separated but have to live together

[2sunny]

It just depends - and you really won't know IF she can get well and stay healthy for a long time.

 

It can be determined as time goes along... Depending upon how she CHANGES.

 

In the meantime - it may be best not to discuss that part with her - but just continue doing the best you can for yourself and your kids while she does the work to get healthy.

 

Is she in detox?

[Jstub]

 

Is she in detox?

 

Detox first. I have the info of the facility and will keep checking if she leaves early.

[2sunny]

Glad to hear that! Good for her! It's a start in the right direction!

[Jstub]

So as the title says, I am such an idiot. I had a crazy weekend... my W said that she will put off the whole checking into the facility till next week, however she will start the detox with the pills. I said ok.. and we spent the whole weekend + Monday (took the day off) together in the house and we had such a crazy time. We probably had sex more than 10 times in the span of these 3 days, stayed up all night just crazy crazy sex and just talking about what got us here and our problems etc... the way she was looking at me, the way i was looking at her... there was so much passion, so much fire, I could not believe it. During those 3 days, she did not take a single pill and she said her headache is so much better... I checked her bag and the bathroom for pills etc, I did not find anything.

 

I know what happened was just stupid and it does not help with anything. I told her this morning that nothing really changes and that I will not put up with her OM BS and she needs to go into rehab and not live here still.. ughh... I had such a good time... 3 steps forward 10 steps back!!!!

[carhill]

Google 'hysterical bonding'

[2sunny]

So as the title says, I am such an idiot. I had a crazy weekend... my W said that she will put off the whole checking into the facility till next week, however she will start the detox with the pills. I said ok.. and we spent the whole weekend + Monday (took the day off) together in the house and we had such a crazy time. We probably had sex more than 10 times in the span of these 3 days, stayed up all night just crazy crazy sex and just talking about what got us here and our problems etc... the way she was looking at me, the way i was looking at her... there was so much passion, so much fire, I could not believe it. During those 3 days, she did not take a single pill and she said her headache is so much better... I checked her bag and the bathroom for pills etc, I did not find anything.

 

I know what happened was just stupid and it does not help with anything. I told her this morning that nothing really changes and that I will not put up with her OM BS and she needs to go into rehab and not live here still.. ughh... I had such a good time... 3 steps forward 10 steps back!!!!

 

Why didn't she start detox when she said she would? Any reason?

 

In the mind of an addict - always tomorrow or next week.

 

If she's not showing signs of withdrawal - then she was still taking them... You won't find them - they start hiding it better. She goes pee right? Good time to take it. She showers right? Good time to take it. You get the idea.

 

And the sex. Don't get distracted... She's not the first gal to manipulate and control with sex, it worked to some degree right? She stayed all weekend and didn't have to stay with Daddy. She also thought you might change your mind and not require her to change at all. It happens, a LOT!

[Jstub]

Why didn't she start detox when she said she would? Any reason?

 

In the mind of an addict - always tomorrow or next week.

 

If she's not showing signs of withdrawal - then she was still taking them... You won't find them - they start hiding it better. She goes pee right? Good time to take it. She showers right? Good time to take it. You get the idea.

 

And the sex. Don't get distracted... She's not the first gal to manipulate and control with sex, it worked to some degree right? She stayed all weekend and didn't have to stay with Daddy. She also thought you might change your mind and not require her to change at all. It happens, a LOT!

 

I don't know why she did not start her detox when she said she would - her excuse was because she wanted to spend time with me and the kids etc. I know it's just an excuse.

 

As for signs of withdrawal - I am really confused. She did not show any - She said her headaches have been gone for a couple of days. My explanation to this is that she is obsessed about looking good and the pills were making her look bloated, her face puffy, her belly puffy - she just hates herself. I always thought her headaches were an excuse for being on some drug. But now, since they started affecting her looks, she wants to get off of them. I am telling you, her looks come first. This does not mean she will become clean, maybe she will replace the pills with another drug. I checked the facility and she has not checked in yet. I have not called her and I will wait and see what she does.

