need advice about party and wet t-shirt competition.

[Pyrannaste]

Friday the 18th of June people from my boyfriend's fraternity are throwing a swimming pool night party.

There will be also a miss wet-t-shirt competition. No prizes or anything, people partecipating to it will do it just to show off.

The party is open to people in their fraternity and to people from other fraternities. Everyone can also bring friends.

 

It's two weeks to the party and I'm extremely upset already.

 

As some of you already know from my other posts, the big hate of my life are the girls in my bf's fraternity, because they got naked in front of him, and stayed naked in front of him (and all others frat members) , while doing 'mockeries of sexual stuff' like lap dances(naked), body painting, a girl licking chocolate from another girl's body(and they were both totally naked) because in their frat it is normal from that kind of stuff to happen.

 

I happen to *hate* any woman who has been doing stuff like giving a blowjob to a beer bottle while *totally naked* in front of my boyfriend (and other guys to even breath the same air as him,

so this is way I am alrady feeling upset for a party. For a *oh, damn, it's only a pool party*.

 

I would not care that much if he sees a stripper get naked and he is not going to meet again in his life because she is just a stranger, but I'm already fuming at the idea of him being with those girls.

It *expecially*disturbs me that they will be in their bathing stuff. It would not be so disturbing if he had not seen them without the bathing suit.

 

Last summer I went to a similar party they threw (there were a miss wet t-shirt competition too, which pissed me of moderately but would have pissed me off big time if I hadn't been there). In the end I was glad I went, I'd have felt awful if I stayed home.

 

When I went there last year I wore the thinniest and most see-thru bikini I owned(something I'd never wear to the beach....I usually am a very shy person, but not that day).

It made me feel better.

 

Well, last year I had a great body, which was what helped me most.

I was in a mindset like "hey, you girls know I am jealous of you, joke at the fact i'm jealous of you, but *now* you can see that it is NOT because you are more beautiful than me without clothes. Yes, I *am* pissed of at you, but not because I fear the comparison. I look great in my bikini, I have a great ass, while most of you look like big wobbling creme caramel puddings".

(I know they are not nice thoughts).

 

Currently I'm not in great shape as last year so I won't have the reassuring help of wearing a thin bikini and look great in it. Noone is going to ask me to take a pic of my ass this time;).

 

Now I badly need advice.

What do i do?

 

 

Do i go, try to get as in shape as last year and try to enjoy myself as much as I can? (I have chances of enjoying myself there only if I am self-confident about my body).

Do I go and try to drown one of those girls in the swimming pool?

Do I stay home and get some stuff to help me sleep and try to forget about the party?

Do I go somewhere else and try to have fun and/or get drunk so I won't think about it?

Do I go with my most handsome male friend (the guy who looks exacly like legolas from lord of the rings movie) , of whom my bf is quite jealous? So i will be jealous, but I'll have a nice person to talk with, and my bf will be jealous too? (childish i know)

Do I sulk and get angry while the miss wet t-shirt competition take place?

Do I buy my bf blindfolds?

Do I pretend I'm okay like I did last year and I comment on the girls too?

Do I ask to be part of the jury and ask the girls to let me touch their tits to see whether they are fake?? (playing lesbian would embarass some of them).

Do I partecipate too, possibly carrying a "save small tits and whales" sign?

 

what do i do?

[moimeme]

Drop the jerk BF and go someplace where you might meet a better guy.

[Pyrannaste]

Moimeme, thanks for replying.

I forgot to add a *very* important thing though.

It's almost three months he does not go to his frat meetings.

So basically it is three months he has not seen the girls in his frat without clothes.

I guess that means a lot....or not?

[moimeme]

It would mean a lot more if he gave this party a pass. Isn't this the guy who's been out of this faternity for years? Time for him to grow up, no?

[Pyrannaste]

Thanks again for replying, Moimeme.

 

Funny thing is, I didn't even consider asking him not to go at all.

 

I guess I'd feel it was selfish to ask since it's a while he has not seen these guys, they are friends of him and he is losing contact with them (because of me).

