She cant explain why she wants to divorce

[2sunny]

No worries Blue Knight.

 

But I have to disagree with your truth theory.

 

There is HER truth and HIS truth. Each person has their own based on THEIR own experience and perspective.

 

For example: we could both be watching a sunset. I could think it fabulous and amazing - that is MY truth! You could be at the same place- at the same time and think it sucks because it's cold and the clouds are blocking the sunset. That's YOUR truth.

 

They are both valued! They are EACH our OWN TRUTH. Each persons experience and perspective changes what their truth IS. Both are correct. But it is that persons truth.

 

It is also valuable (especially when in any relationship) to KNOW what the other persons truth is... That way one knows what the other is thinking/feeling. Any lie (even by omission or half truth) isnt helpful to have the partner understand what can be adjusted.

 

That is the issue here - is that Peter hasn't been allowed her truth. She isn't telling what's REALLY going on - or what can be adjusted. Until he knows - there's nothing that can be done.

 

He needs to find her truth. That will be a starting point.

 

Any blame shifting or pointing the finger isn't productive.

 

She needs to own HOW she participated and he needs to own how HE participated.

 

When they determine what they DON'T intend to DO anymore (the things that pissed off the other spouse) THEN they can make an agreement to CHANGE the behavior that was pissing the other one off. But he won't know if she doesn't tell.

 

Maybe she needs to take a leave from school for a while. Maybe he needs to exhibit less controlling behavior. Maybe...... We could go on and on - but the one he REALLY needs to ask is HER. He needs HER TRUTH.

 

I hope I'm conveying it well enough through typing...

 

Nasty exchanges aren't productive. They both need to get to what the CAUSE of the anger is. And be sure to change the circumstances that are the cause.

 

He needs to go to her immediately and find out HER truth. She's hiding away and not facing reality. It's time she owns what's bothering her.

 

Then something can be done about it.

[2sunny]

And if she just wants the divorce and won't tell you what's wrong - you have NO choice but to give her the divorce - and then accept that it's just over.

 

So IF that's what she wants - DO IT.

[petterr]

So insightfull alot of threads here!

 

 

Well! She turned up together with her younger sister om FB! Ego- picture on both of them. Going out tonight!

 

I just feel hate right now! Shes entitled to have fun being a single woman. Thats probably how she thinks of it. Me... Well the word B..h comes to mind!

 

Things like this that forces me to drop her.

 

So maby its a good thing in the end!

[Steadfast]

There is HER truth and HIS truth. Each person has their own based on THEIR own experience and perspective.

 

For example: we could both be watching a sunset. I could think it fabulous and amazing - that is MY truth! You could be at the same place- at the same time and think it sucks because it's cold and the clouds...

 

It IS important to know what truth is, or isn't.

 

sunny, you know I've got your back, but I have to side with reason here. The TRUTH in your scenario is you both watched a sunset; the rest is perception. Like everything else in nature there's an order to truth. There is real and unreal. True and untrue. Perception isn't truth, it's opinion.

 

All my opinion of course. But in Peter's case...in everyone's, there is a truth. Just one. Twisting it won't change the truth, it'll change what someone hears. This is why untruth is so utterly damaging. It's nothing new either; Pontius Pilate asked Christ "What is truth?" after Christ told him He was the truth and the life. Untruths are as old as untrue people.

 

All that said, very few betrayed spouses ever get the full truth, and some don't even get a decent explanation. Why? It's because the betrayed would rather not admit to any of it. It is not a pretty picture when you realize that your spouse is not only betraying you, but in some twisted way enjoying it. It's a sad commentary on society and human nature when people gain enjoyment from being cruel. But, when they embrace that, it embraces them back. It is a known fact that evil destroys evil. Bad place.

 

Once again Peter, you may not know why but you know what. Believe me when I say that's good enough.

[petterr]

Stedfast!

 

Your right! I know the what and it fightens me to think that I loved this woman for so many years for her to end up like this.

