The story of a fool

[Nukem]

Hello,

Here is my story.

We are married since 2002 and have 8 years old daughter.

We are separated since the beginning of 2011. My wife is beautiful, sexy and financially independent.

She is wealthy and has many estates.

 

My wife had been having emotional affair for 4 years with 10 years older married man (father of 2 children)

A few months after our separation it turned into a physical affair and she tried to live with him. He got divorced.

Soon she realized his bad habits and personal traits and they split up.

We've been trying reconciliation since September 2011. Meanwhile the other man proposed her to marry him. She told me a lot about him, but she wasn't remorseful. She was rather disappointed because I was her first man in her life and she had had a lot of hope about the other man. I think she still maintain contact with him.

Things were going fine, when she got annoyed by some of my actions where facebook female friends of mine were involved.

She asked me not to spend the nights in her flat. I agreed. Soon after that she asked me not to visit them so often because she didn't want she and our daughter to get used to me again. I agreed and continue going in her home only with explicit invitation.

On 27th Feb she turned 31. I gave her a huge bouquet of tulips which she liked very much but she told me that she didn't want me to have any hopes about our marriage and she couldn't forgive even my smallest sins.

I agreed and said that I hope we will continue our good friendship and she is very precious for me, but I also love her only as the mother of my child (I am afraid it was a fatal mistake). However I stopped calling her, stopped showing jealousy and the rest of the Homer's advises.

Recently she asked me if we would get divorced and I answered that I think there is no need, because I am not going to pretend for her assets and possessions. She claimed that I was acting as I was divorced. I replied that I don't have any hopes about us after so many months of trying.

In the last several weeks I only see her when I pick up the kid for her tennis, English and swimming lessons during the weekends.

My wife continue to call me 2-3 times a day. Every morning she asks me why I didn't call her. In the weekend mornings she offered me a cup of coffee while waiting for the kid getting prepared. Occasionally in the evenings she invited me to have dinner with them and watch a movie. Usually our phone calls continue for 25 minutes, when I try to hang up she gets annoyed. She often asks me If I date another women and doesn't hide her jealousy well. She also is jealous about two female friends in my Facebook profile. She knows that I have affinity to them though they have families.

I don't date any women and don't intend to start dating. Those two women are just friends.

 

Few more words about my wife:

- she has wealthy and attractive adorers

- she is easily angered and shouts a lot

- she doesn't like to lie and pretend, though she had been lying for years

- she doesn't accept different opinions, especially mine opinions

- she is resentful and open-handed

- she pretends to be honest and hardworking person

- she has high opinion about herself

- she has two female friends which are divorced

 

I took all the guilt about the disastrous affair and everything before and after.

I constantly agree with her about everything.

 

She continues affirming she doesn't love me, even though two weeks ago I confessed to her that I miss her.

She believes that a marriage could not exist without love.

I missed some appropriate occasions when she was very loving and tender. I am afraid there won't be any similar moments ahead of us.

 

We talk to each other everyday at least for 10-30 minutes. It gives my hopes.

 

Here are my concerns about Homer McDonald advises:

- I am afraid that I felt in my own trap by playing unconquered?

- should I start showing my love again?

- I am afraid that making her jealous deteriorate our relation.

- she is acting happy, meeting people, it seems she is familiar with some tactics?

- I am afraid that my wife needed love from me, not indifference, but it's to

late?

 

Please, advise me. Is my marriage still workable?

[stopdropandroll]

Why do you want to be with your wife after she's had another man inside of her and she's unremorseful about it? She only went back to you because her affair partner ditched her. It sounds like she's a real piece of work but at the same time I think you have your own issues you need to address.

 

Sorry you're going through this.

[stopdropandroll]

Oh, and she's still sleeping around...

[Exit]

It's not fixable as long as she doesn't love you. Frankly I think it's silly to be talking on the phone every day and letting yourself think she is getting jealous when you pay attention to other women. It sounds very toxic and prevents you from finding happiness elsewhere, I think you really need to find the strength to suggest putting an end to it and only interacting to co-parent and see your kid. She says she doesn't love you, she says a marriage should not exist without love, so why not get an official divorce?

 

You are falling into the trap of these mind games perfectly by saying things like "maybe she needs love and not indifference from me, but is it too late?". You have it twisted around in your head that you're the one who did something wrong and that you need to adjust your behaviors to hopefully win her back again.

 

I don't want to hurt your feelings, but rather give you the appropriate kick in the pants to get you back on the right track, so I'm going to let you know that you sound like you are operating in total spineless doormat mode right now. She had an affair, which she took to the next level once you two were separated, she's the one who says she isn't in love anymore, she's the one who doesn't really care to fix it, why are you believing and acting like you are the bad guy? You are not the one who messed up here. It still hurts your heart to not be with the person who you had a child with, but apparently it doesn't bother her.

