relationship

[ky_girl]

I am 30 years old and have been married for 12 years. This is the problem (ugh, its long and complicated), My husband and I have had a hard time communicating for years. He is very quiet and doesn't discuss our everyday problems very well. He avoids discussion at all costs. Our major problem has been his job, he is a police officer, and is very seldom home. He works holidays, weekends, and nights, this poses a very lonely life for myself and my children. I have been very unhappy for years, and the fact that he would not acknowledge it, is even more frustrating. I have always felt that his job was more important than his family. I have told myself many time...."Girl, he is a good man, and a hard worker, you just have to live with the loneliness and the fact that he won't talk to you." About 5 years ago I asked him for a divorce, his reply was the usual stoic attitude. I asked him to attend counseling with me, he said...."If there is a problem in our marriage, it is your problem."

 

I have just given up. I feel like I have fallen out of love with him. No, I know I have.

 

I have found someone else that I confide in on a regular basis, a male, who gives me advice on my relationship, whom my husband thinks I have been unfaithful with. I haven't. But I do have deep feelings for this confidant, and wont lose him. I feel like he is my sole mate.

 

My husband has now decided that he "Loves me Oh So Much." And for me it is just too late, I hate hurting him like this, but I want out, and don't know what to do.

 

Do you have any advice for me?

 

I would really appreciate.

 

Confused in Kentucky

[Paulie]

Give your husband one last chance. Marraige means forever, and it's consistent with your vows...to go to counseling, and give him one last chance. If this had been just a dating relationship, I'd tell you to leave him, and not look back. Marraige, however, has further considerations, namely, vows.

If he f**ks this one up, you can live in peace, knowing you gave it your all.

 

This is just my opinion, however, and I'm sure there will be many who disagree with me, and I certainly welcome their opinions as well.

 

Best of Luck,

 

Paulie

[Tony T]

The only advice I have for leaving a police officer is be careful, he has a service revolver.

 

You are right...it was too little too late. And if your husband really is being more attentive these days, there is no way of knowing just how long it will last. And if you have to go to such extremes to get his love and attention, it's not worth it anyway.

 

You tolerated his neglect for many lonely years. You tried to talk to him, to tell him how you felt, and he seemed to think it was your problem.

 

Now, you've found someone else who meets your needs and you can leave this man...and it is now HIS problem.

 

Move forward as swiftly as humanly possible with your plans to get out of this sorry situation you have been in. However, I urge you to move very slowly in a new relationship. Almost anybody would look great after what you have been through. If you attracted one neglectful, non-communicative person once, you can do it again. In the beginning, all men are ssssoooooooo sweet, but once they have you under their spell...that's when you find out exactly how they are for sure. Move slowly.

 

I wish you great happiness in the future. You certainly have paid the price.

[ky_girl]

Tony thank you so much for your response, this is the first objective opinion of have gotten from anyone. made me cry.

 

thank you for caring

The only advice I have for leaving a police officer is be careful, he has a service revolver.

 

You are right...it was too little too late. And if your husband really is being more attentive these days, there is no way of knowing just how long it will last. And if you have to go to such extremes to get his love and attention, it's not worth it anyway. You tolerated his neglect for many lonely years. You tried to talk to him, to tell him how you felt, and he seemed to think it was your problem.

 

Now, you've found someone else who meets your needs and you can leave this man...and it is now HIS problem. Move forward as swiftly as humanly possible with your plans to get out of this sorry situation you have been in. However, I urge you to move very slowly in a new relationship. Almost anybody would look great after what you have been through. If you attracted one neglectful, non-communicative person once, you can do it again. In the beginning, all men are ssssoooooooo sweet, but once they have you under their spell...that's when you find out exactly how they are for sure. Move slowly.

 

I wish you great happiness in the future. You certainly have paid the price.

[Paulie]

Gee...I was only trying to help too...

 

It was my opinion, and I was trying to help.

 

Sorry I wasn't more "objective."

