separated but have to live together

[Jstub]

ok so here is an important update that I need opinions on. I am so confused right now. So my wife left at 1:30 and came back home at 8:30. I was completely ignoring her when she got home and she asked me what's up your ass. I said nothing, why do you ask. Anyway long story short, I told her I am not an idiot and I know you were with OM.

 

Now here is some background about the OM. He is a writer, pretty well known in his field. The primary reason why my wife and OM started talking was because of writing. Then they had an EA (before they met) and then they met. I always assumed they had something going on (PA) even though seeing his pictures I know there is no way in hell my wife would be into that...

 

So after I told her that she said yes I was with OM, but it's not what you are thinking. I did not want to tell you, because I knew you would assume that I am sleeping with him. I said, I do not care at this point, you can sleep with whoever you want. Then I told her, you go do what you want, I will not be your doormat. You want to move out? Get the eff out. Me and the kids are staying here. She said, what you gonna do hire a nanny? I said that's my business. So we argued a little bit and she started crying and saying why can't you just let me have my thing. I told her what is "your thing" she said, I went to an event (checked the event - was legit), he took me there to meet all these connections, I want to write, I want to be someone. This is my dream...... why can't you just let it be.... I told her why would you keep this a secret from me. If this was your dream you know damn well that I would have supported it. She said, I feel so stupid right now... she said I didn't think you would support it and I wasn't even sure myself if I really want this. I just wanted to find out, I wanted to find out if this is really what I want to do. I want to go to any event as I please and meet people, that's why I don't know if i should be alone or not. This is not about sex, this is about me feeling trapped, like I have to answer to you. I told her, why couldn't you just be honest with me, you think I would have stood in your way??? Why do you think our marriage and your dreams can't coexist?

 

She said I have been trying to salvage us. I said salvage what? she said I want to make this a smooth transition no matter what the outcome. If I wanted to be myself, I wanted you to have all rights as a father. No conditions, you could see the kids any day, any weekend. She said, she is also wrecking her brain about being together, if she could feel that she can fulfill her dreams while being in this marriage. She said, she feels like herself when she is out and when she comes home she feels like in prison.

 

I told her, I want you to know that you can be honest with me and that I will support your dreams. However, if you feel like I am not your husband, I will not do that. I will not go out of my way and sacrifice myself for your dreams.

 

After a while we made some small talk and then she gave me a background of what type of material the OM writes etc. she started talking about the struggle the OM is having with this software (I am in IT so I am familiar) and she started talking about how he can't make a deadline and how he doesn't have much money to purchase this other software bla bla, I said why don't we call him up and I can help (I did this just to see her reaction) - so right away she did (no hesitation at all). Went to VM and she left a message saying the following: Thank you for taking me along to the event (name) today. I really enjoyed it. I told my husband about my plans of writing for you and he is actually very enthusiastic about it.. (I should have known...) I told him about the issue you were having and he is willing to help, so call me back if it's the next 30 minutes.

 

The end.

 

Now, as you can imagine, I am confused. I don't want to get my hopes up, but I just can't help myself. I have read so many threads here, getting hopes up and only ending up in the same misery. I want to be smart, if I keep doing the 180 and LC, she will feel like I am punishing her... I don't know what to do.

 

a Little background here, we had 2 kids back to back, my wife has been very depressed, the kids are very difficult to handle, they fight a lot and scream a lot. She was struggling to lose her baby weight and that hit her self esteem pretty badly. On top of that, turning 31 and not working, she feels like she is nothing but a mom and a wife and that drives her crazy. These factors must influence something!

 

Thoughts???

Edited March 19, 2012 by Jstub

[standtall]

Sorry to hear about your troubles Jstub.

 

Your wife sounds immature.... She sounds like she is trying to escape her decisions by running around like she is single without being accountable for the responsibilities that she has at home.... 31 is too young for a mid life crises. Marriage and parenting are easier for some and an absolute hardship for others, but she was a grown adult when she got married and had children and she needs to be there for her children at least.