And he does not have a lot of friends. I wish he went out more and met new people.

Those frat people don't actually seem great friends to me because it would be difficult for my bf to hang out with them only outside fraternities meetings, except for a couple of them (whom I like too, because they are intelligent, kind and don't always look like they have dung under they nose) whom my bf sees sometimes.

You stop going to frat meetings for a while, they become distant, colder, stop calling you when they do something together.

He might also see a couple of people he hasn't seen in ages there.

 

I also told myself that all that would happen is him seeing some tits. (some of which he's already seen).

And he does not even like big breasts!

But yet again since it would bother me perhaps it's a good reason to ask him not to go.

And it's people who'll be there that bothers me the most, not the stupid competition.

 

And I also thought, if it were not his frat's party, just a party with strangers, everyone would think I'd be overreacting.

I have severe problems tracing the line that separates when I'm overreacting and when I'm not.

 

Thanks again for your help! It meant a lot, because reading your last post made me feel better. It made me understand that I'm not necessarily selfish if i get upset at the idea of him being there.

[moimeme]

Ideally, of course, you wouldn't even have to ask him to not go; he'd figure it out for himself. If you ask, now you're the typical 'controlling' woman

 

Having said that, it sounds as though he's not doing well at sorting out how to make and keep friends. If these guys drop him when You stop going to frat meetings for a while, they become distant, colder, stop calling you when they do something together they're not that great friends. If he wants to meet up with old pals, he could go for a while, get their numbers, and then see them at some function that doesn't involve raunchy teenage behaviour.

[dudesomewhere]

see moi? see what I mean by ladies liking jerks? hehe

course I generalize...cuz I can

I'm the total opposite of frat guys, never saw the draw, never joined, never been in one. Man what kind of no esteem female objectifies herself so much to do the things you said they do. But then you realize...frat guys...there are frat guys, fraternities...guys who join frats...there wil always be frats and that type of draw, that type of crowd because women love it!

[Pyrannaste]

Moimeme,

Ideally, of course, you wouldn't even have to ask him to not go; he'd figure it out for himself. If you ask, now you're the typical 'controlling' woman

 

how true

 

dudesomewhere,

Man what kind of no esteem female objectifies herself so much to do the things you said they do

 

I love to hear this from a guy.

I don't think a woman with some self esteem would do this.

My bf says it takes quite a lot of backbone and personality for them girls to do that kind of stuff, to me it is more *lack* of backbone.

 

He even suggested I joined the fraternity, at least for enough time to go through those fraternity rituals that include staying totally naked for hours.

He reckons it would be good for me because "I'd lose some tabooes, understand that certain things do not really mean nothing, I'd understand that nudity is not bad and I'd feel better with myself after."

I'm worried when I hear such stuff, problem is that he means it.

I'd really like to know why such an otherwise nice person as him -he's kind, caring, he's not the cheating sort and I'm positive he'd never physically cheat on me- thinks that stuff is okay.

Which sort of scares me. I can't really *understand* him.

I guess that if he is/was being a jerk, he does not do it on purpose.

I am also his first serious relationship, so he sort of never had this kind of problems with other women before.

 

I'm sure he means it when he says he'd have no problems if they did that kind of stuff in my fraternity too. He says that he is surprised that to me "looking is like touching". He'd never touch any of the girls in his frat (when she is clothesless).

Well, there never is touching there while that stuff happens.

If I were a boy the thought of my gf being naked in front of about 30 people (more than half of them boys) *she knows and she is going to meet again and possibly become friends with* would send me in a frenzy. I'd feel like she was cheating on me. Like when my bf went to the frat meetings time ago, he was there while that stuff happened and I felt like he was cheating on me.

I guess some people can just be not jealous of some situations.

 

 

I had half an idea to go to that party and join the idiotic wet t-shirt competition, but I already know I won't.

My bf would NOT be pissed off, and I'd end up feeling sluttish

Of course the wet t-shirt thing is braless.

 

I wonder why the whole darn idea is so disturbing.

 

I'll think carefully and decide how to deal with this party thing.