 

About the sex. While in the moment I really enjoyed it, the images in my head with her doing it with OM haunt me, and I start resenting her, hating her sometimes. The fact that she is still in contact with him disappoints me even more. I know she may have used sex to get her way, but the way she was looking at me.. that was not fake, I know in that moment she loved me, but I also know that, in reality, she does not really love me - because if she did, she would not be doing what she is doing. She shows no signs of regrets (talk is cheap), she still talks to OM because she wants to know what that was, why it happened, did he BS her, was it real. I have told her, you go figure out what you need to figure out, that's your business. For me this is over, it's been over.

 

I don't think she managed to manipulate me with sex - after 3 days of fun, I woke up and told myself - nothing has changed - you enjoyed your time, nothing wrong with that - but don't get off track.

[Owl]

Did you ASK her what she did with her pills? How she was "detox'ing" without having given them over to you?

 

Why did you 'accept' her choice to put off going into rehab for a week? Why didn't you insist that she go as she'd planned?

 

And I've not read the recent pages...what's the status of her communication/interaction with OM at this point?

[Jstub]

Did you ASK her what she did with her pills? How she was "detox'ing" without having given them over to you?

 

Why did you 'accept' her choice to put off going into rehab for a week? Why didn't you insist that she go as she'd planned?

 

And I've not read the recent pages...what's the status of her communication/interaction with OM at this point?

 

I have had the pills that I know of for a while. I just know she got about 30 in a legit way a while ago. Dont know more details. I did not ask any questions because I had a moment of weakness. I had missed her and the kids had missed her. So I just allowed it. I know it was wrong - I did not hold my ground.

 

As for OM - I know they are in contact. I am no longer spying on her so I don't know much details. She says she wants to find out what it is that happened. Him being a complete stranger and all (some guy that added her on fb) how could have they connected in such a way bla bla. That she wants to figure it out. My attitude towards that is go figure out what you want, but I will not be part of it. I am proceeding with divorce. She begs me not to, but I have already seen lawyers etc and I know my options. Will be filing very soon.

[Owl]

I have had the pills that I know of for a while. I just know she got about 30 in a legit way a while ago. Dont know more details. I did not ask any questions because I had a moment of weakness. I had missed her and the kids had missed her. So I just allowed it. I know it was wrong - I did not hold my ground.

 

As for OM - I know they are in contact. I am no longer spying on her so I don't know much details. She says she wants to find out what it is that happened. Him being a complete stranger and all (some guy that added her on fb) how could have they connected in such a way bla bla. That she wants to figure it out. My attitude towards that is go figure out what you want, but I will not be part of it. I am proceeding with divorce. She begs me not to, but I have already seen lawyers etc and I know my options. Will be filing very soon.

 

Sounds similar to my wife when she was still very "foggy". She got really angry and asked me "Why can't I just go see if what we have is real? If it's not, I'll come back to you!".

 

Not one of her more stellar moments of logic, but there you go.

 

Spell out clearly to her that you're not her backup plan. You're either her choice...or you're her past.

 

Set that expectation, and hold yourself to it as well.

 

I took some sort of similar actions in our recovery. For a short time I entertained her idea of a "temporary seperation"...until I realized that she still intended to pursue a possible relationship with him during that time, and that she was willing to sign a lease ensuring that our "temporary" seperation would last at least a year.

 

I had enough. The next day after that conversation, I sat down with a lawyer and learned about how the divorce process works for our state, and figured out what we needed to do to get that started. That night, I informed her that I wasn't willing to wait for a year (at least) for her to make up her mind. If she wanted to "seperate" for that long, I would file for divorce and move on with my life without her. I reminded her that she still had the same choice I'd already given her...she could have him in her life, or me...but not both.

 

She was totally shocked, completely shellshocked. I stood my ground, made it clear this was MY decision, and that I wasn't backing down.

 

That was the night she made her choice.

 

We've been recovered very well for several years now.

