Million.to.1 Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) HeavenOrHell.. I'm sorry, but i disagree with you. If you go back and read TaraMaidens posts, she explains it really well. I also have an issue with people labeling themselves as having a mental disorder as a way to justify a behaviour they associate with. I'm not saying that there aren't really people with these issues, but it seems that three quarters of the American public are on some kind of medication for depression or bi-pola or anixiety or believe they have some kind of personality disorder. Once again.. you can say that bad thing happen to good people, and you can say that some people are victims. Truth is, that if someone came up to me and punched me in the face, stabbed me in the ovaries and stole my shoes, yes that would be stink. BUT, it is my responsibility how i choose to feel about it. I can let it effect me, or I can choose to let it go.. I KNOW that seems harsh. And it is. But no one ever said that life was gonna be all rainbows and unicorns. IT'S WHAT YOU MAKE IT. .... and your signature is basically of that philosophy too! Edited May 7, 2012 by Million.to.1 Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Karma's a bitch. You tryin' to get me going again - ?! Karma is what we do - it's not the kick up the pants. 'Karma' means action.... Or have I just swallowed the bait again? Link to post Share on other sites
HeavenOrHell Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 So sorry to hear this happened to you TM, my point though is that while you were able to pick yourself up and not let it crush you, maybe you had some inner strength, or the right support, or personality traits, or maybe solid foundations as a child which enabled you to be able to do that. Ross, there are two types of suffering: The physical actual 'pain' of the moment - and the mental pain of perpetuation of the experience. I have absolutely no qualms whatsoever in telling you I was raped as a young girl, by the son of a close family friend. The man was never brought to justice, and i only told people about this a long time after the event. At the time, the experience was frightening, and horrendous. Now? I've moved on, and I don't feel the effects of the experience, any more. I really give a damn. But I had to drop that emotional perpetuation myself. It was a choice I made - carry on the mental anguish long after the event was over and done with - to keep carrying it around as a negative reminder and emotional burden, or let it go, release myself from the weight and pain and suffering, and look ahead, not back. I chose the latter. Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 So sorry to hear this happened to you TM, my point though is that while you were able to pick yourself up and not let it crush you, maybe you had some inner strength, or the right support, or personality traits, or maybe solid foundations as a child which enabled you to be able to do that. Thank you for your kindness. I think this is possible for anyone, really I do. But something has to trigger the response, the desire, the refusal to succumb to negativity for one more moment. I make it sound easy, but it was in fact a monumental process i willingly put myself through, and decided to not pander to for one moment longer. I went to counselling, but TBH the counsellors were one whole big greater phukkup than I was! I invested in a lot of self help books, and gradually, refused point blank to allow the past be a crutch, excuse and rationale for my Present, which would of course, taint, affect and cripple my Future. So actually, it is really a simple process. But make no mistake - 'Simple' does not mean 'Easy'. Getting to grips with circumstances is hard work - and I constantly see people on here with what they feel are insurmountable problems, saying things that are evidently foolish - "I think I'll die without him", or "She was my soul~mate, now my life is over"....and i "face-palm" because honestly, I know what happiness is dependent on, and it ain't someone else. But they don't realise that. They don't see it, and sometimes, I sympathise and support them, and at other times i just give 'em the ole slap-up-de-head... I don't know how I evaluate the difference, but 9 times out of 10, it works.... (The odd times it doesn't are a bit embarassing...) We are strong, supportive and helpful here, and many people make it, and start to heal. A community of like-minded spirits is helpful in the healing process, but ultimately, the person has to do this for themselves. And it really boils down to whether the person has the strength within themselves to recognise they're really worth that effort. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
HeavenOrHell Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 She explains it very well, but my point is no two situations/experiences/people are the same, there are always differing factors, so it's not as cut and dried as choosing whether to suffer or not, a person can try their hardest to be positive, but it might not work, because we all react differently. Maybe some people label themselves as having mental disorders when they don't, but I was talking about earlier is people who have recognised/diagnosed mental health problems, yes there are large amounts of people taking meds for depression or anxiety, life's a battle for a lot of people, it's not easy for many. And obviously it's not just people with mental health problems who react badly to stress. To me it implies someone isn't trying hard enough if they 'choose' to suffer/react badly to something, which in some cases maybe true, but far from