 

I don't think you will win her back by being this soft ball of clay for her to manipulate. You need to work up your confidence and realize who really screwed up here. Stand your ground and set your boundaries, you've started to go down the right path with not being the one to initiate phone calls to her and trying to leave it alone for the most part.

 

Until if/when she decides that she wants this to work out, you shouldn't be concerned about what efforts you're making. If she ever says "hey let's fix this" then you can be Mr. Enthusiastic and show her that you love her and show her that you want this to work. But right now she is the one who is standing outside of the circle, not you.

[Nukem]

Dear all,

during the separation I made a lot of mistakes. She wanted me back. She apologized. But I was acting like a man, I wanted her to suffer. She assured me that she has no future with the OM. I was blind. I rejected her and she tried with him. It ruined her. I helped her to get over and our reconcilliation was going really well.

 

I don't believe her she is happy. Don't believe she doesn't love me. I am her first man, her husband and the father of our child. She tells me she likes me, but it's not enough.

 

She blames me that I have pushed her in his arms. Actually she is correct. During our last years I was concentrated mainly on my fitness issues, yoga and diets. I didn't pay enough attention to them. I end up with nothing - I have no home, no confidence, no gorgeous wife. The future is bleak without her.

 

My selfishness and my pride brought me here.

Edited April 3, 2012 by Nukem

[tojaz]

Is it fixable? Time will tell, she definitely still wants "something" from you. What that may be might not turn out to be what you want though.

 

You say she gets jealous, please elaborate on that. How does she show her jealousy? Have you ever brought that up to her?

 

TOJAZ

[oldguy]

Don't play games.

Cancel the FB account, (not a FB fan anyway)

See an actual marriage counselor. Together would be preferable.

oh, and I know it's easier to type; "the Kid", but I would recommend you start calling her; "my daughter" or "our daughter", especially if she's yours, that's another personal opinion.

[Nukem]

Is it fixable? Time will tell, she definitely still wants "something" from you. What that may be might not turn out to be what you want though.

 

You say she gets jealous, please elaborate on that. How does she show her jealousy? Have you ever brought that up to her?

 

TOJAZ

 

Hello Tojaz,

the deterioration began when I visited a friend of mine who she doesn't like. She blame me that I visited him because there were whores, and that I wanted to flirt. Later a female friends of mine posted on my facebook photos and she got annoyed.

This weekend she asked me if I had a girlfriend because I had used a perfume she doesn't like. She also get annoyed if I go out with some of my male friends, who are single. During a business day I had two meetings and didn't manage to answer her calls, but sent her sms. She blamed that I was cheating. It was ridiculous, and I explained to her carefully.

 

I knew she was very confused and nervous so I tolerated this behaviour.

[Nukem]

Don't play games.

Cancel the FB account, (not a FB fan anyway)

See an actual marriage counselor. Together would be preferable.

oh, and I know it's easier to type; "the Kid", but I would recommend you start calling her; "my daughter" or "our daughter", especially if she's yours, that's another personal opinion.

 

Thank you, oldguy,

I guess you're right. I'm not good at bluffing nowadays

I've just deactivated my FB account, but she invited me to her Linkedin

[oldguy]

Your wife invited you to her Linkedin?

That's nice, I guess

We're talking about the professional network right?

 

P.S. I meant now is not the time to be playing emotional games with her. Not that there ever is a time for that sort of thing.

[Nukem]

oldguy,

how to act?

Recently she threatened me she would stop calling me, because I tried to hang up the call. Since monday she really stopped. She only makes return calls.

[Nukem]

Few months ago she was talking about us going on a trip to Italy.

In January we were on ski vacation and she spoke her mind about the OM.

I was sure when I endure this the things will get better.

But I messed up.

[oldguy]

Is she open to seeing a marriage counsellor jointly & maybe a therapist on her own?

[Nukem]

I asked her this in September. She answered '' I'm not sure I want to work on this marriage. I don't need anyone telling me what to do''. I am pretty sure she hasn't changed her mind.

[jaymz]

At the moment she is cake eating on a grand scale and has shown little remorse for what has happened and is not doing anything to fix things.

 

Well if you want to know for sure. Sit her down and ask for a decision: She either works on the marriage or you two work towards a divorce. No time limits for her to come to a decision, you want to know now.

 

If she tells you she wants to work on the marriage then you have some great advise here already. If she doesn't, then you need to get a lawyer and start the ball rolling immediately. You then need to start LC and the 180, also start separating your lives: change passwords, finances, etc.

 

Ask her when she is leaving the home, offer to help her pack. Keep your daughter with you. File for full custody.