 

 

sorry about this other long rant and thanks again, moimeme and dude.

[CurlyIam]

ok, so I admit I didn't thoroughly read all the posts in reply!

 

So WHAT if she loves this jerk? By all mean, WTF is the definiton of a jerk?

 

I mean if he's great with her the rest of 364 days, so what if he goes to this stupid party?

 

Please, stop preaching!!!!

 

Pyra, girl, you could be Angelina Jolie and you'd still be uncomfortable around them naked girls! No woman on the face of this Earth, no matter how beautiful and perfect, can compete against a bunch of naked, slutty eager to please girls!

 

I'm so sure you have a great figure! You don't have to expose your beautiful body to prove anything to anyone! My true conviction is that this is a prerogative of your loved one and your loved one alone!

 

So go find you a sexi sarong, if you gained weight, your breasts are supposed to be a but bigger, so get something nasty, you know?

 

Anyway, believe me, it is never a question of looks, it is always a question of ATTITUDE! Attitude as in trust, confidence, etc! So be sure to be doing whaterever makes you feel great about yourself the day before: your hair, a face treatment, a massage, whatever!

 

If he loves you and is proud of you, you have nothing to be insecure about... it' just this one evening. If the guy is worth it, then it's a small price to pay!

 

Lots of kisses,

 

Curly

[CurlyIam]

Ok, now I have read the posts in front of me!

 

A. You said ne stopped going there during the las 3 months! That's good. IT means he is starting to grow up, listen, whatever.

 

B. He wants to be in contact with people. This is also very good. Especially since he doesn't seem to have too many friends. I know about fraternitiesand about networking. IT is always a good idea to keep people around. Ideally, you'd do it because they are your friends!

 

But this isn't a f*cking fairytale so one must do things if wants to go places. Again in my point of view it is ALWAYS a good idea to mingle! With a purpose!

 

C. You don't like the people there at the party. Just think you're doing it for him. He started to quit going, he is meeting there some friends with whom he lost contact and you'll be there to watch those easy girls keepaway from him!

 

If you play your cards right, he might even be greatful for your going there with him.

 

 

IMHO, if life offers you lemons, try making a limonade!

 

 

Cheers,

 

Curly

 

p.s.what was all that... "legolas" like boy, huh? Naughty naughty Pyrannaste!

[Pyrannaste]

Originally posted by CurlyIam

 

Pyra, girl, you could be Angelina Jolie and you'd still be uncomfortable around them naked girls! No woman on the face of this Earth, no matter how beautiful and perfect, can compete against a bunch of naked, slutty eager to please girls!

 

Lol that is sort of true. I am not jealous only of the very pretty ones, also of the trashy-looking ones. problem is not how pretty they are, it's the 'fraternity link' they have with my bf.

Well, it's not even being jealous... it's halfway between disgust ("I can't believe you've shown every inch of your body to a bunch of pervs that included my bf, you slut") and the kind of feeling you experience when someone has pissed in your cornflakes

 

I'm so sure you have a great figure! You don't have to expose your beautiful body to prove anything to anyone! My true conviction is that this is a prerogative of your loved one and your loved one alone!

 

mine too. That's also why I used to take so badly the fact that he went to those frat meetings. I feel that keeping in shape, trying to keep weigh in control, spend a fortune on skin-care creams, wax my legs to show my naked body for a man who feels entitled to be somewhere in situations that are somewhat erotic with naked/half naked frat girls is throwing pearls before swine.

I once told him, while discussing, that I felt that the fact that he saw all of his frat friends naked was taking something away from me, because my body would be no longer special. I told him that to me it felt like me being naked with him was not as special as it should because of this.

 

Oh, don't get the idea that I'm very pretty. I'm average or even below average!

 

Anyway, believe me, it is never a question of looks, it is always a question of ATTITUDE! Attitude as in trust, confidence, etc! So be sure to be doing whaterever makes you feel great about yourself the day before: your hair, a face treatment, a massage, whatever!

 

I don't think massages or a new haircut would be useful.