 

Focusing on those years and all the good stuff that was us makes me realise the one thing i perhaps need to build my reality around. I have been so caught up in the fact that its my loss. She however loses just as much as me even if its her choice. She didnt thing this break ut througt and now she lives her fantasy. Perhaps shes satisfied with that for now but...

 

Who wants that life in the long run?

 

Come to think of it my life right now opens up alot of potential if I only could get passed this. I have a good economy, social kind of guy, single and not that ugly!

 

Egoboosting myself could be some kind of medicin against the insanity.

[worldgonewrong]

I respectfully say that this thread has gotten waaaay too long in the short time since it started. 1 week and it's 9 pages already?

 

Petterr, you need to take a deep breath, step back, and digest a ton of info you've gotten here so far. You're in 'reactive mode' now. For your own sanity, ease back.

Digest some of the minutiae happening day-to-day, hour-to-hour, and allow yourself to sift through it before reacting. Otherwise you're gonna get caught in a feedback-loop, like some posters have in past - and what happens is that the helpful people ultimately get a little resentful of dishing out the same advice, and variations thereof, over and over. I say that will all respect, no sarcasm or malice.

[petterr]

Worldgonewrong!

 

Your probably right! Thanks for the advice!

[2sunny]

My vote is bump her off the fence she's sitting on.

 

Either she wants to come home and be a wife and mother - go to counseling to WORK on the problems she seems to NOT be addressing

 

OR

 

Stay there by avoiding her life as she knew it and divorce her.

[justsomebody]

from Findingnemo:

 

"...If indeed she has a mental issue, then it would be wrong to let this go any longer. Time will not sort things out. And at least you can confirm if this is the case..."

 

Many years ago I read a story about a homeless woman died on a Toronto street. It turned out that this woman had a wonderful family, but mental disease drove her away from her family but her family in some way also had abandoned her since they didn't insist her to get help.

 

Job, study and family all falling apart are major signs of mental illness. Please talk to her family and help her.

 

Even if it turns out totally not the case, you didn't owe your kids for not doing all you can to help their mother.

 

I am very sorry that this happens to you. Take one day at a time.

[2sunny]

Your typed words that she said - what happened - happened and can not be changed...

 

Makes me wonder what is it that "happened"? Has she stated what cannot be changed?

 

Also - certain things CAN be changed - and SHE has the ability to change things... Like moving home and going to counseling and participating within the family and making a firm commitment to get healthy and balanced.

 

She CAN change those things by working on them.

 

If she doesn't intend to change a thing - she's already given you her answer = nothing is planned to change.

[petterr]

I have talked to both of her sisters about her health. Her older sister said it was no longer my concern and that I had to move on. She did say that " We are all concerned about her health". This is the same sister mind you that hopes we will end up together again. And to top it all of she works with exactly these kind of problems. A therapist! Go figure what she really thinks. But shes trying to push me away for my sake, I guess!

 

When the ex says what happened happened shes refering to her behavior and how she treated me during the separation. Clearly her defence mecanisms. Dont think she wants to face her dark sides because who would. Its easier to minimize what happened or to put the blame elsewere right!

 

right now she doesnt want to change anything. So we are heading straight to our divorce.

[2sunny]

I suppose her sister telling you to move on says everything your W won't tell you.

[petterr]

True! But it bothers me that she can say that and still share her own hopes with me. Kind of puzzles me acctually. Well It could simply be that she feels like Im one of the good guys and dthat we did have a good relationship once and... That she knows I have been good to her sister. Perhaps shes fearing for whats going to happen next. Who knows!

[2sunny]

I'm real sorry... Mainly that your W just won't be honest. That sucks!

[petterr]

Thanks! Shes not being honest to herself! Many thats even worse!

[findingnemo]

This really sucks! Since her sister says you should move on and that they will handle it, I think you may just have to accept that. It may be that the sister is protecting you from something...or that she has determined that it's not a mental issue at all.

 

Sometimes you just have to move forward even when all is not clear. Start the D proceedings knowing you've done all you can. Your kids need you stable and calm, not stressed and worried. You never know what the future holds but you have to keep moving ahead to get there.