[ky_girl]

oh, you were very helpful, and the same thing has been on my mind for a long time. and i have tried again over and over, with out him asking me too, but now i just feel so tired. i find your opinion very caring. i suppose i am looking for justification to leave. just confused. ya know?

It was my opinion, and I was trying to help.

 

Sorry I wasn't more "objective."

[Robert]

I think you being honest with yourself when you say that you were simply looking for justification (in plain words you were not looking for the truth).

 

You did not display any sense of love for the guy - caring about his happiness, concern about his lack of communication (in terms of his suffering). You expressed the history of your relationship in terms of only the wrongs done to you.

 

Why do I get the feeling that your story is so one sided?

 

Tell us more but tell us of his life, what drives him to "seclusion". That is, if you really want to do the right thing. Otherwise, run off with your new toy and drop the facade.

[ky_girl]

Robert,

 

I dont not want to run off with "my toy" as you so callously put it. I have no idea why my husband is so quiet, because he chooses not to talk to anyone, he has told me that he was happy in our marriage, and figured i would get used to being lonely. he has apologized many, many times recently. He is a very good natured person, hard worker, good provider. But on the other hand he is very selfish, and admits he took me for granted. Maybe this seems so one sided to you because you are much like him and self centered, and cant see any one elses side of things as long as you have your way. I think if I was so selfish, I would not have put up with this for 12 years. So there is no facade, only lonely hearts and hurt feelings.

I think you being honest with yourself when you say that you were simply looking for justification (in plain words you were not looking for the truth).

 

You did not display any sense of love for the guy - caring about his happiness, concern about his lack of communication (in terms of his suffering). You expressed the history of your relationship in terms of only the wrongs done to you. Why do I get the feeling that your story is so one sided? Tell us more but tell us of his life, what drives him to "seclusion". That is, if you really want to do the right thing. Otherwise, run off with your new toy and drop the facade.

 

[J]

My situation was very similar to yours. The way you described your partner he could have been the same guy. It seems that they are kind enough to keep you dangling, but the rest of the time is spent lonely, and desperately trying to feel loved or even noticed.

 

About 6 months ago, after deliberating about it for ages, I finally made the decision to leave the relationship. I have four children, and to cap it off, my partner was in a very high paying job, which gave us a very comfortable life.

 

I can honestly say that it was one of the best decisions that I ever made. I don't think that I realised until I was away from it, how much my self-esteem had suffered by his continual rejection, or the way he blamed me for everything that went wrong between us.

 

Although life isn't always perfect, I am finding that peace within myself that I craved. I no longer feel lonely, but now feel like I have some choices. I am choosing to remain single, until I have fully healed, but I am now re-establishing friendships and getting myself back into the world of the living.

 

I have had to put up with a lot of crap from the ex- true to his character, he sees the relationship breakup as ENTIRELY my fault, but I am learning to ignore that.

 

I hope that you can find peace and happiness in your life. You deserve to be loved, and if your partner obviously can't or won't provide that, then be brave and confront it head on. You will come out the other side of the difficulties of separation with the whole world opened up to you and the chance of finding real happiness. Good Luck.

[Robert]

Ky_Girl,

 

Well at least you said something about him which makes it easier to begin forming an image of the situation.

 

Lets start with statistics. They seem more objective. Then we can move to resoning.

 

The overwhelming majority of people in second marriages find they are no happier than they were before. Yet, most start off saying it was the best decison of their lives. Only later does reality set in. If the first marriage lasts ten years, then two years into the second marriage is too soon to say if things are better.

 

Why don't they move onto a third marriage? Possibly because they no longer believe it is worth the effort.

 

Often you can pretty fairly say how long a relationship will last. If its grounded on physical terms, sexual attraction, then figure five years at best. If on an emotional experience or sense of mutual dependency, then figure on closer to ten years before frustration sets in. If on financial terms for material gains, thats good for as long as the money last or as long as 20 years (assuming married in early twenties). If on a heart-felt love for one another that is sustained by a spiritual life, figure on fifty years and more.