I'd end up feeling awkward and stupid to do more to prepare for a stupid party than what I've ever done to prepare for a date

If i managed to lose just a little weigh and get something that resembles a tan in a couple of weeks, it would be great.

 

If there will be there a couple of *extremely good looking* guys who used to have a crush on me, that would do miracles for my self esteem and be more useful to me than anything else.

I have half an idea to call them and ask if they will be to that party, but I think I'll just hope to meet them there since calling them would be sort of inappropriate.

 

If he loves you and is proud of you, you have nothing to be insecure about... it' just this one evening. If the guy is worth it, then it's a small price to pay!

 

keywords : just one evening. If he's not setting a foot to fraternity meetings ever again, I could live through this

I reckon that when I'll be there if I see anything I don't like I can still break up and possibly leave with someone else.

[CurlyIam]

Originally posted by Pyrannaste

 

mine too. That's also why I used to take so badly the fact that he went to those frat meetings. I feel that keeping in shape, trying to keep weigh in control, spend a fortune on skin-care creams, wax my legs to show my naked body for a man who feels entitled to be somewhere in situations that are somewhat erotic with naked/half naked frat girls is throwing pearls before swine.

I once told him, while discussing, that I felt that the fact that he saw all of his frat friends naked was taking something away from me, because my body would be no longer special. I told him that to me it felt like me being naked with him was not as special as it should because of this.

 

That's exactly how I feel! I think revealig clothes are pretty cool, but then what's the role of imagination? Anyway, this particular aspect makes me hate shopping! I never find things I like wearing.

 

 

I don't think massages or a new haircut would be useful.

I'd end up feeling awkward and stupid to do more to prepare for a stupid party than what I've ever done to prepare for a date

If i managed to lose just a little weigh and get something that resembles a tan in a couple of weeks, it would be great.

 

Whatever makes you feel good about yourself. I have long hair and it is so difficult in the summer to take care of it. I always feel great when applying a treatment, or just oil on it. I was simply trying to suggest to inhance your strong points: like a nice mask for a stunning shiny skin or ... you know what I mean.

 

 

If there will be there a couple of *extremely good looking* guys who used to have a crush on me, that would do miracles for my self esteem and be more useful to me than anything else.

I have half an idea to call them and ask if they will be to that party, but I think I'll just hope to meet them there since calling them would be sort of inappropriate.

 

YEs it would! And I am not sure your even saying it out loud is such a good sign! Hum...

 

 

keywords : just one evening. If he's not setting a foot to fraternity meetings ever again, I could live through this

I reckon that when I'll be there if I see anything I don't like I can still break up and possibly leave with someone else.

 

woow, wait a minute. New info comming up! what do you mean you don't know if it's just one evening? I thought you said he's trying to change. Ok, more often than 2, maybe 3 like that in year...

 

And, Pyra, not even as a joke will I ever consider leaving a party with someone else. I tend to take relationships very very seriously.

 

Your talking about it, even as a joke, tells much more than you know. If you don't love this guy and are so serenelytalking about leaving with someone else, why on Earth are you going through with this stupid party after all?

 

I am sure you can meet other "eligible" young men some other places than a fraternity you hate!

 

 

Put some order into your ideas, Pyrannaste. Pick sides!

 

Curly

[moimeme]

keywords : just one evening. If he's not setting a foot to fraternity meetings ever again, I could live through this

I reckon that when I'll be there if I see anything I don't like I can still break up and possibly leave with someone else.

 

ROTFL!!! You go girl!

 

He even suggested I joined the fraternity, at least for enough time to go through those fraternity rituals that include staying totally naked for hours.

He reckons it would be good for me because "I'd lose some tabooes, understand that certain things do not really mean nothing, I'd understand that nudity is not bad and I'd feel better with myself after."

I'm worried when I hear such stuff, problem is that he means it.

 

Well, that's the thing. He seems to have been really influenced by frat life. It looms large in his life and his attitudes are coloured frat colours. People are supposed to move on from that sort of life one they've left college. It's as though he's trying to hang onto the past or something. Being 30, jobless, and still heavily tied to his old frat are not good signs. Heck, frat brothers are supposed to help each other out with stuff like finding jobs!