 

This part

Little background here, we had 2 kids back to back, my wife has been very depressed, the kids are very difficult to handle, they fight a lot and scream a lot

 

indicates that she needs to be home so you two can start parenting. With toddlers at home and 2 parents employing their skills, that behavior will stop in a week.

 

Your tolerating her affair in the past is not a good thing...there is no 3rd party in a marriage, and IMHO, you need to give her an ultimatum. She is either in the marriage and will cease all contact with the OM and work on the marriage, or she has abandoned the marriage.

 

This part

 

She said, I feel so stupid right now... she said I didn't think you would support it and I wasn't even sure myself if I really want this. I just wanted to find out, I wanted to find out if this is really what I want to do. I want to go to any event as I please and meet people, that's why I don't know if i should be alone or not. This is not about sex, this is about me feeling trapped, like I have to answer to you

 

are just words to excuse her cheating. People can network outside the marriage and she should have known that.

 

This part

 

I said why don't we call him up and I can help (I did this just to see her reaction) - so right away she did (no hesitation at all). Went to VM and she left a message saying the following

 

while a nice gesture on your part, shows that you are still being used as a complete doormat/cuckold..whatever you want to call it. He gets to go to the event with your wife, have sex with her at will, and you get to raise the family, and do work for him for free. As long as you allow her to walk over you, she will.

[Jstub]

Sorry to hear about your troubles Jstub.

 

Your wife sounds immature.... She sounds like she is trying to escape her decisions by running around like she is single without being accountable for the responsibilities that she has at home.... 31 is too young for a mid life crises. Marriage and parenting are easier for some and an absolute hardship for others, but she was a grown adult when she got married and had children and she needs to be there for her children at least.

 

This part

 

indicates that she needs to be home so you two can start parenting. With toddlers at home and 2 parents employing their skills, that behavior will stop in a week.

 

Your tolerating her affair in the past is not a good thing...there is no 3rd party in a marriage, and IMHO, you need to give her an ultimatum. She is either in the marriage and will cease all contact with the OM and work on the marriage, or she has abandoned the marriage.

 

This part

 

 

 

are just words to excuse her cheating. People can network outside the marriage and she should have known that.

 

This part

 

 

 

while a nice gesture on your part, shows that you are still being used as a complete doormat/cuckold..whatever you want to call it. He gets to go to the event with your wife, have sex with her at will, and you get to raise the family, and do work for him for free. As long as you allow her to walk over you, she will.

 

Thank you for your kind advice Standtall. I woke up today feeling angry and betrayed. I told her she needs to be completely honest with me and that I will not tolerate her shady behavior. I said, I am ready to make her dreams come true but our marriage and family come first. If that is not the case for her, then I will pull the plug and she will not get any support from me.

 

She was quiet and now she is saying she just wants me to meet the OM to see for myself that there is nothing going on. That the only reason why she wants to keep the contact is for her dreams. She says, she is completely not into him. He is in his late 50s, not doing well financially and I KNOW he is not her type at all. I asked her why the hell would you have had an EA with him in the first place? She said she hadn't met him at that point, and it was just an idea a fantasy, her way of "breaking free" knowing that she will not do anything physical with him. She claims that her and I don't have the best conversations when it comes to her interests so she just wanted to talk.

 

I want to hold my ground. All I keep reminding myself when I get weak is that I don't want to be with someone who does not want to be with me.

[Jstub]

 

There would be NO reason in the world that she couldn't tell you her aspirations, unless you are the type to keep her down or make fun of her. Are you? Can you honestly say that by all rights she should have felt comfortable coming to you with her dreams of being a writer? If you can, then this whole thing, I believe, is more a guise to cover her initial EA with this man, that didn't turn out because she hadn't met him and didn't know she wasn't attracted to him. She's re-writing history as she goes along to suit her purposes.

 

I do not want to go into too much detail, but the topic that she wants to write about is sensitive - as in, there is a small chance that you can tick some people off. When initially the OM came into the picture, I found it very shady and was not comfortable with it (I knew what he writes about), due to the problems it may cause. So she may have felt that I was trying to control her and telling her what to do. So to say she not only wants to meet him but to start writing about the very same topics, she might have felt that I would not be supportive at all.

