paigej91 Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Should I kick him to the curb or join the 21st century? Lol he has to play the game in order to score. Surely after enough failed attempts he will get his act together or be single forever. I say lose him Link to post Share on other sites
venusishername Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Lol he has to play the game in order to score. Surely after enough failed attempts he will get his act together or be single forever. I say lose him Yeah, it rubbed me the wrong way! For a second date, I'd expect him to pull out all the stops. But I do like him, that's the thing. I'm used to men telling me to put my money away. Maybe I've been close-minded? Link to post Share on other sites
TheZebra Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I'm as modern as they come and will tend to go dutch on dates (or do the 'I pay this time, he pays the next', etc). That said, something about that situation just came off weird.. I can't explain it but it DID rub me the wrong way too and like I said, I'm a modern independent gal with a job too! I dunno... If you like him enough, maybe go on another date and keep examining things. Make sure he's not a cheapskate either. Link to post Share on other sites
Eggplant Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 No -- YOU invited HIM to that last thing. The person who invites pays. He never offered to take you there. Of course it's on you to pay for it! And by the way, I usually think the man should pay, but in this case, that bill was yours. Link to post Share on other sites
TheZebra Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 That IS true Eggplant - that's what my mother taught me as well, and when I do invite a guy out I do reach to pay. It's just the way he said it was weird. I think he could've said it without it seeming... I dunno, weird. It was like being blunt, but not a good blunt... I dunno Link to post Share on other sites
nescafe1982 Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I'm inclined to agree with Eggplant that if you did the inviting, you should offer to pay. But I still wouldn't go out with him again... his stated rationale bothers me. The first date is a little early to be keeping score, isn't it? So we get (promised) equal access to jobs, wages, etc, but this then means that all chivalry is dead? Pssshhhh. Our gender equality is about correcting historical wrongs, not about dating culture. Link to post Share on other sites
CherryT Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Each person is different. Like you, I am also a successful, independent woman who lives a fairly comfortable life. However, I always offer to pay because I don't think the occasional "pick up the tab" only when we're in a long term relationship is right for me. I get denied by my boyfriend (we've been in a long term relationship) most of the time (99%), but I always want to offer. I also spoil my boyfriend and don't expect that it should always be him surprising me. My boyfriend is also a successful, independent man and up until he met me, he's always been accustomed to paying the bill without thinking and he's always felt being a provider was a natural reaction. It's hard to explain, but I'm just not like that. I do like traditional dating and courting but I think just offering is nice. Maybe you not offering turned him off? Whether he was going to deny you picking up the tab or not... you did suggest it and if I was a man, I would think it would have been nice to at least offer. Link to post Share on other sites
skydiveaddict Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I'm not sure if I like it, but he gave me food for thought. Should I kick him to the curb or join the 21st century? I think it's bad manners and very effeminate to ever ask a girl to pay for a date. It just sounds weird to me. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Eggplant Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I'm inclined to agree with Eggplant that if you did the inviting, you should offer to pay. But I still wouldn't go out with him again... his stated rationale bothers me. The first date is a little early to be keeping score, isn't it? So we get (promised) equal access to jobs, wages, etc, but this then means that all chivalry is dead? Pssshhhh. Our gender equality is about correcting historical wrongs, not about dating culture. I agree with you, personally. Women and men are different in the dating world; women have the babies, blah, blah. I'll not thread jack with that topic because it's all over LS on other threads, and I've already posted millions of times about it. However, many people disagree with you and me, like the guy in question. This man is looking for a woman who thinks similarly about the topic. That's fine. Maybe the OP will agree with him; maybe she won't. That's up to her, use the info to evaluate him along with everything else. That's what dating is for -- getting info and checking out compatibility. Link to post Share on other sites
Lixxy Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 If I were a guy, a woman not offering to pay at least half would be a huge red flag to me... I'd be thinking... ~ possible golddigger; possibly expecting me to do all the hard work; and - even though she's a "strong, independent, successful woman who earns her living", somehow... she can't afford to go halves with me?! That would leave a very bad taste in my mouth. This mentality of the man paying 100% makes no sense to me especially when the woman can afford to pay her own way. I don't like the: "Well, sure I have money, but I also have a vagina, you see. Therefore I expect you to pay 100%. What? I have a vagina!" 5 Link to post Share on other sites
