Am I being stupid or hopeful

[trinity1]

Hi there

 

I haven't been on here for a while but long story short, gave my guy an ultimatum to leave, he never, we split but I stupidly got back together with him.

 

He has told me that in order for us to ever have a future he has to not have me in his life at all, to determine whether or not I am the reason he is staying with his wife ( in other words, I make it tolerable) and to see what life would be be like for him, minus me in it.

 

Does this sound like he is trying to let me down gently( he says it isn't) or is he genuinely trying to make an informed decision regarding the future

 

Any comments would be helpful

 

Arran

 

Been there, done that. That's what my MM told me to. He wanted 3 months of NC to figure it out and give his marriage a chance. Long story short, he lasted a week and had thought about me the whole time. More or less only been physically present at home, not mentally present.

 

Give your guy what he is asking for and don't worry. He'll be back. Probably not much wiser though except that he will have found out that he wants you for sure in his life. At least that's what happened in my case.

[whichwayisup]

He'll be back. Probably not much wiser though except that he will have found out that he wants you for sure in his life

 

As his future wife? Or to continue the affair? I highly doubt she wants to be the OW in his life for years to come. Not fair to her at all when she is hopeful he'll divorce and be all hers. The guy (just my opinion) isn't looking to start over after a 30 year marriage.

 

What if he doesn't come back? I think giving her hope when her MM (not yours, HERS) has told her he wants to end things and truly give his marriage a real shot at working without her in his life. He sounds like he means it..Not only in words but in actions.

[donnamaybe]

Been there, done that. That's what my MM told me to. He wanted 3 months of NC to figure it out and give his marriage a chance. Long story short, he lasted a week and had thought about me the whole time. More or less only been physically present at home, not mentally present.

 

Give your guy what he is asking for and don't worry. He'll be back. Probably not much wiser though except that he will have found out that he wants you for sure in his life. At least that's what happened in my case.

And you are still only the OW right? The OP wants a relationship. Not to be someone's supporting actress when she should be in the starring role.

[Arrangrl]

Donna, that's all I have ever wanted.

 

Guys your insight has been helpful- I'll always have hope though but really considering your advice

 

 

Arran x

[donnamaybe]

Donna, that's all I have ever wanted.

And you have every right to a good R. It will happen, providing you don't settle. And never EVER make excuses for your man, whoever he may eventually be. BIG mistake many of us women make.

[Arrangrl]

Yes and I have done. Were

 

you hurt Donna?

 

 

Arran x

[MissBee]

No.

He likes the best of both worlds/ wants his cake and to eat it.

 

If I had a nickel every time a woman made some excuse why a man couldn't do something (myself included), only to see him do something that is the equivalent or worse later on smh, I'd be rich!

 

Fears are real and some decisions being difficult are real of course. But we all work through our fears and difficult stuff when we REALLY want something. That is the truth. Yet often we conveniently forget this fact of life in these scenarios, acting as though fears and difficulty are insurmountable and that someone has license to string you along for years in the name of "not easy" and "fear" versus calling it what it is: cake eating and comfort where you are.

 

Often times fears and difficulties do exist but if what is on the other side is worth it to you, you'll make it over there. If all you have are excuses going into infinity, needless to say, you may "want" what's on the other side, but not at the expense of what you have now. And that's okay too....but the person who is waiting on the other side trying to coax this "scaredy cat" over needs to know when to throw the towel in and realize when it's obvious that this person's love for safety and their current life is more than it is for you. Simple. It is not that they don't care at all. They just don't love you enough to risk their current life and to be uncomfortable, quite simply. That is often the difficult part....it's easier to "have hope" and stay in that liminal stage of waiting and believing that they just need more time....versus packing up and moving on, confident that if they truly want you, then they will eventually brave their fears and do what it takes.

Edited April 10, 2012 by MissBee

[MissBee]

And you are still only the OW right? The OP wants a relationship. Not to be someone's supporting actress when she should be in the starring role.

 

Yes, I see no purpose in someone's return if nothing has changed and if what lead to the separation still exists.

 

People should read the Breaks and Breaking Up forum. Everybody wants their ex to come back and most people are praying night and day for this. I was one. And he sure did....most do....for a while. But usually what happens is that, what lead to the break up STILL exists! Missing someone is normal...this does not mean you are "meant to be" or that your relationship will work out. Most people panic when they go NC....I did. Most people go back and forth....but the bottomline is that usually these "returns" bring false happiness as they are short-lived. You feel euphoric and like you cannot live without this person....yet when it wears off...the same old problems are there or usually one comes back for a fix then crashes and burns.

 

So a MM going NC and missing you and coming back to continue having you as his secret OW is nothing special or romantic....but a part of the normal process of detaching that is often difficult and a rollercoaster. Until REAL changes are made....absolutely nothing is different and you usually have to separate again at some point.

[donnamaybe]

Yes and I have done. Were

 

you hurt Donna?