 

It won't be that simple for you, given your wife's addiction. Personally, I don't recommend staying married to her...she's both an addict AND she's cheated on you. There is very little positive foundation to rebuild from that I've seen. Until she's truly clear of that addiction, there's no way she can be a fit wife, nor a fit mother (again, my opinion and I understand yours may differ).

 

My advice for you would be to seek PROFESSIONAL assistance in recovering your marriage with this woman. You need help, from someone who is both a marriage counselor, and has experience in dealing with trying to save marriages to addicts.

 

There isn't a book to follow on this path. Too many variables outside the "norm" to go that route, IMHO.

 

You might consider working directly with the Harley's or some other counselors. They'll give you better advice than you'll find on the internet, my friend.

[2sunny]

There's really no starting point since she isn't in detox and following through on a path to get clean and stay clean. It's a full time job for a while once she starts (IF she starts).

 

Your best plan right now is to be taking good care of YOUR best interest and your kids.

 

She's not thinking clearly... I can guarantee you.

 

Look out for you. Encourage her to get well. But you can't do it for her and you can't make her do it.

[Jstub]

Thank you owl and 2sunny - I hear you loud and clear. I completely understand that there is no chance of reconciliation at the current state. I am not willing to put up with the nonsense, can't do it, even if in moments of weakness I would like to give in and run after her and try to get her back - but, when I think about all her actions, I do not want her back.

 

I think she thinks I am not serious about divorce, that I would not do that to her, because according to her, she did not do this by choice... I forced her (right... crazy) - Told her countless times, cheating is 100% your fault, marriage problems - I take 50% blame for it and you better own up to your part.

 

If she is not in the facility by end of this week, I will file for divorce. That is her last chance - I just don't want to add more pressure if she is willing to work on herself. However, even if she gets clean, she needs to take further action. OM has to go, transparency, have to see that she is doing it for the right reasons and not because the OM is broke, therapy - basically she has to give it all, if i see all those things, then I might give it my all for one last time. Not sure, but I might.

 

Forgiveness is the final form of love. --Reinhold Niebuhr

[2sunny]

I think that's a clear, healthy boundary you decided on.

 

Now it's time to allow her to understand exactly what it is (as you stated here) and he consequences if she doesn't do what she needs to do.

 

You're doing great. I know it probably doesn't seem like it - but you are.

 

Hugs - I know it's hard!!!!

[Jstub]

You suggest I tell her? I was thinking I shouldn't tell her anything - I have spoken about the same things over and over I feel like a broken record. She keeps telling me that I don't understand her and I keep telling her I am not judging her actions anymore because I don't care, my problem is how her actions make ME feel. That I will not sit idle, while she takes me for a ride. You think at this point it make sense to tell her my decision?

[2sunny]

You suggest I tell her? I was thinking I shouldn't tell her anything - I have spoken about the same things over and over I feel like a broken record. She keeps telling me that I don't understand her and I keep telling her I am not judging her actions anymore because I don't care, my problem is how her actions make ME feel. That I will not sit idle, while she takes me for a ride. You think at this point it make sense to tell her my decision?

 

Yes. As in - you really need to do this. If you don't do this - expect that I will do that.

 

Not as if it's open for discussion or as judgment - just as a fact of what you expect and what happens off she doesn't do it.

 

Detox and rehab could take months to get her head thinking clearly - but a consequence should happen if she doesn't intend to get clean and show actions of continually moving toward staying clean. Same goes for her OM and the affair. No contact at all should be your boundary. All her focus needs to be on getting clean and focused on healing her marriage. If its not - you have your answer by what she does or doesn't do.

[Jstub]

She now claims she is in love with OM and that she has not felt like this for years and that it is no coincidence that they 2 met at such hard times. That they were both not looking for this but they can't just get it out of their heads. So basically, instead of going to rehab, I discovered that she is planning a weekend with OM, calls to hotels using MY VOIP (how dumb of her) etc. I smelled something fishy with her excuses so I just looked around a little bit and put the pieces together etc.

