new and hesitant to post: is it an affair or not?

[Breaking_Apart]

I've been reading for a bit and it took me some time to decide to post; I'm not all that comfortable putting it all out there, but here goes.

 

I'm going to keep it short-ish and go from there.

 

Is it still an affair if he is completely seperated from his wife and family? I'm involved with a man who lives in a different city from his wife and kids. He and I met after he had moved out; we became good friends first, and then progressed to something more. Currently we are...intimate friends, to attempt a label that makes sense. He works a lot and so do I; we see each other once a week or so when we have time.

 

I'm having a hard time seeing this as an affair becuse he doesn't live with his wife anymore; however, they haven't moved forward with divorce yet, so how could it be anything except an affair? Affairs are big secrets, right? Well, his friends and family know about me--they know we are friends and spend time together--there is discretion but not secrecy. That would seem to indicate it's NOT an affair.

 

I just want an outside opinion.

[spice4life]

What's his relationship with his stbxw? Is he "emotionally divorced" from her and very clear about moving on? The fact that he is not moving to get divorced and is only separated, is a red flag. It means that you may be at risk, meaning, he may end up going back to his wife. If that is the case, then yes, you are involved in an affair with a "fence sitter." Guard your heart and don't give him any room to feed you any lame MM excuses.

[The Blue Knight]

I've been reading for a bit and it took me some time to decide to post; I'm not all that comfortable putting it all out there, but here goes.

 

I'm going to keep it short-ish and go from there.

 

Is it still an affair if he is completely seperated from his wife and family? I'm involved with a man who lives in a different city from his wife and kids. He and I met after he had moved out; we became good friends first, and then progressed to something more. Currently we are...intimate friends, to attempt a label that makes sense. He works a lot and so do I; we see each other once a week or so when we have time.

 

I'm having a hard time seeing this as an affair becuse he doesn't live with his wife anymore; however, they haven't moved forward with divorce yet, so how could it be anything except an affair? Affairs are big secrets, right? Well, his friends and family know about me--they know we are friends and spend time together--there is discretion but not secrecy. That would seem to indicate it's NOT an affair.

 

I just want an outside opinion.

Where he lives or doesn't isn't really the point BA. It's about the fact that he's still legally married to his wife.

 

Perhaps a better question might be, why hasn't he moved on with a divorce? What's his status with his wife? Is she under the impression that their marriage is dead or is she under the assumption that they are going to continue working on it?

 

They may know about you, but do they really KNOW about you?

 

I'm always flabbergasted by women who are willing to be the other woman. It seldom comes out good for them and after months or years of being the other woman, it dawns on them finally that the relationship is not moving forward, but is stuck right where it's at.

 

If things are really open and on the up and up, then this guy should have no problem with you calling his wife to find out where things are at with she and him.

 

Others may disagree. But it still comes down to an adulterous relationship. Yes, I'm a bit old fashioned. But you did ask. I hope you can see your way clearly through this situation and come out of it unhurt, but that's unlikely.

[skywriter]

If he is legally seperated from her, then he can live as a single person.

[Breaking_Apart]

I see there's no more clarity in a diverse range of opinions than there is in my own.

 

Thank you for the input.

[skywriter]

Regardless of whether the separate is legal or not, the MM and the wife may have agreed that they are separating with the intention of working towards rebuilding their marriage. MM may have been kicked out by the wife and didn't want to leave - the OP has NO WAY of knowing if anything he says is true.

 

In my opinion, a separated man is merely a married man waiting for his wife to take him back. Play at your own risk.

 

Alice,

 

With all due respect to your opinion, if a couple has gone to the extent of a legal seperation and all the cost involved to do so, not to mention child custody agreement and seperation of all assets aquired.

 

....and had the agreement that they are entitled, and do agree to live as single, then they can legally see other people without it being used in court against them.

 

Just depends on if they've done this.

 

However, the above point about steering clear until he's taken care of his marital statis, is wise.