true in others. For all the reasons I've mentioned, maybe you would be able to cope better than someone else, maybe you have factors in your life which mean you could pick yourself up a little more easily than another person might, and maybe you might not pick yourself up as much as yet another person. Yes, life is what you make it, but we all have different circumstances and factors which are out of our control and play a huge part too in how we react to situations in life. HeavenOrHell.. I'm sorry, but i disagree with you. If you go back and read TaraMaidens posts, she explains it really well. I also have an issue with people labeling themselves as having a mental disorder as a way to justify a behaviour they associate with. I'm not saying that there aren't really people with these issues, but it seems that three quarters of the American public are on some kind of medication for depression or bi-pola or anixiety or believe they have some kind of personality disorder. Once again.. you can say that bad thing happen to good people, and you can say that some people are victims. Truth is, that if someone came up to me and punched me in the face, stabbed me in the ovaries and stole my shoes, yes that would be stink. BUT, it is my responsibility how i choose to feel about it. I can let it effect me, or I can choose to let it go.. I KNOW that seems harsh. And it is. But no one ever said that life was gonna be all rainbows and unicorns. IT'S WHAT YOU MAKE IT. .... and your signature is basically of that philosophy too! Link to post Share on other sites
wwwjd Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 k, I didn't read the whole thread, so not sure if someone covered this: I live the 10/90 thang: Live is 10% what happens to you, and 90% how YOU respond to it. That empowers YOU to struggle and suffer less. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Million.to.1 Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 She explains it very well, but my point is no two situations/experiences/people are the same, there are always differing factors, so it's not as cut and dried as choosing whether to suffer or not, a person can try their hardest to be positive, but it might not work, because we all react differently. Maybe some people label themselves as having mental disorders when they don't, but I was talking about earlier is people who have recognised/diagnosed mental health problems, yes there are large amounts of people taking meds for depression or anxiety, life's a battle for a lot of people, it's not easy for many. And obviously it's not just people with mental health problems who react badly to stress. To me it implies someone isn't trying hard enough if they 'choose' to suffer/react badly to something, which in some cases maybe true, but far from true in others. For all the reasons I've mentioned, maybe you would be able to cope better than someone else, maybe you have factors in your life which mean you could pick yourself up a little more easily than another person might, and maybe you might not pick yourself up as much as yet another person. Yes, life is what you make it, but we all have different circumstances and factors which are out of our control and play a huge part too in how we react to situations in life. I do see your point, but i don't understand how it is relative. The title of this thread is "Why do some people seem to struggle all their lives when others seem to never suffer?" Suffering is an EXPERIENCE. We choose our experiences. Of course some people have it "better" than others. But that in itself is all subjective anyway. I have seen the happiest most content people with absolutely nothing, living day to day in poverty and struggling to survive. And I seen the richest most beautiful people with perfect lives do nothing but bitch about their lot. People either focus on the good or they focus on the bad. People either blame the outside world for their suffering or they take responsibility for their experience. (their reaction and how it continues to effect their state of happiness) Link to post Share on other sites
turnera Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Why do some people seem to struggle all their lives when others seem to never suffer? It can't be just plain bad luck (I don't believe in good or bad luck...just cause and effect). Is it just your fault that things continue to go wrong in your life - or can other people contribute to your lack of success? Finally, what if despite your best efforts...you still continue to falter and are no closer to achieving your goals than when you started? I just don't understand. Help me out here.It's all in the attitude. Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 ... it would be kinda nice at this point to have input from writergal and gain her perspective on this now.