Eggplant Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 If I were a guy, a woman not offering to pay at least half would be a huge red flag to me... I'd be thinking... ~ possible golddigger; possibly expecting me to do all the hard work; and - even though she's a "strong, independent, successful woman who earns her living", somehow... she can't afford to go halves with me?! That would leave a very bad taste in my mouth. This mentality of the man paying 100% makes no sense to me especially when the woman can afford to pay her own way. I don't like the: "Well, sure I have money, but I also have a vagina, you see. Therefore I expect you to pay 100%. What? I have a vagina!" Reaching for your wallet is always polite. But the inviter is the one to pay. I think it best for the development of a relationship if somebody is treating the other -- going Dutch is for just-friends. If it's to be equal, and not old-fashioned, then the woman should take the man out on a date half the time and pay for those dates. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
nescafe1982 Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 "Well, sure I have money, but I also have a vagina, you see. Therefore I expect you to pay 100%. What? I have a vagina!" This made me LOL, even though I do think it's important for the guy to pay in the beginning (if he's the asker). Maybe OP can just make that argument? Link to post Share on other sites
Lixxy Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Reaching for your wallet is always polite. But the inviter is the one to pay. I think it best for the development of a relationship if somebody is treating the other -- going Dutch is for just-friends. If it's to be equal, and not old-fashioned, then the woman should take the man out on a date half the time and pay for those dates. Ah see though I don't even believe in the inviter paying 100%, lol. ;P IMO, treating is lovely once the relationship has actually been established, but until then it's something of a risk for just one person to pay 100%. Being willing to compromise for fairness on both sides always leaves a nice impression too, I feel. Whereas an expectant or entitled attitude on a date does the complete opposite. Link to post Share on other sites
Eggplant Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Ah see though I don't even believe in the inviter paying 100%, lol. ;P IMO, treating is lovely once the relationship has actually been established, but until then it's something of a risk for just one person to pay 100%. Being willing to compromise for fairness on both sides always leaves a nice impression too, I feel. Whereas an expectant or entitled attitude on a date does the complete opposite. Actually, initially, I think dates should be very low key and casual. Coffee. Breakfast. A walk in the park for free. This guy is looking for a woman with your views. I see merits to old-fashioned dating and merits to mirror-role dating. Like-minded people can date like-minded people. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Lixxy Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Actually, initially, I think dates should be very low key and casual. Coffee. Breakfast. A walk in the park for free. This guy is looking for a woman with your views. I see merits to old-fashioned dating and merits to mirror-role dating. Like-minded people can date like-minded people. Completely agreed. Link to post Share on other sites
Untouchable_Fire Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I'm a successful, independent woman with a good career and am living comfortably, but I swear this is the first time on such an early date that a guy has done this. I'm not sure if I like it, but he gave me food for thought. Should I kick him to the curb or join the 21st century? The fact that you even have to ask this question says bad things about your overall character. It's like a dude bitching because he didn't get sex on the 3rd date. It's simultaneously pathetic and obnoxious. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
kaylan Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I went on a date last night with someone I met recently. He asked me out both times, and this was our second date. He came to pick me up and my place, and he brought over something to drink so we could have a chance to talk before going out. We went out to a place of my choosing, he was a total gentleman, even ordering for me, and picked up the bill. Things were going perfectly. As we were leaving, I was not quite ready to end the night, so I suggested we go somewhere else. The check came to the table, and he didn't touch it. We wanted to leave, and so I felt compelled to ask him, "Did you want me to get that?" First of all, I have never dated a man who did NOT pick up the tab, unless we were in a long term relationship and I occasionally got the check. Of course I paid for our drinks after he said that, but I told him that he caught me off guard and that I wasn't used to that. He had a good argument though, and said he appreciated me being old-fashioned, but men and women are equal in the world now, and so you can't have your cake and eat it too, basically. He went on to explain that he was the one to ask me out, so he wanted to pick up 'most' of the tab. I like him, but this really threw me off. I'm a successful, independent woman with a good career and am living comfortably, but I swear this is the first time on such an early date that a guy has done this. I'm not sure if I like it, but he gave me food for thought. Should I kick him to the curb or join the 21st century? You picked the first place and he paid. You suggested another place and youre upset that you had to pay? Talk about being entitled. You are not independent at all if you expect someone to pay for you twice after you chose where to go twice. I would stop seeing a girl with your attitude. You wouldnt have to worry about telling me you were done. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