Edited March 11, 2012 by skywriter

[The Blue Knight]

Regardless of whether the separate is legal or not, the MM and the wife may have agreed that they are separating with the intention of working towards rebuilding their marriage. MM may have been kicked out by the wife and didn't want to leave - the OP has NO WAY of knowing if anything he says is true.

 

In my opinion, a separated man is merely a married man waiting for his wife to take him back. Play at your own risk.

 

Alice,

 

With all due respect to your opinion, if a couple has gone to the extent of a legal seperation and all the cost involved to do so, not to mention child custody agreement and seperation of all assets aquired.

 

....and had the agreement that they are entitled, and do agree to live as single, then they can legally see other people without it being used in court against them.

 

Just depends on if they've done this.

 

However, the above point about steering clear until he's taken care of his marital statis, is wise.

 

I think the point everyone here is making is that the OP doesn't really know the TRUE status of the man she's involved with. Martial separation can mean a million things, and not all of them are heading toward divorce outcomes necessarily.

 

Which by the way is why I suggested asking the man she's seeing if she can call the wife. How he handles that question may be very telling.

[skywriter]

Which by the way is why I suggested asking the man she's seeing if she can call the wife. How he handles that question may be very telling.

 

Yea, I agree, that should leave ,few ,if any questions.

[wannabdone]

We could look at the legal descriptions, we could look at what we all think is the right thing or not.

 

But, I don't think if you didn't feel like it was so b/w and something wasn't a little fishy about the situation, you probably wouldn't be on the LS and reading and now posting.

 

I mean this with the most respect and not to seem rude, but I think you maybe being on here reading and then posting something, probably answers your own question.

[Breaking_Apart]

I tend to believe life is complex, and relationships can be some of the most complex situations in life.

 

As to why no moves towards divorce, it comes down to the kids (as I think it frequently does in these situations.) No good parent wants to cause their kids pain.

 

My own thought and opinion goes to the idea that it's complicated; the variety of opinions on here validate that idea, if nothing else.

 

I searched, and read, and finally posted to get a few different viewpoints. In my life I have two very good friends who I have consulted. One believes since he is living alone and has been for some time, he is seperated and free to pursue other relationships. The other friend states I need to wait for him to be completely and totally divorced and free.

 

My own idea is that I don't want to be dumb, stupid, naive, and get involved in what is frankly a mess. I don't relish the idea of getting hurt...and I'd be stupid to think that wasn't a possible and even likely outcome.

[spice4life]

Hmm. The separation is the hardest and most painful part and he has already accomplished that. The divorce is simply paperwork. They have already went through the most painful part, so it doesn't really make any sense that they won't divorce because of the kids. I would be careful because something doesn't ring right here.

[whichwayisup]

As to why no moves towards divorce, it comes down to the kids (as I think it frequently does in these situations.) No good parent wants to cause their kids pain.

 

But they live apart, yes? And, he doesn't see his kids everyday/everynight, tuck them in or is there in the mornings. Isn't there for dinner time, morning breakfasts and family time. He doesn't go on holidays or spend time with her side of the family (his inlaws) and he isn't "living" life with her, right?

 

These are things you need to ask him and have some back up and clarify that what he IS infact telling you is true/truthful.

 

Are they separated with agreement that it'll be a divorce? or is the separation to figure out what if they should just have time apart and then try to fix things?

 

Does she know he's 'dating' you? If no, then it IS an affair. He's hiding you.

His family and his friends don't count here.. His wife doesn't know then it is an affair.

[whichwayisup]

How long have you known him and been 'seeing' him? How long has he been separated and been living on his own? And yes, how long was he separated before you two started seeing eachother?

[MissBee]

If he is separated from his wife, living elsewhere and she and he have an agreement that they are divorcing and are free to date others, then no it is not an affair.