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Eve Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Why do some people seem to struggle all their lives when others seem to never suffer? It can't be just plain bad luck (I don't believe in good or bad luck...just cause and effect). Is it just your fault that things continue to go wrong in your life - or can other people contribute to your lack of success? Finally, what if despite your best efforts...you still continue to falter and are no closer to achieving your goals than when you started? I just don't understand. Help me out here. I don't know OP. I want to believe that it is about facing fears and coming to accept ones learning curve - as this is how I got out of my mess. Maybe it is a case where you need to re-think the aspect that things not going great is something to get over once and for all? In my life this has not been the case. The initial issues are still there in background; with me I suffer terribly from impatience. I still face this issue but have altered my reception of challenges. Wanting things to go away or focusing too much was my main problem. Once I let go off that I could live much better. Also I was prone to beating myself up a lot due to wanting things to be perfect. I still have a fascination with perfection which I don't bother to try and change that much now because I love it too much.. but I don't beat myself up at all nowadays. Just stopped it. Don't miss it either. There are people all too willing to downgrade others out there, so it is best to be on your own side. I think it is about accepting your life as it is and working on things bit by bit and uprooting any negative people/learning how to deal effectively with others as you go along. Still I have seen people who have really **** lives continue in this pattern. Mostly I would say that they become SO used to downgrading themselves to others and themselves that this becomes an actual communication style so ingrained that they don't move forward. I have met people who are in therapy constantly because of this. You are what you say you are methinks. Harsh lesson to overcome but feels good once you get past it. Life is now, whatever is happening. Don't wait for good times. Be the good times. Well, that's what I do. Faith assisted me alongside continued study etc. Take care, Eve x 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author writergal Posted May 8, 2012 Author Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) ... it would be kinda nice at this point to have input from writergal and gain her perspective on this now.... I LOVE everyone's responses to my question - even those who I slightly disagree with, because I don't know that there is one right answer. I definitely think we can't control our environment, how other people treat us, or what happens to us. Sometimes we can't even control our reactions because we are overcome with emotion or physical responses. Yes, sometimes we can choose our experiences (sometimes we can't), but we can't control the outcome no matter how hard we try. All we can control is our reactions even when that seems hard. Help, I also think that having social networks HELPS A LOT. Transitions in work, life, love, financial and spiritual can be REALLY stressful. Moving to a new city where you don't know anyone. Starting a new job. Returning to school later in life. Being a single parent. Developing a skill. Coping with financial strife. Living with a disability. Recovering from trauma, injury or a loved one's death. We can't make it through those life experiences without someone else's help. We need each other but when you find yourself alone it's hard to reach out to others when complacency sets in; when you think, "what's the point" or "no one cares." I think intuition is crucial to being happy and when we ignore it, we fail ourselves by letting others' opinions influence how we feel about ourselves. Such an easy trap to fall into - I know it is for me. Although I feel pessimistic about my future based on my past, I refuse to give up. ACCEPTANCE This is how it is. Not how it was, might have been, should have been. Not how I want it to be, hoped it would be, planned it to be. I accept that THIS is how it is. And now I will get on with my life in a positive way. Edited May 8, 2012 by writergal 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Mr Scorpio Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 I agree with TaraMaiden that it's about perception and how you frame things. And you are comparing your insides with other people's outsides. You don't know what internal struggles people face to get where they are or to do what they need to do just to get by. I know people who are in senior jobs working for huge conglomerates and they're on megabucks but they also work 70-100 hour weeks and don't have time for their family or to take care of their health. I know people who have adorable bright children and they are constantly teaching the children new things and giving them new experiences but their marriages are falling apart because they're neglecting their spouses. I know people who live amazing fun-filled lives and are always learning something new or travelling to some exotic land but inside they're terribly lonely and would give it all up if they could just find 'the one'. There are upsides and downsides to every choice we make in life. It's up to us to decide what we consider those to be and which we can/can't live with. That's not to say that we should approach everything with rose-tinted glasses but sometimes you are right where you need to be. You have an important lesson to learn and sometimes the lesson is in the journey and not the goal. Besides, your life is not over yet. Until it is, there is always an opportunity to reach your version of successful. Best. Post. Ever. Link to post Share on other sites
