Consolidated Discussion - Paying for Dates

[HHC]

But what if he thinks the same way? If he asked you out, he expects to pay for the date. If you offer to pay half, he would feel uncomfortable, kind of like how you would feel uncomfortable if HE paid when YOU planned the date.

It's how we sort it out that matters. I'd rather fight over who doesn't pay rather than who does.

You have to think in his shoes too.

Yeah, no I don't. Not when it comes to the first date. I don't even let my friends buy me a coffee without keeping track and buying them two in reply.

 

It's how I work and the quicker people figure that out the better. No point in hiding it on the first date

[Leopard]

However, we see no reason to waste money on someone who may vaporize into thin air, not be compatible, or is just a plain horrible date. Just as women, in this day and age, are not obligated to sleep with someone until they feel a connection, a man should not be obligated to pay until he feels a connection and does it out generosity of heart.

 

That's the thing. If a man needs to feel "generosity of heart" just to pay for a date, then he isn't the kind of guy I would want to date. He needs to have generosity of heart to begin with. If that's how everyone was, good deeds wouldn't exist because people would always need a reason or reward to be nice. I don't think that's genuine generosity if you ask me.

 

A woman giving her body versus a guy paying for dinner are two completely different things.

 

You can't compare a woman's need for connection to have sex, with paying for dinner. Worse comes to worst, the guy will waste $40, but a woman will have gotten hurt way more.

Edited June 11, 2012 by Leopard

[Sanman]

We live in a society where there are certain standards. Women are expected to dress nice when they are out with a man, be the primary caregiver of their children (if they have any)... men are expected to be providers, to show a girl that he's man enough to take care of her, and to be a gentleman. Yes, these ideals stem from way back, but there is a reason why many of us still hold on to them.

 

Now that I know he has the capability of being a gentleman, I will offer to pay for future dates. So to be specific, I believe that for the very FIRST date, the man should take the whole tab. I just think a man like that is showing her that he's really interested. And the woman, in turn, should offer to pay in the future because the man has successfully shown that he is interested and is a gentleman.

 

You are entitled to your opinion, but if you want traditional roles then you better be prepared to get in the kitchen and make him a sandwich. A good one. And follow that sandwich up with a nice BJ whether you feel like it or not (because raping your wife was not a crime in the good ol' days).

 

I live in the world of today. That means that I split checks when I first start dating. My gf makes more than me (and may have more income potential). Money comes from whoever has it as the moment. I may be the primary caretaker of our children or we may split the responsibilities as evenly as possible.

 

Him buying you ice cream actually means nothing. It might mean something if every guy did not already know many women think like you. All it means is that he is hedging his bets that you won't sleep with him without at least a minimal cash outlay. He may have done that for the three other women he is sleeping with as well. Wealthy men even buy a house for their wife and an apartment for their mistress. However, that is alright since he paid the apartment rent and held the front door for her. He is not using that mistress at all.

 

It is nice that you think the man should pick up the tab on the first date to show that he is a gentleman, but what are you doing to show him you are a lady? For every woman that is a faithful 'lady' there is one that goes home to sex her fwb and has dates with three other men lined up for three more cups of ice cream (or low-fat frozen yogurt more likely). How is paying for that woman and showing her you are a gentleman a worthwhile task?

 

For many men, the concept of gentlemanliness went out with the concept of chastity. While many men would not mind paying to court a woman who comported herself with respect and was very selective about her sexual partners, no one wants to have to buy dinner for the one that got drunk and banged the whole basketball team last night but puts on a dress and pretends to be a woman with you. Yet, it happens all the time now.

[Sanman]

You can't compare a woman's need for connection to have sex, with paying for dinner. Worse comes to worst, the guy will waste $40, but a woman will have gotten hurt way more.

 

Some women give it up for nothing and some dates cost significantly more than $40. 3 dates at that cost is even $120. That money compounded with interest is in the thousands. Multiply that times hundreds of dates and you are losing a substantial amount of future savings. At what point does the loss that a man takes matter?

[Kamille]

Some women give it up for nothing and some dates cost significantly more than $40. 3 dates at that cost is even $120. That money compounded with interest is in the thousands. Multiply that times hundreds of dates and you are losing a substantial amount of future savings. At what point does the loss that a man takes matter?

 

You're imagining a life of first dates only.

 

Stop dating and find a partner with whom you share similar financial goals. In every single one of my relationships, we would easily come to a financial arrangement that benefited us both. (Sharing groceries, the cost of housing, traveling, etc.)

[musemaj11]

A woman giving her body versus a guy paying for dinner are two completely different things.