 

As for rewriting history, you are absolutely right. I think she had every intention of getting physical with this man if she felt like it. She always said, she wants to put our love to the test. She said, what would be more beautiful then to go and meet someone that represents everything you are missing and not want to do anything and come home running.... I did this myself on the weekend.. I passed?

[worldgonewrong]

I think your wife is full of sh_t and that she's talking out of both sides of her mouth re OM.

 

If what she says is so, she should be able to say to OM-- with you listening or present -- that she is "completely not into him". No preparation beforehand. If she can't do that, then she's incriminated herself.

 

This whole thing stinks to high heaven.

[worldgonewrong]

She always said, she wants to put our love to the test. She said, what would be more beautiful then to go and meet someone that represents everything you are missing and not want to do anything and come home running.

 

Oh my God, the woman is mental!

 

Two people in LOVE don't play games like this. This is sadistic.

[Jstub]

I think your wife is full of sh_t and that she's talking out of both sides of her mouth re OM.

 

If what she says is so, she should be able to say to OM-- with you listening or present -- that she is "completely not into him". No preparation beforehand. If she can't do that, then she's incriminated herself.

 

This whole thing stinks to high heaven.

 

That could be easily done with me being there and then taken back in a private conversation. Oh he made me say this etc.

[Jstub]

Do you think I should just meet the OM. I will be able to sniff if something is going on or not in a second. Thoughts?

[2sunny]

If there wasn't anyhing to hide - she wouldn't have been hiding her OM.

 

I think she's back peddling... Just to try to look innocent.

 

Stand firm - keep looking forward and do what's best for you and your kids.

 

She's ginna do whatever she wants - she's shown that with her evidence.

 

IF the kids aren't easily capable of being in control- that's a training and boundary problem. It's because your wife ALLOWS them to behave that way.

 

She needs to understand the kids are trainable at a young age - and will follow firm boundaries IF she implements heheh and is consistent.

 

Stay on path - you're doing great. She looks like she may just have tried throwing you a curve ball to distract you from what she really doesn't want you to know.

 

Don't fix his computer! Just don't!

 

And if you think she isn't or won't sleep with him - think again! An emotional attraction far outweighs any physical attraction, doesn't matter what he looks like - a snake has MANY appearances! One of them is your wife!

 

She's not trustworthy... Know that for sure!

[worldgonewrong]

I think you should let OM know that when (don't say "if", it's weak) your divorce comes to trial, you will make sure he is subpoenaed. Let him be notified that if his conscience is clear, he should be prepared to testify in court re adultery. Oh, and mention if he's not honest, it's perjury.

 

OK, now I'm just fantasizing...on your behalf...haha!

[Jstub]

Thank you both for your replies. I will keep my eyes open and I definitely do not trust her one bit at this point. I will update as new things unfold.

[Steen719]

Oh my God, the woman is mental!

 

Two people in LOVE don't play games like this. This is sadistic.

 

I agree. She is either extremely immature, cruel or nuts. There are many stories of men on here who think the OM is NOBODY their wives would ever want and then, sadly find out that is not true. The OM might be the exact opposite of you, 20 years older, not educated if you are, and the list could go on and on. You want to believe that. Wives also see the OW as being glamorous, more beautiful than her and find out she is not...she could be a plain Jane. So, it is not always about looks, money, etc. It can just fill some self-centered need.

 

Let's assume for a moment that this wasn't an EA per se and she really wanted to write and did all of this manuevering from fear of your reaction. Does that indicate a healthy marriage or healthy mindset to you? She went to the point of separation, teasing you, having a "hidden" relationship with someone else, supposedly because she couldn't talk to you (and that was largely from her own doing from the first EA). Take away the confusing part for a moment (her motive for this). Her actions were still unacceptable.

 

Yep. Sad said it best.

[Jstub]

Let's assume for a moment that this wasn't an EA per se and she really wanted to write and did all of this manuevering from fear of your reaction. Does that indicate a healthy marriage or healthy mindset to you? She went to the point of separation, teasing you, having a "hidden" relationship with someone else, supposedly because she couldn't talk to you (and that was largely from her own doing from the first EA). Take away the confusing part for a moment (her motive for this). Her actions were still unacceptable.