HeavenOrHell Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 We choose some experiences, not all, people don't choose to be born into abuse or to be born with health problems, for example, unless you believe in reincarnation or karma, which I don't. I wouldn't call suffering an experience as such, it's more the effect of certain circumstances/happenings and it affects us as individuals. Some people may feel able to choose whether to suffer, others won't be quite so able to, because as I've said many times, we ARE ALL DIFFERENT, no two people will/can react the same. Taramaiden summed it up perfectly >And it really boils down to whether the person has the strength within themselves to recognise they're really worth that effort< Some will have the strength, some won't. Simple. Maybe the happiest most content people you've seen who are happy have other factors with give them strength, for example even if they struggle to find food daily or a roof over their head, they may have wonderful friends, or a family which instilled them with love and positivity. And some of the richest most beautiful people might not be happy because their lives might be devoid of real love. Also, many people battle hugely to overcome traumas, but they don't always succeed, depression and despondency will overcome some people and not others, this doesn't mean they're not trying hard enough, they could be battling to try to change things every second of their life, but not everyone will succeed. I do see your point, but i don't understand how it is relative. The title of this thread is "Why do some people seem to struggle all their lives when others seem to never suffer?" Suffering is an EXPERIENCE. We choose our experiences. Of course some people have it "better" than others. But that in itself is all subjective anyway. I have seen the happiest most content people with absolutely nothing, living day to day in poverty and struggling to survive. And I seen the richest most beautiful people with perfect lives do nothing but bitch about their lot. People either focus on the good or they focus on the bad. People either blame the outside world for their suffering or they take responsibility for their experience. (their reaction and how it continues to effect their state of happiness) Link to post Share on other sites
TaraMaiden Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 (edited) I definitely think we can't control our environment, how other people treat us, or what happens to us. Sometimes we can't even control our reactions because we are overcome with emotion or physical responses. Yes, sometimes we can choose our experiences (sometimes we can't), but we can't control the outcome no matter how hard we try. All we can control is our reactions even when that seems hard. This is absolutely true and I know it seems difficult (And yeah, actually, the reason it 'seems' difficult is because at times, it damn well is!) but it IS possible. I learned the hard way - through personal evaluation, and just reading everything I could get my hands on, in the way of self-help books - to actually change the way my mind worked, the way it perceived things, the way it processed them and digested them. I had to re-programme my perception, and actually willingly discard and abandon previous concepts that had been ingrained into me over the preceding years. Not by any person in particular, perhaps - but just concepts that I had adopted, because I knew of no other way of doing anything else with them. I had to re-learn how to evaluate, appreciate and digest experiences. I had to alter my own perspective, perception and processing. This . Takes . Time. And it also takes a lot of mistakes, wrong turns, dead ends and huge hurdles. And that is perfectly fine. The secret is to just get up every time you tumble, and not be tempted to stay there. And the temptation, at times, is huge, because such Effort takes you way out of your comfort zone, and the temptation to scoot back in there, is huge. You just have to fix on the fact that the comfort zone is actually a crippling, debilitating and limiting place to be.... and comfortable as it is, it's not helping you none... ACCEPTANCE This is how it is. Not how it was, might have been, should have been. Not how I want it to be, hoped it would be, planned it to be. I accept that THIS is how it is. And now I will get on with my life in a positive way. Brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. Write this out in huge red letters, stick it on every wall you see, and live by it as your mantra. My current mantra - if you're interested is this: "Whatever you put Energy in to, will grow." (Miranda July) Every time I see it, I breathe in deeply, pause, come back to The Moment, Let Go, and move on. Breathing is so therapeutic! Edited May 9, 2012 by TaraMaiden Link to post Share on other sites
Eve Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Writergirl - what are you going to do then? I love words too but what precisely are you thinking you need to do right now? I think if you don't have a strategy of some sort you will remain in the same place. Take care, Eve x Link to post Share on other sites
Heart Of A Lion Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 (edited) I often don't agree with the standpoint that suffering is about "how you view things" and that "hapiness is found on the inside" and that "suffering is a choice" Let me tell you some of the stories of people who have been in North Korean concentration camps, then tell me if their suffering is a choice. 