job without a degree anymore? Opportunity for success was much more open in the past, I remember reading about enlisted guys coming back from WW2 and getting jobs as stock brokers and other stuff that requires a lot of formal, expensive training nowadays. You seem to have snagged a guy who made it without the degree but a lot of girls my sisters age are picking up on the fact it's the main ingredient for success and disqualifying those who don't have one. Not that they wouldn't take a guy like yours, but those kind are becoming more rare every year.

 

Huh. Unless it was somebody really intensely following a dream, I would be embarrassed for somebody who so badly mismanaged themselves that they put themselves 150K in debt for a useless degree that still leaves that unemployable. IMO that shows poor judgment and life skills.

 

I do know somebody like that and he now regrets his decision intensely. He just had to have that shiny private university credential because he thought it would be cool, and now he has to live with his parents while he tries to pay off his student loans at a low-tier job that's completely unrelated to his degree, which he's not even good at and doesn't care about. He wasn't really passionate about his field of study, either, just chose it to choose something and get those letters.

 

On the other hand I have a friend who has a PhD in a creative field and works at Starbucks, and I think she absolutely made the right choices for herself as it was in her blood, it was her dream, and she still works very intensely at it in her off hours. She's extremely talented and she's very well-trained and knowledgeable, which aids her craftsmanship. So it's all relative to motivation, I suppose.

 

Anyway, my husband is definitely not a WW2 relic but yes, it is difficult to get his kind of work without a degree, unless you're demonstrably brilliant at it.

[Stung]

Count me amongst the clueless--not because I think homemakers do nothing or their efforts in life are worth less than my own, but every time I've asked and tried to get a feel for what the life would be like if I were to do it myself, I get the kind of hostility you're currently relaying. So yea, I'm clueless, because I've never done it and people get offended when you ask them what they do.

 

I'm particularly curious because if I had a child with a woman who made more money than myself, I'd consider being a homemaker myself. I wish homemakers weren't so touchy about what they do so I knew more the lifestyle.

 

I'd only get touchy if somebody asked me in a condescending manner (which is what most people do). Genuine curiosity is never anything offensive, IMO. If you'd really like a run-down, feel free to PM me. BTW, my brother-in-law is a homemaker with two young girls and he's awesome with them.

[jobaba]

Can you even get an engineering job without a degree anymore? Opportunity for success was much more open in the past, I remember reading about enlisted guys coming back from WW2 and getting jobs as stock brokers and other stuff that requires a lot of formal, expensive training nowadays. You seem to have snagged a guy who made it without the degree but a lot of girls my sisters age are picking up on the fact it's the main ingredient for success and disqualifying those who don't have one. Not that they wouldn't take a guy like yours, but those kind are becoming more rare every year.

 

It's difficult sometimes to get an engineering job if YOU HAVE an engineering degree. Many engineers go on to other fields, particularly finance. And there are so many people with an engineering degree.

 

Without an engineering degree, the opportunities to do engineering in a design sense these days are limited I'd say.

[jerbear]

Exactly. There are plenty of 'wife' degrees such as English or History.

 

I think it's a class specification by the person that selected this restriction on their profile more than education related.

 

More like the MS degree.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Yeah, people have asked me that too. Particularly when my son was a colicky infant who had to be rocked for hours and nursed every hour and a half and was up half the night while I walked him back and forth, I thought very hard about punching those people in the face. I still consider it a triumph of nurture over nature that I restrained myself. Seriously, what a rude, condescending, clueless thing to say to somebody.

 

Over the years I have worked full time while taking care of kids at night, been at home full time with kids, and worked part-time while doing the kid thing the rest of the time. There were advantages and disadvantages for all of us with each situation. For me, what seems to work best right now is working part-time. Other individuals and families have different needs/wants.

 

However, I feel like we're veering off-topic.

 

Absoluetly.

 

And yes, I guess we are. But I just needed to add one more thing on this. Like you said, what works for different families. I look at me and my brother. He is able to go, go go..he can operate on very few hours of sleep and still keep going. I however can't. I need to sleep to function. And I need a good amount of rest. We have both been like this since we were kids. Some people are just not physically capable of doing everything other people are. I can't operate like my brother does. That doesn't mean I am less of a person though.

 

Some women can do kids/work/keep in shape. But in most cases, something is going to have to give or suffer for it.

 

Sorry. I had to add that!

[phineas]

It's funny. If I was doing OLD I would not put such a "requirement" on there. I remember when I had a profile some didn't like that I did not put grave detail in "what I want in a mate".

 

I just felt I'd rather keep things open and just meet people. Just see if we click online and then in person. I'd rather just meet women and then weed out the bad ones.

 

A degree doesn't mean anything. She could have a liberal arts degree and yet be serving hot wings at Hooters for a living while jumping from douchebag to douchebag. She could have her only real "goal" in life is to get married, crank out a few kids, and let a man take care of her.

 

She could also be a high school graduate who ended up starting her own business and is doing well...or she could have networked her way into a sales position and is savvy enough to pull big money.

 

I say one should judge a person by how they live their life...not on if they have a degree.

 

Yeah, what he said.

It seems EVERY woman my age on match either owns her own company or has multiple degree's.

I'm a cave-man. LOL!

 

but even though i only got a 2yr in electronics I know guys in my area with 4yr degree's unemployed or actually making less than me.

