Don't you hate when SHORT women require TALL men???

[udolipixie]

Of course I want a GF who meets my standards. Nobody, male or female, wants to date somebody who doesn't.

I wasn't stating, suggesting, or implying that someone does.

 

I was stating that you claiming height is the primary reason you can't get a GF is likely false as you most likely can get a GF.

 

The issue isn't getting a GF it's not getting a GF that fits your standards. I'm not really into the pity party focused on one factor as if you have no options and can't get any gal.

 

What you are not realizing is that my standards are far more lax than you think they are.

Doubtful.

 

If it was far more lax you'd most likely have a GF.

 

Average looking girl, healthy weight, doesn't have very short hair, not flat-chested, under 30.

Physical attractiveness is subjective though I've noted that with guys when rating 1-10 it tends to be that a 5 isn't average it's 6s and 7s. which are technically above average so...

 

That describes millions of women in California alone.

There's likely plentiful of average guys that are average height so exactly why would an average gal pass up an average guy (average includes average height) to be with a below average height guy with sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills?

 

Why would she want to be a part of your life and have you a part of hers? Dish out the whole being the best you that you can be when you're not even average but sub-par.

 

I believe that height is the primary reasons but there are also probably secondary things that are making it hard on me as well.

There are probably several primary reasons a gal may rule you out. Confidence, facial features, body, clothing.

 

Confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills are my biggest weaknesses.

These are probably some of the primary rule out reasons.

 

Thanks to having low confidence and self-esteem, I was shy and quiet for most of my life.

Another rule out reason.

 

So here I am, a guy who is not physically attractive who's confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills are below par.

More like a below average height guy with sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills. Physical attractiveness is subjective to me.

 

If I was tall or really good looking, the later personality traits wouldn't be that much of a drawback. Conversely if my personality traits were abvoe average, they could overcome me being short and average looking.

Probably best suited to work on that.

[somedude81]

Your standards have already been discussed and dissected to great detail on this board, and every female who has stepped into the conversation has pointed out that no, your standards go BEYOND this. You are extremely critical of women's bodies and appearance, and yet frame yourself as having "normal" standards. It's disingenuous and a major mark against you.

No they do not. Everybody just likes to pick on me thinking that because I can't get a GF, I shouldn't have any standards at all.

 

Untangle that, get some confidence, ask out some girls. The advice is always the same. Why do you ignore such helpful and straight forward advice? Even if "growing" the confidence is difficult, asking out girls is not. I'd kill for a solution to my similar problem that is so easy to undertake.

Just asking out girls is not going to work.

 

The only thing a string of rejections will do is make me think that I'm an even bigger loser.

Keep doing it. It never stops. Learn to enjoy the process, that's what I'm doing. The more I enjoy what I'm doing, the better the journey is for me. I think the key is to stop being so down about everything. It's really not as bad as you think it is. Self-improvement is a lifelong journey. Learn to enjoy it, otherwise you will always be unhappy. And it will be even harder to get a GF. Stop believing in the cycle, and make your own. Learn to make things fun.

The reason I'm not enjoying the process is because I'm so focused on the goal. It's the only thing I want and until I get it, nothing else matters.

 

The main reason you can't see that is because I'm several yeas older than you. God forbid you ever reach my age without getting anywhere with women, you will have nowhere near the same amount of optimism you have now.

Damn it, I want to say something - I've been thinking about how to respond to you since yesterday, because I can relate to you, but I also understand what others are getting at in their responses to you. I can't organize my thoughts, though, and others here communicate theirs so much better than I do (usually).

 

I just hope that you aren't still feeling this way when you're almost 37, like me. Hindsight really hit me when I was 34, and that was what came before my big depression; getting my heart broken around the same time, was just the icing on the cake.

And just like what I said to Wholigan, if I manage to hit 37 without things getting any better, I have no idea what I will be like. All I can imagine is that I'll be even more angry and bitter. That's not a future I'm looking for.

 

I empathize with you about getting your heart broken. It completely sucks. It's happened twice to me in the past four years. The most recent time was in November of last year and I'm still trying to get over it.

[somedude81]

If it was far more lax you'd most likely have a GF.

No because

There's likely plentiful of average guys that are average height so exactly why would an average gal pass up an average guy (average includes average height) to be with a below average height guy with sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills?

Is it any wonder that I have poor self-esteem?

 

It also shouldn't be a surprise that I see no way out of the sh*t hole that my life is.

 

Thanks for point out how hopeless everything is udolipixie

[jobaba]

What you are not realizing is that my standards are far more lax than you think they are.