 

Our marriage is far from healthy.. farrrr from it. Right now I am just trying to figure out if this is worth fighting for. If it is salvageable. I want to look at it from all angles, from hers specially. It's crazy and my wife is not your ordinary woman (far from it - that's why I fell for her so bad). It's a web of lies that makes me sick - I just hope that this whole thing was her way of just going insane and "rebelling" to get her life together. I say I HOPE, I see a small chance of that. That doesn't mean that I will hide my head in the sand, I will keep focusing on myself and my children. Sometimes you try to tell yourself something lie to yourself, but when you go to sleep at night, deep down you know the truth.

 

As previously suggested, I am watching her closely (goes against 180 though) is that wrong?

[worldgonewrong]

As previously suggested, I am watching her closely (goes against 180 though) is that wrong?

 

It's wrong if it's an empty gesture on your part because she doesn't give a flying flip.

 

If you're conveying, "I've got my eye on you", and her actions are the equivalent of "ok, whatever", then you're in trouble.

[Jstub]

It's wrong if it's an empty gesture on your part because she doesn't give a flying flip.

 

If you're conveying, "I've got my eye on you", and her actions are the equivalent of "ok, whatever", then you're in trouble.

 

I am not conveying a message of "I am watching you" I am conveying (or at least trying to) I don't care what you are doing - obviously, I am not there yet, because I care what she is doing.

 

Yesterday's episode, when she left for 8 hours, I did not call her once, nor asked her where she was at all. When she came, she was the one who wanted to confront the situation. I told her, I am not stupid - I can put 1 and 1 together. That's how the whole thing started.

[Jstub]

Another dilemma is that she used to work for a very very good lawyer. He has a track record of winning 100% custody when it doesn't even make sense. so she pretty much has a free lawyer - I know he will not charge her (good family friend). Best case scenario I can get 50% custody of the children and she will probably get the majority of the income I have. I will live a ****ty life and she will live a ****ty life and ultimately the children will live a ****ty life. Throughout this process, I will spend thousands on legal fees and get screwed anyway. She hasn't had a job for over 4 years, her writing dreams won't pay the bills. At this point, I am thinking of the children - I don't think she knows wtf she is doing and I don't think she knows the implications of her actions. Our kids are so young it just breaks my heart so much more. I know if i try to kick her out, it's going to get really ugly and I don't know if I want to go through it. I keep telling myself she will come to her senses, she will figure it out but most of the time I feel like that's just wishful thinking.... what have i done? Why did I get married to this woman.. why... I keep wondering. There must have been a sign... I just failed to see it...

 

Going home now.. I plan on just spending time with the kids and ignoring her in a non-obvious way, because if I make it obvious she always thinks I am depressed and just dying to have her back. After I put the kids to sleep, I will go jogging and go visit my brother. He is the only "real" person I can talk to.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Jstub

[Frank13]

Our marriage is far from healthy.. farrrr from it. Right now I am just trying to figure out if this is worth fighting for.

 

For me, her saying she loves you but not in the husband/wife sort of way was the final nail in the coffin. Nothing else matters. Then when you add all the other stuff she has been doing to the equation, there isn't anything worth fighting for.

 

How would you feel if everything else was perfect but she still did not love you like husband and wife? Would you want to be with someone who felt that way? I wouldn't.

[Frank13]

And if you think she isn't or won't sleep with him - think again! An emotional attraction far outweighs any physical attraction, doesn't matter what he looks like -

 

I knew my ex for three years before I became emotionally attracted. I wasn't physically attracted to her for three years and wouldn't have given her a second look had I seen her in public. However, once the emotional connection was there, very soon she became the most beautiful looking woman in the world to me.

[Jstub]

Yeah I get your point about the 180 being in contradiction to verifying, but what else can you do besides accepting the situation as is? I suppose, since the 180 is all about taking care of yourself (the true intent) that protecting yourself can fall into that realm as well.