 

You speak in terms of "needs" and lonely hearts. This seems to say your relationship barely reached the heartfelt level and has remained on the psychological level.

 

If you move onto another relationship without ever learning how to love, what reason do you have for thinking you will find it in another person? Love comes from within yourself and is not created by meeting the "right" person.

 

True love can stand alone. This means that a person who has the capacity to love can do so even if that love is not returned. The reward for love is the beloved. This means that those who love possess the joy of loving because they possess love itself, the source of joy for us humans.

 

You do not speak of the joys of love in your life. If they are simply absent, then the void is within yourself, within your own heart. The happiest thing in life is to love faithfully. But, this love is the kind that flows from the heart and not the mind.

 

I assume you know where love comes from and so I'll not go down this path.

 

Tell us more.

[ky_girl]

Thanks J. for the advice, i have received alot of ridicule because of my feelings, mostly because of the fact that people dont really know how my husband is, they only see the face he puts on for them. he really is a kind person, but very absorbed in himself. he and i no longer meet one anothers needs. even though he himself believes that he is oh so in love with me these days, i feel its because his life as he knew it, is crumbling, and i can understand that, i really can, and i hate hurting him, but it seems he did not mind it all those years to hurt me and ignore me. I think that if you continually hold someone at arms length from you for years, they will eventually walk away. so now my time has come.

 

thanks again J.

My situation was very similar to yours. The way you described your partner he could have been the same guy. It seems that they are kind enough to keep you dangling, but the rest of the time is spent lonely, and desperately trying to feel loved or even noticed. About 6 months ago, after deliberating about it for ages, I finally made the decision to leave the relationship. I have four children, and to cap it off, my partner was in a very high paying job, which gave us a very comfortable life. I can honestly say that it was one of the best decisions that I ever made. I don't think that I realised until I was away from it, how much my self-esteem had suffered by his continual rejection, or the way he blamed me for everything that went wrong between us. Although life isn't always perfect, I am finding that peace within myself that I craved. I no longer feel lonely, but now feel like I have some choices. I am choosing to remain single, until I have fully healed, but I am now re-establishing friendships and getting myself back into the world of the living. I have had to put up with a lot of crap from the ex- true to his character, he sees the relationship breakup as ENTIRELY my fault, but I am learning to ignore that. I hope that you can find peace and happiness in your life. You deserve to be loved, and if your partner obviously can't or won't provide that, then be brave and confront it head on. You will come out the other side of the difficulties of separation with the whole world opened up to you and the chance of finding real happiness. Good Luck.

[ky_girl]

Robert:

 

I feel I have no reason to justify to you my feeling or my capability of loving someone. But for some unknown reason, your questions and comments intrigue me. So with that, I will say....When I married my husband, I loved him more than any other human, I did not know that a love and respect for another existed so strongly, or how bad it would hurt to hurt the one you love. That is why I could never understand how he could continuously ignore me, knowing it hurt, when i felt the way i did about him.

 

But tell me....How can you expect to bring back to life, a plant (love) that you have refused to water (love)and tend to (care for)?

 

Tell me more.

Ky_Girl, Well at least you said something about him which makes it easier to begin forming an image of the situation. Lets start with statistics. They seem more objective. Then we can move to resoning. The overwhelming majority of people in second marriages find they are no happier than they were before. Yet, most start off saying it was the best decison of their lives. Only later does reality set in. If the first marriage lasts ten years, then two years into the second marriage is too soon to say if things are better. Why don't they move onto a third marriage? Possibly because they no longer believe it is worth the effort. Often you can pretty fairly say how long a relationship will last. If its grounded on physical terms, sexual attraction, then figure five years at best. If on an emotional experience or sense of mutual dependency, then figure on closer to ten years before frustration sets in. If on financial terms for material gains, thats good for as long as the money last or as long as 20 years (assuming married in early twenties). If on a heart-felt love for one another that is sustained by a spiritual life, figure on fifty years and more. You speak in terms of "needs" and lonely hearts. This seems to say your relationship barely reached the heartfelt level and has remained on the psychological level. If you move onto another relationship without ever learning how to love, what reason do you have for thinking you will find it in another person? Love comes from within yourself and is not created by meeting the "right" person.