 

Average looking girl, healthy weight, doesn't have very short hair, not flat-chested, under 30.

 

That describes millions of women in California alone.

I believe that height is the primary reasons but there are also probably secondary things that are making it hard on me as well.

 

Confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills are my biggest weaknesses.

 

I'm going to circumvent the back and forth banter here.

 

Dude. In all honesty, I suggest trying to surround yourself with better people. I've seen your requirements on your recent posts and you're right. You're not very picky or shallow.

 

People are going to discriminate against you because you are short, because you are still doing your first undergrad at age 31, because you are a 31 year old who has never had a GF.

 

Oh god to the last one. It's bad.

 

There are going to be people who are just not going to want to associate with you based on the above, let alone DATE you.

 

You know what kind of people are out there based on the people who post here.

 

It's a big world but ours is a relatively small one. You don't have room for that many people in your social circle. Surround it with less shallow ones, and the world will be a better place.

[udolipixie]

No because

Is it any wonder that I have poor self-esteem?

 

It also shouldn't be a surprise that I see no way out of the sh*t hole that my life is.

 

Thanks for point out how hopeless everything is udolipixie

It's only hopeless in the sense of not getting a gal that fits your standards not in the sense of having no options & can't get any gal.

 

It's likely only hopeless if you continue to have sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills

 

Self-improvement and personal development tends to work wonders.

 

No they do not. Everybody just likes to pick on me thinking that because I can't get a GF, I shouldn't have any standards at all.

Egh I've heard broaden your stnadrds not don't have any at all.

 

Quite interesting if you think being open to others out of your stndards is not having any at all.

 

Just asking out girls is not going to work.

Depends on how many you ask and their attraction for you.

 

The only thing a string of rejections will do is make me think that I'm an even bigger loser.

Perhaps it's best suited not to base your ego and feelings on women's reciprocation of your attraction.

 

The reason I'm not enjoying the process is because I'm so focused on the goal. It's the only thing I want and until I get it, nothing else matters.

Perhaps it's best suited to change the mindset.

 

And just like what I said to Wholigan, if I manage to hit 37 without things getting any better, I have no idea what I will be like. All I can imagine is that I'll be even more angry and bitter. That's not a future I'm looking for.

Why? At who?

 

No one is obligated to dole out sex or relationships for you. No one is obligated to reciprocate your attraction.

[ThaWholigan]

Just asking out girls is not going to work.

 

The only thing a string of rejections will do is make me think that I'm an even bigger loser.

 

The reason I'm not enjoying the process is because I'm so focused on the goal. It's the only thing I want and until I get it, nothing else matters.

 

The main reason you can't see that is because I'm several yeas older than you. God forbid you ever reach my age without getting anywhere with women, you will have nowhere near the same amount of optimism you have now.

 

. I could bet you £1million that I won't . I'd probably win too....

 

You absolutely HAVE to focus on the journey, if you want to get to the destination. Otherwise you will keep getting lost.

 

I must be a sucker, I don't know why I keep replying to you, you have a rebuttal for everything. It's like you actually love being unhappy and don't want to change

[udolipixie]

No because

It's true if it was far more lax you'd most likely have a GF.

 

In the because you quoted the gal is average that's already your standard

more lax would be less than the standards you have.

 

It's not that you can't get a GF it's that you can't get a GF that fits your standards most likely because of sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills.

[somedude81]

What do you want me to say.

 

That because of how I am, I should settle with a below average woman that I have absolutely no attraction for?

 

Sounds like the basis for a wonderful relationship.

 

Aside from the height, I am not bad physically.

 

My only issue is the social things and they can be improved. Frankly all I need is a girl to give me a chance and from that alone my confidence will skyrocket.

Edited March 26, 2012 by somedude81

[ThaWholigan]

What do you want me to say.

 

That because of how I am, I should settle with a below average woman that I have absolutely no attraction for?

 

Sounds like the basis for a wonderful relationship.

 

Aside from the height, I am not bad physically.

 

My only issue is the social things and they can be improved. Frankly all I need is a girl to give me a chance and from that alone my confidence will skyrocket.

No Somedude, that's not what we want you to say.

 

I don't really want you to say anything. I want you to make a conscious effort to work on your confidence, your social skills, your physical and mental health and become a happier person. Then I want you to go out and meet some new friends and eventually find yourself a GF. Then you can come back to this forum and tell everybody about it and actually have something new to say. Then we can all be happy and toast your success. That's what I want.

 

Yeah it's hard work, it's ****ing hard, I agree, but it has to be done.

[somedude81]

No Somedude, that's not what we want you to say.