1. North Korean guards ordered the woman to stand under a large industrial crucible containing hot orange-glowing liquid metal, after which they tilted the crucible and poured the hot glowing liquid metal over the woman. Burning her entire body, burning all her skin away, her eyes away. You know what the worst thing was about that? She survived the ordeal. Tell me if you would have the balls to tell her at that moment "happiness is found on the inside, your suffering is a choice. Life, is about dancing in the rain." 2. Same camp. A pregnant woman is giving giving birth to a baby, while she is giving birth North Korean soldiers are kicking her in her belly with their boots, as hard as they can. When the head of the baby comes out of her body, one of the soldiers steps on the head of the baby and breaks its neck, killing the baby while it's still for the most part inside the woman. The soldiers pull out the baby, shoot it and throw it on a pile of other dead babies outside. Tell me if you would have the balls to tell her at that moment "happiness is found on the inside, your suffering is a choice. Life, is about dancing in the rain." 3. Same camp. Soldiers have cut small holes in a wall. The holes measure 2 feet high, 1 feet wide and 1 feet deep. They take people and stuff them into the holes, breaking their bones in the process. The people are still alive while in the holes, but can hardly breathe in the small cramped spaces and are left in there for weeks. If they survive, they come out completely deformed and highly psychologically damaged. Tell me if you would have the balls to tell them at that moment "happiness is found on the inside, your suffering is a choice. Life, is about dancing in the rain." I read these stories in a book of collected stories from North Korean concentration camp survivors. My point is that some things sound nice as a philosophy or in theory, but don't sound so convincing in practice. Unless someone knows of a way of making those people feel happy in those situations using those philosophies, then I'm not convinced that those philosophies apply. Edited May 10, 2012 by Heart Of A Lion 2 Link to post Share on other sites
wwwjd Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 Quite obviously, someone who is having their body hacked to little tiny pieces very slowly is "suffering"... but that probably isn't MOST of us.... and I don't even think that is the type of "SUFFERING" THIS thread is talking about. Is it? Maybe I missed it. YES, Captain Obvious, people who are SUFFERING PHYSICALLY TORTURED are not going to think their way out of it with happy thoughts. Did you really even have to bother going there? What I read in the initial post was more about fairly typical lives and suffering mental turmoil. Most reply with general life in mind. Not tourturous concentration camps. There is a downside to everything so long as you want to go there. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Anela Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 YES, Captain Obvious, people who are SUFFERING PHYSICALLY TORTURED are not going to think their way out of it with happy thoughts. Did you really even have to bother going there? Man's Search for Meaning - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia I bought the book last September, but had nightmares, so I have yet to finish it. There was also a woman who wrote about her experience in the camps - she lost her sister, and other family members. I'm forgetting her name, but it stayed with me for years. She wrote a book called The Hiding Place. Corrie Ten Boom - that was her name. I read her books when I was getting over agoraphobia, in the Spring of 2003. Link to post Share on other sites
Anela Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 We may not be physically tortured, but we can only go by our life experiences, in comparison to others. I was crying last night, and feeling a lot of pain, over something that might seem pointless to others - either because they haven't had my experience, they don't want the experience, or they've had it, too, and have just handled things much better than I have. I'm appalled by the fact that I haven't done much better in life, because I have had such supportive parents. They don't have much money, but they have been emotionally supportive, and I sometimes wonder if they've given me too much of a cushion (although, in contrast, I had experiences with others, that left me needing that cushion for a while). I'm more lost than I ever was when I was younger, I should have learned to drive (or moved to a place that allowed me to walk/take buses and/or trains) - there are all sorts of things I could have (should have?) done. But I also remind myself that bad things could have happened with any of those choices, had I made them, otherwise I spiral down and it's tough to get me out of that depression. Some think that depression/apathy is just another excuse to stay stuck. I really don't know anymore. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Heart Of A Lion Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 (edited) Quite obviously, someone who is having their body hacked to little tiny pieces very slowly is "suffering"... but that probably isn't MOST of us.... and I don't even think that is the type of "SUFFERING" THIS thread is talking about. Is it? Maybe I missed it. YES, Captain Obvious, people who are SUFFERING PHYSICALLY TORTURED are not going to think their way out of it with happy thoughts. Did you really even have to bother going there? What I read in the initial post was more about fairly typical lives and suffering mental turmoil. Most reply with general life in mind. Not tourturous concentration camps. There is a downside to everything so long as you want to go there. I expected this sort of response. And my answer to that is a question: "At what point is mental suffering no longer linked to physical factors?" For example. I've been feeling lovesick for the past year and a half year. At no point did making a conscious choice "to not feel lovesick" alleviate it. I suspect that my hormones are playing up at my age. And that's exactly what I mean, at what point is mental suffering no longer linked to something that is actually physical of nature? In the case of the concentration camp it were the soldiers that were torturing the people. In my case it's probably my hormones that are causing my feeling of lovesickness. While the concentration camp scenarios are way worse than my personal example of lovesickness, it's just the extent of the suffering that differs, but not its nature. In both cases the source and nature of the suffering is physical and it is external in the sense that I do not control those physical factors by choice. So then how is the suffering a choice? Edited May 10, 2012 by Heart Of A Lion Link to post Share on other sites