 

You can't compare a woman's need for connection to have sex, with paying for dinner. Worse comes to worst, the guy will waste $40, but a woman will have gotten hurt way more.

Very typical.

 

This line of thinking that plays down the other side's concern while playing up your own really irritates me.

 

If you wanna play that game, then men could say losing money is much worse because not only you lose something tangible that you earned through hard work, you also suffer emotional pain due to rejection. On the other hand, SEX IS FREE. The loss is imaginative.

[Sanman]

You're imagining a life of first dates only.

 

Stop dating and find a partner with whom you share similar financial goals. In every single one of my relationships, we would easily come to a financial arrangement that benefited us both. (Sharing groceries, the cost of housing, traveling, etc.)

 

 

This isn't about me. I am in a relationship (and have been for over a year). I really don't care about what I spend on my gf as we would like to get married and in the end all the money will be ours anyway. That does not change the fact that I (and most men) will go through many women before finding a lasting relationship and the tenure of most of those women will be 1-3 dates that the man has to pay for. I would love the thousands of unreciprocated dollars I spent on those women back because I could really use it to help pay for a house with the one I did choose. I am not even talking about past relationships, just the money from the hundreds of failed dates over the last decade or so.

[Sanman]

Very typical.

 

This line of thinking that plays down the other side's concern while playing up your own really irritates me.

 

If you wanna play that game, then men could say losing money is much worse because not only you lose something tangible that you earned through hard work, you also suffer emotional pain due to rejection. On the other hand, SEX IS FREE. The loss is imaginative.

 

 

Actually the most poignant issue there is the assumption that women give up more for sex than. Men associate emotion and feelings with sex as well and need a connection equally there too. It just is not acknowledged by much of society. There is just that assumption that all men with stick it in anything with zero forethought.

[mesmerized]

Women spend more money on looking good than men spend on paying for dates. From birth control to makeup to brizilian wax etc, not to mention the very expensive anti-aging products that women have to buy to not god forbid ever look old...pleasing these creatures called men isn't easy lol

Edited June 11, 2012 by mesmerized

[Sanman]

Women spend more money on looking good than men spend on paying for dates. From birth control to makeup to brizilian wax etc...pleasing these creatures called men isn't easy lol

 

 

No, you're pleasing other women too. Please show me a straight man that knows which shoe is a jimmy choo and which dress is a dolce & gabbana. Besides, women want fashionable men too. The amount one spends depends on the individual. If I wear $200 armani jeans and $1000 hugo boss suits everyday, then my money spent on looking good for women may eclipse the money they spend looking good for me. I can even get my nails done and my eyebrows waxed. Metrosexual men prove that theory wrong and many women are attracted to that type.

[Woggle]

Women spend more money on looking good than men spend on paying for dates. From birth control to makeup to brizilian wax etc, not to mention the very expensive anti-aging products that women have to buy to not god forbid ever look old...pleasing these creatures called men isn't easy lol

 

Women do that just as much to impress other women.

[mesmerized]

No, you're pleasing other women too. Please show me a straight man that knows which shoe is a jimmy choo and which dress is a dolce & gabbana. Besides, women want fashionable men too. The amount one spends depends on the individual. If I wear $200 armani jeans and $1000 hugo boss suits everyday, then my money spent on looking good for women may eclipse the money they spend looking good for me. I can even get my nails done and my eyebrows waxed. Metrosexual men prove that theory wrong and many women are attracted to that type.

 

Well, I was told recently that I can only get "crappy" men because I'm not very stylish, And yes, by a MAN. Almost every guy I know also has an opinion on how nails should look like lol Men might only spend on their cloth (which lets face it, is still very limited) but women have to spend on so much more.

 

The whole women do it to please other women is such bull****. Women do it cause they have to compete to get men's attention.

[mesmerized]

Women do that just as much to impress other women.

 

 

Seriously, you men know nothing about women lol they do it to compete for men's attention, not to "impress" women.

[Sanman]

Well, I was told recently that I can only get "crappy" men because I'm not very stylish, And yes, by a MAN. Almost every guy I know also has an opinion on how nails should look like lol Men might only spend on their cloth (which lets face it, is still very limited) but women have to spend on so much more.

 

The whole women do it to please other women is such bull****. Women do it cause they have to compete to get men's attention.

 

As I said, men get waxed and have manicures too now. Just because a man said that to you does not make it true. My gf is not a style maven and I still date her. I also don't really care how she keeps her nails as long and she is happy and I don't have to listen to any complaining.