 

True love can stand alone. This means that a person who has the capacity to love can do so even if that love is not returned. The reward for love is the beloved. This means that those who love possess the joy of loving because they possess love itself, the source of joy for us humans. You do not speak of the joys of love in your life. If they are simply absent, then the void is within yourself, within your own heart. The happiest thing in life is to love faithfully. But, this love is the kind that flows from the heart and not the mind. I assume you know where love comes from and so I'll not go down this path. Tell us more.

[J]

You are welcome. I really do understand what you're going through. I hope that you can be strong and find the peace and happiness that I am finding.

 

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. If you have tried and tried to make your husband see the faults in the relationship and he won't then I think you are making the right choice. Don't worry about what others think of your decision. If your man is anything like mine was then everybody thinks he is just WONDERFUL.

 

The only people you need to worry about are yourself and your kids. I hope that the road ahead is kind to you. Good Luck.

[J]

I just wanted to add one more thing about the "other guy". Please be cautious and take it slowly. Loneliness can make anybody even remotely kind seem wonderful.

By all means keep him as a friend. Friends are the most priceless treasures we have. True friends can be the difference between misery and making it through the rough patches. However I would urge you to take it slowly, until you are back on your feet - that way you will be really seeing who he is and you will be more steady too. If he is right for you he will prove it in the times to come.

 

All the very best.

[Robert]

Robert: I feel I have no reason to justify to you my feeling or my capability of loving someone. But for some unknown reason, your questions and comments intrigue me. So with that, I will say....When I married my husband, I loved him more than any other human, I did not know that a love and respect for another existed so strongly, or how bad it would hurt to hurt the one you love. That is why I could never understand how he could continuously ignore me, knowing it hurt, when i felt the way i did about him. But tell me....How can you expect to bring back to life, a plant (love) that you have refused to water (love)and tend to (care for)? Tell me more.

Ky_Girl

 

You never had to justify anything to me, thats for sure. You write of your own free will.

 

Some of the things you say indicates a real capacity to love and then suddenly you say something that makes one wonder how contradictory your understanding of love can be.

 

Maybe we can approach this on another topic and then see if we can bridge the divide. Before beginning lets make sure we understand that if he is abusing you physically or psychologically - then clear out. Abuse means intent.

 

On that other topic for a moment. Whats the key difference between a sinful person and a good person? Answer - they both have the same types of faults and commit the same type of actions. However, a good person regrets what they had done, when they think back about it, and a sinful person just doesn't give a dam.

 

Here we have here two considerations; what a person did versus how the person felt about what they did. Likewise we can ask a similar sort of question about the difference between a loving person and a cold hearted person.

 

So, what is the difference between a loving person and a cold-hearted person? They both can exhibit the same type loving behavior. Both can do things that appear so loving and kind. Both can get pretty passionate. Both can be so forgiving. etc etc.

 

A loving person can do something for another with no gain for themselves, so can the coldhearted. A coldhearted person cannot do for another if it means a loss for themselves.

 

Love has no measure, it doesn't ask the cost. For the coldhearted, everything is an equation or a calculation. Is this worth doing, what will I get out of it. Sometimes what they get is the good-feeling that they are generous. Even that is calculated in terms of its worth vs cost.

 

So, when you speak of the years of pain I get the impression that you have a genuine capacity to love. To feel this pain there has to be a heart that can love. Only the heartless do not feel pain in their heart. In fact, for several thousand years people have equated a capacity to bear pain, for the good of someone else, as a measure of their capacity to love. For example, it is a mother's love of her child that enables her to nurse a sick child for long into the night.