 

I have now given up, I will go NC unless it is absolutely necessary (kids, finances etc). She called me once today and sent me a message asking how I am doing - did not reply.

 

So disappointed in her yet again. Oh well... happens I guess.

 

I told her I will be filing for divorce next week - she said, why does it matter, it's just legal crap - I said, I want to cut you out of my life completely. She said that she will not sign ANYTHING at this point. I said that's fine, then I'll get an uncontested case, even better. Afterwards she said, the reason why she is meeting OM is to see if this is real or if she's making a mistake and that it's not what I am thinking, she knows it will turn into **** as soon as real life kicks in (this woman contradicts herself so many times) - I asked her to stop her crap and leave me the f alone and that I hope she finds what she is looking for on the weekend.

[Steen719]

She now claims she is in love with OM and that she has not felt like this for years and that it is no coincidence that they 2 met at such hard times. That they were both not looking for this but they can't just get it out of their heads. So basically, instead of going to rehab, I discovered that she is planning a weekend with OM, calls to hotels using MY VOIP (how dumb of her) etc. I smelled something fishy with her excuses so I just looked around a little bit and put the pieces together etc.

 

I have now given up, I will go NC unless it is absolutely necessary (kids, finances etc). She called me once today and sent me a message asking how I am doing - did not reply.

 

So disappointed in her yet again. Oh well... happens I guess.

 

I told her I will be filing for divorce next week - she said, why does it matter, it's just legal crap - I said, I want to cut you out of my life completely. She said that she will not sign ANYTHING at this point. I said that's fine, then I'll get an uncontested case, even better. Afterwards she said, the reason why she is meeting OM is to see if this is real or if she's making a mistake and that it's not what I am thinking, she knows it will turn into **** as soon as real life kicks in (this woman contradicts herself so many times) - I asked her to stop her crap and leave me the f alone and that I hope she finds what she is looking for on the weekend.

 

Sorry, Jstub. I know you are disappointed and hoped things would be different. You have looked at it realistically, though, and given her chances. She has made her own choice and it is one she will most likely regret at some point. She is still lying to you. I just don't understand what makes a person be able to look you straight in the eyes and lie to you again.

 

She reminds of a girlfriend of a friend of my son. She kept telling this kid that she loved him, but she needed to get other guys out of her system and then eventually, they would end up together. He put up with it. My son tried to talk with him about it; the kid even quit their band so he could spend more time with her. He followed her to a college near her instead of the colleges his mom wanted him to go to. My son said he was one of the smartest kids he had ever seen in Math...could have gone to a great college, probably with scholarships, but he chose her. Well, she kept getting other guys out of her system, discarding them when it wasn't quite what she wanted. She moved back home...he is still at the college he chose to be near her. He did not end up with her, of course (well, she may come back and he would say yes), and now he is 21 and spent the last 5 or 6 years following her around like a sad puppy, instead of having a great time with his friends and band-mates. I always felt bad for him, but was really just amazed at what kind of person she was that she thought that was alright to do that and at such a young age. Anyway...long story that wasn't about you....sorry, it just made me think of her and how I think she will most likely never change. She will always be looking for something other than what she has. Well, you see her now for what she is and you don't have to wonder anymore.

[2sunny]

She now claims she is in love with OM and that she has not felt like this for years and that it is no coincidence that they 2 met at such hard times. That they were both not looking for this but they can't just get it out of their heads. So basically, instead of going to rehab, I discovered that she is planning a weekend with OM, calls to hotels using MY VOIP (how dumb of her) etc. I smelled something fishy with her excuses so I just looked around a little bit and put the pieces together etc.

 

I have now given up, I will go NC unless it is absolutely necessary (kids, finances etc). She called me once today and sent me a message asking how I am doing - did not reply.

 

So disappointed in her yet again. Oh well... happens I guess.