 

 

Arran x

 

I think everyone has been at some time in their lives. Hopefully we learn along the way, which is probably why I am so happy right now. No excuses necessary with my fiance. He is so wonderful - for me. In the past there was always some issue or another that should have made me say to myself, "Deal breaker. Next!" but I didn't far too long in a few R's. There is no forcing two people to fit in a successful R. There will always be discussions to negotiate things as you learn each other, but if there is mutual love and respect you will both be happy. At least, that is how it is for me.

Edited April 10, 2012 by donnamaybe

[trinity1]

Yes, I see no purpose in someone's return if nothing has changed and if what lead to the separation still exists.

 

In my case what led to the separation no longer exists, ie the idea that the marriage could be worked on. My MM is now slowly working his way towards divorce. Will he ever get there? Who knows? But he is detaching more and more from his marriage for every day. And meanwhile, he and I are enjoying our relationship, which of course has its ups and downs like any relationship. If our relationship ended today without him ever getting a divorce, it would still have been sooooo worth it.

 

Arrangrl, just like you I want a relationship where my SO is not married. That has not been possible in my case so far. I have made the choice to still stay with him, because the benefits of staying outweigh the negatives to me. I understand if that is not the case for you. We can not force our MM to get a divorce, but we all have a choice when to leave and when to stay.

Edited April 11, 2012 by trinity1

[trinity1]

Yes, I see no purpose in someone's return if nothing has changed and if what lead to the separation still exists.

 

In your case, Arrangrl, it seems your MM's need for NC is to determine what you say below:

 

He has told me that in order for us to ever have a future he has to not have me in his life at all, to determine whether or not I am the reason he is staying with his wife ( in other words, I make it tolerable) and to see what life would be be like for him, minus me in it.

 

So returning to you after NC, would hopefully have given him answers to those questions whether or not he would also be ready to take the next step towards divorce.

 

And if he is not ready to get divorced, you of course have the option to end the relationship right there and then as you always have.

 

Does this sound like he is trying to let me down gently( he says it isn't) or is he genuinely trying to make an informed decision regarding the future

 

Based on my own experience your MM is likely to be genuinely trying to make an informed decision regarding the future, although NC may not be enough to give him all the answers you and he are looking for.

Edited April 11, 2012 by trinity1

[frozensprouts]

OP,

i know it's probably hard, but instead of worrying about what he wants, why not focus on what you want.

 

What kind of relationship do you want to have in your life? Do you want to be with a guy who can't decide between you and someone else? You deserve better than that. You deserve to be his first choice...he should want to be with you without having to give it a second thought. And if he truly loves you, he won't want to hurt you just so he can get his 'fix' when he's with you.

 

for what it is worth, in my humble opinion , you shouldn't wait around for this guy to figure out what he wants. You should live your life and be happy. if he gets a divorce from his wife so he can be with you, then he with him, but if he doesn't , then what does that tell you? If he doesn't divorce his wife but still wants a relationship with you, then what does that tell you?

 

I don't think that it's asking too much of someone to end one relationship before they begin a new one with someone else...if the person isn't willing to do that, then I have to wonder how much value they actually place on the "outside' relationship.

 

you have a lot of value, and you deserve to be treated like you do. you deserve respect.

Edited April 11, 2012 by frozensprouts

[trinity1]

Do you want to be with a guy who can't decide between you and someone else?

 

A common misconception is that the MM is choosing between the OW and the wife. He is in most cases choosing between the OW and the marriage. Unless of course he is one of the MM Alice so eloquently described.

[whichwayisup]

My MM is now slowly working his way towards divorce. Will he ever get there? Who knows? But he is detaching more and more from his marriage for every day. And meanwhile, he and I are enjoying our relationship

 

Take a step back and be objective for a mintute, k. People who want a divorce, do so and it doesn't take a long time to do so, most separate then divorce..they don't still live life with their spouse while planning a D.

 

How is he detaching by still living in the house with his wife? Do they sleep in the same bed? If yes, sorry that's not detaching, that's called HIS life is just going on as it was and he's given you a 'line' to keep you in the affair. this guy gets the best of both worlds. Does his wife even know he's unhappy and wanting a divorce? If that is the case.

[donnamaybe]

OP, if you don't remain in NC with this MM, you may wind up like others; still the OW in waiting with six years under their belt.

 

If I were in this situation I would have a definite time limit. This isn't forcing HIM to do something. It would be forcing ME to do something. There is no way I would enable a cake eater for any length of time.

[donnamaybe]

OP, if you don't remain in NC with this MM, you may wind up like others; still the OW in waiting with six eight years under their belt.

 

If I were in this situation I would have a definite time limit. This isn't forcing HIM to do something. It would be forcing ME to do something. There is no way I would enable a cake eater for any length of time.

Sorry. Had to make a correction.

[TaraMaiden]

I'm confused why you're demanding that he divorce if you are still married, .....

I must be missing something... where do you get that she is married...?

[TaraMaiden]

Oh sorry... i tried to go back and check... i couldn't find anything....

Thanks for the update...

 

Any news on that score, I wonder...?

[Arrangrl]

Hi there

 

Yes I am divorced. My separation had nothing to do with MM , we legally separated 4 mnths before I met him. Legally Seperated is a legal term used in UK - google it for more info if interested.