 

I don't really want you to say anything. I want you to make a conscious effort to work on your confidence, your social skills, your physical and mental health and become a happier person. Then I want you to go out and meet some new friends and eventually find yourself a GF. Then you can come back to this forum and tell everybody about it and actually have something new to say. Then we can all be happy and toast your success. That's what I want.

 

Yeah it's hard work, it's ****ing hard, I agree, but it has to be done.

That process will take years.

 

Finding a girl that is willing to give me a chance will cause an almost over-night change.

[verhrzn]

What do you want me to say.

 

That because of how I am, I should settle with a below average woman that I have absolutely no attraction for?

 

Sounds like the basis for a wonderful relationship.

 

Aside from the height, I am not bad physically.

 

My only issue is the social things and they can be improved. Frankly all I need is a girl to give me a chance and from that alone my confidence will skyrocket.

 

.... You were perfectly willing to use a "practice girlfriend" to raise your confidence, until a better girl came along that you could snag.

 

And yes, because of who you are, you may need to lower your standards. You've said the exact same thing to me, so why are you exempt from your own advice?

[ThaWholigan]

That process will take years.

 

Finding a girl that is willing to give me a chance will cause an almost over-night change.

 

It might. True confidence will come from within though.

[jobaba]

That process will take years.

 

Finding a girl that is willing to give me a chance will cause an almost over-night change.

 

I have found some success in women who don't date that often in a traditional sense.

 

Sometimes women from foreign countries and women who have been married and divorced are a much better bargain.

 

They haven't dated and rejected hundreds of guys from Match.com and POF either because dating in their country is different or because they were married to someone so they were out of the game for a long time.

 

They are often better looking, smarter, and much better people than traditional women who have had a hundred dates by the time they are 27. And sometimes much less picky when it comes to things like looks and success.

 

Yes. This is from my REAL experience.

 

Ignore me at your peril.

[udolipixie]

That process will take years.

 

Finding a girl that is willing to give me a chance will cause an almost over-night change.

 

Doubtful.

 

If it was finding a gal that's willing to give you a chance you could most likely find that pretty easily.

 

I think you mean finding a gal that fits your standards.

 

As well as giving you a chance in the sense of "he's good let's see what happens" not settling, "he's all that's left", "he's short but", "I prefer and want something else but egh I can't get it".

[somedude81]

.... You were perfectly willing to use a "practice girlfriend" to raise your confidence, until a better girl came along that you could snag.

I really don't like the thought of using somebody for my gain.

 

My heart is too soft for that.

And yes, because of who you are, you may need to lower your standards. You've said the exact same thing to me, so why are you exempt from your own advice?

When did I ever tell you to lower your standards?

 

The advice that I remember giving you was to learn how to be a seducer. If you put as much effort into that as you do martial arts, you cold get almost any man you desire.

[udolipixie]

What do you want me to say.

That it's not some pity party focused on one thing as if you can't get a gal and have no options.

 

That because of how I am, I should settle with a below average woman that I have absolutely no attraction for?

...where did you get that?

 

Aside from the height, I am not bad physically.

In your opinion some gals my differ with attractiveness being usubjective at least to me.

 

My only issue is the social things and they can be improved. Frankly all I need is a girl to give me a chance and from that alone my confidence will skyrocket.

If it was a gal to give you a chance you'd most likely find that pretty easily.

 

I think you mean all you need is a gal who fits your standards to give you a chance.

 

So why should a gal who fits your standards give a below average height guy with sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills who may not fit her standards?

 

What exactly do you offer that would have a gal who fits your standards negate her own standards to be a part of your life and have you a part of her life?

[verhrzn]

 

When did I ever tell you to lower your standards?

 

The advice that I remember giving you was to learn how to be a seducer. If you put as much effort into that as you do martial arts, you cold get almost any man you desire.

 

And if you actually asked out girls who you found attractive on a regular basis, you could get the girlfriend you desire, without even having to pull out some BS games.

[PlumPrincess]

The only reason I'm 'obsessed' with height, is that I see it as the primary reason for why I can't get a GF.

Really, it's not your primary reason. Even if you were 6' you wouldn't get a girlfriend. There are enough male posters here who are not short and they still don't have girlfriends.

 

Of course I want a GF who meets my standards. Nobody, male or female, wants to date somebody who doesn't.

 

What you are not realizing is that my standards are far more lax than you think they are.

 

So here I am, a guy who is not physically attractive who's confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills are below par.