 

I told her I will be filing for divorce next week - she said, why does it matter, it's just legal crap - I said, I want to cut you out of my life completely. She said that she will not sign ANYTHING at this point. I said that's fine, then I'll get an uncontested case, even better. Afterwards she said, the reason why she is meeting OM is to see if this is real or if she's making a mistake and that it's not what I am thinking, she knows it will turn into **** as soon as real life kicks in (this woman contradicts herself so many times) - I asked her to stop her crap and leave me the f alone and that I hope she finds what she is looking for on the weekend.

 

Dang, I'm sorry to hear that. She's not in her right mind, remember? Know that!

 

She will do anything to avoid going to detox and rehab. It's hard and will be very painful withdrawals IF she goes. The sex last weekend - was a manipulation tactic in hopes that you would eliminate your boundary/guidelines/and requirements for her.

 

You're not dealing with the "real" her. You're not.

 

Stick with what you're doing. It's hard - but it's the only way to either get her to get help and stay together or she keeps using and runs off with that dork.

 

Find hobbies that make you happy, stay busy. And love your kids like you have been doing.

 

My heart is heavy for you. IF she wants to get well - NOTHING would stand in her way. IF she doesn't want to get well -NOTHING will keep her from her drug of choice.

 

What meds has she been taking now, any idea? Most pain meds are a gnarly detox once someone is hook on them. The mind takes a long time to clear after the physical turbulence subsides.

 

Best to let that kite fly in the wind - since that's what she wants right now. There's no stopping someone who doesn't want to stop. Even when they WANT to stop - its still damn hard! That drug just pulls them back in every time they experience any emotional pain. It's getting past that emotional pain that's key. Clearing away what pain they have - and letting it all go.

 

You can't do that for her...she must make it so bad that she gets desperate to never want the drug again. It's hard to watch someone go down... But if they suffer enough while doing that - they get to a point that they are sick of being sick and sick of themselves = enough to never want to go back.

 

If she's not willing - you can't make her.

 

Pray for her though... Even if you don't normally pray. She needs prayers.

[2sunny]

Here's that formula for change. Notice that if her resistance is bigger than the sum of the others - change wont happen.

 

 

 

Formula for Change - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[BewitchedandBothered]

I thought these additional information would be helpful:

 

1. We had the kids back to back and this caused my wife A LOT of stress. She always freaked out.

2. My wife does not work. She is a stay at home mom.

3. The kids are very difficult to handle and cause a lot of stress. It's screaming all day.

4. My wife has been suffering from severe headaches and recently started blaming me for the headaches. Saying that, it's because I am controlling her she feels trapped and her body is telling her something is wrong - (I became controlling and paranoid after her EA and possible PA.)

5. She was expecting her headaches would go away once we made the separation official, but guess what? The headaches are still there. Now she says, it's because of the situation.

What's wrong with being a stay at home Mom? It is an often thankless job and many who do this feel unappreciated and taken for granted. the kids are needing attention, hence all the screaming. She is clearly overwhelmed.

[2sunny]

Read the thread...

 

 

Kids screaming may be due to Moms lack of focus and attention. How else are they to get her attention?

 

They may now be able to live in a peace and serene environment... And when they do - they won't act out that way.

 

I stayed home with my kids for many years - we never had screaming. Laughing yes, screaming no.

 

When they learn that they are value when they speak - they tend not to have a need to scream.

 

 

The OP wasn't criticizing her staying at home - he was just describing his home life. That's my take though.

[Jstub]

Sorry, Jstub. I know you are disappointed and hoped things would be different. You have looked at it realistically, though, and given her chances. She has made her own choice and it is one she will most likely regret at some point. She is still lying to you. I just don't understand what makes a person be able to look you straight in the eyes and lie to you again.

