independent woman

[Els]

Interesting how the two most mistrustful, cynical women on this thread (Breals and NegativeNancy) also claim to be the most independent. Perhaps this is what has led to some men being wary of 'independent women'. A pity, though, because I think that it's possible to be independent without being like THAT.

[pureinheart]

There are a few recent topics regarding people who "fail to launch".. I am actually curious as to whether the opposite is also a turn off.

 

If a woman is able to pay off a mortgage, car, bills, 50/50 in relationships etc (I think

sum it up quite nicely!) is this a turn off for men?

 

I was having this debate with a friend of mine a while back, and he was of the opinion that it's a turn off if a woman is too independent. He said that most men like to feel like they are needed.

 

So I'm just curious gents, what's your opinion? Ladies, would you consider yourself independent?

 

I am very independant because that makes me happy. I however really appreciated my exfiancee. He was extremely generous, and would not let me pay for anything. It was not to control me, not anything negative at all...it simply made him happy. To reciprocate I did a lot of the fixing up his house needed while he was away at work.

[joystickd]

a woman nowadays has no choice but to be independent, be it emotionally or financially because men just can't be trusted anymore (maybe they never were trustworthy and just hid it better back in the "good ol' days").

 

i've heard of cases where women played the dutiful wives for 20 or 30 years, did all the household chores, raised the kids, put their education aside for the sake of the husband so he would have a nice cozy home while working on his "career" - and then were given the boot because they were too old and wrinkly and the husbands wanted to start a new family with the secretary.

 

those women ended up being poor and relying on social welfare because with no education (that they neglected because the husband didn't want them to be "independent") they had zero chances finding a job that paid for the living expenses. the new divorce law favors men now, so men have an even easier time leaving their "old wives" for some new toy.

 

yes, in this brave new world a non-"independent" woman either needs a really good prenup or she's gonna be screwed over if the man decides that her face isn't young enough anymore. i'm sure alot of women would like to be a SAHM when there are kids (I'm one of them, even though I am "independent" now) but in today's society that would be just like russian roulette.

 

men complain about women being "too independent" but what they fail to realize is that they helped creating this "monster".

Not all men are like that.

[joystickd]

Men like independent women. I know I sure as hell do. There are some that have one issue. Carl Friedan described it about his wife: "She changed the course of history almost singlehandedly. It took a driven, super aggressive, egocentric, almost lunatic dynamo to rock the world the way she did. Unfortunately, she was that same person at home, where that kind of conduct doesn't work. She simply never understood this."

 

Some take the same skills that make them successful at work and think they apply at home or in a relationship

[123321]

Men like independent women. I know I sure as hell do. There are some that have one issue. Carl Friedan described it about his wife: "She changed the course of history almost singlehandedly. It took a driven, super aggressive, egocentric, almost lunatic dynamo to rock the world the way she did. Unfortunately, she was that same person at home, where that kind of conduct doesn't work. She simply never understood this."

 

Some take the same skills that make them successful at work and think they apply at home or in a relationship

 

In an nutshell ^^^^

 

I like my GF being independent, in that she's a fully functioning adult human who has taken care of herself and assisted her family for 5+ years, however a lot of times when women refer to themselves as "independent" it's code for "bitch".

 

My GF, for instance, has NEVER referred to herself as independent even though her life history clearly shows it.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Some men like independent women because men don't want to be responsible for anyone but themselves. They want to date younger women, not pay for dates, not do any gentlmen-like behavior or be romantic unless it's them getting their sexual fantasies met in bed. Some men simply want it all with very little work put into a relationship. And they expect women to think they are these wonderful men despite doing very little in return.

 

By the way, I think "independence" is an over rated phrase in our culture and in the dating world. Much like 'traveling". there are many people in my life that help me and vice versa. This doesn't mean once person does all the work while the other person sits back or that you don't have your own interests, but I do think people overuse the idea of "independence".

[Mme. Chaucer]

Some men like independent women because men don't want to be responsible for anyone but themselves. They want to date younger women, not pay for dates, not do any gentlmen-like behavior or be romantic unless it's them getting their sexual fantasies met in bed. Some men simply want it all with very little work put into a relationship. And they expect women to think they are these wonderful men despite doing very little in return.

 

And, SOME men like independent women because an independent spirit, resourcefulness and self reliance are qualities they admire in people. Of course, any man who likes ME likes this stuff.