 

I don't know if this would work, but if you got serious about divorcing her, you could always go see her lawyer friend first for a consultation and try to hire him before you tell her you're filing. Even if he doesn't take your case, it may prevent him from taking hers if he talks to you about it first. Just food for thought.

 

I'm not saying you have to divorce her, but you do have to do something to stop this madness. Being proactive will serve you better than being passive.

 

There is no way he would take my case. He's too smart for that.

[Jstub]

For me, her saying she loves you but not in the husband/wife sort of way was the final nail in the coffin. Nothing else matters. Then when you add all the other stuff she has been doing to the equation, there isn't anything worth fighting for.

 

How would you feel if everything else was perfect but she still did not love you like husband and wife? Would you want to be with someone who felt that way? I wouldn't.

 

Goes without saying that even if everything else was okay and she didn't love me, of course this would be over. Not good enough.

[Jstub]

I knew my ex for three years before I became emotionally attracted. I wasn't physically attracted to her for three years and wouldn't have given her a second look had I seen her in public. However, once the emotional connection was there, very soon she became the most beautiful looking woman in the world to me.

 

Frank my wife is smoking hot - when she enters a room all guys get stunned. She is also into looks obviously. If a guy is 20 years older and looks like this guy does, she will not want to be seen with him in public (as her bf or whatever)

[Jstub]

So I played with the kids for a long time. Been enjoying my time with them much more recently. They are my joy in all this madness. They make me forget all the pain. I put them to bed and went jogging. Before I left my wife asked where I'm going so I said "jogging" she asked if i'm crazy and if I am not too tired. I don't get this woman sometimes. Anyway after that I came home and just like every night I sat outside to have my glass of wine. She of course came outside. She then started talking about moving up north and buying a house (I know - crazy right?) I said you must be insane. You don't even know if you want us to be together and you want us to buy a house? She said its for the kids, that way they can have a nice place to grow up. I said ok?? So I get you a house and live in a **** hole and pay for your life? She said oh no no ill be taking care of the kids. At this point I'm just amazed. Speechless. Then I asked her what her priority is. Her family or what? She said I don't mind if you live with us as long as you accept that we are separated and we are not married. You shouldn't freak out if I start seeing someone or taking to someone. If you can deal with that, then I don't see why we can't live together. I said you must be insane. (maybe she is?)

 

After a while she came again and started asking if I can help OM with his software issue. I said no. She said what I have to beg you now? I said no you don't have to beg but you certainly can't talk to me this way. Learn to respect. She said **** off, I hate you, you make it worse every day and went to her room.

 

So that's another day in my life! Pretty nice way of wrapping up the day!

 

Again writing from my phone so excuse any spelling mistakes.

[Steen719]

Jstub,

It is just so sad to see how she is yanking you around. What she is describing is not a marriage and you know it. She wants you to pay for her to live in a new house while she takes care of the children and sees other men? I mean, really, she is unbelievable! She won't mind if you live with her in a house you are paying for? Dear God, she is a piece of work.

 

You know what has to be done here unless you are willing to live with her, knowing she has no respect for you and does not love you as a wife should love a husband. You are making it worse for her because you are not participating in her manipulation, that's what she means if she were being honest.

 

I'm sorry, I sure know how it feels to love someone who treats you like yesterday's garbage, but at some point, you need to see her for what she really is and move forward. If you don't, you will be as insane as she is.

[worldgonewrong]

F*cking hell, dude, in many ways,

your wife sounds EXACTLY like mine. It spooks me.

[Jstub]

Steen. At this point I am not living with her by choice. I don't want to leave the house because hell why should I? I want to be with my kids. She actually likes that because she gets to relax and do her own thing while I watch the kids. So now? Do I punish my kids to punish her? I am not willing to do that. I just did some basic calculations of child support and spousal support and it looks bad. I'd be left with $1200-$1400 a month to live in California. What am I supposed to do? I can't live on that - rent for a room here is $600. Not even a studio. So I feel trapped.

 

Worldgonewrong - I think a lot of people would say that. How women turn... What a phenomenon!