 

She reminds of a girlfriend of a friend of my son. She kept telling this kid that she loved him, but she needed to get other guys out of her system and then eventually, they would end up together. He put up with it. My son tried to talk with him about it; the kid even quit their band so he could spend more time with her. He followed her to a college near her instead of the colleges his mom wanted him to go to. My son said he was one of the smartest kids he had ever seen in Math...could have gone to a great college, probably with scholarships, but he chose her. Well, she kept getting other guys out of her system, discarding them when it wasn't quite what she wanted. She moved back home...he is still at the college he chose to be near her. He did not end up with her, of course (well, she may come back and he would say yes), and now he is 21 and spent the last 5 or 6 years following her around like a sad puppy, instead of having a great time with his friends and band-mates. I always felt bad for him, but was really just amazed at what kind of person she was that she thought that was alright to do that and at such a young age. Anyway...long story that wasn't about you....sorry, it just made me think of her and how I think she will most likely never change. She will always be looking for something other than what she has. Well, you see her now for what she is and you don't have to wonder anymore.

 

I don't understand how she can lie to me like this either. I am so hurt and so disappointed. I won't be chasing her around though - I will keep my dignity - I chased her enough and gave her enough chances. I am done with that.

[Jstub]

Dang, I'm sorry to hear that. She's not in her right mind, remember? Know that!

 

She will do anything to avoid going to detox and rehab. It's hard and will be very painful withdrawals IF she goes. The sex last weekend - was a manipulation tactic in hopes that you would eliminate your boundary/guidelines/and requirements for her.

 

You're not dealing with the "real" her. You're not.

 

Stick with what you're doing. It's hard - but it's the only way to either get her to get help and stay together or she keeps using and runs off with that dork.

 

Find hobbies that make you happy, stay busy. And love your kids like you have been doing.

 

My heart is heavy for you. IF she wants to get well - NOTHING would stand in her way. IF she doesn't want to get well -NOTHING will keep her from her drug of choice.

 

What meds has she been taking now, any idea? Most pain meds are a gnarly detox once someone is hook on them. The mind takes a long time to clear after the physical turbulence subsides.

 

Best to let that kite fly in the wind - since that's what she wants right now. There's no stopping someone who doesn't want to stop. Even when they WANT to stop - its still damn hard! That drug just pulls them back in every time they experience any emotional pain. It's getting past that emotional pain that's key. Clearing away what pain they have - and letting it all go.

 

You can't do that for her...she must make it so bad that she gets desperate to never want the drug again. It's hard to watch someone go down... But if they suffer enough while doing that - they get to a point that they are sick of being sick and sick of themselves = enough to never want to go back.

 

If she's not willing - you can't make her.

 

Pray for her though... Even if you don't normally pray. She needs prayers.

 

2sunny - she is on vicodin. However, I will not sit here and blame everything on the drugs. I have seen her high plenty of times and she did not act this way. This is deeper than that - this cold person she has become, it's not just the drugs, I refuse to believe that. She changed, she had a change of heart and she stopped loving me and saw me as an obstacle - that's all I was, an obstacle. What do you do to an obstacle that's standing in your way? You try to destroy it - but not me, I will not be destroyed by her.

[2sunny]

Druggies and alcoholics always lie! They also steal your peace of mind - IF you ALLOW them to!

 

Learn about active disease... She's not thinking clearly.

[Jstub]

What's wrong with being a stay at home Mom? It is an often thankless job and many who do this feel unappreciated and taken for granted. the kids are needing attention, hence all the screaming. She is clearly overwhelmed.

 

As 2sunny said, obviously you have not read the thread. I was trying to describe the situation. I had always been very grateful for her putting her life on hold and staying at home and taking care of the kids. Cooking for us every day. I always thanked her, every single day, for every small thing she did, I showed appreciation. I also helped her around the house, it's not like I said, oh it's your job - I cleaned the bathroom, the kitchen and cleaned a very good share of the kids' poop, did laundry, washed dishes - you name it. I am fully aware of how tough a job it is to be a stay at home mom and that is why, after my work day, I was at home right on time, taking over the kids and asking her to go rest. Maybe a lot of people take that for granted or don't appreciate it, not me. If I look back and think about it, she always acted like I had the easy life, "What! all you have to do is go work and pay the bills", as if it's nothing. Nothing was ever good enough for her - NOTHING.