And you claim to be an average guy with normal standards? Your self-description makes people think that your standards are indeed too high. If you have crappy social/communication skills and low confidence, then maybe you should consider girls that don't meet your "average" standards completely? You can't describe yourself as sub-par in important parts of your personality and expect that average is what you should get. Sub-par is not average.

 

The main reason you can't see that is because I'm several yeas older than you. God forbid you ever reach my age without getting anywhere with women, you will have nowhere near the same amount of optimism you have now.

The difference between you and ThaWholigan is that you never ever had his optimism and the belief that you are responsible for your own happiness.

 

My only issue is the social things and they can be improved. Frankly all I need is a girl to give me a chance and from that alone my confidence will skyrocket.

Your social skills will not improve with a girlfriend. You develop good social skills by interacting with people and pushing the borders of your comfort zone inch by inch, cm by cm.

[somedude81]

It might. True confidence will come from within though.

Sometimes, it's as basic as just wanting to feel desired.

 

"If somebody likes me, then I must be great."

I have found some success in women who don't date that often in a traditional sense.

 

Sometimes women from foreign countries and women who have been married and divorced are a much better bargain.

 

They haven't dated and rejected hundreds of guys from Match.com and POF either because dating in their country is different or because they were married to someone so they were out of the game for a long time.

 

They are often better looking, smarter, and much better people than traditional women who have had a hundred dates by the time they are 27. And sometimes much less picky when it comes to things like looks and success.

 

Yes. This is from my REAL experience.

 

Ignore me at your peril.

I'm confused. What are you suggesting?

 

To date foreign women, and older divorcees?

[zengirl]

That process will take years.

 

Finding a girl that is willing to give me a chance will cause an almost over-night change.

 

First of all, I think THIS ATTITUDE is the 'primary reason' you cannot get a GF. More on that later.

 

The only reason I'm 'obsessed' with height, is that I see it as the primary reason for why I can't get a GF.

 

I would bet A LOT of money that height is NOT the primary reason you cannot get a GF. It's just one where no one can suggest improvements to you, so you fixate on it because you're too afraid to try to change and still fail at getting your desired outcome. I think that terrifies you. You want it to be transactional -- do this, get that -- and you're so terrified to do anything that isn't.

 

No they do not. Everybody just likes to pick on me thinking that because I can't get a GF, I shouldn't have any standards at all.

 

Oh, SD, you miss the point quite often.

 

Most of the posters who have discussed your standards, including myself, have very clearly said the issue is not that you have standards -- not even that you don't have a right to choose whatever standards you like. They've just pointed out it's hypocritical to be upset at women for having physical standards (and other standards!) when you have standards yourself and standards which many of the least shallow women would find unappealing.

 

You are saying your looks and height stop more shallow women from being attracted to you, but I think you're erroneously assuming a higher % of women care THAT much about those things (it will be more important among more young women in a college campus type atmosphere in SoCal, granted -- that's not the best place for someone who wants to avoid those judgments to be, simply put, but c'est la vie). The issue is the women who DON'T care about those things care about a myriad of other things that you're unwilling to cultivate -- a good self image, friendships, social skills, depth of character, empathy, etc. And a lot of those women are going to be thoroughly repelled by the notion that you, as a down-on-your-luck man, have more right to your standards than they have to theirs, whatever their standards are!

 

Yes, I think several of the things you've expressed put together make it relatively picky -- compared to the average guy's -- in the looks department, and I think the bigger problem is your standards are sadly vague in the other departments and lacking in depth.

 

tl;dr: Most women don't want to be wanted purely for their looks. The less shallow the woman, generally the less she wants you to care about her looks no matter how pretty she is. If there is some mythical woman who is shallow about her own looks -- and wants people to care about that -- but does not care what her partner looks like (unless she judges a man by his money, and then substitute hot looks for big $$$), she's extremely rare and I've never met or seen her.

 

That's been the point all along with the shallow thing -- not that you can't want whatever the heck it is you want. Go bananas. Seriously. Just don't whine when other people have criteria that bothers you, because that's hypocrisy. And almost no one finds hypocrisy sexy.

 

Just asking out girls is not going to work.

 

How do you know?

 

So here I am, a guy who is not physically attractive who's confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills are below par.

 

I would suggest tackling social skills, empathy, and friendships first. REAL friendships, not friends with girls you want to date. You need some guy friends. Female friends wouldn't hurt, if you weren't attracted to them and they weren't attracted to you, but you badly need male friends if you want to improve your social life overall.

 

If I was tall or really good looking, the later personality traits wouldn't be that much of a drawback. Conversely if my personality traits were abvoe average, they could overcome me being short and average looking.

 

Then why not work on your personality traits? Those are easier to change than your height.