 

I don't think many truly "independent" women would put up with being treated like crap in the way you describe above, DY. Seems that guys who want to treat a woman like that in a relationship would best select an insecure and needy woman. After all, an independent woman knows how to take care of herself and enjoys it. Her life is not a waste if she has to wait for a man who brings to a relationship the things she values and who wants what she offers, too.

 

By the way, I think "independence" is an over rated phrase in our culture and in the dating world. Much like 'traveling".

 

It seems that there are many things you consider "overrated." I don't get it. If someone admires independent people with big breasts and loves to travel with their menage-a-trois, and you don't, who are you to say that the things they like are "overrated"?

 

there are many people in my life that help me and vice versa.

 

Me too. My husband does many things that I am completely hopeless at. Vice versa. I have had rough times in my life when dear friends came to my aid, and I can't imagine what I would have done without them. But I am still INDEPENDENT and proud to be, and my husband (and my ex husband, and my former boyfriends) liked this about me. Or they would not have been with me.

[namenottaken]

I don’t think the reasoning behind a man ‘wanting to be needed’ is a monetary one. (At least I hope not.)I would think it’s no different than a woman wanting to be needed.

 

I want to be needed for what I, not my wallet, bring to his life.

 

Do I make him happy? Does he look forward to our time together? Does he come to me with his problems? Does he look to me for help, advice or comfort?

 

These are the things I want to be needed for. It would really suck to feel like money is the reason a person needs you.

 

I agree with other posters that (because of men who seem to be so concerned with 'gold diggers') some women will put that 'they don't need a man', only meaning they don't need one for financial support.

[Emilia]

Some men like independent women because men don't want to be responsible for anyone but themselves. They want to date younger women, not pay for dates, not do any gentlmen-like behavior or be romantic unless it's them getting their sexual fantasies met in bed. Some men simply want it all with very little work put into a relationship. And they expect women to think they are these wonderful men despite doing very little in return.

 

By the way, I think "independence" is an over rated phrase in our culture and in the dating world. Much like 'traveling". there are many people in my life that help me and vice versa. This doesn't mean once person does all the work while the other person sits back or that you don't have your own interests, but I do think people overuse the idea of "independence".

 

I think you would do yourself a huge favour if you spent less time in front of the keyboard and more time outside with people.

[Chubbi]

This is another time when you need to believe what they do, not what they say. It reminds me of when I was in high school. My male friends told me they liked smart girls, but when I was myself and showed my smarts, they treated me like a friend. When I pretended to be dumb and acted giggly and girly, they got all flirty and sexy with me.

 

Agree with this completely. The more dumb the girl is, the more male attention she has. It's gotten so bad my PHD girlfriend from Harvard (4.0 GpA) still acts like she is dumb in front of men, and they just eat it up. The more airheaded you are, at least in high school/college, the better and more "feminine"

 

They even try to downplay Natilie Portman's degree/Shakira's/Tyra Banks degrees because it's not as attractive as bimbo

[musemaj11]

I dont think its the independence of a woman that men are turned off by.

 

But when a man hears that a woman is financially successful, the first things that come to his mind is that she will require him to be more successful, she will expect him to keep up with her financially, and she will be bossy.

 

Personally if Im interested in a woman and find out that she has a better job than I do, I will stop trying to get with her because first, big chances are she wont want to be with a man who makes less so I will just be wasting my time, and second, even if she does accept me, its very likely that she is just settling with whoever she can get because she cant have the successful man that she actually wants.

 

Some men like independent women because men don't want to be responsible for anyone but themselves. They want to date younger women, not pay for dates, not do any gentlmen-like behavior or be romantic unless it's them getting their sexual fantasies met in bed. Some men simply want it all with very little work put into a relationship. And they expect women to think they are these wonderful men despite doing very little in return.

 

By the way, I think "independence" is an over rated phrase in our culture and in the dating world. Much like 'traveling". there are many people in my life that help me and vice versa. This doesn't mean once person does all the work while the other person sits back or that you don't have your own interests, but I do think people overuse the idea of "independence".

I bet you are not an independent woman and a couch potato who doesnt get outside much.

 

And whats wrong if a man doesnt want to have anyone else as his responsibility? Are you saying that women are parasites who need men to be responsible with them?

Edited April 3, 2012 by musemaj11