 

However, some here can attest to still feeling like a secret even when their MM divorces. I say, tread carefully. Separated, newly divorced, newly broken up people often don't make the best relationship material for lots of reasons. Even though it is not an affair, sometimes one can still feel like one is on egg shells and on the back burner or feel insecure like one does not have a legitimate place. So I think you should focus on whether or not your relationship feels out in the open, honest, transparent, you feel involved in his life etc as you should with a man you're in a relatigonship. Although from what you're saying it seems like you are "intimate friends"...and have not made any clear decisions about the level of commitment and what kind of relationship this is

 

I do think not being clear about what kind of relationship you have can lead to more feelings of insecurity in general and feelings of illegitimacy, as if he is not serious about you or you him, then I don't think he'd be quick to announce your relationship. So that's my advice. Consider what the relationship is, where it is going, what you want out of it, does his wife know he dates others, do you feel secure and does it feel like an affair to YOU is the main question.

[awkward]

Does he live in the same town as his wife and kids or does he work/live in another place and travel home to see his kids on weekends/once a month/etc.?

 

How often does he see his kids? When he has his kids do they come to his home or does he do overnights at his wife's home?

 

How does he explain to you that being legally separated but not divorced and not living in the family home is better for his kids?

[Ms. Red]

I've been reading for a bit and it took me some time to decide to post; I'm not all that comfortable putting it all out there, but here goes.

 

I'm going to keep it short-ish and go from there.

 

Is it still an affair if he is completely seperated from his wife and family?

 

No, not if he's completely separated and everyone knows about it.

 

I'm involved with a man who lives in a different city from his wife and kids. He and I met after he had moved out; we became good friends first, and then progressed to something more. Currently we are...intimate friends, to attempt a label that makes sense. He works a lot and so do I; we see each other once a week or so when we have time.

 

I'm having a hard time seeing this as an affair becuse he doesn't live with his wife anymore; however, they haven't moved forward with divorce yet, so how could it be anything except an affair? Affairs are big secrets, right? Well, his friends and family know about me--they know we are friends and spend time together--there is discretion but not secrecy. That would seem to indicate it's NOT an affair.

 

It seems to me it is not an affair. My EH (Estranged Husband) and I have been separate for over 5 years now and neither one of us has moved forward with divorce. And neither one of us plan to anytime soon.

 

I just want an outside opinion.

 

You will get many opinions here. My EH has been dating and now living with his girlfriend for 2 years or so. (Can't remember exactly how long) I don't care if he has a girlfriend. All my in-laws are aware of her in his life. However, even with all that, I was told here on LS that my EH is a cheater since he is still fully married. So you will hear all kinds of varied opinions on the matter.

 

IMO, it all depends on how much the wife and family knows and how you feel about it. At first, my EH's GF had no way of finding out how I felt about it. Near the beginning of their R, she contacted me but I refused to talk to her. Not because of her dating my EH but because she was insignificant to me and I had no desire to talk to her.

 

I do admit I don't like the way she left her children to be with my EH. I don't understand how a parent can do that. That means more to me than how one treats their separated spouse. The fact that your "intimate friend" was able to do that to his children bothers me a lot. That would be a deal breaker for me. But that's just me.

[Gentlegirl2]

Never get involved with anybody attached in any way. If they are.. they can come back to you after they have unattached themselves.

 

If you doubt this guy.. ask for his wife's phone number and make sure he is being truthful. If he is real.. he will give it to you without any problems. If he doesn't then there is something really worng.

 

If you read here.. lots of stories like yours.

 

Good luck,

 

GG

[Breaking_Apart]

All right. I do appreciate all the words of wisdom you have shared here. I haven't tried to rationalize or excuse--it may have come across that way but my goal was clarity and additional advice and input. I've just spent so much time trying to think it through on my own that my thoughts had become a bit of a jumble. "Is it wrong / isn't it? Should I trust him and this / shouldn't I? Am I being stupid?" Around and around the thoughts circled.

 

I'm not certain I have much more clarity right now, but a little at least. No, I'm pretty sure his wife is the one person who doesn't know. That does say a lot. It doesn't say it all--as I'm certain he does live seperated from her, I've been to his place before! Could be he hasn't told her about me to be respectful, but more likely because I have to be a secret from the wife. Now I just wonder--is it because she thinks they are working on their marriage, or because he hopes to reconcile and wouldn't want her to think he is moving on?

 

Thanks for all the replies. I appreciate the different perspectives.