 

Average looking girl, healthy weight, doesn't have very short hair, not flat-chested, under 30.

 

Well, going under the guise that your posts have been misunderstood in some way, try to show me what an "average" woman looks like to you, if you have time to do so.

 

Define healthy weight (picture or dress size or height/weight comparisons) and not flat-chested. I do not think many people would see those two criteria the way you do. I suppose there's no way to define "average looking" though I'd love to see pics of girls you consider "average" honestly. I'm willing to admit if I'm wrong and they're truly nothing special.

 

I didn't know the short hair thing, so that's a new criterion on top of the others!

[xxoo]

What do you want me to say.

 

That because of how I am, I should settle with a below average woman that I have absolutely no attraction for?

 

Sounds like the basis for a wonderful relationship.

 

Aside from the height, I am not bad physically.

 

My only issue is the social things and they can be improved. Frankly all I need is a girl to give me a chance and from that alone my confidence will skyrocket.

 

You think that having a gf would cure your confidence problems, but it probably wouldn't. Relationships rarely cure our issues. Usually our issues play out in the relationship.

 

Your height is not the primary reason you don't have a gf. It is a small disadvantage, ok, but it is not the huge barrier that you consider it to be. But by focusing on your height, you avoid dealing with the real reasons you aren't getting the love you so desperately seek (desperation being a key word here).

[verhrzn]

Just gonna leave this here: Are Your Beliefs Holding You Back? | Paging Dr. NerdLove

[olivec]

The only reason I'm 'obsessed' with height, is that I see it as the primary reason for why I can't get a GF.

 

There is no denying that a man's height is a big contributor to how physically attractive he is.

 

 

Its all about confidence brotha. I don't let my height effect me at all. I don"t give a **** really. If you meet a girl and shes not into you because of your height big deal. Just move on to the next one. Not every single girl is obsessed with height. If that was the case there would be 80 million male virgins running around under 6 feet tall right now lol.

[somedude81]

That it's not some pity party focused on one thing as if you can't get a gal and have no options.

 

 

...where did you get that?

You're joking right?

 

You said it again in this very post.

 

So why should a gal who fits your standards give a below average height guy with sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills who may not fit her standards?

 

What exactly do you offer that would have a gal who fits your standards negate her own standards to be a part of your life and have you a part of her life?

That since I can't find an average girl who meets my standards, I should settle for somebody who does not meet them, and that would be a below average girl that I am not attracted to.

 

And when I even say below average, that usually just means somebody who is overweight.

 

In your opinion some gals my differ with attractiveness being usubjective at least to me.

Meh, I'm not fat, skinny and I've got some muscle on me. I've also had a few women call me good looking, that's good enough for me to not be too worried about my appearance.

 

Hell, I can send you a pic of me if you think it will help clear things up.

 

What exactly do you offer that would have a gal who fits your standards negate her own standards to be a part of your life and have you a part of her life?

Because I have a good heart, I'm funny, intelligent, love to listen and communicate, have a wide variety of interests and just need somebody to do them with. There's more that I cant think of right now.

 

IMO the reasons why a girl should date me, outweigh the reasons she shouldn't.

[udolipixie]

You're joking right?

You said it again in this very post.

Nowhere does that state, imply, or suggest you should settle with a below average woman that I have absolutely no attraction for

 

That is asking you why should a gal that fits your standards should give you the chance that you want if you don't fit her standards.

 

That since I can't find an average girl who meets my standards, I should settle for somebody who does not meet them, and that would be a below average girl that I am not attracted to.

Egh you projected that it states:

So why should a gal who fits your standards give a below average height guy with sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills who may not fit her standards?

 

What exactly do you offer that would have a gal who fits your standards negate her own standards to be a part of your life and have you a part of her life?

 

And when I even say below average, that usually just means somebody who is overweight.

Iin America overweight is the average.

 

Meh, I'm not fat, skinny and I've got some muscle on me. I've also had a few women call me good looking, that's good enough for me to not be too worried about my appearance.

You're also below average height, in the 30s, and have sub-par confidence, self-esteem, communication, and social skills.

 

It's not just appearance that can exclude you.

 

Because I have a good heart, I'm funny, intelligent, love to listen and communicate, have a wide variety of interests and just need somebody to do them with. There's more that I cant think of right now.

So why don't you consider those same things for women who don't fit your standards?

 

Why ask someone to overlook her standards for things you don't seem to be willing to overlook your standards for?

 

IMO the reasons why a girl should date me, outweigh the reasons she shouldn't.

Would those reasons outweigh the reasons you wouldn't date someone who doesn't fit your standards?