 

Sorry, man.

[Phanpooh]

she still have her sis, they take care of her, just move on and do what you want...

[Steadfast]

I have talked to both of her sisters about her health. Her older sister said it was no longer my concern and that I had to move on.

 

No longer your concern? Didn't you say you and your wife had children? This is mind boggling to me, but typical. Just another example of wasting time trying to 'rally the troops' in an effort to save your marriage. Blood is thicker than water (and, obviously, marriage, children and legal/moral obligations) and remember this the next time you hear someone advise "Expose! Tell the parents! Tell the boss! Tell everyone!" Doesn't work.

 

Like how this tastes Peter? It's called being crapped on. Bring an umbrella 'cause the storm's just starting. I'm betting her sister is worried you'll clean her out, keep the kids and basically move on before wifey comes to her senses. She may be trying to protect you, but let me ask you: has anyone from her family called to see how you're doing? How the kids are?

 

The answer will tell you how much they really care.

 

As for her supposed 'illness', that didn't stop her and sis from dolling up for a night of bar hopping. And bragging about it on FB no less. *sigh*.

 

And to top it all of she works with exactly these kind of problems. A therapist!

 

That only means she's professionally trained to make things worse.

 

Petterr, you need to take a deep breath, step back, and digest a ton of info you've gotten here so far. You're in 'reactive mode' now. For your own sanity, ease back.

 

Good advice here and point taken wgw. I have no desire to ramp you up Peter, but I do admit to feeling the burn between my ears reading this.

 

My advice remains the same. Judge her actions. Still, it's good to let the emotions settle before making any important decisions. We all check the weather to see how to dress before going out, right? It's the same here. Look at the situation realistically and respond accordingly. Focus on the children, keep yourself going with good diet and exercise. Rest. It's probably time to look into getting some legal advice. Do that soon-

[petterr]

Thanks!

 

I do have contact with both her sisters but I get your point!

 

This morning their picture on FB was removed. She probably has a hard time deciding WHO she wants to present herself. ItS happened before.

 

Sce called me up an hour ago. See if you can analyze this...

 

I asked her why she act the way she does. Being cold and angry all the time towards me. Theres no need to be, I said. You havent changed a bit since this started. Its because I have to, she replied. But its destroying everything between us even our relationship with the kids. I just have to. And then she was silent for two minutes.

 

A lover or If she crumbles on her path her true feelings would show.

 

Just dont get her but something in me is slowly changing. Cant understand irradical behavior, hence the word irradical. Getting tired of this and kind of... For lack of a better word ... Bored!

[Steadfast]

Sce called me up an hour ago. See if you can analyze this...

 

I asked her why she act the way she does. Being cold and angry all the time towards me. Theres no need to be, I said. You havent changed a bit since this started. Its because I have to, she replied. But its destroying everything between us even our relationship with the kids. I just have to. And then she was silent for two minutes.

 

I have no idea what she's afraid of saying Peter, just as I had no idea what my ex was thinking when she did the very same thing. Part of you wonders if they're afraid of burning bridges, protecting their feelings, protecting yours, or just don't really know how to verbalize what they're feeling.

 

Know this; she has a plan. I found out later that my ex was so wrapped up in what she was feeling about other men (or her situation, take your pick) that dealing with me was simply too much to handle at the same time. It took some doing, but she finally did admit to putting me and my feelings way back on the back burner. When she said "I'm sorry" it didn't mean she was sorry about what she had done, or what she was doing, she was sorry that she didn't care what it doing to me. I believe she was being honest.

 

She was being honest about not caring. But not being stupid, she knew I could make lots of trouble for her. She wanted me available, if she needed something, and wanted me (everyone, actually) to think she was dealing with some kind of overwhelming emotional turmoil. The reality is she was involved in a very high school-ish grade of drama. Rebellion is sexy.