[whichwayisup]

. Now I just wonder--is it because she thinks they are working on their marriage, or because he hopes to reconcile and wouldn't want her to think he is moving on?

 

See this is what you need to find out. If their separation is 'separation leading to divorce' or 'separation to figure things out and then work on the marriage.' Intention is important here.

 

You never answered any of my questions. How long have they been separated, how long have you two been together, and how long was he separated before you met him?

[wannabdone]

The only truth you're going to ever get is from the wife. You also need to ask her WHY she kicked him out. Because you can almost be certain it was the wife who made him leave.

 

 

Do you really think she will be 100% honest? or do you think she very much might want to work on things and that is why she hasn't d him, and will tell the poster things that might not be completely true? I just wonder if sometimes, although it seems like it would be the correct thing to do, to get the truth and sit down and talk, if that doesn't often lead to more deception and lies and game playing.

[Breaking_Apart]

See this is what you need to find out. If their separation is 'separation leading to divorce' or 'separation to figure things out and then work on the marriage.' Intention is important here.

 

You never answered any of my questions. How long have they been separated, how long have you two been together, and how long was he separated before you met him?

 

He had moved out about 4 months before I met him--well, I'd seen him around, but nothing more than "hi" or "how's it going" interactions until then. We remained nothing but friends for 7 months. The more than friends part of this has been for about a month now. So, he's been living seperated from his wife for a year at this point.

[whichwayisup]

The more than friends part of this has been for about a month now.

So, he isn't really that obligated to you at this point in time and a month in, isn't that serious. I can understand why he isn't advertising you two as a couple after only a month.

 

Though, with that said, you need to know what's what if you plan on staying with him and dating him. If he isn't 'really' separated, then you need to walk away for own sake, this way you won't get hurt.

[jwi71]

Oh sheesh.

 

Why is everyone making this so hard?

 

Look, this is actually very easy.

 

Sit your man down and tell him the truth.

 

You like him, you like the idea of a future together but you are worried because he is not D. Ask to speak to his W. Ask him for permission to contact her because his lack of a D is scary for you and you don't want to love an unavailable man.

 

If all is as he says, he won't mind. Neither will his W. If he hesitates or pauses or otherwise says no, ask why. Does his refusal make sense?

 

I was in this guy's shoes for a brief while. Just waiting for the D to go through. I had ZERO problems with anyone calling me on it or my stbxw on it. Never came up though. Those women I dated in that window served a purpose - and it had nothing to do with a R.

[nofool4u]

I've been reading for a bit and it took me some time to decide to post; I'm not all that comfortable putting it all out there, but here goes.

 

I'm going to keep it short-ish and go from there.

 

Is it still an affair if he is completely seperated from his wife and family?

 

Yes.

 

If he is headed for divorce, then its a gray area. Also depends on whether he entered the so-called "affair" before or after the separation. Just IMO.

 

 

I'm having a hard time seeing this as an affair becuse he doesn't live with his wife anymore; however, they haven't moved forward with divorce yet, so how could it be anything except an affair?

 

If there hasn't been a decision made about divorce, then yes, its an affair. Because he could end up going back to her and if that happens, then he will use his separation as an excuse to have his little fun, at both you and his wife's expense.

 

 

Affairs are big secrets, right?

 

No, even if everyone knows, and affair is an affair.

[freestyle]

I think you would be wise to guard your heart, very carefully, and be mindful about how much you're investing emotionally.

 

I'm not going to moralize, or split hairs with you--but I'd like to point out something that concerns me.

 

Even if he WAS 'officially' divorced next week, you're still getting involved with someone who's in a HUGE transitional period.

 

He's spinning, and no one, (including himself) knows where he's going to land when he stops spinning.

 

It's a normal thing to go through when ending a major relationship--he's going to be on a rollercoaster of shifting emotions, as he processes everything.

ANYONE involved with him at this point will have no choice but to be on that same ride.

 

I guess what I'm saying is--try not to put too much stock into the words of someone who's not in a stage of emotional equilibrium.

 

Let the dust settle first----maybe THEN you'll see his true face.