 

It's starting to sound like if you stick with this guy, you'll have to deal with an awful lot of issues. Not that anyone should ditch somene with issues, but you need to know what you're getting into if you take one on.

[CurlyIam]

About your little wishes: you can get a much better suntan in 2 weeks, but I hope you aren't gonna do anything stupid like refusing to eat or who knows what a "miracle" 10 days drastic diet... They can be very effective, I know they can.

 

And the minute you stop it and come back to normal habits of eating, you gain back weight and... stretch marks! I absolutely adooooore stretch marks.

 

So think long term, my friend!

 

Curly

 

P.S. Did I mention stomach aches? Lots of them!!!!

[average guy]

I have always thought that guys fraternitys were the bottom of society's genepool, but now I am enlightend to learn that girls fraternitys are as well! Can't they just go to college to get a good education like everyone else?

[Pyrannaste]

Looks like I probably won't be able to go to the stupid party. It shifted a couple of days (20th june) and the following day I'll probably have a test at university so I won't be able to go. (I'd have to travel to my bf's town and sleep at his place).

I panicked at this.

 

And -worse- today while I was on the phone with my bf I mentioned the party, one thing lead to another, I started bitching about a couple of girls in his frat who kissed him on the lips when he (basically)said bye to the fraternity people.

Funny thing is that I wouldn't have minded it that much hadn't it been a couple of those girls. I believed him when he told me they were just symbolic, innocent, half a second long kisses on lips and he did not care about those kiss and they were nothing to him. I( guess it's just because it was them..... and I also reckon what I was really angry about was another girl who stayed naked for three hours that very same evening, and all those girls whom he witnessed get naked and do idiotic stuff the previous year, when he was often to frat meetings. )

 

I bitched, cried, pissed him off, told him something pretty nasty("a man with a backbone would have refused to kiss them, "it would bother my gf" should be a good enough excuse").

And this happened three months ago!!!!And I've *already*bitched about it. More than a time. Why can't I let go stupid things like this one??? And he was the one who told me about it.

Perhaps I just need to hear some "what I did was wrong" line. But right now I'm the one who is acting wrong, I gave him hell enough about that one event.

 

I'm feeling really bad with myself right now for having brought this out.

I can't keep bringing up stuff that happened months ago over and over again.

I feel like I screwed up the last three weeks when things got better with him.

Last three weeks I didn't get hysterical, I didn't have jealousy fits, I kept calm.

Now I really feel like a loser who can't act rationally.

 

I wish I managed to let go of all the anger /resentment I had packed up..... I *feel*I was improving but looks like that the mere idea of my bf being with those people triggers my irrational side.

[CurlyIam]

I wish I managed to let go of all the anger /resentment I had packed up..... I *feel*I was improving but looks like that the mere idea of my bf being with those people triggers my irrational side.

 

I wonder why it triggers your irrational side! Could it be 'cause of naked women? Naah, must be your bad childhood!!! Haha!

 

This thing you're doing is like when you're trying to loose wheight. You stick to you programme religiously, but one has weak moments! One bombon of chocholate won't ruin three weeks of hard work! Don't beat yourself up. This is not irrationl fear. You have very very good reasons of worrying!! But decide if you want to go through this ordeal every time there's gonna be a party. This is getting to you.

 

So what I'm trying to say is get over it or get out!

[gossip_girl]

I deal with jealousy alot... not in that extreme though. Personally, I believe that if you're not on a level where you're comfortable talking to him about how these things bother you, then you need to re-think where your relationship is. You should be able to openly express these kinds of feelings. If you really care about him and your relationship, you should get this out in the open instead of trying to compete with those whores -- which trust me, a girl with respect outwins a whore anyday, so congratulations - and worrying about what they'll do. In my cases of jealousy it's never been my boyfriend I didn't trust, just the girls around him. And there's nothing you can do about the girls around your guy, but if you know for yourself you and your guy have a two-way understanding about what is acceptable and what isn't, you'll feel alottt better because then you're both on the same wavelength.