 

The way I see it, at my age I think as long as i'm not half-retarded or smell bad women will take a guy who isn't fat.

[RecordProducer]

Being myself is stupid. I hate it with a passion!

At least you're passionate about something!

 

Another thing it tends to show is that a person is more disciplined and able to achieve major life goals that take a significant amount of time to accomplish.

The fact is everyone would like to have a degree, and those who don't have one don't have it because of some undesirable reason (e.g. lack of ambition, lazyness, low IQ, not intellectually curious, etc.) And if I person had no money (and couldn't get a loan) to get a degree, so they started working and became very successful - obviously, at that point they wouldn't have the time and motivation to go to college, but they could still educate themselves. The thing is I can tell a person'sdegree when I just read their online dating profile or outside the OLD - as soon as they open their mouth. Heck, I can even tell by looking at them for a second most of the time.

 

What is wrong with a woman just wanting to get married, have kids, and take care of her family? That's all my mom really wanted. She didn't care about having a career. She wanted to have her own children and family since she was a little girl. My father DID take care of her. But she took care of him too. And was a great mother. She did work part time, at times, while we were growing up. But she also was often home when we got off the bus, coached alot of our sport teams, and did a lot of things for us growing up. I see nothing wrong with a woman's goal in life being happily married, wanting kids and wanting her man to take care of her while she also takes care of her man and family.

Nothing wrong, I agree with you, but times have changed. Women used to take care of the house and raise the kids whilemen were providers. That put women in a bad position as they could not survive on their own. They also couldn't meet too many new people; their social circle was limited to their neighbors, church and children's school mates' mothers. Women decided to work so they could have exciting careers, money, independence, their own friends, and professional circles and goals. This took them away from the traditional homemaking/children-rearing role. They strated getting a divorce, demanding, cheating. Then men responded by changing their expectations: women who expect from men to be the providers are today considered golddiggers and SAHMs are "sitting on their asses, doing nothing and spending my money."

 

Gotta pay the price of independence.

[gaius]

Historically, the opposite is true from what I've been able to gather. The caste system in America is winding down, not starting up. I don't know of any time in the history of Western civilization where your family name, your personal wealth, and your past accomplishments have mattered less than your current abilities matter to people today. I'm certainly not saying your station is meaningless--just less valued than it has been in the past. In Europe and America, caste has historically been far more respected and valued than it is today.

 

Anyone else know of a past time when caste mattered less than now?

Oh the caste system is still around, it might be more racially balanced then it was before but don't let that fool you into thinking it went away.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/31/opinion/brooks-the-great-divorce.html

 

Huh. Unless it was somebody really intensely following a dream, I would be embarrassed for somebody who so badly mismanaged themselves that they put themselves 150K in debt for a useless degree that still leaves that unemployable. IMO that shows poor judgment and life skills.

 

I do know somebody like that and he now regrets his decision intensely. He just had to have that shiny private university credential because he thought it would be cool, and now he has to live with his parents while he tries to pay off his student loans at a low-tier job that's completely unrelated to his degree, which he's not even good at and doesn't care about. He wasn't really passionate about his field of study, either, just chose it to choose something and get those letters.

 

On the other hand I have a friend who has a PhD in a creative field and works at Starbucks, and I think she absolutely made the right choices for herself as it was in her blood, it was her dream, and she still works very intensely at it in her off hours. She's extremely talented and she's very well-trained and knowledgeable, which aids her craftsmanship. So it's all relative to motivation, I suppose.

 

Anyway, my husband is definitely not a WW2 relic but yes, it is difficult to get his kind of work without a degree, unless you're demonstrably brilliant at it.

I didn't mean to suggest he was a WW2 relic, I have no idea how old he is. But I assume he started his career at a time when it was easier to get work without a degree then it is now. I know a guy that owes near 150k and can't find work too, and he hasn't had any trouble dating other college educated women. They seem to prefer it over someone who probably makes more money then him but doesn't have the credentials.

[gibson]

Everyone has their own criteria for what they are looking for so if a degree is one of those, I see nothing wrong with it.

 

Even before I was a high income earner, I was always attracted to someone who is pursing their passions and doing what they love, not so much a title or the money. Nursing, Teaching, working with animals, artist, writer, non-profit, consultant, sales executive, lawyer, etc.

 

I didn't go to college for various reasons but I know that I read and invest in myself more (classes, training, seminars, etc.) than most of my friends who did go to college and I also earn more money than most of them as well.

 

I am pro education and I do believe it gives you a "leg up" entering into the work force but after that... It's all about hard work. Every job I have had (Engineer, project management, consulting, sales executive) has required one but I haven't been asked about where I went to school or my GPA since I was in my mid-twenties. If fact, nobody I know has. Late 20's and beyond, it's your experience and hard work that matters.

 

For me, I could care less what my partner does because I will be with someone who wants to raise our children in the traditional family home. My father worked and my mother was a stay home mother (although she was a nurse for many years before having children). Thankfully, there is no shortage of women that feel the same way I do.

 

I have dated women with Sociology, English Lit, Art History, Communications, History, American Studies, etc. and they are to be applauded for earning those degrees. However, I have found women that posses "street" smarts were more well rounded, far more interesting and made better partners.

 

To each their own...

Edited February 1, 2012 by gibson