 

 

We have tried NC before but were both just playing at it. I think we especially myself, realise that this is now the point we are at to either move forward together, or not.

 

 

I am under no illusion that he loves me, but he does have much more to lose than I do. I know it's the whole package, family, responsibility, attachment , friends, however, if it is meant to be.... It will be. Pillow talk lol he's a man from the West of Scotland, has never happened! So I haven't been swept off my feet by some silver tongued Lothario, far from it.

 

 

 

 

Yes this is most def wrong but people fall in love

 

 

That shouldn't every single day since time began and will continue to do so.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Arran

[Arrangrl]

Excuse typos typing from my phone folks. Thanks to everyone for their points do far.

 

Arran

[MissBee]

A common misconception is that the MM is choosing between the OW and the wife. He is in most cases choosing between the OW and the marriage. Unless of course he is one of the MM Alice so eloquently described.

 

What's the difference? Since the marriage doesn't exist without the wife, as far as I know.

[MissBee]

In my case what led to the separation no longer exists, ie the idea that the marriage could be worked on. My MM is now slowly working his way towards divorce. Will he ever get there? Who knows? But he is detaching more and more from his marriage for every day. And meanwhile, he and I are enjoying our relationship, which of course has its ups and downs like any relationship. If our relationship ended today without him ever getting a divorce, it would still have been sooooo worth it.

 

Arrangrl, just like you I want a relationship where my SO is not married. That has not been possible in my case so far. I have made the choice to still stay with him, because the benefits of staying outweigh the negatives to me. I understand if that is not the case for you. We can not force our MM to get a divorce, but we all have a choice when to leave and when to stay.

 

Well from what you're sayng....he is "slowly" working his way toward divorce and you are not certain if he will actually ever get there, but you are still around because he has given up the idea that the marriage can be fixed? I'm honestly not seeing a difference between a man who thinks his marriage can be fixed and one who is "slowly" working on divorce but I still have no clue if he will ever actually do it. The slowly part especially trips me up as my immediate response to it is that it is just another way of doing a whole bunch of nothing as before....but then because you say it is "slowly" you can use the excuse that you are taking microscopic steps that cannot be readily seen with the naked eye...so even though it seems like nothing is happening, you have to "trust" that it is....and for me personally, that just reads as garbage and even for you...the fact that you said you don't know if he ever will "get there" reiterates this notion that it's so "slow" that one cannot actually even be certain this person will do it and one can see no legitimate steps being taken besides "he is detaching slowly" which what does that mean really when you think about it?

 

But the point as you said is that you have the choice about leaving or staying, as this person's actions are on them and they pretty much show you what they will and won't do and how fast....so it's up to you to decide what you will and won't accept.

Edited April 11, 2012 by MissBee

[Arrangrl]

Trinity

 

Aren't you worried that you get caught?

 

 

 

 

Arran x

[trinity1]

TrinityAren't you worried that you get caught?

 

 

 

 

Arran x

 

 

I wouldn't mind getting caught since I never liked the secrecy to begin with, but in our case the wife seems to have blinders on. We think she doesn't want to know. As long as he is still there that is enough for her. No sex, no intimacy, but he is still there physically, more as a room mate and father to the children than anything else.

[wannabdone]

Arran,

 

Again, i'm sorry for your pain.

 

I think if you can cut through the hatefullness of some of the posters, you will see there are some good points. You told him that he left or you would walk. He didn't leave, and you didn't walk. He can't pull the trigger, and so he probably isn't going to. I know its hard to give up on that hope, but where do you draw the line and say I have spent enough of my life waiting on this?

 

I disagree that you were merely a piece of a$$. I don't know you two from a can of paint. Maybe you were, maybe you weren't. Maybe he really does love you. But the one thing you DO KNOW is that he does not love you enough. Not enough to actually make a life with you and give you what you deserve.

 

I made these "dead lines" MANY times, and stupidly bought it each and every time he came back because he couldn't "pull the trigger" at that point. Always a bday, taxes, job issues, home issues, blah blah blah...that kept him from doing it at that time. I do think its easy to make these plans while you are with someone...but when it gets down to the "nut cutting" for a lack of better words, he can't. For whatever reason. The fact is...it doesn't matter why he isn't doing it. It doesn't matter if it is because his wife is terminally ill and dying, the fact is HE IS NOT. And the other fact is YOU DESERVE MORE.

 

I know going NC is hard. I tried it over and over again. Had d day after d day after d day. If there was anyone that ppl would look at and think "that person is a lifer in this A", it would have been me. I am proud to say, I finally broke free of it. I finally stopped just saying "I deserve more" and really realized in my heart I did. I spent 10 years and a 1/4 of my life waiting for someone who never was coming. I felt hopeful and stupid. I am a intellegent, well educated woman, and STILL fell into this. Its much easier than one thinks. You've done it, no changing that. You have become emotionally invested into someone who is unavailable. We all do things we shouldn't. But this is truly how are you going to finish the race? Are you going to give yourself the chance at love and peace? Are you going to continue to put yourself down and be the second place?

 

GO FOR FIRST! That is what you deserve!