 

Good luck!

[Unlucky In Love]

I am a woman who went through the fraternity thing when I was in college. I was actually the first girl on campus to became president of a fraternity, but that's another story.

 

I'm not condoning the whole fraternity system, in fact, I think parties like this are very dehumanizing to both men and women. However, a large portion of our society condones these kind of parties. Even though we claim to be Christians. So we're stuck with it. Women get assaulted and raped at fraternity parties all the time. Men hook up, people get laid, etc.

 

You sound like a very attractive woman. Your boyfriend is not going to dump you because he went to a frat party. Your relationship sounds like it is based on a lot more than that. You have to remember, boys will be boys and sometimes they need this type of male bonding. Maybe you could just talk to him and say that you don't mind if he goes, as long as he didn't kiss any of the girls. Tell him that you trust him, but you just want to be sure he's being faithful.

 

I don't think you're being irrational at all. The last time my boyfriend was invited to a party, he told me that he wouldn't go without me. I told him that I had to work, so he didn't go. I really appreciated that, but it took a lot of training for us to get to that point.

 

It takes men alot of time to grow up and stop being little babies. The period of growth is torture for us, but at the end you may wind up with a husband. It's up to you to decide what you can tolerate.

 

Good luck, let us know what happens.

[Pyrannaste]

Thank you so much girls from your replies.

 

Curly, my friend, thanks for always being there for me and for all the support you give me.

I wonder why it triggers your irrational side! Could it be 'cause of naked women? Naah, must be your bad childhood!!! Haha!

 

Funny you mention it, because my bf once told it must be my childhood too.

Problems are the naked women cases.

I can't bring myself to forget a year and half spent arguing about this stuff, I can't forgive him for having been to those frat meetings for a long period of time while he knew it hurt me and then saying that it is me the one who has to grow up, that is a prude, that has tabooes and so on.

he was going to witness and partecipate in that sh*t while he knew I was at home crying, I can't forget being so anxious and stressed I threw up, I hurt myself, I lied on the bed and yelled and cried and cried and cried again.

And it was always me, and he was, in his opinion, the 'patient one' and " another boyfriend would have dumped me, but he still hoped I would grow up.

I never got one f*cking apology. I felt unloved, disrespected, treated like a dog.

And it is funny hearing someone whom you can find at a frat meeting with naked girls some of which are 10 years younger, telling *me* to grow up.

 

Things are changed a lot now he stopped going to the frat meetings.

Apart fron this frat thing he was (and is) a nice guy. I don't think he'd physically cheat on me ever.

 

But it looks like I can't let go of past things. I can forget for a while and as soon as I know he's meeting those girls again I go into a frenzy and all my past negative feelings resurface. It bothers me enough if he's meeting them (I can't stand the thought of my bf being with a girl he has this weird 'fraternity link' with, and that he saw naked), but if he's meeting them and they are NOT going to have all of their clothes on I go in a frenzy.

 

gossip_girl,

if you know for yourself you and your guy have a two-way understanding about what is acceptable and what isn't, you'll feel alottt better because then you're both on the same wavelength.

 

you hit the spot here.

We are not on the same wavelenght..... quite a lot of things that to me are not acceptable when in a relationship are really no big deal to him.

Lately he will not do them because of me (which I really appreciate), but he still sees nothing wrong with them.

Like fraternity stuff. To him as long as he is not touching no one, anything that can happen in fraternities like his is okay when you are in a relationship, and he finds it weird that I'm bothered by it.

 

Personally, I believe that if you're not on a level where you're comfortable talking to him about how these things bother you, then you need to re-think where your relationship is. You should be able to openly express these kinds of feelings.

 

Problem is, when there is something that bothers me, the first times I talk about it I can tell my bf about my feelings without upsetting, not accusing, trying to take his point of view into account, asking to be reassured, and being as nice as I can.

If my bf dismisses my feelings, or acts like I have a problem, or becomes upset at me, and thinks that was happened "is my problem", the next time I'll bring the subject up I'll be less understanding, and more bitchy.