january2011 Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 I think that we're losing perspective by comparing the lives of torture and murder victims to writergal's. All suffering is not the same. Link to post Share on other sites
Heart Of A Lion Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 (edited) I think that we're losing perspective by comparing the lives of torture and murder victims to writergal's. All suffering is not the same. No, but all suffering seems similar in its underlying nature. Only the extent of the suffering seems to differ in different scenarios. My sincere apologies Writergal if is this is going to sound blunt, but I'm trying to make a point. Writergal has told in her threads that for example she had been in a terrible car accident. She had been in the hospital for a long time. She has also said that she has $100k in student debt. And no, that is not comparable to the example of torture in concentration camps. However, in neither scenario would thinking happy thoughts have solved the source of the suffering. Making the choice to think happy thoughts would not have prevented the car from hitting her, neither would it forgive her student debt. Yet that seems to be the point that a lot of people are trying to make, that making the choice to think happy thoughts will make the suffering go away. However, that does not solve the underlying issues that caused the suffering the first place. Would making the choice to think happy thoughts truly solve the issues at hand or is that just equal to sugarcoating and ignoring the actual problems? Edited May 10, 2012 by Heart Of A Lion Link to post Share on other sites
january2011 Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 I don't know what you've been through Heart of a Lion, but my advice is based on what I've been through and what worked/s for me. And yes, thinking happy thoughts is what got me through the suffering. While you might consider that impractical, sugarcoating and ignorant, I can assure you that when all you've got is your thoughts to keep you company, then you are going to hold onto them and make them as happy as you can despite whatever physical pain your body is going through. The brain. What a wonderful and powerful tool. How else do people find the endurance to bear their pain? YMMV. If you consider that the advice so far ignores and sugarcoats writergal's actual problems, how about posting the solution? If you think happy thoughts aren't going to cut it, what will? Sincerely, I think it would be helpful to know. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
turnera Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 Before my mother died from emphysema, she could no longer take full breaths. She couldn't walk more than 15 feet without having to stop. She had chronic back pain. She wanted all the suffering to go away. But do you know what she told me? That she caused her own suffering for continuing to smoke, and that she was grateful that - aside from going to my daughter's high school graduation at Reliant Stadium - she had never had to use a wheelchair. She was grateful. That she could still walk at all. THAT is all in the attitude. Link to post Share on other sites
Heart Of A Lion Posted May 10, 2012 Share Posted May 10, 2012 I can assure you that when all you've got is your thoughts to keep you company, then you are going to hold onto them and make them as happy as you can despite whatever physical pain your body is going through. With that I agree, because if it's your only option and last resort for alleviation, then it would make sense to make use of it. If you consider that the advice so far ignores and sugarcoats writergal's actual problems, how about posting the solution? If you think happy thoughts aren't going to cut it, what will? Sincerely, I think it would be helpful to know. I didn't mean to imply I had a solution for her problems. What I tried to challenge for the sake of discussion was the notion that her suffering is supposedly a choice. When it comes to suffering, there is one psychological trick that works in a lot of situations/scenarios, i.e. ignoring a problem and not caring. It would even work in extreme examples. To use the concentration camp as an example again; Suppose they would shoot someone's child. If the parent would manage to shrug it off and not care about it, then the parent wouldn't suffer from it. And while that psychological trick would be a practical solution to the suffering that would have resulted, it somehow does seem f*cked up. You would need to be pretty hardcore in your attitude to not let something like that affect you. You could apply this to smaller daily issues too, but I'm not sure what to think about that. Does that bring happiness? Is it ethical? And should that person even care about it being ethical? Does it actually solve anything? Technically you could wave a lot of suffering away by "not worrying or caring". But if that's the answer, should people live their lives in that way then? I don't know. I don't have all the answers. Link to post Share on other sites
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