[Woggle]

Seriously, you men know nothing about women lol they do it to compete for men's attention, not to "impress" women.

 

Women tell me this all the time how they do it to impress other women and feel good about themselves. The other day I saw a group of women comparing each other's nails.

[mesmerized]

As I said, men get waxed and have manicures too now. Just because a man said that to you does not make it true. My gf is not a style maven and I still date her. I also don't really care how she keeps her nails as long and she is happy and I don't have to listen to any complaining.

 

I don't really know any man who spends money on those things. Brazilian wax is like 50 dollars. I highly doubt there are men who spend that amount each month for just waxing lol

 

Seriously, let's be real here. Women spend much much more to look good than men do. Men and women are certainly not equal in this regard.

[mesmerized]

Women tell me this all the time how they do it to impress other women and feel good about themselves. The other day I saw a group of women comparing each other's nails.

 

Put all those women in a world without men and see how they become sloppy and careless lol Just because women compare nails doesn't mean they are trying to impress "women", the underlying message is "I'm pretty too, I can get men!". At the end it's all about men.

[Woggle]

Put all those women in a world without men and see how they become sloppy and careless lol Just because women compare nails doesn't mean they are trying to impress "women", the underlying message is "I'm pretty too, I can get men!". At the end it's all about men.

 

Then does my friend who is a lesbian come into work every day dressed to the nines with perfectly manicured nails and perfectly applied makeup? She is certainly not doing it to impress men.

 

Some women are also just really into fashion and makeup. It is a hobby to them to get dressed up.

[musemaj11]

Women always say its all not about money, but about thoughtfulness and consideration. However, dont they think that men would appreciate the same thing also from them?

 

Two months ago for example, I went to meet a woman for a date. We lived in different cities so I went to hers with a taxi because my car had a problem. We had a nice date and after the date she refused to let me pay and picked up the whole tab citing that she was grateful that I had come a long way with a taxi just to see her and the least she could do was to treat me.

 

As everyone here knows, I distrust women and have low expectation of them. So when that happened it really touched me that a woman could be very generous and thoughtful.

[mesmerized]

Then does my friend who is a lesbian come into work every day dressed to the nines with perfectly manicured nails and perfectly applied makeup? She is certainly not doing it to impress men.

 

Some women are also just really into fashion and makeup. It is a hobby to them to get dressed up.

 

Whatever, yeah women have no reason to do it. Most attractive or rich men don't give a damn about a dolled up women. Ignorance must serve you well.

[Woggle]

Whatever, yeah women have no reason to do it. Most attractive or rich men don't give a damn about a dolled up women. Ignorance must serve you well.

 

So then tell me what reason a lesbian would have to get dressed up like that if according to you women just do it to impress men?

[mesmerized]

So then tell me what reason a lesbian would have to get dressed up like that if according to you women just do it to impress men?

 

She is a freaking lesbian! lol how do I know? Maybe women she is attracted to also care about these things, maybe she is doing for women because you know, she is going to have sex with WOMEN. Straight women aren't having sex with women, they have no reason to impress women lookwise other than to show them their power to attract men. Just like how men show off to other men about their ability to attract women.

[Sanman]

I don't really know any man who spends money on those things. Brazilian wax is like 50 dollars. I highly doubt there are men who spend that amount each month for just waxing lol

 

Seriously, let's be real here. Women spend much much more to look good than men do. Men and women are certainly not equal in this regard.

 

 

And because you don't know any, they do not exist? Ever have your back waxed? Ever heard of a male brazilian? Visit NYC and LA

[Woggle]

She is a freaking lesbian! lol how do I know? Maybe women she is attracted to also care about these things, maybe she is doing for women because you know, she is going to have sex with WOMEN. Straight women aren't having sex with women, they have no reason to impress women lookwise other than to show them their power to attract men. Just like how men show off to other men about their ability to attract women.

 

It's not always about attracting women to men. Women comparing makeup, nails and clothes is their version of men comparing cars, high end electronics and other things.

 

I am not saying that women look their best to impress a man because who doesn't want to impress somebody they are interested in but I highly doubt women would just let themselves go if it weren't for men.

[mesmerized]

It's not always about attracting women to men. Women comparing makeup, nails and clothes is their version of men comparing cars, high end electronics and other things.

 

I am not saying that women look their best to impress a man because who doesn't want to impress somebody they are interested in but I highly doubt women would just let themselves go if it weren't for men.

 

don't doubt. You already see how a lot of women let themselves go after they're married and don't care about attracting men anymore. It's really not that hard to see or grasp.