 

If she calls you, only answer 1 in 4 calls and only talk if its important or about your daughter, filter the VM and only return important calls. Ignore all texts unless they are important or about your daughter. Follow LC and do the 180.

 

Start to work on yourself. Fill your time with friends, new hobbies, working out etc. Limit your thinking about the end of your marriage to a small time each day, this allows you to process it without it overwhelming you.

 

Ignore her threats. She is going to kick and scream to keep everything the same and not have to do anything.

 

Remember you can also stop the divorce before its signed. But now is the time to act as a decisive and in control man, show her that you do not need her anymore.

 

Start today.

[standtall]

Dude, grow a pair and stop being a doormat. Women do not love men they don't respect, and as long as you let her stomp on you, then she aint in love with you. I would get a lawyer and take her a** to the bank, then take her money and some tramp to the Bahama's and make sure she knows about it. So IMHO, no your marriage will not work unless you stop being her little pool boy.

[Nukem]

Guys,

let me be little more chronological:

 

Nov - 2010- she asked me to leave her flat. I rented a flat and lived 2 weeks alone. When we met we talk a little about divorce and I started kissing her with passion. She asked me to get back home.

 

Dec - 2010- we had a row/fight and I started to monitor our home pc, I saw their correspondence. I was shocked. Soon she found out that I was spying her. She asked me to leave her home because I knew the name of the OM' wife

 

Jan - June 2011- I vaguely remember, but we had a few fights, we had sex occasionally, and I spent some nights in her home.

On 4th June she confessed that she knew that I was the best husband for her. She apologized. She was remorseful. I acted as child and rejected her.

Later on she and our daughter went to the seaside. I didn't call them often.

When she returned she was completely different.

She rejected all my attempts to be loving.

 

July - August 2011- We spent 3 weeks in England, the holiday was previously arranged. She continued to reject me, meanwhile she was skyping with her lover.

 

At the end of August 2011 we returned back in our country and she started to live with him. Two weeks later she called me and invited me to spend the evening near the swimming pool of her parent's house.

 

Slowly we moved ahead. She invited me to meet Christmas and the New Year Eve with her family. We went on ski vacation in the mountain, she was telling me about the OM.

 

You know the rest.

 

I am not capable to do 180. She knows that cause I tried it several times.

There were a lot of crying and screaming from both of us. I can not bear a day without calling her.

 

One day she told me she didn't respect me and that's why she cannot love me. When I tried 180, she changed herself and told me the opposite. But I overacted and she began to pull herself.

 

Currently she is pulling. I am going to push a little during the weekend.

 

WHEN I MAN WISHES SOMETHING VERY MUCH EVEN THE UNIVERSE WILL HELP HIM

[stopdropandroll]

WHEN I MAN WISHES SOMETHING VERY MUCH EVEN THE UNIVERSE WILL HELP HIM

 

I'm not sure what planet that works on but it isn't true here on planet Earth.

 

Stop pining over her. Stop feeling guilty for being pissed at her for her affair. You didn't kill the relationship because of that, she did. I'm sure it doesn't help that you have co-dependency issues but she's a big girl and made her own decisions. She could have dealt with your marital issues in a completely different and healthy way but instead she chose to have an affair and continue the affair right in front of you.

 

Your behavior now just reinforces the fact she can do whatever she wants with absolutely no consequences. You bend over backwards for her and act like her toilet paper and she treats you as such.

 

Start standing up for youself. Learn how to set appropriate boundaries with your wife and people in general.

 

I realize this post isn't fluffy and nice but it's the truth and it's intended to help you. Best wishes.

[Nukem]

Hey, stopdropandroll,

 

in the relationships I think the guilt is 50/50 for both partners.

 

I owe her 15 years of happiness and our beautiful daughter.

There's no deed which could make me forget this.

She and her parents helped me a lot and would help me again.

I also will continue to help them whenever they need me.

They are very good people.

 

I have to overcome the loss without insulting them.

 

Thank you for your opinion

[Steadfast]

WHEN I MAN WISHES SOMETHING VERY MUCH EVEN THE UNIVERSE WILL HELP HIM

 

These are the words of a fool. There is no magic. There is only what we do to help ourselves and others.

 

The reality is, you've probably ruined any real chance of saving your marriage by playing games and trying to control your wife into being devoted to you. Nothing kills love and attraction faster than manipulation. Stop.

 

The good news is, what you're losing probably isn't worth keeping. Not now anyway. She is NOT a good person. Good people do not cheat on their spouses. She is NOT a good parent. Good parents don't screw over the other parent. Even the worst people have some good qualities. This is fact.