 

Since for a year my bf thought it was my problem if I was upset at frat things, would go to the frat meetings and refuse to even turn his gaze elsewhere when some girl got naked, told me I had to grow up, etc. I got to the point every time his frat is mentioned I became literally *crazy*. And I mean *very* mad. Lately, since my bf stopped to go to frat meetings, I have improved. expecially in the last month. Last month I first managed after more than a year to bring up that subject without becoming a b*tch and keeping calm, explaining him how I felt about it without accusing, and telling him that I was wrong to bestow moral judgement on his frat, or on him, or those girls, and that I did not have a problem (which is true) with whatever happened there before we got together or I don't care whatever the girls in his frat do as long as he is not there, it's not my business. I told him that I am not necessarily right, my feelings are not right or wrong, they just are my feelings. I told him i was sorry for telling him quite bad things.

 

 

Unlucky In Love,

 

You sound like a very attractive woman. Your boyfriend is not going to dump you because he went to a frat party.

 

Thanks, but I am not attractive actually.

I know he is not going to dump me because he went to a frat party...

the problem on the contrary is that *I* might dump him because he went to a frat party, or that he might dump me not because he went there but because I nagged him to death about it.

 

Maybe you could just talk to him and say that you don't mind if he goes, as long as he didn't kiss any of the girls. Tell him that you trust him, but you just want to be sure he's being faithful.

 

I actually *do*mind if he goes, but I can stick a smile on my face and act like it's okay and live trough this.

I know he is going to be faithful. He is not the cheating kind.

 

Even if I believe that if he is given a kiss on lips by a girl for 'frat things' he will not refuse it because it is not big deal to him.

As I told him yesterday there are a few women I would not mind if he kissed quickly on lips, like his best female friends, other female friends of his, and a couple of frat girls he has not seen without their clothes.

A quick kiss on lips for 'symbolic reasons' is nothing. (Ideally he should ask if I am okay with it. Ideally. but even if not no big deal, unless it is a girl you are interested in)

A kiss on lips to someone you have fraternity bond with, whom you saw do a lap dance naked, or mimicking a blowjob on a bottle while naked, about whom you know personal detalis like her favourite way of masturbating (detailed), whom your gf hates, is *very* bad in my book.

 

It takes men alot of time to grow up and stop being little babies.

 

True. Lately he is acting like he is growing up. Now I guess it's my turn to grow up, too.

[FreeMe]

Pyrannaste,

 

First of all, I think you've really got it together and I don't think you're immature or need to grow up. I think you're completely right. I would have dumped the guy a long time ago.

 

All he's been doing is justifying and rationalizing his behavior. He's 30 year old guy who gets to go and get off (figuratively - maybe) on seeing college girls completely naked for hours at a time doing things that I'm sure display every inch of their bodies. Plus you've mentioned that they do lap dances and stuff. These girls are extremely stupid. The guys are getting off and making fools of those girls under the guise of pledging into the fraternity. What a joke!! I've no doubt those guys sit around and say things like "do we have the life or what? we don't have to pay them. we don't have to take them out or listen to their bull****, but they get completely naked for hours at a time and do things for us of their own free will!!" They sit back and watch it and enjoy it as if they're entitled to it.

 

Do you think these guys have a high opinion of women? They can't possibly. They might think they do, but underneath this is what they expect of women, and the women are playing right into their hands.

 

You're boyfriend may act like the long-suffering patient one because of your outbursts, but believe me, you are the patient one to tolerate that.

[Confused123]

ok, I didn't read everyone's response to your post, but I def understand the situsation here. I have to admit, i would be DAMMED if my man went to a party were girls are buck as$ naked, pretending to give a hummer to a beer bottle. I am not in college anymore, but it hasn't been too long since I got out. I know the Frat guy type and I personally I never been too attracted to them. In my opinion being in a faternity is besides the point.