 

When you ask how can one bring back to life a plant that has not been cared for etc. This seems to say you haven't a clue about where love comes from.

 

Your love for anyone does not come from that person. This love comes from within your own heart. It is your love to bestow on another. It is your gift of self to the other. It belongs to you and to you alone. The other can do nothing to increase or decrease the love you have in your heart, this love that is yours to bestow.

 

When someone disappoints me, my love for them does not decrease. I may begin to hate their behavior. But that doesn't mean I hate them. In fact, love for the person may make you unwilling to encourage them in their bad behavior. Tough love as it is sometimes called.

 

Where does love come from? It comes from being good. When you pursue goodness, your capacity to love increases. When you choose evil, your capacity to love decreases. No one else can increase or decrease your capacity to love. Which also means they cannot take away the joys you hold in your heart because of the love you possess (in your heart).

 

Personal example.

 

My wife does not love me. She has a tremendous capacity to love, but she does not love me. She doesn't hate me or do anything to harm me. Being sincere, there is no affection towards me. She is a lovely person and possesses many admirable virtues.

 

However, I love my wife dearly. Proof of this is the joy I possess in this love I have for her. Does it hurt? Sure does. All the more so since I have a particularly deep capacity to love.

 

If I look at life in terms of needs, then my life is painful since these needs are not met. I am a human male and so there is a sex drive, unmet. I'd love to be hugged or to sit intimately with the woman I so dearly love. Will never happen. Painful, yes. Married over twenty five years.

 

If I look at life in terms of my heart. I am so fortunate. I am still married to someone I dearly love and possess the joys of that love. Affection can find many means of expression. It simply will not be in the form of physical intimacy in this marriage. But it is in the form of a good friendship. A deep caring, sharing life's joys and trials and providing for her in whatever way I care to.

 

So, I have a choice. I can live within the frustrating confines of my "needs" or I can live within the expansive freedom of my heart.

 

For years I didn't understand my wife and her condition. It just seemed cruel that I could so deeply love someone and not be loved in return. Her bouts with depression were not recognized as such and were only felt as a coldness and meaness. A previous male had abused her terribly, unknown to me. Yet, I could see the contradiction in that she also had a good heart. So, how could she seem, at times, to be so cold/mean while at the same time possessing an interior goodness that is truely beautiful?

 

The one operates at the psychological level and the other at the spiritual level. Needs are at the psychological level, love is at the heart (spiritual) level.

 

Returning to the subject at hand - you.

 

It may be that from the long trial, difficulties, you have endured that you are depressed and low on energy. It may simply mean that you need a period of rest, apart, for the source of your stress. It most likely means you need to deepen your spiritual life.

 

Your husband needs to come to some realizations about himself and how he treats you or his lack of treating you. That is another subject for which I am not qualified to deal with.

 

As for you and your capacity to love, your own happiness, do not deny your heart even if it means denying your "needs".

 

Write some more.

 

Follow your heart.

 

Robert

[Tony T]

You have made some very excellent points here. I am quite enlightened. I would like to pose several questions to you that arose while I was reading your post above...actually, they are questions that I have pondered for a very long time but surfaced again at this time.

 

1. What causes a loving, caring person (or a cold-hearted person) to choose this mode selectively, that is, to be loving and caring towards one person and completely cold and distant towards another, without provocation or cause?

 

2. To what extent do you feel love has to do with the extent a person determines the beloved can be of value to him/her in their life, outside the emotional realm?

 

3. How can a "friend" appear to be caring and loving for a very long period of time and, when circumstances change in their life (such as falling in love, moving, getting a new job, etc.), this caring and loving sometimes very abruptly turns into dislike, indifference, or complete disinterest in the friendship? Was the friendship phony all along?

 

I will leave you with these three. Only answer if you care to. You seem to have a pretty good handle on this stuff. I may hit you with more at a later time. Tackle them only if you care to and at your leisure.

 

Many kind thanks.