 

Like your wife I'm positive, there was some pretty heavy gripping going on about the kids and what kind of harm she might do. My ex was counting on my maturity to make sure they were ok. In summary, she basically gave me the stick, strapped on her parachute and jumped out of our marriage.

 

The whys and wherefores are all out there for you to discover. In my experience, knowing more about what she was doing/had done didn't help me nearly as much as I thought it would. By the time some of the truth had trickled down to me, I'd moved well past needing it. About the only thing it did was give additional reassurance that I'd done the right thing.

 

Yep, boring. That's when you know you've had enough.

 

Hang in-

[2sunny]

Good post Steadfast.

 

She must have some things she's got going on while she's away.

 

She doesn't want you to know what hose things are.

 

If it were me - and since she won't tell - I'd head up to her area after getting a family member (not her sisters) to watch the kids for several days.

 

I'd sit in a rental car and follow every move she made. I'd SEE what she's doing since she won't ever tell you.

 

A little peace of mind - sure- the. You may actually have a chance of knowing what her day to day life is like.

 

 

Seriously - IF she finds out and is mad - you can tell her "how would YOU like it if I disappeared with no explanation?" she hasn't been thinking of anyone but herself. She walked away from her kids! That makes ME mad at her!!!

 

Aren't the kids asking her for an explanation? She is causing harm that they may very well never recover from. When my exH Mom walked away from three kids under the age of 7 - they all have suffered from abandonment and trust issues through all their years. My exH doesn't like or trust women. He also doesn't respect them. I'm sure it's because his Mom just walked out of his life when he was 7. She re- entered when he was 17... The damage was done. He has felt unloved his whole life.

 

If your W thinks she's not affecting her kids - she better think again. I think it's terrible that she's not with them without a serious explanation to them.

[petterr]

2Sunny! Sorry but another missunderstanding on your part. She has thebkids every other week. She has however acted verry passive with the kids the last couple of years and especially now during her kaos. At some point FB seemed more important. My son has aked her why this is going on. She gave him the same strangeness that she gave me. I had to step in later and give him perspective. He still doesnt get it but hes not being very talkative about it. I appriciate you sharing on your last post. Cant really understand peoples selfishness!

 

stedfast! Great post, thanks! Im getting there. I think my understanding of what happened will take time. I surley hope I will reach that point when I dont care anymore. I feel reasured by your post that I will. Cant understand something that she cant understand herself or at least cant explain and everitime she makes a complete ass out of herself another part of my feelings for her dies.

[worldgonewrong]

right now she doesnt want to change anything. So we are heading straight to our divorce.

 

I'm sorry, man.

[Owl]

I still think that if FB seems to be the center of her distraction away from the marriage, you need to find out specifically why that is.

 

Did she ever use a shared, home computer to access her account from, or was it only on a laptop that she personally was the only one with access to?

 

Myself, I'd consider reviewing the cookies and history on that shared computer for other activities that may have occurred in conjunction with her FB activities. Access to e-card websites, etc...

 

I'd consider that if you were somehow to see her FB or email accounts, you'd get more information on the situation...just remember that sometimes home computers are left with a "remember me" checkbox...she might have left a home computer "logged in" that way, and you'd of course legally have to immediately sign out of her account if you found that it was set that way...

[petterr]

Checkt her e-mail, nothing! Fb no chance! Now when shes moved out I have come to the end of the line when it comes to all your suggestions Owl! Facebook in my book was a way to escape reality when she felt pressure answering questions she didnt have the answers to. Lover or no lover she sat starring into the computer screen even when I tried to have a serious conversation with her.

 

Today I removed my FB-account! Time to live in reality for a while! Started thinking of my posts on FB and what kind of things I shared. Well... The last three months most of my posts had to do with me and the kids and what I did with them. And I started to realise that I dont need any " likes" from others to know Im a good father. Thats probably why I posted them. Mind you perhaps one or two post a week.

 

No more russian roulette with the chance of seeing her adolesent behavior... Its perhaps time to move on. What happens in the future lies in the future. I will no longer get sucked into her strange new world.