FitChick Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Only date men over forty and you won't have this problem. Either that or go to cheap or free places. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
camillalev Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 He paid for dinner, you pay for drinks. Sounds pretty fair to me. Link to post Share on other sites
venusishername Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Not really fair to say that's a mark against my character. I wasn't upset that I paid. I'm used to old-fashioned men, even by my father's example growing up. Maybe as a woman I believe that chivalry and romancing should not be dead. I did suggest the second place and that's fine to pick up the bill. Of course I have offered on dates before and the reaction has always been the man insisting on paying. This was the first time for me, I just didn't know what to make of it is all. Maybe I did come off a little entitled but i agree, like minded people should date like minded people. Link to post Share on other sites
Legatus Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I don't think you should worry about that. I would like an independent woman to say she wants to pay, although I wouldn't let her anyway. Not if the entire date was my idea. However if next time she invites me out I would still offer to pay but expect her to take the lead. I think sometimes the intention to do something is enough and it sends the right message. Perhaps he came to strong being open but I think this is just a matter of compatibility, not necessarily his bad character.. Link to post Share on other sites
kaylan Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 (edited) Not really fair to say that's a mark against my character. I wasn't upset that I paid. I'm used to old-fashioned men, even by my father's example growing up. Maybe as a woman I believe that chivalry and romancing should not be dead. I did suggest the second place and that's fine to pick up the bill. Of course I have offered on dates before and the reaction has always been the man insisting on paying. This was the first time for me, I just didn't know what to make of it is all. Maybe I did come off a little entitled but i agree, like minded people should date like minded people. If you are used to that kind of treatment from men (and if you expect it), then you are not at all independent, which you claim in your original post. Find another guy then. You know, the kind of guy whos mind is stuck in the past that men pay for everything, despite it being 2013 with women working full time and earning good salaries. Find that guy who lets you have your cake (job and income), and eat it too (him paying like a scrub imo) Excuse my being so opinionated on the matter, but I just didnt enjoy how the guys character was questioned by you originally. But it is what it is. Im guessing you are perhaps over 30? Because I notice that women in my age groups (20s) dont get so bent out of shape about actually having to use their disposable income on someone their dating. Dont continue dating this current guy. Because clearly you have a problem with his dating views. Thats a glaring incompatibility. Edited July 8, 2013 by kaylan 1 Link to post Share on other sites
bac Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 No -- YOU invited HIM to that last thing. The person who invites pays. He never offered to take you there. Of course it's on you to pay for it! And by the way, I usually think the man should pay, but in this case, that bill was yours. I agree that if you expect a man to pay you should be sensitive and careful. In other words, you let him to pay if you are sure that he wants to pay. Therefore, you cannot invite him directly. You can do it only indirectly. Then, you check his reaction. A person who pays has the absolute right to make decisions about payments. It is disrespectful to force men to pay for you. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
pcplod Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 I am a rather quaint, old-fashioned fart. I thought this whole female equality/independence thing was about asserting yourself as a person, gender notwithstanding. I thought it was symbolic. That is, "I am not for sale, nor can I be bought". It looks like I've been labouring under a serious delusion for far too long and that being an old-fashioned fart is where it is at, ie exactly where it has always been. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Chivalry is on it's way out and people just need to accept that fact. It's not men that killed it either. Link to post Share on other sites
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