 

The best thing for you now is to stop the current trend, let her go, and work on your considerable issues. Let her go. If she really loves you, she'll find her way back. Distinguish the difference between right and wrong and apply it to every area of your life. Once your eyes are opened to reality, you may not want her back. However, if both of you somehow manage to wake up, see the destruction, admit to your part of it and do everything in your power to make it change, then your family might survive intact.

 

Don't come on here preaching to the choir. Too many of us know better. If you're smart, you'll read, listen and learn. Help is available. Pull your head out of your behind, understand and apply what's being advised to you.

[Nukem]

Steadfast,

 

I am not as smart as I thought.

I hoped when I start agreeing the marriage would get better.

 

The problem is she is waiting something from me.

She got annoyed in Saturday when I returned our daughter in her parent's house but I didn't wait her to come and left the house almost immediately. She had invited me to spend the evening with her parents and her brother's family. She is rejecting me but at the same time she wants us to be good and friendly parents/ friends. She wants to keep me close to her. She wants to rule.

If I try to change this it will be a new game played by me.

It seems when the things happen in her way she is getting warmer.

It confuses me.

[Nukem]

““When you want something, all the universe conspires in helping you to achieve it.””

 

Paulo Coelho quotes (Mystical author, one of Brazil's most successful novelist)

 

He is very popular here

[trippi1432]

Dude, grow a pair and stop being a doormat.

 

Personally..I love posts like these...it reminds me what I forgot to collect in the divorce settlement.

 

Yes..good advice...grow a set because men here see that you left yours at the bedroom....what man doesn't?

 

Nukem...the gist of the situation...what is more important. Your wife and love or the material things? See..the problem with a woman who brings more to the table is emasculating to the male ego, but something no one talks about is when a woman just wants to be loved for who they are..money and influence become de-masculating to the relationship.

 

I may be wrong......but deep down, I think the two of you really love each other...something else..opinions or otherwise are getting in your way?

 

 

So....are you just in love with the life or do you love her? I can't tell from your posts honestly.

[Nukem]

It is also interesting to tell you that in Saturday they had slept at her parent's house.

When I went there to collect our daughter my wife pulled me towards her to kiss her for good morning on her lips. It seemed she expected to feel a different emotion by my kiss.

 

I don't believe she is happy without man by her side.

Last Monday me and the kid were watching a movie when she got home from a theatre with her mother. It was after 22 pm so she got very angry because of my irresponsibility. I got home and we continue talking by phone.

She admitted that she was sharing her opinion about my immaturity because she loves me very much. Next day in the morning she called me and apologized for her rude behavior.

 

Her signals are mixed she doesn't know what she wants, I guess.

[Steadfast]

Do not take my words as a judgement of your character. I don't know you. My words were written in response to your actions. They are flawed.

 

Early in the demise of my marriage I made all of the classic mistakes. I tried old tricks (to sway her) that worked before, but they didn't. I said the wrong things, did the wrong things and acted the wrong way. Why? Because I didn't want to lose my wife. I loved her. I didn't want to suffer, I didn't want my kids to suffer and I didn't want her to suffer. I wanted it all to go away.

 

Later, much later after the divorce was final and I had done much work, I wished I would have taken a simpler approach. It would have saved me much suffering. She was over a lot in those days (I'm in a relationship now so she stays away, as she should) and remarked how much she respected me. I no longer judged her so quickly, or responded so harshly.

 

My response? "What was going on brought out the worst in me."

 

And it does. Cheating, separation and divorce often rips a person open; exposing all the nasty things inside for everyone to see. All of the insecurities, all of the fear. And while I believe that if a person truly loves another they would never subject their spouse to that, that emotional turmoil must be dealt with. That's where you are. You need to deal.

 

My advice is this; one time (repeat: one time only!!) level with your wife and tell her exactly how you feel. The truth. Explain that your actions demonstrated that this painful situation brought out the worst in you. Tell her you love her, tell her you don't want the relationship to end, that you do not wish to put your child through this. Tell her you're sorry for your part. Then, tell her it will take both of you to fix it; each being responsible for repairing the damage they caused. Tell her the cheating must stop.

 

What she does next will be critical. This is THE MOST IMPORTANT PART:

 

She must be willing to do anything to save the marriage. She must say, "I'm sorry, I love you, I don't want to divorce and I'm willing to do whatever it takes." Only this answer. If she complains you are pressuring her or says nothing, Let Her Go. Do not attempt to persuade her further. Do not talk about the relationship. Be kind when you are around her to pick up or deliver the child. Smile, be polite and move on.

 

Prove your love by letting her off the hook. Give her freedom from you. Restore your worth. She has a freewill and so do you. You can't make someone love you and want to stay. It only works if you both desire it.

 

No games. Get real then get busy restoring peace and joy to your life.