 

People need to grow the fu&k up, I will be livid is my man every too part in that type of ****. I don't care if he touched them or not. NO FUC$ING way. I an not insecure, I an attractive and I have a nice figure, but that is not what it is about.

 

It is about RESPECT...

 

I don't care if these are suppose to be your college years, I would tell him to grow the fu&k up or go out with one of those stupid sluts... Personally, i couldn't go out with someone who would disrespect me in such a way... I am not trying to take a shot at you or your choice in a man. I am sure he is a nice guy, that is just caught up in a situsation. however, all this stressing is it really worth it??Good luck.....

[tiki]

Whoa. That's just crazy. I'd find me a new man that had a different hobby.

 

You're more of a woman than me to be able to put up with that stuff. Good luck.

[Pyrannaste]

Sunday I was at my bf's place and I became quite hysterical.

Like, I started punching cushions (and my legs too) and call the girls in his frat very bad names. This happened a couple of times.

I am pretty ashamed of having lost my control this way, I know it's bad.

 

Today my bf wanted to dump me on the phone, he sounded pretty serious.

Looks like I screwed it up, in the end.

 

He said that I was becoming very hysterical, I was starting to have tantrums, he said something like "look what has become of yourself" (he is right).

He sais he is tired of me becoming hysterical, abnormally jealous, and that he thinks that if it is not girls in his frat it will later be his female co-workers, or any woman he is in contact with.

At that I told him that I'm never going to be jealous of co-workers or friends if they act like co-workers or friends. I told him to notice that I never was jealous of his best friend, who is a very pretty girl, but acts like a friend. She used to be in his frat too, but she stopped going to the meetings before my bf and I got together, so I have no reason to be jealous of her because if he saw her clothesless it was a long time ago before we were together.

 

My bf has not dumped me yet but he's pretty pissed off at me.

 

Sounds like he is dumping me if I do anything like this again.

I promised him i would not become hysterical and keep calm until that stupid party and that i would 'behave well'at the party, that is: not to make jealousy scenes.

 

I am half sad/worried he will really dump me this time, half feeling like a loser because he will dump me now that he has left that stupid fraternity, which caused all the problems with me.

I waited more than a year that he left the frat, it was a sh*tty year, and now he's out of it he's dumping me and his future new gf won't even have this problem to deal with. that sucks.

[CurlyIam]

Question for you: do you actually think that he'll stop going once you're out of the picture? This actually makes me smile. I don't think so.

 

And stop thinking of "future" gf etc. That won't be your business! You should be breaking up with him. Because you hate his friends, his frat, his party, his lifestyle! Why don't you just accept it?

 

Just say to him: "honey, I'll always ALWAYS always have a problem with it. Take it or leave it. It is beyond me to have naked chicks running around you. If these strangers are more important to you than myself, go!"

 

 

 

Don't force yourself this hard. Pyrannaste, you'll never succeed in getting over your jealousy. It doesn't make you a bad person, or a good person or a strange person. This is yourself! It's part of yourself! Honestely, Pyra girl, leave the sucker! Once and for all. I mean a man in his right mind will do anything to make you stop hurting, not ask you not to hurt. He hates the effects(your scenes), but looooves the cause (party party party).

 

I mean really, coworkers and friends!!! Don't make me laugh! Maybe between men, 'cause I don't see any girl with enough self respect do that. Workmate? Does your bf have a job? Friends he said? Acquaintances maybe!!!

 

I mean should he be this hot shot type of guy, to be into networking and meeting people and establishing contacts for a specific purpose(human resources, head hunting, sales, pr), I'd say "hey, who are you to stand in the way of his plan, career, etc?"But he has no plan, no job really, no specific thing to do!!! These are EXCUSES! BE wise enough to see through it! Girl, it's better than tv what he's havin'!!!!

 

Pyrannaste, I have been waiting for weeks for you to get mad enough and instead of hitting the cushion, kicking his a$$ out of your life!!! It's your life, your choice!

 

I couldn't for the life of me understand why you'd want such a "man" near you, but then I know love is blind and makes us do the stupidest things.... Just...please, please please open your eyes and at least learn from this disaster!!!